Private course membership

KMeloney · June 6, 2018

Tavistock has a waiting list now.

Dang. Really like the course, and was going to recommend it. It, too, is not the most walkable course (you get pretty far from the clubhouse, and the elevation changes out back are pretty hearty). But I really liked it when I played it last year.

I'm at Little Mill if ya had any questions about there. Might be just too far for what you're looking for.

Know a really tall guy there named Jim who works for HSBC?

driveandputtmachine · June 7, 2018

I have been a member of a couple of private clubs and on the board and head of a couple of committees. Let me give you a few tidbits.

1. For the majority of folks being a member and playing at your club will always be better than playing public golf. You find more people similar to you, normally faster rounds, and just a better atmosphere.

2. If you are joining and thinking of saving money over public golf, stop. Go back to public golf. In today's climate in most of the US, the members trying to skimp by are why private courses fail. If you have a pile of members, paying 400 a month(dues) and doing nothing else at the club(stopping for fast food on the way to or the way home from the club) your club will end up in financial difficulty soon. Too many people joined private clubs over the years that barely had the means to do it and this is why clubcorp has bought so many failed clubs.

3. Members make your experience. This is hard to gauge playing as a perspective member, but I would take a lesser golf course/facilities and better members over a nicer course and pretentious DB members.

4. If your dues are say 350 and you have a 50 food and beverage minimum a good rule of thumb if you ride and play a decent amount each month is that you will have a bill of around double your minimums. Then add on golf events, drinking and the like. One thing I have found at my club is the dinners are just as good as some of the nicer restaurants in town, and the atmosphere is better and the price is the same if not a little cheaper. This is a great way to support your club and one I wish more members took advantage of. If you play a lot it could be even more than double your minimums, if a club has a bunch of members that are not averaging close to double that club will soon start to have financial difficulties.

The dues part and double is a good rule of thumb, but not exact for each club. Some clubs spend way less on staffing and way less on maintenance. That being said I have never seen a private club (that was as nice or nicer than the nicest local public courses) that didn't average over double coming in what their minimums are that stayed financially secure

Noyes26 · June 7, 2018

Tavistock has a waiting list now.

Dang. Really like the course, and was going to recommend it. It, too, is not the most walkable course (you get pretty far from the clubhouse, and the elevation changes out back are pretty hearty). But I really liked it when I played it last year.

I'm at Little Mill if ya had any questions about there. Might be just too far for what you're looking for.

Know a really tall guy there named Jim who works for HSBC?

I wouldn’t say Tavi is a bad walk. Plus they are one of a few places that still have a caddie program in the area. Few elavation changes, sure. But honestly besides a couple holes, your mostly going down hill.

Haven’t met a Jim. But LM is pretty big. I’m sure I will eventually.

KMeloney · June 7, 2018

I wouldn't say Tavi is a bad walk. Plus they are one of a few places that still have a caddie program in the area. Few elavation changes, sure. But honestly besides a couple holes, your mostly going down hill.

I didn't mean a "bad walk". I agree that it's certainly not that at all. I was just thinking of walking a quick 9 or something after work, and thought maybe it might not be as easy to do there. At my club, the course is pretty tightly laid out. You're never very far from the clubhouse, and so I was making that comparison in my mind. But, regardless, I really, really liked Tavistock. Need to get back there this summer.

RichieHunt · June 7, 2018

Depends on the course.

The only thing you can run into is if the Board of Directors are really ignorant and out of touch. When I was a teenager I joined a private club as they had cheap junior memberships. Had about 300 members, but only 3 people were on the BoD. And 1 of them was a Judge Smails type, very out of touch. And he just bulldozed over the other 2 people on the BoD and you basically had to live by his silly rules and whatever direction he took the course into.

The other problem is you can run into some heavy cliques. When I was a member at a course in Atlanta, it was very clique-ish. Of course, Atlanta in itself is very clique-ish. Problem for me was I was a NY'er and I didn't go to some big school in the south. Fortunately, I was finally able to meet some friends that were all from NY and we played together every week.

RH

howellhandmade · June 7, 2018

I was thinking about this thread today. I got home from work about 4:30, changed into shorts and headed to my club. The ladies' league had the front, so I played the back. Had a twosome in front, but they had a cart and I was walking, so if I moseyed a little and practiced chipping and putting a bit I might as well have had the course to myself. Which is when I thought about the comments about the economics of club membership. I've played practically all of my golf until this season on public courses, and the only way I've had golf like this was to play in weather that weeded out everyone but meshuggeners like me. I had to get home to grill dinner so I skipped 18, cut over to the practice tee to hit a dozen balls and fix the thin miss I'd been fighting, walked back to the clubhouse, changed my shoes, and was home by 6:30.

It's a luxury to be able to play golf almost anytime I want, to play any number of holes I have time for, to have a well-maintained course with nice bunkers and greens that aren't full of unrepaired pitch marks. It's a luxury to have a clubhouse with good food and cold beer and comfortable chairs and a pool table when I have time for those. It's a luxury to have a staff that knows my name and acts like it makes a difference to them whether I have a good day or not. And if anybody figures up the cost per round and says no thanks, I completely understand. That's how I feel about cars; it's a box to get me from point A to point B. I may enjoy the differences between my $15k Mazda and a $60k Mercedes, but not enough to pay for them.

However, I very much am willing -- now -- to pay for the difference in my golf. Golf is more accessible, so I'm playing more, and better. Golf is more relaxed and relaxing so I can step out of the rat race rather than stepping into another version of it. Knowing that this retreat exists makes the inevitable stresses and frustrations elsewhere more bearable. Yes, club membership is a luxury, but in this case it does exactly what a luxury is supposed to do. I don't only enjoy golf more, I enjoy life more.

jambox107 · June 9, 2018

Hopefully you don’t get board if playing the same course over and over. It may sting to play golf with your non member buddies at other courses where you have to pay also. The social aspect and convenience is the main driver here because you’d have to play a lot of rounds to get your money’s worth for the economics to make sense from a golf standpoint.

howellhandmade · June 9, 2018

Hopefully you don’t get board if playing the same course over and over. It may sting to play golf with your non member buddies at other courses where you have to pay also. The social aspect and convenience is the main driver here because you’d have to play a lot of rounds to get your money’s worth for the economics to make sense from a golf standpoint.

Preface by making it clear that I'm not trying to talk anybody into joining a club or suggesting it's for everybody, I'm just trying to offer a perspective, having lived on both sides of the fence.

I agree about playing a lot of rounds, but I see it more as "get to" rather than "have to." Because I joined a club I'm playing at least three times a week. Playing public courses, I couldn't play unless I basically had the whole day free because a round could take five hours, so once a week plus hitting off mats at a range was the best I could do.. Walking my club as a single, I've never taken more than three and a half hours, and often I have a clear course and can play 18 in 2:15-2:30. If I have two hours I can play nine holes, door to door. This allows me, knowing the general patterns at my club, to squeeze rounds into spaces of free time that simply would be impossible at a public course. Granted, not all public courses are busy all the time, but they COULD be busy at any time, you'll never get a straight answer if you call ahead trying to figure out if it's worth a trip, and the way people behave these days it doesn't take many golfers to clog up a public course.

So I guess I now view "the economics" a little differently than I once did. You get your money's worth in quality, not (necessarily) quantity. The social aspect is not a driver for me, except in the sense that golfers at my club tend to treat each other with respect. I don't fuss about paying for outside rounds with friends, but it IS nice to have something to offer in return if someone invites you to play as a guest at his club.

lukerguy · June 10, 2018

I'm 32 and have been a member at a few courses. I prefer semi-private memberships to fully private. I find private to be 30% more expensive and have no reason to keep the course open due to semi-poor weather. They've already earned the majority of their income from members so they are less incentivized to keep the course open. This may not be important in Hawaii or California, but very important when you live in Canada :)

Chomper · June 10, 2018

I'm 32 and have been a member at a few courses. I prefer semi-private memberships to fully private. I find private to be 30% more expensive and have no reason to keep the course open due to semi-poor weather. They've already earned the majority of their income from members so they are less incentivized to keep the course open. This may not be important in Hawaii or California, but very important when you live in Canada :)

That sounds like a problem with that course. I can promise you that, in the summer in Phoenix, my private course is open all day, even if nobody is on the tee sheet.

As mentioned above, there is a cost associated with pace of play, and that is the biggest benefit, in my opinion, of joining a private club.

3offthetee2 · June 10, 2018

Being in south jersey it is 100% worth it to join a private or semi private club. Unless your idea of fun is playing 6 hour rounds then you should most certainly look to a private course.

ronnbee · June 10, 2018

For years, I didn't join a club because I couldn't justify the expense, and there are still plenty of clubs where that is still true. But this year I joined a small club 15 minutes from home, little over 2k a year for the first year of an introductory membership, no initiation, no food/beverage minimum.

I love it. Initially I thought the course was too short/easy, but as the course has dried out and the greens have firmed up I have come to appreciate it. It is eminently walkable, and many times I've had it all to myself. I'm getting to know the staff and have played with a couple of other members. Food is great but only open a few days a week. I can play 9 holes in 2 hours, door to door, don't have to worry about tee times. Or (like today) I can spend the day -- play 18, have some lunch, hit a few balls, putt for a while, play a few more holes, have a beer and watch golf in the grille room.

It's a club that falls into the category that my dad called "good enough for who it's for." But I can't express how much I enjoy having a place to go play golf where I don't have to deal with a different version of rush hour traffic. The way I look at it, you have to match expenses to income. If you can afford it, try it.

howell - What club did you join this year? I'm in the pittsburgh area as well and was just curious which course you're talking about here. Thanks

GREEN OAKS LOOKING FOR MEMBERS, ITS A COUNTRY CLUB LIKE EDGEWOOD

*T* · June 10, 2018

I am absolutely for joining a Private Club. As many have mentioned, it is just an all around better experience. From staff, to course conditions, playability, length of round, food and beverage and events, every aspect tends to be more enjoyable than a public course. If you join, definitely play in as many events as possible. Take adavantage if the practice facilities, pool, gym etc. I have met some of the best people out or my club and I wouldn’t trade it for anything.

lukerguy · June 11, 2018

Our semi private course is open for member/member guests only between Fri-Sunday mornings and holidays- with a 4:15 mandate. Public booking is available other days which helps keep the fees down.

bubbaleon · June 18, 2018

I can play 9 holes in 2 hours, door to door, don't have to worry about tee times. Or (like today) I can spend the day -- play 18, have some lunch, hit a few balls, putt for a while, play a few more holes, have a beer and watch golf in the grille room.

See...this sounds so amazing to me.

If there was an affordable club in San Diego, I would join it in a heartbeat but I don't think there is a worthwhile club under $10,000/year once it is all said and done.

Look into Bernardo Heights CC

MikekiM · June 18, 2018

I can play 9 holes in 2 hours, door to door, don't have to worry about tee times. Or (like today) I can spend the day -- play 18, have some lunch, hit a few balls, putt for a while, play a few more holes, have a beer and watch golf in the grille room.

See...this sounds so amazing to me.

If there was an affordable club in San Diego, I would join it in a heartbeat but I don't think there is a worthwhile club under $10,000/year once it is all said and done.

Our club has a Jr executive program that I believe gets in under that. Guess it depends how old you are. I can put in touch with our director if you're interested.

cma8516 · June 18, 2018

So how many of you guys are members of a private courses? i am 29 and do ok for myself so a private membership is something i've wanted to treat myself with for a while now but just keep getting cold feet. I play usually once or twice a week and i will play year round if the course is open(Im in NJ). What are somethings that i may not be thinking on with private course life? both good or bad. I have only really played one private course every (with a friend that was a member at the course). I really enjoyed the customer service and the way i didn't have to deal with the general public. The club Im looking at is Trump Philadelphia. and from my understanding im looking about 7K for my first year. Just trying to get feed back from guys who do the private clubs because i really cant make up my mind if i should do it or not!
Thanks,
Nick

Nick -- i'm in the same area - mt royal/mantua.

Similar situation as you - maybe playing once or twice a week if i'm lucky and then on weekends. I was a member at woodcrest for 2 years until i turned 30 and the price jacked up to where it didnt make sense for me - had kids and started playing less.

Woodcrest is not a bad drive at all from our area -- quite honestly it takes longer to get to Trump because there is not a great direct route there. Might be a different story from where you work but if your coming from home its a pain in the a**.

Coming back from Woodcrest you can hit traffic sometimes if you snuck out for an afternoon round and are finishing around rush hour. They do have a real nice patio/bar for hanging out after you play.

Also I believe Hidden Creek was mentioned in here -- look into it...I believe right now they're running around $2,400 for under 30 with maybe $500-$600 food minimum for the year which you'd probably spend anywhere else anyway...may not be able to get there during the week but if you play it sat/sun or play 36 on a weekend day its well worth it -- fully private, great course, good food. Id try to join it for this year then try to bargain your way into a 2nd year at the under 30 rate depending on when you turn 30. I play it regularly.

Play some rounds at Scotland run during the week when it gets cheaper late in the afternoon and then save weekends for HC.

From Mullica Hill should easily get there in an hour or so depending on traffic.

cma8516 · June 18, 2018

It's a public course, but Scotland Run is only about 20 mins from Mullica HIll. And at your age, $3,500 gets you 7 day access to Atlantic City CC, Scotland Run GC & Ballamor GC. It doesn't seem what you're looking for, but seemed worth throwing it out there.

Woodcrest (in Cherry Hill) is always a solid option. I play at Merchantville (also in Cherry Hill). You have some options outside of Trump in the area.

only problem here is 5 hour rounds at scotland run...not bad for afternoon practicing though or 9s...but then id drive to ACCC on weekends. Far better course.

ratdg1 · June 19, 2018

Don't do the math - it is never economical to join a club. Join for other reasons mentioned by club members in this thread - because you can easily afford it, social aspects, connections/contacts, etc.
my rounds came out to less than $40 per in 2017 at my private club...

That's great for you. I can tell you there's no private clubs in the Central Ohio area (except possibly one that is not a good golf course) where that could happen. And, at the $7k price stated by the OP, he'd have to play 175 rounds in the first year to get the cost down to that per round (not that he is necessarily trying to do so). Point being, I don't think that is close to the norm.

I can tell you that there are at least two: York and Hickory Hills. Both have memberships for less than $300/month, depending on age. While neither of them will ever be mistaken for Scioto, they're both solid tracks.

NM44 · September 13, 2018

just a little update. I actually ruled trump out when they dropped the bomb that they close on Mondays. Monday is my most consistent day off and most likely when id play a majority of my golf. I have always heard Tavi. was a pain in the a** to get into and very snobby so i really didn't pay it much mind. I'm the opposite of your normal "country club guy" (big ,bearded, covered in tattoos with a truck drivers mouth lol) and never really though of the whole social/clique thing. believe me when i say i'm thick skinned and don't care if the ppl like me but at the end of the day none of us want to be looked at as an outsider or treated rudely when you are paying good money to be somewhere. I really want to go to hidden creek but the battle with shore traffic all summer is just something i will not do. I have looked at some of the public course memberships you guy mentioned but if i'm gonna do it, im' going private for all the reasons you guy mentioned. For now i will play another fall/winter of public golf and go from there. Thanks for all the input you guys have given!! any of you south jersey guy who want to link up on a Monday and play, Let me know!

Noyes26 · September 14, 2018

Being closed on Mondays is normal for private clubs. Two reasons, it’s the clubs maintanence day and also the new thing is their outing day. You’re gonna have a self battle with that one....

thejuice · September 14, 2018

Being closed on Mondays is normal for private clubs. Two reasons, it’s the clubs maintanence day and also the new thing is their outing day. You’re gonna have a self battle with that one....

OP, Noyes is right about Mondays being the usual day clubs are closed. You might get lucky and find a club that’s closed on Tuesdays, but again, it’s rare to find one that’s not closed on Monday.

Schley · September 14, 2018

Unfortunately Mondays are pretty standard to be the day off for staff and used for course maintenance. They also open it up for charity tourneys to help the club finances. The pools many times will be open on Monday's but the course is closed. So privates are tough to find that Monday's are open.

Johnny_Fairway · September 14, 2018

Is it usual for members not to be allowed on the course on Mondays? Our clubhouse and pro shop are both closed, but we're free to use the course. I assumed that was the norm.

golfortennis · September 14, 2018

Yeah, our club isn't closed on Mondays. Maybe it's a Canadian thing since the season is so short.

Schley · September 14, 2018

Is it usual for members not to be allowed on the course on Mondays? Our clubhouse and pro shop are both closed, but we're free to use the course. I assumed that was the norm.

We have 2 courses and both are closed on Mondays in addition to everything on property except the pool area.

Occasionally they open up one of the courses on Monday in the afternoon, if there isn't an outside tourney. The morning is needed by the maintenance staff at a minimum. You super's I'm sure treat this time as sacred!

KMeloney · September 14, 2018

Is it usual for members not to be allowed on the course on Mondays? Our clubhouse and pro shop are both closed, but we're free to use the course. I assumed that was the norm.

We're closed Mondays and are not permitted on the course.

Soxfan21 · September 14, 2018

My club is closed most Monday’s as well for maintenance and the occasional outing. The only time the course is open on Monday’s is very early in the season, usually March and April, and very late in the season, usually October and November.