Pursing a Career in Professional Golf

[Lagavulin62]

What do you mean by plus 4 ‘ish’?

 

 

 

ish, used as a suffix, means about, around, etc. So if someone says their age is 20ish, they could mean 20 or 29, or anywhere in between. It’s a cool way of getting someone in the ballpark, albeit a very large park.

[Hawkeye77]

And what is +4 "ish"? Sounds like it may be a little optimistic.

 

Still stick by my original post, but sounds like you just need a real job that captures your interest/passion if you are sitting around daydreaming about pro golf - that's probably the root issue. Maybe work on that if worrying about being a pro golfer is really a serious distraction.

 

But it's a message board and everyone says "go for it" to be nice and supportive, but like someone else said, you already know the answer to the question.

 

PM August, Monte, Dan, some others who have posted here and in other threads if you don't want to get the answer locally, I'm sure they would be happy to give open and honest advice.

 

FWIW, my encouragement comes from the perspective of somewhat who did go for it, and failed. I won some money in mini-tour events but exhausted my savings before I got good enough to make a living of it. It cost me 3 years and about $40k, and I don't regret it.

 

I think that's pretty cool.

 

But 3 years would run a lot more than $40,000 now!

 

Know someone who finally got a card, know what his talent level is and what it has taken him to get there and "+4ish" dreaming out of an office isn't a likely candidate for success and really doesn't sound serious about it. If he is, hope he enjoys it regardless of the outcome.

[DaveLeeNC]

FWIW, back when I was a few years younger and actually worked on my game, my index would bounce around between 4.0 and a bit over 6 (NOT plus 4.0 ala' the OP). I would refer to this as "5'ish" and assumed that people kind of knew what I meant. Maybe not.

 

These days (older, less play, virtually no practice) my index is "AllOverThePlace'ish".

 

dave

[BNGL]

Sup Guys,

 

As I sit here on this gorgeous Friday afternoon, I am sitting here in the office at my cubicle doing absolutely nothing so I figured I would start a new thread.

 

Prior to the current office job I have now, I used to work as an assistant golf pro for a semi private facility just outside of Baltimore. I always had a passion for the game so it only made sense for me to work at a golf course as my first ever job. What I quickly learned throughout my adolescence was that if I continued to stay in this line of work the opportunity for advancement would ultimately dwindle especially at the club that I was working at the time. This was the main reason I stopped doing what I was doing. With all of this being said, I am now bored out of mind doing a job that I have zero interest in!

 

I currently maintain a +4ish handicap at the club I am at and keep having these wild thoughts of going pro and chasing the dream of becoming a successful touring pro. I know its a shot in the dark but I feel like if I dont give it some sort of shot I will spend the rest of my life in regret of not knowing what could happen.

 

GolfWRX users give it to me straight, I can take it.

 

Go for it. Don't do something because you aren't sure, and live with the regret. But be ready to fall...hard. There are a ton of guys that are great players, better than some PGA Tour players that I know, but they cannot compartmentalize their games enough to make it happen. There is things that are far more to it than just being able to hit the golf ball, like travel arrangements, hotel arrangements, where to play, what to play, getting around in a foreign town (whether domestic or international) where you don't know anyone or anything. But if you have a passion for the game, and can sustain that competitiveness through out the year and into the future then go for it. But if you do not believe it yourself, than you will get run over, because everyone on TV that you see knows that they will beat you before the ball is even hit.

 

Find the state events to play, Open and Local qualifying. January is approaching enter Latin Q School (do it fast typically fills up quick) and find out where you stack up.

[hack2489]

Old thread, but maybe relevant for the OP:

 

http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/788791-scratch-vs-pro/

 

And, a similar topic article from a while back:

 

http://www.golfwrx.com/386250/the-statistical-differences-between-a-scratch-golfer-and-pga-tour-player/

 

 

[PenetratingWedgeStinger]

Everybody says you regret the things you don't do far more than the things you do. I personally find that a load of codswallop, in reality the 'what if' regrets feel extremely mild since they're based on abstract scenarios, compared with the regret of real, concrete consequences of pursuing a high risk dream, it not working out and then finding yourself struggling just to get back to where you began.

 

Note I am absolutely not saying you shouldn't go for it, but as others have said just make sure you have plenty of worst case scenario contingency in place, particularly when it comes to finances. External risks can emerge from places you'd never imagined, even though you've done everything right. Optimism of the heart needs to be counter-balanced with some serious pessimism of the mind :)

[chrisgilly09]

True, Mikey Mcdermott almost died at the hands of cops and russians to get back his nest egg of 30 grand

[ShankedShots]

What do you mean by plus 4 'ish'?

 

What I mean is that my handicap fluctuates around there. Two months ago I was at +4.4 but at the moment I am +3.6

[Santiago Golf]

Id say try to play in your state am, state mid am, state open, try qualify for us open, us am, us mid-am. You dont have to win these events to be good enough to play on tour but these events can show if you ready to take the risk of playing for a living. I have really good friends that are the best ams in the state, the biggest factor in their game versus a scratch player is ballstriking. They also say its big tournament pressure/nerves/excitement experience. Some players get used to it by the time they are signing their 36 hole scorecard to miss the cut, the good players are use to it when they tee up in a practice round.

[Ghost of Snead]

IMO, you're going to have to move. Winters are too long in MD and hundreds of players at your cap already in Florida practicing all day and working nights to support themselves. You have an office job - IMO, you need to treat golf as your job.

[2bGood]

Lots of bad advice here. Of course my advice is brilliant:

 

Don't do this half way, don't dip your toe in the water to see how you do in a few mini tour events, or high level am events. You need to commit 100% and leave yourself zero back up plan.

 

What you are trying to do is too hard to only do it part way, and you need to make sure you only option is moving forward.

 

So you need to:

 

1. Break up with the girlfriend - she will hold you back when you are trying to make it to the Tour and you will have better options when you get to the Tour

2. Move to a golf hotbed

3. Put all your money into playing and practicing and compete like crazy.

 

At worse you will delay you life at a desk for 2 or 3 years, which is no big deal.

[ShankedShots]

Can you financially support yourself for at least 3 years with your current savings?

 

Even if you are good enough, it'll take a full year or more to get your game into shape, then a year or 2 of competing to make progress towards a respectable tour.

 

 

A few guys at the club I am at always tell me that they would put me up and let me see what I can do.

[ShankedShots]

I say go for it and post your experiences here.

 

If I ever do muster up the marbles to actually do it I will be sure to post it here lol thanks man

[ShankedShots]

Should be someone within 30 - 60 minutes of where you live who could spend a few hours (or less) with you and give you a pretty accurate assessment of your chances.

 

I am confused by who this someone might be? Other tour pros? Club pros? coaches?

[ShankedShots]

My advice would to play in as many tournaments as possible. Play in the big AM events and see how you stack up. Assess from there.

 

I would love to play more events but I can only get about 5 tournaments a year because I also need to keep a full time job. So I guess I should just pick my tournaments wisely.

 

Thank you for the reply

[ShankedShots]

Move to a warm climate and find the local money games

 

This is something that would definitely help me... in MD I can only play about 9 months out of the year due to weather. If I want to even think about doing this thing it would start by moving to FL.

 

Thanks for the reply man

[ShankedShots]

I have no idea about golf in MD. If you're a +4 at home, go around to some of the courses in your area and play them to see if your +4 will travel. Or take a vacation and go find a mini tour event or two to play. Play on days when it's not a nice day. A +4 is very, very good, even elite, but tour pros are almost magical.

 

This is great idea. My parents have a place down in FL, I know for a fact there are a number of mini tours down there. I will try that.

 

But yeah the tour pros on tv are insane!

[ShankedShots]

This might be an obscure view, but, if you are asking, questioning etc rather than doing ... We'll, you've already failed.

 

If you're going to make it, YOU have to be 100% committed with rock solid belief in yourself. If you've got that, go for it.

 

If not, start playing in harder tournaments away from your area, force yourself to travel, play tough courses with good players and get a dose of reality.

 

If you like the travel, costs you fund yourself and still play well, win a few, then maybe you'll find that rock solid belief in yourself.

 

 

I know for a fact you are correct. If I cant be 100% committed to this cause then I would only be wasting time and money. I have had some success in the past but I feel like if I played tournament golf more frequently I would be able to go off of something and build my way up.

 

Thank you for your advice and reply!

[ShankedShots]

Have you entered a Q-School Qualifier?

Have you tried your luck at a mini tour event as a professional or an amateur?

Have you made it out of local U.S. Amateur qualifying? Have you entered a U.S. Amateur Qualifier?

Have you made it out of local U.S. Mid-Am qualifying? Have you entered a U.S. Mid-Am Qualifier?

How many State level tournaments have you won, played in the final group. had a top 5, or top 10 finish?

How many Regional competitions have you won, played in final group, had a top 5, or top 10 finish?

Have you won your City Championship?

Have you ever been Club Champion.

Do you play money games against really good players? Do you take their money of give them money?

Did you play College golf? If so, what was your best finish/scoring average?

Did you play AJGA at the Regional or National level?

How many official tournaments have you won?

How many official tournaments 's have you played in?

 

These things are what separates professional golfers from everyone else. The reality is that the guys you have to beat to reach your goal have done, and are doing these things consistently. A +4 that only plays on an average 6800 yard muni or local soft edged CC is not a traveling +4. They are not going to shoot the scores required to win tournaments on long and difficult golf courses against battle hardened players that have been doing it for years. Even the mini-tour fields are full of ex-Tour players, ex-Web.Com players, ex-college players from major and minor universities, U.S Open Regional Finalists, U.S. Mid-Am Finalists, State Am and State Mid-Am Champions, Regional Champions, City Champions, Club Champions, AJGA National Champions, an on and on. These are the guys you have to beat and you have to beat them over an entire season. Every time you tee it up, you have to think you're the best player on the property, and you have to be to beat them. There is no hiding behind a scramble partner, or goofing around with your friends, taking mulligans and gimme's. Every stroke is counted by people that don't care if you succeed or not. Mini-tours are where you find out if you're actually any good over an entire season on a different golf course every week. That's where professional golf dreams go to die and where the good ones separate themselves from the pack.

 

I am in no way suggesting you can't do it. But take it from a guy that tried, and tried, and tried. You have to be brutally honest with yourself and with the state of your game. Not only that, you have to be brutally honest with the depth of your financial ability and your emotional and physical dedication to the almost endless hours of work and travel required to make an actual living playing competitive golf. It can be demoralizing at a level few can imagine. One stroke here, one stroke there can mean the difference between one more week of trying, or a long trip home with no money and no hope for the rest of the season. It's not easy telling your friends and family that you have already run through $20K and the season isn't half over.

 

Good Luck to you if you make the leap. It's like cocaine cashing that first check...even if it's only for $310.

 

 

First off, thank you very much for this reply. Your experience truly shows with what you have written, and I appreciate that.

 

I have never gone to a q school qualifier but a lot of the guys I play state tournaments with have gone to q school. I think a couple of them are actually playing this week in First Stage. These are guys I have beaten in the past.

 

I have played a few mini tour events when I was younger. I was still classified as an amateur but I could hold my own out there, I cashed out a couple of times (gift card money cuz I was still an am) which felt amazing since some of these guys had some sort of status on either the mackenzie tour, challenger tour, or the Asian tour. I would like to say I have gotten a lot better since then but I will be headed down south to play an event next week.

 

Unfortunately I have never made it out of a US Am local, I have been in two playoffs for the last spot but never made it through. I have made it through US open locals twice and I have made it through to the US 4 Ball. After the stroke play portion of 2016 4 ball my friend and I were in a tie for 5th. We ultimately got beat in the first round of match play though.

 

I have made a number of top 10s at the state level but have never won. Ive been really close but if I had a dollar for everytime Ive said that I could probably fund my golfing career.

 

Ive been a club champion at 3 different courses.

 

I never went to a college that had a golf team.

[Lagavulin62]

Ok after reading your posts I say move to FL. You will have to find a roomate situation or its some cheap studio. It can be done. Also the day job is not going to work unless its early part of the week. Many of us worked as couriers while working our way through school. All types of jobs will work but flexibility is the key and you will have nights where you only get a few hours sleep.

 

A word of caution. Stay away from these “money games”. You do not have to be a gambler in that sense to be successful. Don’t let anyone tell you different. If gambling is your only hope of making it, quit now. This is serious business. You will have plenty of stress as it is. Don’t be a sucker to some jerk who only wants your money. You have bills to pay, big bills.

 

Lastly have fun. Many young people leave home for NY or CA to make it in show business. Most will never make it. But those that try, very few ever regret it. If in 5 years still nothing, you will still have a real job to pursue. Nothing lost.

 

 

[Z1ggy16]

I think Andrew Jensen put out a youtube video a few months ago about the life style and expenses incurred as a 'struggling' touring pro. If I remember correctly, assuming you never really won any big purses, you'd be in the hole something like $20-30k per year, depending on current debts, life style you lead during that time and how many tourney you enter.

 

If that's something you can afford to do, you should definitely go for it. If you're saying that it would be a huge life regret if you did not, there's no doubt that you should at least try. It's certainly a long shot, but guys like Ian Poulter and Justin Rose struggled a lot when they first became pro. There's always a chance you could find a great coach or caddie and elevate your game even more.

[benhays98]

A few guys at the club I am at always tell me that they would put me up and let me see what I can do.

 

My parents have a place down in FL, I know for a fact there are a number of mini tours down there. I will try that.

 

I have never gone to a q school qualifier but a lot of the guys I play state tournaments with have gone to q school. I think a couple of them are actually playing this week in First Stage. These are guys I have beaten in the past. I have played a few mini tour events when I was younger. I was still classified as an amateur but I could hold my own out there, I cashed out a couple of times (gift card money cuz I was still an am) which felt amazing since some of these guys had some sort of status on either the mackenzie tour, challenger tour, or the Asian tour. I would like to say I have gotten a lot better since then but I will be headed down south to play an event next week. Unfortunately I have never made it out of a US Am local, I have been in two playoffs for the last spot but never made it through. I have made it through US open locals twice and I have made it through to the US 4 Ball. After the stroke play portion of 2016 4 ball my friend and I were in a tie for 5th. We ultimately got beat in the first round of match play though. I have made a number of top 10s at the state level but have never won. Ive been really close but if I had a dollar for everytime Ive said that I could probably fund my golfing career. Ive been a club champion at 3 different courses. I never went to a college that had a golf team.

 

It sounds like you have your answers above. What do you have to lose?

[ShankedShots]

Lots of bad advice here. Of course my advice is brilliant:

 

Don't do this half way, don't dip you toe in the water to see how you do in a few mini tour events, or high level am events. You need to commit 100% and leave yourself zero back up a plan.

 

What you are trying to do is too hard to only do it part way, and you need to make sure you only option is moving forward.

 

So you need to:

 

1. Break up with the girlfriend - she will hold you back when you are trying to make it the Tour and you will have better options when you get to the Tour

2. Move to a golf hotbed

3. Put all your money into playing and practicing and compete like crazy.

 

At worse you will delay you life at a desk for 2 or 3 years, which is no big deal.

 

 

Dude how the heck did you know I had a girlfriend lol

 

 

But I would have to agree... sadly

[ShankedShots]

I think Andrew Jensen put out a youtube video a few months ago about the life style and expenses incurred as a 'struggling' touring pro. If I remember correctly, assuming you never really won any big purses, you'd be in the hole something like $20-30k per year, depending on current debts, life style you lead during that time and how many tourney you enter.

 

If that's something you can afford to do, you should definitely go for it. If you're saying that it would be a huge life regret if you did not, there's no doubt that you should at least try. It's certainly a long shot, but guys like Ian Poulter and Justin Rose struggled a lot when they first became pro. There's always a chance you could find a great coach or caddie and elevate your game even more.

 

 

I actually watch his vids all of the time! Love his content. But you are right.

 

Thank you very much for the reply and advice

[Z1ggy16]

Keep us updated if you do decide to try and get your card. It's always really fun to read these stories.

[Hawkeye77]

Should be someone within 30 - 60 minutes of where you live who could spend a few hours (or less) with you and give you a pretty accurate assessment of your chances.

 

I am confused by who this someone might be? Other tour pros? Club pros? coaches?

 

You were in the biz and can't think of a quality teacher/pro that could give you insight into whether you have a realistic chance? Even a cheap flight and visit Dan - money well spent, time well invested, answer found.

[slprince67]

my first question would be.... how did you do in your section events when you were an assistant professional?

[Gamble Gamble]

At the end of your life you will regret the times you avoided what you love out of fear of failure. Too many people choose a life of safety and just "run out the clock."

 

Get to work. Chase your dream but commit to it 100%. Let the "safe" people who tell you that you cannot succeed be the fuel to get you through the tough times.

 

Good luck, Godspeed and make sure you execute.

[blehnhard]

Kinda been there - Kinda done that.

 

After 27 years as a club pro (4 as assistant and 23 has head pro at 2 different courses), I decided to throw my lot onto playing the Senior PGA Tour. I was a 5 hdcp when I turned "pro" in 1965 (75 was very good for me then). Over the years, I developed into a solid local performer (2 state opens, numerous PGA section championships) and some modest success at the national level in PGA Club Pro Championships (numerous top 15's and a best of 3rd in 1988). I qualified for 1 US Open and 4 PGA Championships (thru finishes in Club Pro). I played in 9 PGA Tour events (5 Kemper Opens and 4 A/B Championships).

 

When I was 48 (and playing my best golf), I decided that I wanted to give "tour golf" a shot. I worked a deal with my club where they bought out my golf operation (pro shop, carts, etc) in exchange for salary. This was in late 1991. This provided me with a nice "bankroll" of about 30K. I worked at the club till end of June 1992 and took leave of absence (no pay) to practice and play to get ready for Senior Q School in November. I played 4 events on Hogan/Nike/Nationwide (can't remember the name back then) in Sept and October (1 cut made) and the Club Pro that year out in California (tie 10th). Finished 3rd in Regionals at Sarasota and 7th in Finals in Palm Springs to gain full exemption for 1993 season.

 

Did not keep exempt status for 94 (58th on money list and then missed at Q school), nor did I gain exempt status for 95, 96, or 97. Played local section events and senior mini tour events as well as 4 spotting for Senior Tour events (I would qualify for 4 or 5 events each year). Partial exempt status for 98 with 13th place finish at Q School. Got in 17 events. Did not make it thru Q school for 99 season and decided that I had given it my best shot with some modest success, so I hung up my "competitive" spikes. Worked in the golf industry (Soft Spikes) for the next 10 years and have enjoyed retired life since 2009.

 

My best finishes were a tie for 2nd at Long Island in 93 and a 5th place at Tampa in 95 after Monday qualifying. When I left the tour at end of 98, I had more money in the bank then when I started. I did not have a "sponsor" but did have an equipment contract with Taylor Made.

 

I was never a flashy "stick" that could shoot real low scores (no 63's or 64" came showing up in my game). My career best was a 64 in the VA State Open one year. Good days for me were 67's and 68's, but I could keep my poor days down to around par.

 

I have no regrets about giving it a shot. Was not sure what I would have done if I had not made it thru Q School the 1st time.

 

Still play casual golf 3 or 4 times per week with hdcp staying about scratch. Minor physical issues (almost 76 now). Right hip replacement in May 2016 and bad case of sciatica in fall last year that laid me up for almost 4 months.

 

Certainly try to find a course that has at least almost "tour" conditions to practice and play. Short game is where it is at. There a number of "overachievers" on the tour (Zach Johnson et al) who have done well and numerous "can't miss" types who fizzle out.

 

Best of luck.

 

Bruce

[596]

At the end of your life you will regret the times you avoided what you love out of fear of failure. Too many people choose a life of safety and just "run out the clock."

 

Get to work. Chase your dream but commit to it 100%. Let the "safe" people who tell you that you cannot succeed be the fuel to get you through the tough times.

 

Good luck, Godspeed and make sure you execute.

 

I'll second this from experience. Though not the same business as you. Sometimes you need to take a leap of faith and take a risk. Not doing so may be regrettable later in life.

 

My wife and I both quit our jobs at the age of 46. We closed her Avis Store and I quit my job as a teacher. We sold our house and used the profits and ALL the money we had and purchased a bed and breakfast in St Augustine, FL. We were totally broke when we moved in and took over the business. 3 years and 2 bed and breakfasts later we purchased a 16 room Inn in Sedona, AZ that was built by Frank Loyd Wright. The value was near 8 times more then the first one had had purchased 3 years earlier.

 

12 years after the first B&B we retired. We've never regretted what we did for a split second. We had a blast. Did something most people would only dream about. Got to travel a bunch and live in many places as a result.

 

Plan well. Find and listen to a Mentor and do exactly what they say.