Monte's new No Turn - Cast

[ThePaineTrain]

E: double posted

Edited September 20, 2022 by ThePaineTrain
double posted

[naj959]

6 hours ago, Duffer Mark said:

If someone has Monte's NTC and is working through it but is also considering another of his series between BroomForce and The Efficient Swing, which would you suggest?

I have all three and Efficient Swing is my favorite. It's a little more in-depth. NTC is kind of a cliff notes version of ES. Has some different feels/drills to get you in the same positions. The "point the butt" drill had me hitting my irons noticeably longer.  Broomforce is good if you're struggling with downswing concepts.

[Hilts1969]

16 hours ago, ericschlukebir said:

 

 

Here's the swings.  I try and get out and play once a week, but I don't always make it.  I pretty much work from home, so practice usually looks like somewhere between 50 and 100 balls broken up over the course of a day.

 

 

IMG_5955.mov 12.45 MB · 31 downloads
IMG_5956.mov 8.5 MB · 20 downloads  

 

 

 

 

You could probably do with working on that trail elbow.

[Duffer Mark]

9 hours ago, naj959 said:

I have all three and Efficient Swing is my favorite. It's a little more in-depth. NTC is kind of a cliff notes version of ES. Has some different feels/drills to get you in the same positions. The "point the butt" drill had me hitting my irons noticeably longer.  Broomforce is good if you're struggling with downswing concepts.

 

Sounds like ES compliments NTC well providing even more. So does ES compliment BroomForce at all?

[TheDeanAbides]

18 hours ago, ericschlukebir said:

 

 

Here's the swings.  I try and get out and play once a week, but I don't always make it.  I pretty much work from home, so practice usually looks like somewhere between 50 and 100 balls broken up over the course of a day.

 

 

IMG_5955.mov 12.45 MB · 35 downloads
IMG_5956.mov 8.5 MB · 24 downloads  

 

 

 

That trail elbow provides no stability at all. It should be pointing to the ground. Your arms are wrapping around your body - you need to create some width (connected to that trail elbow).

 

 You’re also too close to the ball and your grip is quite unstable. I’d imagine you have the club twist quite a bit in your hand. 
 

Also that hitting mat is too high. If you’re gonna use that find a platform to stand on to equalise it. 

Edited September 20, 2022 by TheDeanAbides
Typos!

[TheDeanAbides]

11 minutes ago, Duffer Mark said:

 

Sounds like ES compliments NTC well providing even more. So does ES compliment BroomForce at all?

They all compliment each other. 

[ericschlukebir]

29 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

 - you need to create some width (connected to that trail elbow).

 

 

width is a concept I have always had trouble understanding.  What distance is supposed to be wider?  

[TheDeanAbides]

55 minutes ago, ericschlukebir said:

width is a concept I have always had trouble understanding.  What distance is supposed to be wider?  

 It’s because you think that the arms swing around the body instead of staying in front of it. 
 

 

Edited September 20, 2022 by TheDeanAbides
Typo

[games]

3 hours ago, Duffer Mark said:

 

Sounds like ES compliments NTC well providing even more. So does ES compliment BroomForce at all?

 

Might help to understand the order in which the videos were released:

• Efficient Swing is a fairly comprehensive look at the full swing
• NTC is a concise full swing primer with elements of ES and the original NTC YouTube video.
• BroomForce is a detailed look at Cast B from NTC

IIRC, it was about three years between the release of ES and NTC.  In that time and in my opinion, Monte's view of the swing really crystallized.

If you get NTC, make sure to watch the live Q&A video Monte did following up on NTC.  Also, watch the video Monte did with Hackmotion where he gets into mechanics of NTC.

[naj959]

4 hours ago, Duffer Mark said:

 

Sounds like ES compliments NTC well providing even more. So does ES compliment BroomForce at all?

Like @TheDeanAbides, they all complement each other. Broomforce has some different drills/feels for transition downswing that add to those already in ES. The big picture is the same for all Monte's videos so you should wind up at the same destination no matter which series resonates with you more.  

[ericschlukebir]

5 hours ago, TheDeanAbides said:

 It’s because you think that the arms swing around the body instead of staying in front of it. 
 

 

thanks, that is really helpful.   My trail shoulder doesn't have tons of flexibility because of an old injury so it doesn't like the pointing down part.  But, that feeling of pushing up and away in the takeaway instead of back and around is really helpful.   I can feel my path being much more straight through the ball.   

 

You are also right about the grip.   I've noticed the club twisting when I don't make good contact.

[TheDeanAbides]

50 minutes ago, ericschlukebir said:

thanks, that is really helpful.   My trail shoulder doesn't have tons of flexibility because of an old injury so it doesn't like the pointing down part.  But, that feeling of pushing up and away in the takeaway instead of back and around is really helpful.   I can feel my path being much more straight through the ball.   

 

You are also right about the grip.   I've noticed the club twisting when I don't make good contact.

Off to bed now, but I’ll find a good resource to help with the grip tomorrow.

[iceman1118]

13 hours ago, TheDeanAbides said:

Off to bed now, but I’ll find a good resource to help with the grip tomorrow.

Please do. Your setup tip from a while back with setting club and right foot to the ball and looking at the target to settle in was amazing. 

[TheDeanAbides]

12 minutes ago, iceman1118 said:

Please do. Your setup tip from a while back with setting club and right foot to the ball and looking at the target to settle in was amazing. 

I’m glad it helped. 🙂

[Boikie]

On 9/20/2022 at 11:44 AM, TheDeanAbides said:

 It’s because you think that the arms swing around the body instead of staying in front of it. 
 

 

Is this consistent with Monte's approach?

[TheDeanAbides]

1 minute ago, Boikie said:

Is this consistent with Monte's approach?

Certainly the arm swing illusion is. It’s  relevant to every swing. Keeping the arms in front of the body is key to NTC.

[flyingwedges2]

29 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

Certainly the arm swing illusion is. It’s  relevant to every swing. Keeping the arms in front of the body is key to NTC.

Waldron isn't the best at conveying the concept, but he is absolutely correct.  I think I referenced it earlier in this thread. Ultimately, the golfer realizes it's about hip articulation, along with extensor action. Do that, and any golf movement becomes immensely easier to repeat, IMHO.

[TheDeanAbides]

5 minutes ago, flyingwedges2 said:

Waldron isn't the best at conveying the concept, but he is absolutely correct.  I think I referenced it earlier in this thread. Ultimately, the golfer realizes it's about hip articulation, along with extensor action. Do that, and any golf movement becomes immensely easier to repeat, IMHO.

Yeah, there’s a lot of truth to that. 

[ericschlukebir]

On 9/21/2022 at 2:09 PM, TheDeanAbides said:

Certainly the arm swing illusion is. It’s  relevant to every swing. Keeping the arms in front of the body is key to NTC.

 

I haven't had a lot of time to work on this the last few days, but starting with the takeaway as described here and keeping the arms in front of the body, almost forces the rest of the NTC movements.   If I keep the rest of my swing the same, but work on this arms in front takeaway, I end up cutting across the ball pretty drastically.   the Cast to 8 seems to keep my hands where they should be, and path is much more neutral.   

[Boikie]

On 9/21/2022 at 4:45 PM, flyingwedges2 said:

Waldron isn't the best at conveying the concept,

So if not Waldron, then who? This has piqued my interest. 

[ahelix]

WOW, NTC is pure gold. I just watched all the videos and in about 15 minutes I was FLUSHING my 7i like never before, consistently, AND EFFORTLESSLY! Monte is a GENIUS!!! Can't believe I wasted so much time beating my head against a wall with my in-person coach!

 

I think the biggest thing (among others) was that I have just remained clueless about the proper arm/wrist movements and sequencing (especially on the downswing). The two throws concept and timing made a HUGE difference for me... so glad I found this.

[glk]

40 minutes ago, ahelix said:

WOW, NTC is pure gold. I just watched all the videos and in about 15 minutes I was FLUSHING my 7i like never before, consistently, AND EFFORTLESSLY! Monte is a GENIUS!!! Can't believe I wasted so much time beating my head against a wall with my in-person coach!

 

I think the biggest thing (among others) was that I have just remained clueless about the proper arm/wrist movements and sequencing (especially on the downswing). The two throws concept and timing made a HUGE difference for me... so glad I found this.

Monte stuff is really good.   I’ve had at least 8in person lessons with him and one via FaceTime.    I would highly recommend a FaceTime/zoom lesson with him - biggest issue folks have with any golf video is that most end up doing thing wrong and focus on parts of the motion that aren’t appropriate (have a poor setup and takeaway yet focus on the cast,as an example).   One lesson will get you on the right track and frankly one lesson every 3 months is more than enough.   Monte offers an improvement plan for a monthly fee where you get discounted lessons and more interaction.

[pgetzen]

For those of you finding success with this swing pattern (and I am one of those), how do you work on speed training with this if at all?  Would it work with a system like Superspeed or Stack while still using the fundamentals of the NTC?  I love the swing, but would like (like most people) to work on increasing some swing speed with it

[naj959]

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Edited October 6, 2022 by naj959

[glk]

1 hour ago, naj959 said:

Question for the lower cap NTC users. Have any of you implemented the pressure shifts advocated by biomechanist like Kwon? Or does thinking about shifting pressure run contrary to the idea of "No Turn" and they should happen naturally. I only ask because I tried shifting pressure and combining the arm movements of NTC (specifically only winding up to 8 o'clock) and started flat out bombing my driver with a very straight ball flight. Previously, I felt very out of synch and was hitting it all over the lot. 

Monte includes the pressure shift in NTC.    Hard to miss

[naj959]

4 hours ago, glk said:

Monte includes the pressure shift in NTC.    Hard to miss

 

Edited October 6, 2022 by naj959

[Duffer Mark]

What’s the best way to practice Cast A so the proper ulnar deviation becomes part of the swing? 

[Trippels]

9 hours ago, Duffer Mark said:

What’s the best way to practice Cast A so the proper ulnar deviation becomes part of the swing? 

Many reps very often at a swing length and speed where you can actually perform the movement. And getting rid of other swing/set-up faults that prevents you from doing it, if any.

Took a long time for me to get it into the swing, but now I think I can do it in a dynamic/legato motion above what you could call "steering speed". And it seems to have fixed my decade long steepening motion.

Although correct me if I'm doing it wrong @MonteScheinblum

 

 

 

Now:

Before:

Edited October 17, 2022 by Trippels

[bcc624]

delete

Edited October 18, 2022 by bcc624

[KD1]

I skimmed the first two pages of search results for this question and was surprised to not find this being discussed:

 

In the videos for cast a and b, a in particular, Monte strongly emphasizes what the lead wrist needs to be doing. Does anyone here focus on the trail hand instead?

 

For me, focusing on the trail hand instead, the cast moves have become the tiddy twister and the spank moves. Someone please stop me if I'm going town the wrong road.

Edited October 19, 2022 by KD1