Phil with new Epic

[AntonA9]

2 very different head shapes next to his bag...

[ProjectX]

Phil with the GCQuad and Trackman double flex.

[Matt70]

1 hour ago, ProjectX said:

Phil with the GCQuad and Trackman double flex.

 

Is it happy or sad to see an artist such as Phil go down the power and speed route?

 

 

[Red4282]

13 minutes ago, Matt70 said:

 

Is it happy or sad to see an artist such as Phil go down the power and speed route?

 

 

He isnt making a very good argument for it, hasnt really been relevant since he has taken this approach.

[bigeasy]

2 sen

2 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

He isnt making a very good argument for it, hasnt really been relevant since he has taken this approach.

2 champions tour wins not too shabby?

[Red4282]

2 minutes ago, bigeasy said:

2 sen

2 champions tour wins not too shabby?

For one of the best golfers to ever play the game who has added distance and speed since he was in his prime... 2 champions tour wins is not impressive, sorry.

[cubuffs]

In true WRXer fashion - the things I noticed about the video when posted yesterday:

 

1.  New Callaway Epic driver - but is that speed or LS?

2. GC Quad and Trackman 

3.  Oh, there is Phil....

[bigeasy]

4 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

For one of the best golfers to ever play the game who has added distance and speed since he was in his prime... 2 champions tour wins is not impressive, sorry.

Sorry, didnt know winning was bad!

[pinestreetgolf]

32 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

He isnt making a very good argument for it, hasnt really been relevant since he has taken this approach.

 

In 1993-94, he was 25th in driving distance.

 

In 2003, he was still 25th in driving distaance.

 

Right now, he is around 25th in driving distance.

 

Stop romanticizing the past.  Mickelson has always been all about speed.  He's not "going down the speed route" - he's always been on the speed route, just like any other player worth a damn (anyone seen Jordan Spieth?).  These are Mickelson's words from just before Bethpage in his prime:

 

"“You can win on the PGA Tour not hitting the ball long. You can out-putt, you can out-strike, you can have great weeks and win golf tournaments without being the longest guy or without overpowering a golf course, but you cannot dominate the sport without speed,” he noted. “You might be able to do it for a year or two, but you can’t out-perform everyone consistently without lots of clubhead speed.”

Edited December 29, 2020 by pinestreetgolf

[BirdieBob]

Now those are DEEP faced drivers!

[Red4282]

12 minutes ago, bigeasy said:

Sorry, didnt know winning was bad!

I didnt say it was bad...? By that logic, I he could go out and win a local cub championship...its not the same thing and you know it. If you would have told me ten years ago phil would be hitting it 340 in 2021, with no real changes to equipment, I would absolutely think he would be winning on the big boy tour. Fact is, the obsession with distance hasnt proven to be too fruitful. Bryson won a major, and thats about it.

[Red4282]

4 minutes ago, pinestreetgolf said:

 

In 1993-94, he was 25th in driving distance.

 

In 2003, he was still 25th in driving distaance.

 

Right now, he is around 25th in driving distance.

 

These are Mickelson's words from just before Bethpage in his prime:

 

"“You can win on the PGA Tour not hitting the ball long. You can out-putt, you can out-strike, you can have great weeks and win golf tournaments without being the longest guy or without overpowering a golf course, but you cannot dominate the sport without speed,” he noted. “You might be able to do it for a year or two, but you can’t out-perform everyone consistently without lots of clubhead speed.”

Well he has the speed, i guess he’s dominating the old guy tour.

[pinestreetgolf]

2 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

I didnt say it was bad...? By that logic, I he could go out and win a local cub championship...its not the same thing and you know it. If you would have told me ten years ago phil would be hitting it 340 in 2021, with no real changes to equipment, I would absolutely think he would be winning on the big boy tour. Fact is, the obsession with distance hasnt proven to be too fruitful. Bryson won a major, and thats about it.

 

You're delusional.  Koepka won two majors as a top 3 in distance guy.  McIlroy, when he won Congressional, was the longest in the world.  Pull out a list.  Dustin. Sergio.  Justin Thomas.

 

The only non-bombers in the last 30 majors are Morikawa, Molinari, Shane Lowry and Reed and even Lowry and Reed are really long.

[pinestreetgolf]

2 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

Well he has the speed, i guess he’s dominating the old guy tour.

 

Yeah, *because he's an old guy*.

 

I'm getting the feeling you're being dumb on purpose to troll me at this point, so I'll exit.

[Red4282]

1 minute ago, pinestreetgolf said:

 

You're delusional.  Koepka won two majors as a top 3 in distance guy.  McIlroy, when he won Congressional, was the longest in the world.  Pull out a list.  Dustin. Sergio.  Justin Thomas.

 

The only non-bombers in the last 30 majors are Morikawa, Molinari, Shane Lowry and Reed and even Lowry and Reed are really long.

Yea the guys you listed are doing that with their natural “comfortable” speed. They are gifted. Phill is obsessed much like bryson about adding gains and “sending it” swinging like 120%, thats is what im talking about with the obession with distance.

[Red4282]

2 minutes ago, pinestreetgolf said:

 

Yeah, *because he's an old guy*.

 

I'm getting the feeling you're being dumb on purpose to troll me at this point, so I'll exit.

But wait, logic. Hes hitting it *farther* now than any time ever in his career. Does age prevent you from hitting a putt or a chip?

[Red4282]

4 minutes ago, pinestreetgolf said:

 

Yeah, *because he's an old guy*.

 

I'm getting the feeling you're being dumb on purpose to troll me at this point, so I'll exit.

Im the biggest phil fan. But his game plummeted when he got obsessed with adding distance. No trolling, just an observation and a reply to someomes comment. Tiger took the opposite approach, hes been content with his 115 swing speed, trying to hit fairways. Now obviosuly a big reason is his body, but he is still somewhat relevant.

[pinestreetgolf]

Just now, Red4282 said:

But wait, logic. Hes hitting it *farther* now than any time ever in his career. Does age prevent you from hitting a putt or a chip?

 

*sighs audibly*

 

No dude, but he's playing against other people.  It doesn't matter that he's as far as he has ever been if everyone else has gotten faster.  He can be 122 (Best in my career!!) but he's still only 25th.  In every year until around 2013 except 1997 (Daly) and 2003 (Hank Kuehne) this year's Mickelson would be the longest hitter on tour.  He isn't winning because everyone else gets to get better too, not just him.  He is trying to keep up (and relatively succeeding, as he IS FREAKING FIFTY YEARS OLD) and has two Champions Tour wins.  He's gone through huge droughts in his career before this, so who knows what will happen.  I do know that saying chasing speed doesn't work because a 50 year old who is maintaining (not improving) his place among other players hasn't won a non-Champions tournament in 13 months is insane.

[pinestreetgolf]

1 minute ago, Red4282 said:

Im the biggest phil fan. But his game plummeted when he got obsessed with adding distance. No trolling, just an observation and a reply to someomes comment. Tiger took the opposite approach, hes been content with his 115 swing speed, trying to hit fairways. Now obviosuly a big reason is his body, but he is still somewhat relevant.

 

Christ dude.  Tiger Woods' averaged 129 mph with the driver on tour this season, 2nd fastest.  Where do you get these 'facts' from?

[Red4282]

18 minutes ago, pinestreetgolf said:

 

Christ dude.  Tiger Woods' averaged 129 mph with the driver on tour this season, 2nd fastest.  Where do you get these 'facts' from?

Wwwwwhat 😳 he was 129 maybe 20 years ago. Just a sec, ill find something..

[pinestreetgolf]

9 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

Wwwwwhat 😳 he was 129 maybe 20 years ago. Just a sec, ill find something..

 

Edited to remove external site link.

 

Let me know if you find anything.

Edited December 29, 2020 by pinestreetgolf

[Red4282]

18 minutes ago, pinestreetgolf said:

 

Edited to remove external site link.

 

Let me know if you find anything.

 

Tiger is a spectator for the most part in this “long drive” but at 4:15 he hits one and they say “116” and he was like “thats all i got”

 

144th on tour and averaging 113 according to this:

 

https://www.pgatour.com/stats/stat.02401.html
 

 

Edit: i guess that link is for one tournament, but you can also check the masters, same, 113 and 144th

Edited December 29, 2020 by Red4282

[radiman]

1 hour ago, Red4282 said:

For one of the best golfers to ever play the game who has added distance and speed since he was in his prime... 2 champions tour wins is not impressive, sorry.

Well, he's also 50.  I would expect him to struggle keeping up with guys 10-20 years younger than him at this point.  

[Bdmac79]

Swinging the Tensei AV Raw Orange.  

[pinestreetgolf]

34 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

 

Tiger is a spectator for the most part in this “long drive” but at 4:15 he hits one and they say “116” and he was like “thats all i got”

 

144th on tour and averaging 113 according to this:

 

https://www.pgatour.com/stats/stat.02401.html
 

 

Edit: i guess that link is for one tournament, but you can also check the masters, same, 113 and 144th

 

No, that link is through that tournament.  Its the correct statistic.

 

I didn't think they would have data for 2021, and I couldn't find him in 2020 or 2019.  129 is through Valspar in 2018.

 

 

But you are correct about Tiger, per those 15 rounds in 2021 he is that slow.  Probably why he never wins! 😛

[ProjectX]

2 hours ago, Matt70 said:

 

Is it happy or sad to see an artist such as Phil go down the power and speed route?

 

 

He was going down this road well before Bryson made it en vogue. Pelz told him he had to hit bombs and drive it like a stallion years ago.

[CKalma]

But did he hit any fairways? Or his target on the range? Or whatever he is aiming at?

[Red4282]

1 hour ago, pinestreetgolf said:

 

No, that link is through that tournament.  Its the correct statistic.

 

I didn't think they would have data for 2021, and I couldn't find him in 2020 or 2019.  129 is through Valspar in 2018.

 

 

But you are correct about Tiger, per those 15 rounds in 2021 he is that slow.  Probably why he never wins! 😛

Thats even more of an indictment on the speed arguement. If he has that gear and chooses not to go there... maybe its his body, maybe its keeping his ball in play. 🤷‍♂️

[NoTalentLefty]

On 12/29/2020 at 7:57 AM, Red4282 said:

But wait, logic. Hes hitting it *farther* now than any time ever in his career. Does age prevent you from hitting a putt or a chip?

No. I hit my putts and chips farther past the hole at 62 than ever .

Edited December 30, 2020 by NoTalentLefty

[SUMM1T]

2 hours ago, Red4282 said:

For one of the best golfers to ever play the game who has added distance and speed since he was in his prime... 2 champions tour wins is not impressive, sorry.

 

This is such a shallow argument. Phil is 50 and he's transformed his body (hard enough at that age) and then won twice on champions Tour. Regardless of how you personally feel about the Champions Tour, it's a big deal to go out there and win like Phil did. To expect Phil at his age to do what kids half his age are doing while maintaining expectations of him in his prime is incredibly and impossibly high standards.