Scotty Cameron 009 vs. Scratch 726 Putter

[putterho009]

Wow great thread.

I myself LOVE the look of a 009.. I just can't justify the price now a days. I just inquired sbout a custom Dalehead.. I think the BBO is pretty close too..

[Olson12]

[quote name='DixieMafia' timestamp='1391643074' post='8606165']
Is the neck not machined?
[/quote]

He said all the necks are hand made

[Mikey Town]

[quote name='Snufles' timestamp='1391643454' post='8606207']
[quote name='Mikey Town' timestamp='1391622995' post='8604089']
[quote name='smeech8000' timestamp='1391618772' post='8603605']
[quote name='mcmanus' timestamp='1391551769' post='8598699']
Wow... $1,100?? That's rediculous! Can't you order a GSS DH89 for cheaper?[/quote]

Not including custom options like finish & stamping. But technically, yes - baseline price of GSS DH89 is [i]only [/i]$1,000.

As good as this looks, I'd rather have a pimped DH89 mini for half the price.
[/quote]

Just for the record... Byron doesn't charge extra for stamping and only certain finishes cost extra. It's actually pretty easy to design a fantastic looking putter with no upcharges at all.

Back on track...

[color=#0000FF][b]If Scratch wanted to sell a bunch of these,[/b][/color] I think the price point would have to come in at $349. Then, you would be able to get into an Dale Head for the price of an OTR Scotty, and it would present a significant cost savings over a Byron. Not only would they take a bunch of orders from WRX, but I wouldn't be surprised if they could get them on the shelves at a few of the big box stores. If you put this putter next to a Cameron Select or a Kenny Giannini, for a very similar price point, the choice would be clear (to me, anyway). They would probably sell quite a few of them.

The $550 price point, however, seems to limit their target market to Scratch loyalists and collectors, only. Anyone who is looking for a DH style putter, but doesn't want to spend the coin for a $2000-$3000 009, would probably end up going with Byron. While it's $50 less, it's not all about the $50. Byron has been making Dale Head putters forever, and has truly mastered the design and execution of them. Not only can you have your putter built by someone who has mastered the DH design, but you can also spend $50 less to have your putter built... that last bit is just a bonus.

That said, if I had a bag full of Scratch clubs, or I was a collector that liked this head style, I'd probably be in the market for this. I'm a big fan of the Case Hardened finishes that James Ingles does.
[/quote]

No way they are going to get someone to hand file a Dale Head for $350. Even before he hooked up with Scratch JI was into creating some extraordinary putters. This guy could braid you a long neck if you wanted.
[/quote]

I understand that. However, you may have brushed over one of the most important parts of my post. It is highlighted in [color=#0000FF][b]blue[/b][/color].

Since my post, James was nice enough to come on here and offer some more insight behind this project. As it turns out, James Ingles, and Scratch, do not want to "sell a bunch of these." It's simply a limited run of a couple dozen putters... which makes much more sense. Add into the deal that the putter comes with any neck you want (handmade and welded), the beautiful bullet logo and fantastic finish options, and $550 is looking much more like a great bang for your buck custom than an overpriced production piece.

That said, I still stand by my statement. I believe that anyone looking to make a significant splash in the Dale Head market would have to come in at a price point around $349, for reasons previously stated.

[SatelliteGuy]

Priced me out.

Putt well with it Boomer... It's gonna be amazing I'm sure!

[zip7111]

The bottom line is Scotty will sell more 009's for 2000 dollars than a 1000 dollar scratch putter. Look at the putter market, Scotty Cameron putters are the only brand that holds their value.

[Medson]

Thanks for clarifying this part. I'm always wondering if Byron touches on the standard head shapes with no further instruction from the customers.

[quote name='Mikey Town' timestamp='1391623568' post='8604153']
However, Byron's DH89 blanks come from the CNC "rough" as well (some edges are so sharp that you need to be careful when handling them so you don't cut yourself). Then he hand finishes the edges, corners, necks, bumpers, etc...
[/quote]

[stage1350]

I would have to think that the only company that could make these with the rounded edges straight from the CNC would be Bettinardi. The level of detail they put into their machining might allow them to create this shape of head with minimal handwork and keep the price point.

But, similar to the Scratch customer, there may not be an appetite to sell at that price. Like Scratch, Bettinardi's high end putters are not designed to compete with companies like Odyssey and non-milled Ping putters and their price points.

Someone stated above that if the 009 was available at $349, nobody would want it because it would kill the exclusivity of it. Considering that the 1995-1996 carbon steel Newports have the rounded bumpers people are looking for, I'd tend to agree. Granted, you are missing the thicker, flatter topline. However, I'd think some of the good putter modifiers out there could adjust an older Newport during restoration to make it what you want.

This thread also demonstrates what a great deal the DH-89 from Byron truly is. The Scratch is a nice putter and I'd love to own an Ingles 8802 style some day. But at their current running prices, I have other items on my wish list that will have to come first.

[Snufles]

[quote name='Mikey Town' timestamp='1391646988' post='8606559']
[quote name='Snufles' timestamp='1391643454' post='8606207']
[quote name='Mikey Town' timestamp='1391622995' post='8604089']
[quote name='smeech8000' timestamp='1391618772' post='8603605']
[quote name='mcmanus' timestamp='1391551769' post='8598699']
Wow... $1,100?? That's rediculous! Can't you order a GSS DH89 for cheaper?[/quote]

Not including custom options like finish & stamping. But technically, yes - baseline price of GSS DH89 is [i]only [/i]$1,000.

As good as this looks, I'd rather have a pimped DH89 mini for half the price.
[/quote]

Just for the record... Byron doesn't charge extra for stamping and only certain finishes cost extra. It's actually pretty easy to design a fantastic looking putter with no upcharges at all.

Back on track...

[color=#0000FF][b]If Scratch wanted to sell a bunch of these,[/b][/color] I think the price point would have to come in at $349. Then, you would be able to get into an Dale Head for the price of an OTR Scotty, and it would present a significant cost savings over a Byron. Not only would they take a bunch of orders from WRX, but I wouldn't be surprised if they could get them on the shelves at a few of the big box stores. If you put this putter next to a Cameron Select or a Kenny Giannini, for a very similar price point, the choice would be clear (to me, anyway). They would probably sell quite a few of them.

The $550 price point, however, seems to limit their target market to Scratch loyalists and collectors, only. Anyone who is looking for a DH style putter, but doesn't want to spend the coin for a $2000-$3000 009, would probably end up going with Byron. While it's $50 less, it's not all about the $50. Byron has been making Dale Head putters forever, and has truly mastered the design and execution of them. Not only can you have your putter built by someone who has mastered the DH design, but you can also spend $50 less to have your putter built... that last bit is just a bonus.

That said, if I had a bag full of Scratch clubs, or I was a collector that liked this head style, I'd probably be in the market for this. I'm a big fan of the Case Hardened finishes that James Ingles does.
[/quote]

No way they are going to get someone to hand file a Dale Head for $350. Even before he hooked up with Scratch JI was into creating some extraordinary putters. This guy could braid you a long neck if you wanted.
[/quote]

I understand that. However, you may have brushed over one of the most important parts of my post. It is highlighted in [color=#0000FF][b]blue[/b][/color].

Since my post, James was nice enough to come on here and offer some more insight behind this project. As it turns out, James Ingles, and Scratch, do not want to "sell a bunch of these." It's simply a limited run of a couple dozen putters... which makes much more sense. Add into the deal that the putter comes with any neck you want (handmade and welded), the beautiful bullet logo and fantastic finish options, and $550 is looking much more like a great bang for your buck custom than an overpriced production piece.

That said, I still stand by my statement. I believe that anyone looking to make a significant splash in the Dale Head market would have to come in at a price point around $349, for reasons previously stated.
[/quote]

No I didn't brush past it, it just isn't possible.

[highergr0und]

What makes the 009 so special? For the scotty people, it's a fine line between prestige, bragging, and rarity. For a byron person, it's about the opportunity to have a personalized piece for you. For Scratch, it looks like it'll be able a limited production run. Every company has a strategy behind their product and price.

Do people think nobody has contemplated a 009 big production run? I just don't think the numbers are there. People on WRX tend to extend the viewpoint of die hard golfers to the whole golfing population. Heck, companies barely even make traditional putter headshapes any more. It's all about how crazy they can make their mallets look.

[jmac13]

I would venture to say Byron sells twice as many DH89's than any other model he makes if not more, so I think it's as much about the style/shape as it is about a personalized putter. JMHO.

[swizbeatz]

Cool stuff Boomer, can't wait to see how it turns out!

[BogeyDog11]

Where is Greg and that guy from Wisconsin with all this hate going on......

Calling out one for Xeroxing a putter from the king of Xeroxing is laughable at best.....

The pot has officially called the kettle black....

[BogeyDog11]

[quote name='highergr0und' timestamp='1391659081' post='8607627']
What makes the 009 so special? For the scotty people, it's a fine line between prestige, bragging, and [b]r[b]arity[/b].[/b] For a byron person, it's about the opportunity to have a personalized piece for you. For Scratch, it looks like it'll be able a limited production run. Every company has a strategy behind their product and price.

Do people think nobody has contemplated a 009 big production run? I just don't think the numbers are there. People on WRX tend to extend the viewpoint of die hard golfers to the whole golfing population. Heck, companies barely even make traditional putter headshapes any more. It's all about how crazy they can make their mallets look.
[/quote]

There is nothing "rare" about an 009.

[finalist]

HAHAHA!!! Great avatar ^^

[rymail00]

I am interested to see what the production/limited run CNC putter looks like.

Boomer, nice putter.

[Pure745]

[quote name='finalist' timestamp='1391732951' post='8612521']
HAHAHA!!! Great avatar ^^
[/quote]

You have found your soul mate!

[QMany]

Ari, I'm glad you didn't have that when I met you at Sand Hills. You would have "lost" it.

[SatelliteGuy]

I'm curious why Scratch charges more than Byron...

Does that seem WAY off to anyone else?

[stage1350]

[quote name='DirecTVTechGuy' timestamp='1391751644' post='8614467']
I'm curious why Scratch charges more than Byron...

Does that seem WAY off to anyone else?
[/quote]

Scratch and Byron don't seem off. Ingles is working a niche market and wants to keep a more exclusive number. Hence, a slightly higher price point.

The part I don't get is when you look at both numbers to a 009. Ingles and Byron will be handworking your putters from either OEM. Cameron will not be touching your 009.

[finalist]

[quote name='Pure745' timestamp='1391751385' post='8614449']
[quote name='finalist' timestamp='1391732951' post='8612521']
HAHAHA!!! Great avatar ^^
[/quote]

You have found your soul mate!
[/quote]

Love is in the air. 2/14.

... The thread titled "Byron Lovers" makes me picture an evening fireplace, a warm bear skin rug and Byron grinding putters in corner with a glass of wine.
...and Soft Hands Scotty is in the kitchen baking bread.

[Pure745]

^^^^ HAHAHAHAH! OH MY.

[KevCarter]

[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1391730244' post='8612285']
Where is Greg and that guy from Wisconsin with all this hate going on......

Calling out one for Xeroxing a putter from the king of Xeroxing is laughable at best.....

The pot has officially called the kettle black....
[/quote]

LOL, calling him out? I made a joke.

Too bad you can't turn your obsession for Scotty Cameron into something positive.

Kevin

[Scotty1140]

[quote name='kevcarter' timestamp='1391796594' post='8617157']
[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1391730244' post='8612285']
Where is Greg and that guy from Wisconsin with all this hate going on......

Calling out one for Xeroxing a putter from the king of Xeroxing is laughable at best.....

The pot has officially called the kettle black....
[/quote]

LOL, calling him out? I made a joke.

Too bad you can't turn your obsession for Scotty Cameron into something positive.

Kevin
[/quote]
For someone who dislikes the brand so much he sure posts in a LOT of threads....

[Scotty1140]

[quote name='finalist' timestamp='1391785282' post='8615573']
[quote name='Pure745' timestamp='1391751385' post='8614449']
[quote name='finalist' timestamp='1391732951' post='8612521']
HAHAHA!!! Great avatar ^^
[/quote]

You have found your soul mate!
[/quote]

Love is in the air. 2/14.

... The thread titled "Byron Lovers" makes me picture an evening fireplace, a warm bear skin rug and Byron grinding putters in corner with a glass of wine.
...and Soft Hands Scotty is in the kitchen baking bread.
[/quote]
LOL!

That scene has to make its way to a headcover haha

[BogeyDog11]

[quote name='Scotty1140' timestamp='1391808733' post='8618565']
[quote name='kevcarter' timestamp='1391796594' post='8617157']
[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1391730244' post='8612285']
Where is Greg and that guy from Wisconsin with all this hate going on......

Calling out one for Xeroxing a putter from the king of Xeroxing is laughable at best.....

The pot has officially called the kettle black....
[/quote]

LOL, calling him out? I made a joke.

Too bad you can't turn your obsession for Scotty Cameron into something positive.

Kevin
[/quote]
For someone who dislikes the brand so much he sure posts in a LOT of threads....
[/quote]

As usual, it is ok to hate on Scratch but not on [b]Don[/b]. Give the Butler family a call and see how they feel right now.

If you look at the last 100 Cameron related threads, I've posted in less than two or three in the past 6 months..........

[KevCarter]

[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1391814276' post='8619145']
[quote name='Scotty1140' timestamp='1391808733' post='8618565']
[quote name='kevcarter' timestamp='1391796594' post='8617157']
[quote name='BogeyDog11' timestamp='1391730244' post='8612285']
Where is Greg and that guy from Wisconsin with all this hate going on......

Calling out one for Xeroxing a putter from the king of Xeroxing is laughable at best.....

The pot has officially called the kettle black....
[/quote]

LOL, calling him out? I made a joke.

Too bad you can't turn your obsession for Scotty Cameron into something positive.

Kevin
[/quote]
For someone who dislikes the brand so much he sure posts in a LOT of threads....
[/quote]

As usual, it is ok to hate on Scratch but not on [b]Don[/b]. Give the Butler family a call and see how they feel right now.

If you look at the last 100 Cameron related threads, I've posted in less than two or three in the past 6 months..........
[/quote]

LOL Too stupid to see how transparent you are. You aren't firing me up like you're trying to do, only making me laugh, just like everyone else who has seen your posts.

[Medson]

Didn't Butler family want out for a while?

[Mitchell]

Shouldn't discussion be about relative merits of each putter and not marketing practices? Hmmm...wonder where heard that before and if that kills discourse?

[KevCarter]

[quote name='nochrome' timestamp='1391815658' post='8619262']
Shouldn't discussion be about relative merits of each putter and not marketing practices? Hmmm...wonder where heard that before and if that kills discourse?
[/quote]

I personally think this Scratch is a great looking putter, and would consider buying one. I made a joke early on in the thread, thought folks here would be intelligent enough to get it, and this douchebag called me out, again. I apologize for my part of the discussion, but the Scotty haters have been allowed to get out of control, and I am going to start defending myself. Only on this forum, could pictures of measuring and recreating a Scotty putter by another manufacturer get turned around into a Scotty hatefest. I've simply had enough of these idiots from ******Talk, and I think everybody else has too.

[dwboston]

[quote name='kevcarter' timestamp='1391816146' post='8619310']
[quote name='nochrome' timestamp='1391815658' post='8619262']
Shouldn't discussion be about relative merits of each putter and not marketing practices? Hmmm...wonder where heard that before and if that kills discourse?
[/quote]

I personally think this Scratch is a great looking putter, and would consider buying one. I made a joke early on in the thread, thought folks here would be intelligent enough to get it, and this douchebag called me out, again. I apologize for my part of the discussion, but the Scotty haters have been allowed to get out of control, and I am going to start defending myself. Only on this forum, could pictures of measuring and recreating a Scotty putter by another manufacturer get turned around into a Scotty hatefest. I've simply had enough of these idiots from ******Talk, and I think everybody else has too.
[/quote]

I took the photos of the 009 being measured as a direct shot at Scotty Xerox, knowing there isn't a damn thing he can do about it, given his history and lack of intellectual property for this putter. I guess the truth hurts some people who are blindly loyal to his brand.