Muirfield Not Hosting Any Future Opens

[Gem]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

Most people in some position of authority or high level sports are too afraid to speak against any p.c. issue for fear of being slaughtered by the brainwashed but vocal minority or possibly lose sponsorship.

 

I am glad Peter Allis has spoken some sense on this matter.

 

People should be allowed to run a club with like minded people and I really fail to see where people can have any problem with private clubs doing this.

[Ayoung19]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

You really can't be serious? This is a private club, a private organization, they can do what they want. You and all the other SJWs will soon be clamoring for the government to force clubs and groups to let anyone do anything they want. Why have any groups at all? Let's just have a nice utopia where everyone gets everything they want and no one has to work and everyone feels included and safe. Its pathetic. That is not how the world works, the sooner you realize that the better off you will be.

[tbowles411]

While I respect the fact you are not defending them, jut playing devils advocate, I cant tell you how cross I am about this. I have a fundamental, unshakeable belief that no one individual should be prevented from doing something on the basis of gender, religion, race or anything else that people choose to differentiate about. I don't give a toss if they are protecting a tradition. Traditions fade out. We used to burn 'witches', it wasnt our greatest of moments in history, or our greatest tradition.

 

I'll defend them. I have a fundamental, unshakeable belief that no one individual should be allowed to tell others how to live their lives. I should be allowed to choose whom I associate with for any reason whatsoever or for no reason at all.

 

In my mind, it has nothing to do with tradition. It's about a person's individual rights.

 

I agree with you. I understand why people are upset about Muirfield's decision, but it's no different than a gym (that you have to be accepted to/pay to be a member of) being only for women. Scream and cry about sexism all you want, but sometimes men just want to be around other men just like there are times women just want to be around other women. The club and its members, whether it be a private golf course or a private gym or whatever other private club we are referring to, has the right to make the rules about who can and can't join. If the policy is bad enough, they will lose members = losing money = making a decision whether to change the policy or staying the same and not being as successful.

 

I think in this day and age there's a certain part of the population who is simply looking for a reason to be "offended" and then moves to crush whatever offends them. That's at least part of what is going on here.

I agree with you...to a point. There are many places, clubs, etc. restrict membership. And those places have a right to do so, but they are also open to all of the distain that comes with it and can be stripped of any prominence that could come with their organization. The market will correct them if the indignation is strong enough, and that would be the byproduct of that. That being said, many prominent clubs have changed their stances and allowed membership to women. It's not the 19th century anymore. Again, while they have the right do restrict membership, this flies in the face of making the game more inclusive and goes to further the notion that golf is still for a select few. Real or perceived.

[hogans71]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

"It's more a loss to Muirfield than it is to us"???

 

Hahahaha!

 

Yes, please... Let's base our supposed socio and political views on world golf rankings.

 

 

[bscinstnct]

Was a very close vote,

 

"Of the 616 members who cast a ballot, 397, or 64%, voted in favour of admitting women, while 219, or 36%, voted against. A further 14 votes in favour of change were needed to reach the two-thirds majority."

 

http://www.telegraph...joining-says-v/

 

Also,

 

"the contents of a letter distributed by the dissenters that expressed concerns about slow play and making women “feel uncomfortable” as reasons for upholding its all-male membership.

The letter added that the club was “quite unique with its fraternity built inter alia, on foursomes play with a round taking only the same time as lunch and leaving enough time for a further round after lunch (even in midwinter). This is one of miracles in modern-day play and is much admired. Our foursomes and speedy play would be endangered.”"

 

http://www.nytimes.c...itish-open.html

[Chartridge82]

The Honourable Company of Edinburgh Golfers (Muirfield is the name of the course they moved to in the late 19th century, not the club) was founded in 1744. The R&A was formed in 1754.

 

I'm not so sure that the decision taken by those members who objected to this change in their constitution (about 36%) was based around a desire to discriminate against women, rather than be told what to do or bow to pressure by the politicians of the day and/or organisation that hasn't been around for as long as they have. Not condoning their actions, just trying to suggest a different motive.

 

This is one of the oldest golf clubs in the world, and they are fiercely proud of the traditions & history they have. This is just an idea, I may be wrong. Don't shoot me for it.

 

While I respect the fact you are not defending them, jut playing devils advocate, I cant tell you how cross I am about this. I have a fundamental, unshakeable belief that no one individual should be prevented from doing something on the basis of gender, religion, race or anything else that people choose to differentiate about. I don't give a toss if they are protecting a tradition. Traditions fade out. We used to burn 'witches', it wasnt our greatest of moments in history, or our greatest tradition.

 

Well how about rich or poor? Would the club have to invite candidates that can't afford it to join and subsidize them? How about crass or refined? Would they have to invite any foul mouthed person even though they offend the members? How about if the club was for reformed alcoholics. Would they be forced to accept drinking members and accommodate their habits?

 

How about person X who is a celebrity and is always pursued by the tabloids. Should they have to admit that person even though their presence would cause the club to be assaulted by snooping reporters day and night? Can you discriminate against famous celebrities?

 

Its totally and utterly different. You can't compare discrmination against women to the ability to afford it.

[spbrooks]

This is one of the rare subjects of my independent type of nature leans toward conservative.

 

Everyone on the inclusion side of the argument likes to yell that is wrong for a private club (golf, or otherwise) to disallow membership based on gender, race, religion, etc., but they have never once provided a sufficient argument as to why.

 

If a private golf course wants to allow its membership to be only men, so what? Let them have it.

If a private car club wants to be all female, so what? Let them have it.

If a private art club wants to be all African American, so what? Let them have it.

If a private video game club wants to be all white, so what? Let them have it.

 

I fail to see how any of these things are cause for the members being considered either immoral, or antiquated. People demanding inclusion often seem to believe they are busting down the doors of discrimination when what they're really accomplishing is the redefinition of what it means to be private which, in my mind, is far more terrifying than allowing the same gender/race/religion of people to have their homogenous associations.

 

Forced inclusion is as impotent as it is a dangerous concept in the way it pertains to private organization which is the lifeblood of pretty much any civilization which claims capitalism in any sense.

 

There is nothing wrong with Muirfield remaining a Men's only club just as there is nothing wrong with The Open not being played there because of it.

 

All that said, the second that any of this touches (or attempts to influence) either public, or governmental domain, all bets are off. In that case, I would be the first in line with my sledgehammer in hand.

 

I can give you a very practical real world reason why sir.

 

My daughter has already said to me that she doesn't want to play golf because it scares her that there are so many miserable old men around my Club, and that it's the same at every Course I play. So you see, her impression of Golf is of miserable old men. Who knows, she could be good at the game, and we have lost that potential talent. I'm not going to push her into doing something that she is uncomfortable with, but is it healthy for the game to lose both numbers and talent regardless of gender purely because of the impressions and perceptions that are so rife?

Where the he** do you play.......I think you need to be worried about your course and leave Muirfield alone.

 

Obviously people are missing the point here and have mistaken what I have said somehow out of context. Let me make it clearer for you and the others that have made the same point. My daughter perception of golf is of miserable men dominating the environment. That feeling alone is obviously going to intimidate some people, and that alone, then effects their perception of the game. It's not just at my Club it's at every Club she has visited with me in the past, to the point now, where she simply will not come. It's about her perception. To you and many others that 'perception' may be mistaken of course, but to her it is, and it's that empathy to other peoples feelings that some people are missing.

 

This perception of the game of being an old mans' pastime, and full of angry men is there, people can stick their head in the sand as much as they want but those perceptions sadly exist. I would like those perceptions to change, but sadly it seems that by some of the comments on here, bigotry in the game still exist in spades, and those angry intimidating men that proliferate in the game are still there, and my daughters perceptions are well founded.

You sir must be very unfortunate in the clubs you choose to visit. My son is 12 years old and has been playing the Jr. PGA for 2 seasons. They get to play at various private clubs and they cannot have been made to feel anymore welcome. His team is made up of boys, girls of many nationalities. Everyone involved has made it an encouraging and enjoyable experience.

[Langlands]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

"It's more a loss to Muirfield than it is to us"???

 

Hahahaha!

 

Yes, please... Let's base our supposed socio and political views on world golf rankings.

 

The hypocrisy of the likes of McIlroy and Gary Player here is stunning - they have been quite happy to play at Muirfield for years (decades in Player's case), all of a sudden they are critical because the club did not agree to change their constitution to allow women members.

[Roadking2003]

I agree with you...to a point. There are many places, clubs, etc. restrict membership. And those places have a right to do so, but they are also open to all of the distain that comes with it and can be stripped of any prominence that could come with their organization. The market will correct them if the indignation is strong enough, and that would be the byproduct of that. That being said, many prominent clubs have changed their stances and allowed membership to women. It's not the 19th century anymore. Again, while they have the right do restrict membership, this flies in the face of making the game more inclusive and goes to further the notion that golf is still for a select few. Real or perceived.

 

If the market forces a club to change their rules, sobeit.

 

BTW, I don't think this will impact making the game more inclusive at all. The characteristics of golf that keep participation down have nothing to do with decisions by private clubs. It's much more about the time required, the cost and the difficulty of the game.

[firstbatch]

Was a very close vote,

 

"Of the 616 members who cast a ballot, 397, or 64%, voted in favour of admitting women, while 219, or 36%, voted against. A further 14 votes in favour of change were needed to reach the two-thirds majority."

 

http://www.telegraph...joining-says-v/

 

Also,

 

"the contents of a letter distributed by the dissenters that expressed concerns about slow play and making women “feel uncomfortable” as reasons for upholding its all-male membership.

The letter added that the club was “quite unique with its fraternity built inter alia, on foursomes play with a round taking only the same time as lunch and leaving enough time for a further round after lunch (even in midwinter). This is one of miracles in modern-day play and is much admired. Our foursomes and speedy play would be endangered.”"

 

http://www.nytimes.c...itish-open.html

 

Thanks for the links.

[sefus12]

While I respect the fact you are not defending them, jut playing devils advocate, I cant tell you how cross I am about this. I have a fundamental, unshakeable belief that no one individual should be prevented from doing something on the basis of gender, religion, race or anything else that people choose to differentiate about. I don't give a toss if they are protecting a tradition. Traditions fade out. We used to burn 'witches', it wasnt our greatest of moments in history, or our greatest tradition.

 

I'll defend them. I have a fundamental, unshakeable belief that no one individual should be allowed to tell others how to live their lives. I should be allowed to choose whom I associate with for any reason whatsoever or for no reason at all.

 

In my mind, it has nothing to do with tradition. It's about a person's individual rights.

 

I agree with you. I understand why people are upset about Muirfield's decision, but it's no different than a gym (that you have to be accepted to/pay to be a member of) being only for women. Scream and cry about sexism all you want, but sometimes men just want to be around other men just like there are times women just want to be around other women. The club and its members, whether it be a private golf course or a private gym or whatever other private club we are referring to, has the right to make the rules about who can and can't join. If the policy is bad enough, they will lose members = losing money = making a decision whether to change the policy or staying the same and not being as successful.

 

I think in this day and age there's a certain part of the population who is simply looking for a reason to be "offended" and then moves to crush whatever offends them. That's at least part of what is going on here.

I agree with you...to a point. There are many places, clubs, etc. restrict membership. And those places have a right to do so, but they are also open to all of the distain that comes with it and can be stripped of any prominence that could come with their organization. The market will correct them if the indignation is strong enough, and that would be the byproduct of that. That being said, many prominent clubs have changed their stances and allowed membership to women. It's not the 19th century anymore. Again, while they have the right do restrict membership, this flies in the face of making the game more inclusive and goes to further the notion that golf is still for a select few. Real or perceived.

 

That's what I was getting at with my "bad policy" line. I don't necessarily agree that a vocal minority should be able to impose their will on clubs if they are simply loud enough. Also, it's not Muirfield's responsibility to grow the game. But if the policy is bad, they will lose money and will have decisions to make.

[Roadking2003]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

"It's more a loss to Muirfield than it is to us"???

 

Hahahaha!

 

Yes, please... Let's base our supposed socio and political views on world golf rankings.

 

McIlroy should stick with golf and leave the political analysis to others. This is NO loss to the golf club and a HUGE loss to the R&A. The members at Muirfield know they have a world class course with a rich history. They don't need the R&A or Rory McIlroy to confirm that fact.

[Shilgy]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

That is what you get from all of that?? Player and McIlroy both said that they should not hold the Open there. Neither said anything about should they be forced to have women members. No one on this board has said Muirfield should be allowed to exclude women as members AND hold the Open. The wives of members per Peter Alliss had no interest in being members in their own right.

[MattTheTaff]

Good

 

At least someone has the balls not get on their knees and bow down to the Mighty Clam.

 

I kid, I kid.

 

Should really open up to women. It quickly becomes a sausage fest otherwise.

 

since we agree that such rules would "quickly" lead to a sausage fest, can you imagine what it's like after 3 or 4 centuries. I mean, I'm thinking an environment totally unsuited for the fairer sex. Foul language, off color jokes, passing gas at the table...all manner of disgustimundo. Like a 4 guy golf road trip that goes on for 400 years.....yech....

 

In Scotland

 

Frigging animals

[spbrooks]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

Most people in some position of authority or high level sports are too afraid to speak against any p.c. issue for fear of being slaughtered by the brainwashed but vocal minority or possibly lose sponsorship.

 

I am glad Peter Allis has spoken some sense on this matter.

 

People should be allowed to run a club with like minded people and I really fail to see where people can have any problem with private clubs doing this.

Rory has 250 million reasons to voice "his" opinion carefully

[Langlands]

Good

 

At least someone has the balls not get on their knees and bow down to the Mighty Clam.

 

I kid, I kid.

 

Should really open up to women. It quickly becomes a sausage fest otherwise.

 

since we agree that such rules would "quickly" lead to a sausage fest, can you imagine what it's like after 3 or 4 centuries. I mean, I'm thinking an environment totally unsuited for the fairer sex. Foul language, off color jokes, passing gas at the table...all manner of disgustimundo. Like a 4 guy golf road trip that goes on for 400 years.....yech....

 

In Scotland

 

Frigging animals

 

Steady on! :D

[Roadking2003]

The hypocrisy of the likes of McIlroy and Gary Player here is stunning - they have been quite happy to play at Muirfield for years (decades in Player's case), all of a sudden they are critical because the club did not agree to change their constitution to allow women members.

 

Professional golfers should stick to golf. Player commented because he wanted to tell us once again that he won there. I think his ego is getting even bigger as he ages.

[tbowles411]

While I respect the fact you are not defending them, jut playing devils advocate, I cant tell you how cross I am about this. I have a fundamental, unshakeable belief that no one individual should be prevented from doing something on the basis of gender, religion, race or anything else that people choose to differentiate about. I don't give a toss if they are protecting a tradition. Traditions fade out. We used to burn 'witches', it wasnt our greatest of moments in history, or our greatest tradition.

 

I'll defend them. I have a fundamental, unshakeable belief that no one individual should be allowed to tell others how to live their lives. I should be allowed to choose whom I associate with for any reason whatsoever or for no reason at all.

 

In my mind, it has nothing to do with tradition. It's about a person's individual rights.

 

I agree with you. I understand why people are upset about Muirfield's decision, but it's no different than a gym (that you have to be accepted to/pay to be a member of) being only for women. Scream and cry about sexism all you want, but sometimes men just want to be around other men just like there are times women just want to be around other women. The club and its members, whether it be a private golf course or a private gym or whatever other private club we are referring to, has the right to make the rules about who can and can't join. If the policy is bad enough, they will lose members = losing money = making a decision whether to change the policy or staying the same and not being as successful.

 

I think in this day and age there's a certain part of the population who is simply looking for a reason to be "offended" and then moves to crush whatever offends them. That's at least part of what is going on here.

I agree with you...to a point. There are many places, clubs, etc. restrict membership. And those places have a right to do so, but they are also open to all of the distain that comes with it and can be stripped of any prominence that could come with their organization. The market will correct them if the indignation is strong enough, and that would be the byproduct of that. That being said, many prominent clubs have changed their stances and allowed membership to women. It's not the 19th century anymore. Again, while they have the right do restrict membership, this flies in the face of making the game more inclusive and goes to further the notion that golf is still for a select few. Real or perceived.

 

That's what I was getting at with my "bad policy" line. I don't necessarily agree that a vocal minority should be able to impose their will on clubs if they are simply loud enough. Also, it's not Muirfield's responsibility to grow the game. But if the policy is bad, they will lose money and will have decisions to make.

Then I missed that. :)

[larssonlegend]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

"It's more a loss to Muirfield than it is to us"???

 

Hahahaha!

 

Yes, please... Let's base our supposed socio and political views on world golf rankings.

 

The hypocrisy of the likes of McIlroy and Gary Player here is stunning - they have been quite happy to play at Muirfield for years (decades in Player's case), all of a sudden they are critical because the club did not agree to change their constitution to allow women members.

 

It's no more hypocritical than Jack and Arnie playing at Augusta before they allowed African Americans to play. I'm pretty sure they hated the policy . Folk are missing the point not many are arguing that they shouldn't be allowed to do what they want. They are just asking why not? For what good reason other than believing they are superior?

[llamont]

Wow... Folks are actually upset with the R&A because they (R&A) banned discriminatory clubs from hosting tournaments that are said to promote the participation of all interested in the game???? I say good for the R&A. Nobody is forcing MV to change their discriminatory membership policy but nobody is going to force a non-discriminate golf association to host events at such a club.

[JaNelson38]

Private clubs should be able to allow who they want. Period.

 

Good on Muirfield for standing up for what they want in their club, and for not relenting to the R&A pressure of taking a tournament away from them if they didnt change to the way the R&A wanted.

 

I cant wait for the R&A reaction when a journalist gets by the faux outrage to ask why they didnt do the same to Royal Troon, which is an all male golf club.

 

Are you out of your mind? In this day in age a group of elite men have actively discriminated against 50% of the population and your response is 'good on Muirfield'. The majority of the British population is embarrassed that this is happening in our country. But hey, more power to them.

 

Muirfield is a private golf club. On private property. Having another entity trying to direct them towards having or not having someone be in their membership is the part that is "wrong" here.

 

Would you let the government or another private entity allow someone whom you dont know or approve of into your private home or on your private property? If your answer is no, then you have no leg to stand on with regards to this issue.

 

The R&A is well within their rights to host their tournament where they see fit for any reason. But a private golf club is allowed to let whomever they want in as a member for any reason as well. For the R&A to have held this over the head of Muirfield to force them to change membership rules or lose The Open was all about strong-arming a private entity into a political/social belief that that R&A holds and wants to push onto others. Whether you, I or anyone else agree with that political/social belief is irrelevant. Whom Muirfield allows or doesnt allow as members to their private club is a private property issue, not a discrimination issue.

 

The part of this whole drama that is becoming "embarrassing" is the fact that we are fast becoming a world where everything should be allowed to everyone, and if it isnt, you should either be angry or offended. If Im looking to join a golf club, Im looking to join a club that is willing and happy to have me, not trying to force my way into a club that I dont meet the requirements for joining by simply claiming "discrimination".

 

What's next? Private clubs being forced to let people in as members who can't afford to pay the stated membership dues because, if someone cant afford it, they're being "discriminated" against by "elite men" (your words) because of their economic status?

[Langlands]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

"It's more a loss to Muirfield than it is to us"???

 

Hahahaha!

 

Yes, please... Let's base our supposed socio and political views on world golf rankings.

 

The hypocrisy of the likes of McIlroy and Gary Player here is stunning - they have been quite happy to play at Muirfield for years (decades in Player's case), all of a sudden they are critical because the club did not agree to change their constitution to allow women members.

 

It's no more hypocritical than Jack and Arnie playing at Augusta before they allowed African Americans to play. I'm pretty sure they hated the policy . Folk are missing the point not many are arguing that they shouldn't be allowed to do what they want. They are just asking why not? For what good reason other than believing they are superior?

 

So what you're saying is that the issue here is not that they don't allow women members, they just haven't given you a good explanation for why they don't?

 

If Jack and Arnie hated the policy at Augusta like you are presuming then their participation at the Masters does make them hypocrites (Player too, who is always quick to tell anyone who will listen how much he loathed apartheid, yet turns up at August a every year as he has for decades - he kept playing in the Master just long enough to beat Palmer's playing record there). Palmer and Nicklaus have been silent so far on the HCEG issue.

 

Any current or past prop who wants to criticize HCEG here needs to think about why they have played in The Open at all in the past, given that the R&A did not allow women members until a couple of years ago. I'd respect their opinions more if they had refused to play and been public as to their reasons why.

[SurfDuffer]

 

 

The part of this whole drama that is becoming "embarrassing" is the fact that we are fast becoming a world where everything should be allowed to everyone, and if it isnt, you should either be angry or offended.

 

 

 

 

This ^^^^^ I read some of the posts in this thread by a couple of pathetic individuals and I just have to shake my head.

 

Let me remind everyone what the Webster's Dictionary's definition of a Club: a : an association of persons for some common object usually jointly supported and meeting periodically; also : a group identified by some common characteristic <nations in the nuclear club>

b : the meeting place of a club <lunch at the club>

c : an association of persons participating in a plan by which they agree to make regular payments or purchases in order to secure some advantage

[Shilgy]

Wow... Folks are actually upset with the R&A because they (R&A) banned discriminatory clubs from hosting tournaments that are said to promote the participation of all interested in the game???? I say good for the R&A. Nobody is forcing MV to change their discriminatory membership policy but nobody is going to force a non-discriminate golf association to host events at such a club.

I may have missed one but I do not believe there have been any posts blasting the R & A for their decision. But many on here have been blasting Muirfield for a decision that in no way affects them.

[wobgon]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

You really can't be serious? This is a private club, a private organization, they can do what they want. You and all the other SJWs will soon be clamoring for the government to force clubs and groups to let anyone do anything they want. Why have any groups at all? Let's just have a nice utopia where everyone gets everything they want and no one has to work and everyone feels included and safe. Its pathetic. That is not how the world works, the sooner you realize that the better off you will be.

He needs to get back to his safe space as soon as possible.......The words and actions of others are just so unfair and he must be protected.

[Ayoung19]

Private clubs should be able to allow who they want. Period.

 

Good on Muirfield for standing up for what they want in their club, and for not relenting to the R&A pressure of taking a tournament away from them if they didnt change to the way the R&A wanted.

 

I cant wait for the R&A reaction when a journalist gets by the faux outrage to ask why they didnt do the same to Royal Troon, which is an all male golf club.

 

Are you out of your mind? In this day in age a group of elite men have actively discriminated against 50% of the population and your response is 'good on Muirfield'. The majority of the British population is embarrassed that this is happening in our country. But hey, more power to them.

 

Muirfield is a private golf club. On private property. Having another entity trying to direct them towards having or not having someone be in their membership is the part that is "wrong" here.

 

Would you let the government or another private entity allow someone whom you dont know or approve of into your private home or on your private property? If your answer is no, then you have no leg to stand on with regards to this issue.

 

The R&A is well within their rights to host their tournament where they see fit for any reason. But a private golf club is allowed to let whomever they want in as a member for any reason as well. For the R&A to have held this over the head of Muirfield to force them to change membership rules or lose The Open was all about strong-arming a private entity into a political/social belief that that R&A holds and wants to push onto others. Whether you, I or anyone else agree with that political/social belief is irrelevant. Whom Muirfield allows or doesnt allow as members to their private club is a private property issue, not a discrimination issue.

 

The part of this whole drama that is becoming "embarrassing" is the fact that we are fast becoming a world where everything should be allowed to everyone, and if it isnt, you should either be angry or offended. If Im looking to join a golf club, Im looking to join a club that is willing and happy to have me, not trying to force my way into a club that I dont meet the requirements for joining by simply claiming "discrimination".

 

What's next? Private clubs being forced to let people in as members who can't afford to pay the stated membership dues because, if someone cant afford it, they're being "discriminated" against by "elite men" (your words) because of their economic status?

 

Thank you for doing a better job articulating what I was trying to say earlier. Could not agree more.

[King_Slender]

You really have to admire the hubris of the R&A, who didn't accept women as members until just last year, claiming the high ground against Muirfield. For that matter - every golfer who has played at Muirfield in the past who knew about the policy that is now speaking out should be asked the question: "You knew Muirfield didn't accept women as members, so why did you participate in The Open there?"

 

The fact is, everyone is self-serving and a hypocrite on some level and to now claim moral superiority because of the actions of a PRIVATE club is beyond hilarious.

 

Unless you're a member at Muirfield for the prestige of it being an Open venue, this is probably good news - you don't have to have your course shut down for a few months every 6 or 7 years.

[SurfDuffer]

I've only had the opportunity to play once at what was traditionally an all male golf club. (Technically.....but not practically...this club does allow women members these days) I've gotta say it was a pretty cool club that I'd join in a heartbeat if I lived close and had an income even remotely close to being able to afford it. This course has a separate dining facility and bar for family dining. It also had a completely separate pub, dining area and game room that was entirely for men only. I believe wives and juniors are allowed on the course after 2:00 and the practice facilities anytime. There certainly was no shortage of women dining. This was by far the friendliest club I've ever been to. You can just tell the members and their families are a very tight knit group and everyone was very friendly to me as a guest of a member. A level of friendship I've never seen at a golf club and that I think every private club should strive to attain. Again, the most friendly club I've ever been to and a wonderful golf experience.

[heavy_hitter]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36338306

 

Even the worlds # 3 thinks its idiotic

 

"It's more of a loss to Muirfield than it is to us," said McIlroy, 27.

"It's not right to host the world's biggest tournament at a place that does not allow women to be members. Hopefully Muirfield can see some sense and we can get it back on The Open rota."

 

McIlroy's view was echoed by Gary Player, who has won nine majors, including The Open at Muirfield in 1959.

"As much as I love and respect Muirfield as a club where I won The Open, I totally agree with the R&A," said the South African. "Staging the championship at any venue that does not admit women is simply unacceptable."

 

 

In announcing the club's decision, Muirfield captain Henry Fairweather stressed that women will continue to be welcome at the East Lothian club as guests and visitors, "as they have been for many years".

Veteran BBC golf commentator Peter Alliss said women who want to play at Muirfield should "marry a member" in order to play.

He also said he had spoken to the wives of Muirfield members and claimed there was "a look of horror" on their faces when he suggested they might be able to become members in their own right.

He reckoned they did not want to become members because they would have to start paying for something they currently got for free

 

"The women who are there as wives of husbands, they get all the facilities," he told BBC Radio 5 live. "If somebody wants to join, well you'd better get married to somebody who's a member."

 

AND THE SEXISM CONTINUES......Muirfield just keeps digging and digging that hole deeper and deeper.....SAD

 

Muirfield Golf Club Picks Discrimination Over the British Open

 

I hate to tell you, but you have no idea what discrimination or sexism is. This has nothing to do with either.

 

There are private all Jewish Golf Clubs in this world, are they racist?

 

There are private all women golf clubs in this world, two are at St. Andrews. Are they sexist?

 

There are private female only gyms all over the world, are they sexist?

 

They want to be with and around like people. I am not kicking and screaming because I can't be a member.

 

Muirfield members want to be around like minded people. Doesn't make them sexist or racist.

 

People like you honestly aren't very smart at all. It is called common sense and you have none.

[llamont]

Wow... Folks are actually upset with the R&A because they (R&A) banned discriminatory clubs from hosting tournaments that are said to promote the participation of all interested in the game???? I say good for the R&A. Nobody is forcing MV to change their discriminatory membership policy but nobody is going to force a non-discriminate golf association to host events at such a club.

I may have missed one but I do not believe there have been any posts blasting the R & A for their decision. But many on here have been blasting Muirfield for a decision that in no way affects them.

 

I'm of the opinion that people are upset with the R&A... Calling the organization a hypocrite stemming from the fact they had their own discriminatory practices until recent years implies that folks are upset with the R&A.