Titleist's new "AVX" golf balls, with premium urethane covers

[BottleCap]

I used to play every cheap ball out there, i was always told that I wasn’t good enough to see the difference and for the price I didn’t care to try it.

 

One day i found a new Prov1x in the ever present rough at Torrey Pines. It was magic, the ball went higher and further, checked, and was soft on the putter.

 

Life’s too short to mess around with garbage. I’ll pickup a dozen in each color to try out.

[xjohnx]

ProV1 is not the #1 ball in golf. Titleist golf ball sales are cumulatively the highest making Titleist the #1 ball(s) in golf based on sales. At the same price point and, if they're lucky, maybe even a slightly lower cost they don't care if they take a chunk out of ProV1 sales. They need to worry about their bottom line because they are trending in the wrong direction and people are losing their minds. They're simply capitalizing on a segment that they have been ignoring for too long.

 

The only harm is see in offering at the same price is that it seems to be hurting golfers' feelings all over the country. Bridgestone has always offered the RX at the same price as the rest of the B330 one. Other than the fact they're all cheaper than ProV1 to begin with, how is this any different? So now that golfers that swing slower can benefit from similar technology and materials with better energy transfer at such speeds, they should also get a price break compared to faster swingers/lower handicaps? Why!?

 

I don't play ProV1 because I agree, they're just too expensive. But why is this the craziest thing ever? Should I also remind everyone that by the time they're in most shops in the country they'll be $40 for the holidays just like the ProV1 always is. So you guys will get to try them for the price you're all crying it should be in the first place. Also since Titleist gets to make the price, not you guys, they also have the option to drop the price whenever they see fit. You guys did read that this is a test, right?

Wrong - the B330-RX(S) are cheaper than the B330(S), just as the Project A is cheaper than the TP5(X) and as the QST is cheaper than the Z-Star / XV line up.

 

Titleist is the only one with the huevos to think people will pay $48 for under $35 and under ball market.

 

I'll concede here as I was thinking about the new Tour B series which are all the same now, no?

 

And to the second point, sure they have the huevos but, people have been buying them for as long as we can all remember. They're sales are finally down and instead of lowering prices this is their play. I don't like the price point as much as the rest of you but, if people always payed for them before they learned they didn't do much for their game, it's fair to think they can get some of those morons back by marketing a new ball "for them".

 

In all fairness, Bridgestones 330 series were all the same price until recently.

Was the B330-RX ever $48?

 

I think that's irrelevant to the conversation. The debate here was always whether Titleist's new ball should be the same price as the ProV1. If you want to debate ProV1 vs. all other premium balls pricing in sure there are about 77 threads debating that over the last ten years.

[Break81]

Well part of what I had said before was this ball is also competing against the QST and Project A. Both under $35.

 

Bridgestone will not sell as many at $44.95 and you can bet their price will readjust where as Titleist will simply pull the offering.

 

It's a short term way of getting a few extra sales IMO.

[crazygolfnut]

ProV1 is not the #1 ball in golf. Titleist golf ball sales are cumulatively the highest making Titleist the #1 ball(s) in golf based on sales. At the same price point and, if they're lucky, maybe even a slightly lower cost they don't care if they take a chunk out of ProV1 sales. They need to worry about their bottom line because they are trending in the wrong direction and people are losing their minds. They're simply capitalizing on a segment that they have been ignoring for too long.

 

If ProV1 is not the #1 ball in golf, then who is? Just wondering.

[xjohnx]

ProV1 is not the #1 ball in golf. Titleist golf ball sales are cumulatively the highest making Titleist the #1 ball(s) in golf based on sales. At the same price point and, if they're lucky, maybe even a slightly lower cost they don't care if they take a chunk out of ProV1 sales. They need to worry about their bottom line because they are trending in the wrong direction and people are losing their minds. They're simply capitalizing on a segment that they have been ignoring for too long.

 

If ProV1 is not the #1 ball in golf, then who is? Just wondering.

 

Assuming you're asking what the #1 selling ball is, I really have no idea. Might be hard to find out too. I don't believe there is any reporting showing sales of individual skus. Everything is category driven. It would also be tough with private label brands like Top-Flite nowadays because I'm willing to bet Dicks/GG easily sells the most golf balls in the US at least.

[North Butte]

The ProV1 franchise (ProV1 and ProV1x) sells more balls than any other. Has done for years. If their sales are down 2% that will not change it being the most popular on the market.

 

I know some people find that fact incredible but it is what it is.

[xjohnx]

The ProV1 franchise (ProV1 and ProV1x) sells more balls than any other. Has done for years. If their sales are down 2% that will not change it being the most popular on the market.

 

I know some people find that fact incredible but it is what it is.

 

Any proof of that? Honest question, if I'm wrong it's cool. I was just under a different impression and would love to see the real answer.

[Break81]

So here is a rub that may destroy the AVX launch. If it's true the next KSIG is hitting stores early October , a 3 Pc Uerthane ball for $15 a dozen, how much does that damage them from tying to sell a 3 pc ball for $48?

 

[North Butte]

The ProV1 franchise (ProV1 and ProV1x) sells more balls than any other. Has done for years. If their sales are down 2% that will not change it being the most popular on the market.

 

I know some people find that fact incredible but it is what it is.

 

Any proof of that? Honest question, if I'm wrong it's cool. I was just under a different impression and would love to see the real answer.

 

Last year I spent a while Googling and found a couple of articles with market share estimates. One was in Fortune or some other finance rag, the other was in Golf Digest or Golfweek or one of those. I don't recall the exact numbers but Titleist sell a truly staggering number of those $48 dozens every year.

 

Hard to imagine that the most expensive brand of what is, let's be honest, a commodity item could also sell in the largest volume year after year. But that does seem to be the case.

[Break81]

The ProV1 franchise (ProV1 and ProV1x) sells more balls than any other. Has done for years. If their sales are down 2% that will not change it being the most popular on the market.

 

I know some people find that fact incredible but it is what it is.

 

Any proof of that? Honest question, if I'm wrong it's cool. I was just under a different impression and would love to see the real answer.

 

Last year I spent a while Googling and found a couple of articles with market share estimates. One was in Fortune or some other finance rag, the other was in Golf Digest or Golfweek or one of those. I don't recall the exact numbers but Titleist sell a truly staggering number of those $48 dozens every year.

 

Hard to imagine that the most expensive brand of what is, let's be honest, a commodity item could also sell in the largest volume year after year. But that does seem to be the case.

All true , but it's also true they have lost considerable market share in recent years. Still on top but also spends the most on marketing as well.

 

As the game of golf is shrinking, more and more avid golfers try other brands. Titleist does great in name brand recognition and is most likely choice for gifts from non golfer etc.

 

If they continue to ignore the low end premium segment , two things are certain 1) they will continue to lose market share 2) they will blow up the NXT line as quality Urethane balls are available for less.

[xjohnx]

The ProV1 franchise (ProV1 and ProV1x) sells more balls than any other. Has done for years. If their sales are down 2% that will not change it being the most popular on the market.

 

I know some people find that fact incredible but it is what it is.

 

Any proof of that? Honest question, if I'm wrong it's cool. I was just under a different impression and would love to see the real answer.

 

Last year I spent a while Googling and found a couple of articles with market share estimates. One was in Fortune or some other finance rag, the other was in Golf Digest or Golfweek or one of those. I don't recall the exact numbers but Titleist sell a truly staggering number of those $48 dozens every year.

 

Hard to imagine that the most expensive brand of what is, let's be honest, a commodity item could also sell in the largest volume year after year. But that does seem to be the case.

 

Yeah as much as I don't want to believe it, I guess I wouldn't be surprised. I would also still want to know more but don't go trying to find anything, it's cool. I would want to know what sources these "estimates" are pulled from and which ones they are not pulled from.

 

When I worked retail, when people would ask for Christmas, birthdays etc. what a good gift for someone who golfs is, I'd always recommend a good box of balls. Most people thought that was a thoughtless cop out but I'd always remind them that us golfers usually hate spending money of the things we actually NEED to play this game. Anyone who receives a dozen ProV1s as a gift will never be disappointed because they either want to play them and never splurge, play them regularly, or know they can exchange them for the balls they prefer and probably even put some money left over towards something else. It's pretty much a fail-safe gift. I guess that's worth considering how many of those damn things are purchased as gifts. Also some places still sell the prior generation for $40 for at least a year after. I wonder if that counts towards the sales numbers? I guess it should?

[BigHook25]

I used to play every cheap ball out there, i was always told that I wasn't good enough to see the difference and for the price I didn't care to try it.

 

One day i found a new Prov1x in the ever present rough at Torrey Pines. It was magic, the ball went higher and further, checked, and was soft on the putter.

 

Life's too short to mess around with garbage. I'll pickup a dozen in each color to try out.

 

I love this sentimental post. My golf game was going to crap, and then I found....a Titleist Pro V!. My entire golf game changed. I could now spin back a 5-iron 3 yards and my drivers went 20 yards further. Golf was never the same because Titleist was the solution. For only $50 a box my golf became easy.

[Lancj1]

It should be simple - there should be three categories of golf ball

 

High end tour ball. $£$£$£

Urethane softer ball. $£$£

Two piece distance ball. $£

 

Wouldn't that be nice

[North Butte]

I used to play every cheap ball out there, i was always told that I wasn't good enough to see the difference and for the price I didn't care to try it.

 

One day i found a new Prov1x in the ever present rough at Torrey Pines. It was magic, the ball went higher and further, checked, and was soft on the putter.

 

Life's too short to mess around with garbage. I'll pickup a dozen in each color to try out.

 

I love this sentimental post. My golf game was going to crap, and then I found....a Titleist Pro V!. My entire golf game changed. I could now spin back a 5-iron 3 yards and my drivers went 20 yards further. Golf was never the same because Titleist was the solution. For only $50 a box my golf became easy.

 

I know, right? It's the K-Sig that cures everything, not some stupid overpriced Titleist rubbish!

[dciccoritti]

I used to play every cheap ball out there, i was always told that I wasn't good enough to see the difference and for the price I didn't care to try it.

 

One day i found a new Prov1x in the ever present rough at Torrey Pines. It was magic, the ball went higher and further, checked, and was soft on the putter.

 

Life's too short to mess around with garbage. I'll pickup a dozen in each color to try out.

 

I love this sentimental post. My golf game was going to crap, and then I found....a Titleist Pro V!. My entire golf game changed. I could now spin back a 5-iron 3 yards and my drivers went 20 yards further. Golf was never the same because Titleist was the solution. For only $50 a box my golf became easy.

 

Where did he say his golf game was going to crap?

 

Where did he say his entire golf game changed?

 

Where did he say he could not spin back a 5 iron 3 yards.

 

Where did he say, Titleist was the solution? Solution to what?

 

Where did he say his golf game became easy?

 

Where did you learn how to read?

[Nessism]

There is no direct correlation to firmness of a ball and a player's swing speed. Chrome Soft is case in point; it's as long as any ball on the market, for a wide variety of swing speeds, and it spins plenty off the short irons. Duo U is another fine example; it feels like a marshmallow but goes like hell off the driver, even for guys with a faster swing speed.

 

It seems to me that Titleist is trying to tap into the Chrome Soft market by offering an alternative. Is the Chrome Soft market older guys with slower speeds? I don't think so. So why all the talk about this new Titleist ball being targeted at slow swinging seniors?

 

Question I have is why didn't Titleist simply denote this new ball a Pro V1 Soft? It's the same price as a Pro V1 so why the new naming convention?

[Les Strokes]

I used to play every cheap ball out there, i was always told that I wasn't good enough to see the difference and for the price I didn't care to try it.

 

One day i found a new Prov1x in the ever present rough at Torrey Pines. It was magic, the ball went higher and further, checked, and was soft on the putter.

 

Life's too short to mess around with garbage. I'll pickup a dozen in each color to try out.

 

I love this sentimental post. My golf game was going to crap, and then I found....a Titleist Pro V!. My entire golf game changed. I could now spin back a 5-iron 3 yards and my drivers went 20 yards further. Golf was never the same because Titleist was the solution. For only $50 a box my golf became easy.

 

I am enjoying this thread because I don't know that much about balls and its great to hear the input. I also think it's amusing that so much angst is expressed over the price difference between premium and not-so-premium. Maybe it's $15? $20? For something that should last many rounds? I rarely lose a ball and can play a couple rounds at least with the same ball. What's $15, the price of a couple of beers at the 19th hole? Which don't last nearly as long.....

[Nessism]

 

I am enjoying this thread because I don't know that much about balls and its great to hear the input. I also think it's amusing that so much angst is expressed over the price difference between premium and not-so-premium. Maybe it's $15? $20? For something that should last many rounds? I rarely lose a ball and can play a couple rounds at least with the same ball. What's $15, the price of a couple of beers at the 19th hole? Which don't last nearly as long.....

 

I'm jealous. You are a much better player than me. I seem to average one lost ball per round; the course I play regularly has a lot of lateral hazards. Regardless of the lost ball cost, I just don't like being ripped off, and I consider Titleist balls a ripoff when you consider their cost vs. that of other balls you can buy.

[BigHook25]

I used to play every cheap ball out there, i was always told that I wasn't good enough to see the difference and for the price I didn't care to try it.

 

One day i found a new Prov1x in the ever present rough at Torrey Pines. It was magic, the ball went higher and further, checked, and was soft on the putter.

 

Life's too short to mess around with garbage. I'll pickup a dozen in each color to try out.

 

I love this sentimental post. My golf game was going to crap, and then I found....a Titleist Pro V!. My entire golf game changed. I could now spin back a 5-iron 3 yards and my drivers went 20 yards further. Golf was never the same because Titleist was the solution. For only $50 a box my golf became easy.

 

Where did he say his golf game was going to crap?

 

Where did he say his entire golf game changed?

 

Where did he say he could not spin back a 5 iron 3 yards.

 

Where did he say, Titleist was the solution? Solution to what?

 

Where did he say his golf game became easy?

 

Where did you learn how to read?

 

I guess you weren't in on the joke

[Mahamilto]

Over and under compression are legitimate concerns... if your swing is really fast or really slow... and you hit the only driver or only wedge...

 

Dynamic game. Max out driver, lose something somewhere else. Max out spin, give up some of driver. Its just how it goes, there will always be some tradeoff. You just have to find out where you wanna give something up.

 

If you average over 275 then it should be driver if you are smart. 5 yards is easily overcome when you are always hitting mid to short irons in.

[Les Strokes]

Once in a while I will find an old ball that has the compression number on it; I have looked online and don't see a number value given to them anymore. Are they still around 90 for mid compression and around 100 for high compression?

[Break81]

Over and under compression are legitimate concerns... if your swing is really fast or really slow... and you hit the only driver or only wedge...

 

Dynamic game. Max out driver, lose something somewhere else. Max out spin, give up some of driver. Its just how it goes, there will always be some tradeoff. You just have to find out where you wanna give something up.

 

If you average over 275 then it should be driver if you are smart. 5 yards is easily overcome when you are always hitting mid to short irons in.

also AOA is a major part of this. A negative AOA usually creates more driver backspin where a positive may not create enough, regardless of your SS is 90 or 110

[cane700]

ProV1 is not the #1 ball in golf. Titleist golf ball sales are cumulatively the highest making Titleist the #1 ball(s) in golf based on sales. At the same price point and, if they're lucky, maybe even a slightly lower cost they don't care if they take a chunk out of ProV1 sales. They need to worry about their bottom line because they are trending in the wrong direction and people are losing their minds. They're simply capitalizing on a segment that they have been ignoring for too long.

 

The only harm is see in offering at the same price is that it seems to be hurting golfers' feelings all over the country. Bridgestone has always offered the RX at the same price as the rest of the B330 one. Other than the fact they're all cheaper than ProV1 to begin with, how is this any different? So now that golfers that swing slower can benefit from similar technology and materials with better energy transfer at such speeds, they should also get a price break compared to faster swingers/lower handicaps? Why!?

 

I don't play ProV1 because I agree, they're just too expensive. But why is this the craziest thing ever? Should I also remind everyone that by the time they're in most shops in the country they'll be $40 for the holidays just like the ProV1 always is. So you guys will get to try them for the price you're all crying it should be in the first place. Also since Titleist gets to make the price, not you guys, they also have the option to drop the price whenever they see fit. You guys did read that this is a test, right?

Wrong - the B330-RX(S) are cheaper than the B330(S), just as the Project A is cheaper than the TP5(X) and as the QST is cheaper than the Z-Star / XV line up.

 

Titleist is the only one with the huevos to think people will pay $48 for under $35 and under ball market.

 

I'll concede here as I was thinking about the new Tour B series which are all the same now, no?

 

And to the second point, sure they have the huevos but, people have been buying them for as long as we can all remember. They're sales are finally down and instead of lowering prices this is their play. I don't like the price point as much as the rest of you but, if people always payed for them before they learned they didn't do much for their game, it's fair to think they can get some of those morons back by marketing a new ball "for them".

 

In all fairness, Bridgestones 330 series were all the same price until recently.

Was the B330-RX ever $48?

 

That wasnt my point. The 330 and 330Rx used to be the same price until recently and it looks like the it will be going forward.

[bam3352]

I know everyone on here is going crazy over this ball being overpriced compared to the "soft" tour level balls and cheaper quasi tour balls likes the project a and the qstar tour. However, might this ball maybe not really aimed at the soft ball market and instead aimed at the TP5X type players?

 

I'm not a titleist guy at all. I've probably played pro v or pro v x's for 5 out of the 50ish rounds I've played this year. They're great balls that do just about everything pretty well but the v1 and x are so similar it's hard to differentiate between the two. Neither Pro v ball really has a short coming, but they both skew towards being great short games balls....i.e. spinning a lot.

 

For most of my rounds I've played the TP5 or the TP5x. The TP5 plays like the pro v's for me...basically good at everything. The TP5x is truly a different ball. It's longer and straighter by a noticeable margin. It has it's issues in not spinning as much for me off of irons and wedges and being a little inconsistent in terms of distance control. I've learned to play the TP5x around the green because it's so great on longer shots and is usable around the greens once you learn how it reacts. However, if you gave me a choice of what ball to use on a short sided pitch shot that needs to stop, I'm taking a pro v1 every time but when choosing a ball to play with for 18 entire holes, the TP5x is better for me.

 

What I'm trying to say is that maybe it's not an attempt to compete with the chromesoft or lower level urethane balls. Reading a bit about the AVX, it seems to me that this ball might be the Titleist version of the TP5X....i.e. slightly less spin off long clubs, which equals more distance, and less spin and control on short shots basically just another choice in the pro v1 line that spins less than the v1X. I don't live in the test market but if I can get my hands on some AVX's I know I'll give them a try.

[crazygolfnut]

Anyone have any idea what the AVX stands for. Advanced Velocity Xtra spin?

[puttingmatt]

AVX.......... always very xpensive

[Break81]

Amature VX instead of Pro V1

[gvogel]

There is no direct correlation to firmness of a ball and a player's swing speed. Chrome Soft is case in point; it's as long as any ball on the market, for a wide variety of swing speeds, and it spins plenty off the short irons. Duo U is another fine example; it feels like a marshmallow but goes like hell off the driver, even for guys with a faster swing speed.

 

It seems to me that Titleist is trying to tap into the Chrome Soft market by offering an alternative. Is the Chrome Soft market older guys with slower speeds? I don't think so. So why all the talk about this new Titleist ball being targeted at slow swinging seniors?

 

Question I have is why didn't Titleist simply denote this new ball a Pro V1 Soft? It's the same price as a Pro V1 so why the new naming convention?

 

Maybe because the AVX is a ball for seekers, and not pros.

[ronster]

I just saw the write-up.

 

352 dimples.

 

Urethane covered.

 

Lower Compression.

 

I've seen and actually played that ball before. It's the Japan-market Titleist Prestige.

 

https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/g-zone/item/301979318-02/

 

It's been around since last year.

 

It's quite ironic and funny, because for a Japan-market only release, the sleeve/packaging of the ball says Made In the USA.

 

So I guess it's finally time to release it to the US market under the guise of "test-marketing" but we all know that it will be released commercially eventually.

so what did you think of the ball then?

[PureStrikes54]

There is no direct correlation to firmness of a ball and a player's swing speed. Chrome Soft is case in point; it's as long as any ball on the market, for a wide variety of swing speeds, and it spins plenty off the short irons. Duo U is another fine example; it feels like a marshmallow but goes like hell off the driver, even for guys with a faster swing speed.

 

It seems to me that Titleist is trying to tap into the Chrome Soft market by offering an alternative. Is the Chrome Soft market older guys with slower speeds? I don't think so. So why all the talk about this new Titleist ball being targeted at slow swinging seniors?

 

Question I have is why didn't Titleist simply denote this new ball a Pro V1 Soft? It's the same price as a Pro V1 so why the new naming convention?

 

Under no circumstances for a long hitter is the chrome soft in the same distance category off of driver as a TP5x, zstar XV, or Prov1x. Especially at 125+ clubhead speed with serviceable impact alignments and smash factor. Easily 15 yards behind those options and sometimes more.

 

Chrome soft feels and responds like a marshmallow being hit with a whiffle ball bat while the other options feel like a juiced baseball off of shaved aluminum.