Tiger Woods 2019 Taylormade Irons...P7TW?

[bambam]

> @uwhockey14 said:

> > @kekoa said:

> > > @Redjeep83 said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @TheMoneyShot said:

> > > > > ^^^^^Wow, TM must be selling the s*** out of these things.

> > > >

> > > > Nope. Still can’t get any heads. My shops order that was placed day 1 just came in Thursday. They blew my phone up when they came in. I said no thanks and haven’t even went down to look. BPs working too good. I’d wager they are still in the shop a month from now.

> > >

> > > exactly, they aren't selling a ton of them, they are blades and very expensive ones for a brand like TM. People don't really buy blades these days except for us die hards on golfwrx. They are selling the crap out of their more forgiving irons. It's like comparing chevy cruz sales vs a corvette z06

> >

> > I think the audience goes beyond Golfwrx gear heads for the TW's. I know a handful of guys who can't play worth **** and bought a set just to have.

>

> I have heard from many people that have hit these that they likely won't be good irons for many people. They spin a lot, that's tigers preference but unless you can control the club head like tiger these irons will spin and balloon up into the wind very easy which is a big no for me... not worth purchasing if that's what they are going to do... I hate ballooning golf shots....

 

They do spin a lot, but Tiger's specs aren't DGX100 straight in. They're modified in how they're inserted in a couple of ways, which help reduce spin and launch; so, they don't balloon.

[uwhockey14]

> @bambam said:

> > @TTURaider said:

> > Where do you get these dowels? And what length and diameter? Also, how far up the tip should they be placed?

> > I picked up a set second hand with PX in them so I’ll be reshafting mine soon with X100 and I’d be interested in trying the dowels too.

>

> I used spiraled dowels 1.5” in length and 5/16” wide. I chose spiraled dowels over fluted dowels to get maximum wood on shaft surface area while still allowing air to pass through to seat properly.

>

> EDIT: You can find them online using a quick google search. The dowels will naturally want to seat themselves in the correct area ~1.5" from the tip without any additional sanding.

 

why not put them all the way down in the tip of the shaft?! seems like that is where they will do the most good? Also do you apoxy them in the shafts or just ram them down into the shaft?! I'd be worried with them coming loose over time?! Thanks

[bambam]

> @uwhockey14 said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @TTURaider said:

> > > Where do you get these dowels? And what length and diameter? Also, how far up the tip should they be placed?

> > > I picked up a set second hand with PX in them so I’ll be reshafting mine soon with X100 and I’d be interested in trying the dowels too.

> >

> > I used spiraled dowels 1.5” in length and 5/16” wide. I chose spiraled dowels over fluted dowels to get maximum wood on shaft surface area while still allowing air to pass through to seat properly.

> >

> > EDIT: You can find them online using a quick google search. The dowels will naturally want to seat themselves in the correct area ~1.5" from the tip without any additional sanding.

>

> why not put them all the way down in the tip of the shaft?! seems like that is where they will do the most good? Also do you apoxy them in the shafts or just ram them down into the shaft?! I'd be worried with them coming loose over time?! Thanks

 

You definitely could. I miswrote what I meant. I meant that the middle of the 1.5" dowel will seat itself where the hosel ends, so 50% dowel above the hosel line and 50% below the hosel line. I did some research on here, and I found that was the recommended sweet spot for the dowels. It gives you the dampening benefit of the wood and it allows epoxy to settle in the gap and not push the dowel out when gluing the head in.

 

Now, if you drill out the center of each dowel, and make it flush/all the way down, you won't have the compression issue. But i found I have received noticeable benefit from the method ascribed.

 

And yes, a dab of epoxy at the insertion end of the dowel.

[uwhockey14]

> @bambam said:

> > @uwhockey14 said:

> > > @bambam said:

> > > > @TTURaider said:

> > > > Where do you get these dowels? And what length and diameter? Also, how far up the tip should they be placed?

> > > > I picked up a set second hand with PX in them so I’ll be reshafting mine soon with X100 and I’d be interested in trying the dowels too.

> > >

> > > I used spiraled dowels 1.5” in length and 5/16” wide. I chose spiraled dowels over fluted dowels to get maximum wood on shaft surface area while still allowing air to pass through to seat properly.

> > >

> > > EDIT: You can find them online using a quick google search. The dowels will naturally want to seat themselves in the correct area ~1.5" from the tip without any additional sanding.

> >

> > why not put them all the way down in the tip of the shaft?! seems like that is where they will do the most good? Also do you apoxy them in the shafts or just ram them down into the shaft?! I'd be worried with them coming loose over time?! Thanks

>

> You definitely could. I miswrote what I meant. I meant that the middle of the 1.5" dowel will seat itself where the hosel ends, so 50% dowel above the hosel line and 50% below the hosel line. I did some research on here, and I found that was the recommended sweet spot for the dowels. It gives you the dampening benefit of the wood and it allows epoxy to settle in the gap and not push the dowel out when gluing the head in.

>

> Now, if you drill out the center of each dowel, and make it flush/all the way down, you won't have the compression issue. But i found I have received noticeable benefit from the method ascribed.

>

> And yes, a dab of epoxy at the insertion end of the dowel.

 

Thanks for the info....

[bluejeeprubi]

“Turns out, they are more shallow than the Nike VR, so I'm having my guy measure and tip accordingly. At the very least, this will help with the shafts feeling like they used to, and I suspect this will get the ball-flight and spin back to where I want it”

 

My flight has come down a little with a ball change, but I am enjoying the high flight with the mid and long irons. It is nice hitting high long irons into par 5s and long par 3s I don’t feel they are ballooning on me. I’m playing them between the standard lofts and tigers loft, so my pw is 48 vs 46 and I’m not hitting as many draws I think my yardages are on point. Though my numbers are creeping up a little with them as I get used to the change in heads and shafts. I’m typically not a TM fan but I’m happy with my purchase.

 

I’ve shot 74 and 75 the last two rounds with them on a 7100 yard course so I’m happy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[bambam]

> @Cpk23 said:

> They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

 

They're very close, but they're not identical.

 

Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

 

Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

 

I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

[kcsf]

> @Cpk23 said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> >

> > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> >

> > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> >

> > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> >

> > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

>

> I am not talking vr pro blades. I am talking OG Nike Forged Blades.

 

You didn't happen to take a pic when you compared them side by side?

[Shakespeare]

> @jll62 said:

> > @rawbuffalo said:

> > Anyone that has disassembled them help me out? Wondering what the raw head weights are. And what the bounce is on the tiger specs option.

>

> The raw head weights of my 5-PW were as follows (I haven't torn down the 3 or 4 irons yet). One thing to note is that these weights are after removing the hosel weight that's used to adjust swing weight during the TM build.

>

> 5 - 247.5g

> 6 - 256.5g

> 7 - 264.0g

> 8 - 271.7g

> 9 - 279.9g

> PW - 283.5g

 

Interesting ...they are almost exactly 7 grams lighter per head then my Adam's cc1 heads with no tip weights....and almost the same as my 0311t's

[dukediv2011]

Mine come in tomorrow!

[bladehunter]

> @bambam said:

> > @Cpk23 said:

> > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

>

> They're very close, but they're not identical.

>

> Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

>

> Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

>

> I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

 

Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

 

Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

 

Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

[cnnmaverick]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> >

> > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> >

> > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> >

> > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> >

> > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

>

> Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

>

> Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

>

> Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

 

> @bladehunter said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> >

> > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> >

> > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> >

> > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> >

> > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

>

> Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

>

> Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

>

> Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

 

> @bladehunter said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> >

> > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> >

> > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> >

> > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> >

> > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

>

> Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

>

> Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

>

> Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

 

> @bladehunter said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> >

> > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> >

> > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> >

> > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> >

> > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

>

> Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

>

> Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

>

> Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

 

Only on WRX are we concerned with the insertion depth of hosels ??

 

 

[bambam]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> >

> > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> >

> > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> >

> > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> >

> > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

>

> Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

>

> Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

>

> Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

 

The feel for me is more akin to the 680 with its Endo forging. It's definitely not as soft as a Mizuno, but it's definitely not hard feeling. Perhaps those people aren't hitting the sweet spot ;-) Joking aside, they're meant to tell you where you hit it, and at impact, they're more solid than soft.

 

The insertion depth is more shallow, which makes the tip play softer. Take a Dynamic Gold shaft. The tip length help determine tip stiffness, so the same shaft in a deeper hosel will play stiffer. This is the same as bore thru vs blind bore hosels. It's enough to change flight and feel, and it's noticeable, especially if you're a higher speed player who likes tip stiff set ups. For me, I noticed excess spin, which led to distance loss and control issues for shots played into the wind.

[bladehunter]

How much difference in depth are we talking here ?

[rawbuffalo]

> @bambam said:

> > @uwhockey14 said:

> > > @kekoa said:

> > > > @Redjeep83 said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @TheMoneyShot said:

> > > > > > ^^^^^Wow, TM must be selling the s*** out of these things.

> > > > >

> > > > > Nope. Still can’t get any heads. My shops order that was placed day 1 just came in Thursday. They blew my phone up when they came in. I said no thanks and haven’t even went down to look. BPs working too good. I’d wager they are still in the shop a month from now.

> > > >

> > > > exactly, they aren't selling a ton of them, they are blades and very expensive ones for a brand like TM. People don't really buy blades these days except for us die hards on golfwrx. They are selling the crap out of their more forgiving irons. It's like comparing chevy cruz sales vs a corvette z06

> > >

> > > I think the audience goes beyond Golfwrx gear heads for the TW's. I know a handful of guys who can't play worth **** and bought a set just to have.

> >

> > I have heard from many people that have hit these that they likely won't be good irons for many people. They spin a lot, that's tigers preference but unless you can control the club head like tiger these irons will spin and balloon up into the wind very easy which is a big no for me... not worth purchasing if that's what they are going to do... I hate ballooning golf shots....

>

> They do spin a lot, but Tiger's specs aren't DGX100 straight in. They're modified in how they're inserted in a couple of ways, which help reduce spin and launch; so, they don't balloon.

 

Do you know what they do off the top of your head, besides dowels?

[Downtown_Brown_41]

Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

 

*edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

[bambam]

> @rawbuffalo said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @uwhockey14 said:

> > > > @kekoa said:

> > > > > @Redjeep83 said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @TheMoneyShot said:

> > > > > > > ^^^^^Wow, TM must be selling the s*** out of these things.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Nope. Still can’t get any heads. My shops order that was placed day 1 just came in Thursday. They blew my phone up when they came in. I said no thanks and haven’t even went down to look. BPs working too good. I’d wager they are still in the shop a month from now.

> > > > >

> > > > > exactly, they aren't selling a ton of them, they are blades and very expensive ones for a brand like TM. People don't really buy blades these days except for us die hards on golfwrx. They are selling the crap out of their more forgiving irons. It's like comparing chevy cruz sales vs a corvette z06

> > > >

> > > > I think the audience goes beyond Golfwrx gear heads for the TW's. I know a handful of guys who can't play worth **** and bought a set just to have.

> > >

> > > I have heard from many people that have hit these that they likely won't be good irons for many people. They spin a lot, that's tigers preference but unless you can control the club head like tiger these irons will spin and balloon up into the wind very easy which is a big no for me... not worth purchasing if that's what they are going to do... I hate ballooning golf shots....

> >

> > They do spin a lot, but Tiger's specs aren't DGX100 straight in. They're modified in how they're inserted in a couple of ways, which help reduce spin and launch; so, they don't balloon.

>

> Do you know what they do off the top of your head, besides dowels?

 

If the hosel depths are the same as retail, then they’re hardstepped, and the PW and 9i are tipped.

 

Reverse calculate the hosel depths and what is known about his top of hosels to first steps lengths.

[bambam]

> @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

>

> *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

 

 

Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

 

Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

 

Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

[Tree Levino]

> @bambam said:

> > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> >

> > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

>

>

> Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

>

> Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

>

> Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

 

Thing is tons of guys on here go on and on about how they ballon X100s etc while many pros play them straight in, have more speed, yet still manage to play them very well. You should be able to hit an A flex graphite into the wind if you're a quality player.

[ghoonk]

> @cnnmaverick said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @bambam said:

> > > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> > >

> > > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> > >

> > > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> > >

> > > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> > >

> > > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

> >

> > Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

> >

> > Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

> >

> > Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

>

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @bambam said:

> > > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> > >

> > > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> > >

> > > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> > >

> > > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> > >

> > > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

> >

> > Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

> >

> > Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

> >

> > Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

>

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @bambam said:

> > > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> > >

> > > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> > >

> > > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> > >

> > > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> > >

> > > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

> >

> > Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

> >

> > Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

> >

> > Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

>

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @bambam said:

> > > > @Cpk23 said:

> > > > They are identical in feel and look at address to the nike forged blades. I took them to cool clubs and compared the two. Identical. Save your money

> > >

> > > They're very close, but they're not identical.

> > >

> > > Facts: The profiles of the face are the same because the template is the same. The muscle back and upper flanges are different 6i -- PW. The muscle is slightly lower, but the upper flanges taper from wide to thin in the P7. The muscle back is higher and the upper flange is constant width in the VR Pro blades. The offset is slightly different (less in the P7), and so is the hosel depth (more shallow in the P7). The latter plays the biggest difference in flight.

> > >

> > > Opinion: The P7 is also softer feeling than the VR Pro.

> > >

> > > I agree, if you can find a set of VR Blades in good condition, I would say go with those, but VR blades in good condition are hard to come by.

> >

> > Hmm. That’s interesting. Almost everybody else has cited how they feel harder than most everything else. Which doesn’t bother me.

> >

> > Also curious how the shorter hosel effects flight? Should only change horizontal cog and move sweetspot towards center of the face away from hosel.

> >

> > Or are you saying actual insertion depth is shallower and yet hosel height is same ? If then I guess the tip insertion depth may feel slightly different , and I suppose effect flight somewhat , but I’m skeptical of it effects flight as much as just feel.

>

> Only on WRX are we concerned with the insertion depth of hosels ??

>

>

 

"Just the tip"

[Chuck905]

> @balls_deep said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > >

> > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> >

> >

> > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> >

> > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> >

> > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

>

> Thing is tons of guys on here go on and on about how they ballon X100s etc while many pros play them straight in, have more speed, yet still manage to play them very well. You should be able to hit an A flex graphite into the wind if you're a quality player.

 

GTF out of here! Getting fitted for the right shaft is paramount.

 

I’ll still hit my buddies so so and it’s a. X-flex to regular flex , but life’s to short. Have the equipment fit your swing. It’s easy to to dial down with today’s technologies

 

As we speak, I’ve had my shaft tipped 1”

last year and soon, it’ll be 1/2” at the butt because I literally need a new grip but it will dial down the last minute details.

[bluejeeprubi]

> @Chuck905 said:

> > @balls_deep said:

> > > @bambam said:

> > > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > > >

> > > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> > >

> > >

> > > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> > >

> > > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> > >

> > > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

> >

> > Thing is tons of guys on here go on and on about how they ballon X100s etc while many pros play them straight in, have more speed, yet still manage to play them very well. You should be able to hit an A flex graphite into the wind if you're a quality player.

>

> GTF out of here! Getting fitted for the right shaft is paramount.

>

> I’ll still hit my buddies so so and it’s a. X-flex to regular flex , but life’s to short. Have the equipment fit your swing. It’s easy to to dial down with today’s technologies

>

> As we speak, I’ve had my shaft tipped 1”

> last year and soon, it’ll be 1/2” at the butt because I literally need a new grip but it will dial down the last minute details.

 

He didn’t say anything about getting fit for a shaft he said a quality player Could hit an a flex shaft into the wind not that he Should use a flex shafts or that not getting fit is a great idea. I agree a better ball striker should be able to flight irons. I see pros and better players flight their wedges without swinging harder and they usually have a softer flex in their wedges.

 

I might be wrong but isn’t club path and face angle impact ball flight more than speed? I ask because I play with a buddy who swings fast but has a low ball flight. I can hit my irons high with a smooth or fast swing. Also I hear on TV that so and so high ball flight with mid to long irons is an advantage.

 

 

[Downtown_Brown_41]

> @bambam said:

> > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> >

> > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

>

>

> Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

>

> Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

>

> Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

 

Tipping the x100’s will be good for 200rpms at most. You could knock that off by better impact conditions easier. I realize high speed players tip their wood shafts for dispersion and spin manipulation but you’re talking about less than a 1/4” tipping on steel, which won’t have benefits on “dispersion”. That’s all face and path

[bambam]

> @balls_deep said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > >

> > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> >

> >

> > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> >

> > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> >

> > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

>

> Thing is tons of guys on here go on and on about how they ballon X100s etc while many pros play them straight in, have more speed, yet still manage to play them very well. You should be able to hit an A flex graphite into the wind if you're a quality player.

 

> @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > >

> > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> >

> >

> > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> >

> > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> >

> > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

>

> Tipping the x100’s will be good for 200rpms at most. You could knock that off by better impact conditions easier. I realize high speed players tip their wood shafts for dispersion and spin manipulation but you’re talking about less than a 1/4” tipping on steel, which won’t have benefits on “dispersion”. That’s all face and path

 

I stated in the beginning of my post you responded to that any good ballstriker can flight the ball, but you're still missing the point. When you look at Tiger's specs (and of course he can flight the ball), we see that his Top of Hosel to First step measurement is 4.5".

 

That means, he's not just tipping his iron shafts. He's hardstepping + tipping his lower irons. You can't get to that measurement cutting "just the tip".

 

So yes, he is doing alterations to his X100s to help him with his ball flight and feel. Tipping .25" may only cut 200 or so rpms as you stated, but add in a hardstep, which is .5", that's .75" total of a shorter tip. This also probably goes back to what Tiger's stated before, which is his cu down shafts as a kid were so stiff that he couldn't flex them. When he started to get older and started to feel lex, he had to time it. These modifications help the shaft become stiffer.

[Downtown_Brown_41]

> @bambam said:

> > @balls_deep said:

> > > @bambam said:

> > > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > > >

> > > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> > >

> > >

> > > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> > >

> > > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> > >

> > > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

> >

> > Thing is tons of guys on here go on and on about how they ballon X100s etc while many pros play them straight in, have more speed, yet still manage to play them very well. You should be able to hit an A flex graphite into the wind if you're a quality player.

>

> > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > @bambam said:

> > > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > > >

> > > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> > >

> > >

> > > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> > >

> > > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> > >

> > > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

> >

> > Tipping the x100’s will be good for 200rpms at most. You could knock that off by better impact conditions easier. I realize high speed players tip their wood shafts for dispersion and spin manipulation but you’re talking about less than a 1/4” tipping on steel, which won’t have benefits on “dispersion”. That’s all face and path

>

> I stated in the beginning of my post you responded to that any good ballstriker can flight the ball, but you're still missing the point. When you look at Tiger's specs (and of course he can flight the ball), we see that his Top of Hosel to First step measurement is 4.5".

>

> That means, he's not just tipping his iron shafts. He's hardstepping + tipping his lower irons. You can't get to that measurement cutting "just the tip".

>

> So yes, he is doing alterations to his X100s to help him with his ball flight and feel. Tipping .25" may only cut 200 or so rpms as you stated, but add in a hardstep, which is .5", that's .75" total of a shorter tip. This also probably goes back to what Tiger's stated before, which is his cu down shafts as a kid were so stiff that he couldn't flex them. When he started to get older and started to feel lex, he had to time it. These modifications help the shaft become stiffer.

 

Ah, I didn’t realize it was that much in the lower irons. Also, I wasn’t referring to flighting the ball down more so the fact that when he mentions ballooning he’s talking a couple hundred rpms because he’s superhuman

[bambam]

> @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @balls_deep said:

> > > > @bambam said:

> > > > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > > > >

> > > > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> > > >

> > > > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> > > >

> > > > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

> > >

> > > Thing is tons of guys on here go on and on about how they ballon X100s etc while many pros play them straight in, have more speed, yet still manage to play them very well. You should be able to hit an A flex graphite into the wind if you're a quality player.

> >

> > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > > @bambam said:

> > > > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > > > >

> > > > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> > > >

> > > > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> > > >

> > > > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

> > >

> > > Tipping the x100’s will be good for 200rpms at most. You could knock that off by better impact conditions easier. I realize high speed players tip their wood shafts for dispersion and spin manipulation but you’re talking about less than a 1/4” tipping on steel, which won’t have benefits on “dispersion”. That’s all face and path

> >

> > I stated in the beginning of my post you responded to that any good ballstriker can flight the ball, but you're still missing the point. When you look at Tiger's specs (and of course he can flight the ball), we see that his Top of Hosel to First step measurement is 4.5".

> >

> > That means, he's not just tipping his iron shafts. He's hardstepping + tipping his lower irons. You can't get to that measurement cutting "just the tip".

> >

> > So yes, he is doing alterations to his X100s to help him with his ball flight and feel. Tipping .25" may only cut 200 or so rpms as you stated, but add in a hardstep, which is .5", that's .75" total of a shorter tip. This also probably goes back to what Tiger's stated before, which is his cu down shafts as a kid were so stiff that he couldn't flex them. When he started to get older and started to feel lex, he had to time it. These modifications help the shaft become stiffer.

>

> Ah, I didn’t realize it was that much in the lower irons. Also, I wasn’t referring to flighting the ball down more so the fact that when he mentions ballooning he’s talking a couple hundred rpms because he’s superhuman

 

Imagine a fist bump emoji here instead of words.

[bluejeeprubi]

I’m not saying right or wrong but if this is true and he uses x100 8i shafts in his wedges is he tipping them too? If not wouldn’t his wedges be a lot weaker than his PW? Wondering not doubting anyone

[bambam]

> @bluejeeprubi said:

> I’m not saying right or wrong but if this is true and he uses x100 8i shafts in his wedges is he tipping them too? If not wouldn’t his wedges be a lot weaker than his PW? Wondering not doubting anyone

 

I don't know. My blind guess is: Considering his irons are hardstepped, to create a sub-flex without going to S400, the wedge shaft could be a straight in 8i shaft or it could be tipped, depending on what he wants. Either way, it won't be much softer. You can't hardstep a PW or 9i shaft because that's the shortest they come. You can only tip them (edit: so a standard X100 8i vs a hardtepped 8i shaft [actually PW & 9i shaft] is naturally a degree of subflex softer).

[KeithM38]

Has anyone tried to register their irons on taylormade website? The model doesn't show up and all the irons have different numbers on them.

[Nard_S]

> @bluejeeprubi said:

> I’m not saying right or wrong but if this is true and he uses x100 8i shafts in his wedges is he tipping them too? If not wouldn’t his wedges be a lot weaker than his PW? Wondering not doubting anyone

 

I've heard he currently uses S400 on wedges and in the past he was tipping his irons an 1".

 

 

[Krt22]

> @balls_deep said:

> > @bambam said:

> > > @Downtown_Brown_41 said:

> > > Tiger doesn’t balloon his irons because he’s a great ball striker. He could hit any irons and not balloon them. It isn’t because of special insertion depth and tipped shafts or wooden dowels

> > >

> > > *edit- I apologize if that came off rude but it wasn’t meant to be

> >

> >

> > Any good ball striker can do the same, but when you have speed, then dispersion, spin and launch become harder to control with a softer tipped shaft.

> >

> > Would you rather be trying to knock down balls all day or be able to put your normal swing on it? Why else do you think so many guys tip their wood shafts? Every high ball speed player that I know of does.

> >

> > Your comment didn’t come off as rude, just a little bit ill informed.

>

> Thing is tons of guys on here go on and on about how they ballon X100s etc while many pros play them straight in, have more speed, yet still manage to play them very well. You should be able to hit an A flex graphite into the wind if you're a quality player.

 

That's just like...your opinion, man.