..

[Krt22]

Same, very weird

[GoGoErky]

Same

[Artemicion]

From what I've seen it depends on the person. At my club there's a bunch of guys mixing golf with the gym. All of us are between 1 and +3 handicaps, so we're pretty solid in terms of swing mechanics. After a couple of years we've all gotten way stronger and more mobile, but speed gains have varied greatly from person to person. The biggest gain of the group has been 112 to 128 mph, whereas the smallest has been 104 to 108 mph.

And then there's this one guy that is built like a stick, has never gone to gym in his life and yet still moves his driver at 120 mph.

So it seems dependent on genetics and age it seems like. If you have the potential to physically develop speed you'll see a ton of extra speed, but if you haven't got the body for it gains will be limited. Regardless strength training has many benefits and certainly isn't useless when it comes to golf, whether you gain distance or not.

[clevited]

Absolutely, everyone's ceiling is different and natural gifts will be different. If a person does what Kyle says he did in that video posted earlier, I think that is the best possible thing you can do if you want speed. My thinking/theory is that you can lift and lift the right way but not necessarily gain tons of speed but you will definitely gain significant speed (almost everyone should). If you don't combine it with speed training, you won't help teach those muscles to fire fast. You can have more muscle sure, but unless you teach it to fire fast, it isn't necessarily going to help you as much as it could.

I know I keep using myself as an example but its the best way I can try and explain things. I don't work out, at all. I don't lift, I haven't since high school and even then it was just a weight training class. I increased my swing speed from around 105 mph to well over 120 (highest I have been officially recorded is 125 but I am almost 100% certain I am knocking on the door to 130 now and have plateaued). I think that if I continue my speed training (by basically wailing on golf balls hard as I can a couple days a week) and also do lifts like both Rosco and KB have recommended, I might get into long drive territory if I put in the work. I would gain the muscle and stability and simultaneously teach it to fire fast as possible. Right now I am doing what I am doing with a stronger than average upper body and core, but well below average leg strength. My legs are very much my weakness.

That is all just an educated guess at best, but it is exciting enough to me to perhaps find the means to go after it.

[PepsiDuck]

I am not a statistical anomaly, and but I've trained in some capacity for over half my life. I haven't read most of this thread, though I've dabbled in a few posts. My view is that strength training can only help, but the extent that it will help depends on a person's natural starting physique and abilities. In other words, strength training will most benefit those who are most physically disadvantaged, while those who are either naturally gifted or physically well-proportioned will benefit less.

Coming out of high school and going into my first year of college, I was a diminutive Asian kid weighing 125 pounds at 5'8". My golf technique back then was better than it is now, but I wasn't a long hitter. Now I weigh a low-fat 175, and even with worse swing mechanics, I can hulk smash it 20% longer than I did 18 years ago. I am not blessed with height, long limbs, or superior fast-twitch muscle fibers; in all honesty, I've had to use strength training to overcome my physical disadvantage, just so I could catch up with the twigs who might be 6'4" and hadn't lifted a single weight in their life.

Until we accept that we are all different and come to the start line with different capabilities, we're going to argue endlessly about the value of strength training in golf.  Those, like me, who come to the table with nearly nothing, understand that we control our own destiny in re-establishing our baseline. Those who are more fortunate in their genetics will likely discount the value of strength training, since they come to the table with a body better "built for golf."

[puresurfr]

Im going to have to Agree and Disagree with this strength training theory. I lifted in my high school and college days for basketball and football and then stopped for about 25 years. Looking to gain swing speed, I have joined a gym and got back into lifting, I increased my strength levels from 30-50% across all lifts and employed the superspeed system and increased flexibility and my swing is more solid due to increased practice. I have also increased my grip strength through the use of hand grippers and pinch plates and rock climbing holds. In addition I have done plyometrics involving box jumps and static jumps and medicine ball sales and throws. Ive been training hard for 18 months and have zero ball speed gains, in fact I may have lost a few mph. Not sure why that is but my golf game has definitely improved and im way stronger now.

In terms of using strength training as an absolute to enhance top range performance, I absolutely agree with that principal. All the guys on the LD tour lift even the ones who are not massive. Jamie Sadlowski could deadlift in excess of 550 on the hex bar which is quite a bit for his weight. If you are at the top of your game and want to increase your speed, weight training can only help. Even Bruce Lee employed weight lifting and I would guess that all of the 100m sprinters ranked in the top 20 in the world lift and do some form of plyometrics. If you are going for peak explosion, lifting can definitely enhance your gains if done correctly.

[PepsiDuck]

If you played collegiate basketball and football, then your body may naturally be built for athletics; or the cumulative training you did in your earlier years re-established your baseline near the peak of your physical ability, so any training you've done since your 25-year hiatus isn't really moving the needle...

Just my speculation...

[puresurfr]

I think there is 2 reasons for this lack of top speed gain. The first is because im old and its tough to hit new PRs as u age. The second is I cant overcome my internal speed govenor. My irons have all increased in swing speed and distance and I find it much easier to swing at my top speed and my overall driving distance has increased. I just cant seem to gain anything on ball speed or swing speed.

[ferrispgm]

As others have said...the amount that training will help is very dependent on your starting baseline and your genetics....some guys naturally create speed such as DJ, Brooks, Tiger, etc. If you are someone that can throw a baseball from center field to home plate in the air or with 1 bounce or hit a ball out to the fence you can probably hit the golf ball pretty far. But expecting to go from hitting it 240 to 310 via strength training is like going from hitting grounders and bloop singles to hitting HR's. Sure a few guys may benefit a lot but most will pick up a few mph

[LICC]

Exactly. No one is going to pick up 30 yards distance from strength training unless they were massively out of shape and could barely swing a club before they got in shape. When it comes to the Tours, not one player has been identified that has significantly increased distance through strength training.

[Krt22]

How do you think power hitters become power hitters in the first place?

[ferrispgm]

Most don't just become power hitters after hitting the gym. Most are power hitters all through their career while playing little league, high school, etc.. A vast majority on the all time leader list are not big guys at all...Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Gary Sheffield, Willie McCovey, and more are not big guys. DJ always hit the ball far, Tiger always hit the ball far before he started being a gym rat...These guys were born to move it and born with arm speed. I'm not saying the gym doesn't provide benefits, it certainly does but they are more centered around injury prevention, stamina, clubface stabilization in the rough, etc.

[Krt22]

Not big does not mean not strong and focusing on those much older players is pointless, modern power hitters are a different animal. They start training as kids and never stop, the one's who stand out early are typically just the bigger/better natural athletes in the first place and further increase that gap with the work they put in.

[LICC]

Justin Thomas. Tony Finau, JB Holmes ...

@ferrispgm is right, it's natural ability. Most all driving distance gains on Tour in the last 20+ years has been from equipment advances, not strength training.

[ferrispgm]

I respectfully disagree....I know modern players train from early on....however....the fact the older players still rank at the top and they didn't train like they do now proves my point that for the most part you are just born with it or you aren't. It's a crummy truth but a truth nonetheless. The only exception is someone going from being a totally lazy couch potato and never doing anything to working out. Even then though I have seen plenty of people who didn't gain more than 5 yards maybe 10. The best way to increase speed is to improve your swing and minimize compensations.

[bluedot]

Excellent post; thank you.

The key to answering the question the OP poses is replacing the term strength training with "golf fitness". Viewed in that light, the answer is almost always "Yes!", though the gains will, of course, vary from golfer to golfer. But the part of golf fitness that the golfer needs to work on will be dependent on their personal abilities and deficiencies; in your case, the prescription seems to have been traditional weight training. In my case, at age 67, I have plenty of strength and flexibility, but lack mobility; different deficiency, different prescription. There are other golfers that simply need to "wake up" their body's ability to move FAST thru the range of motion, so something like Super Speed works. For others, better technique is the answer. And so on.

This is why on threads about this stuff, one guy will say what worked for him, and another guy will counter with "Oh, yeah? I did that same stuff and it didn't do a thing for me!" Could be weight training, could be yoga, could be Super Speed, could be lessons; if it isn't YOUR deficiency, it won't be YOUR answer.

I've gotten lost distance back late in life by a ton of mobility work; I have worked out all my life, and I've done daily yoga for over 40 years. I doubt that what I've been doing would have been the proper prescription even for me when I was 37 instead of 67. On the other hand, I did the Super Speed protocol for nearly a year, and picked up very little. When I got evaluated by a TPI-type guy last fall, he told me that I was already swinging the club as fast as my body could possible allow me to given my mobility, which is why the SS program didn't work for me. Different situation, different prescription.

So the answer to the OP's question is a qualified "Yes!" if we are talking about a particular program for a particular golfer. On the other hand, if we're talking about the average guy with a good swing going to the weight room two or three times a week and lifting, even lifting a LOT, the answer might well be, "Probably not." And you could substitute ANY workout regimen for "strength training" and the answers would be the same. SOME program/protocol will help almost anybody hit the ball farther, but which one(s) is much too individual to have a simple answer.

[Krt22]

I agree that genetics will define your peak performance ceiling, but tons of folks never get to their ceiling because they just don't put in the work or don't know how access their full potential.. I grew up playing hitting sports (hockey, baseball, tennis) and picked up golf late in life. Despite crap mechanics and plenty of compensations, I can now swing faster than some tour pros (~115 peak, when I started maybe 100 or so), but I grew up trying to hit stuff hard and then lifted weights regularly for 7 or 8 years, so I just had a good base to start with. I agree fix mechanics first and foremost, but assuming you have a solid swing and hit a plateau, I don't agree that means it's a permanent ceiling for all players, even more so if those players are generally nonathletic as you mentioned.

[crapula]

What I've learned from this thread. The title/ question is vague and the wrong question to ask. Short answer, no, strength training will not significantly increase distance.

Vague how? What sort of strength training? What is significant?

There are too many variables involved to definitively say that strength training will increase distance. Yes, the right right strength training could help the right person increase distance. That is why the answer has to be no. Variables.

 

 

[Krt22]

I would say the question should be CAN strength training significantly increase distance? In which case the answer to that question is absolutely yes, countless examples have been presented in here, so no need to reiterate that. Does strength training guarantee an increase distance? Absolutely not. The entire golf swing hinges on exerting force at the right time to maximize speed, if you inherently do that incorrectly, the extra force is wasted and in some cases may be detrimental.

[crapula]

Agreed. There is no doubt in my mind that the right strength training could help the right person increase distance. Again, insanely vague, but I feel it is an appropriate statement.

[clevited]

@crapula I would tend to disagree. The general statement is true that strength training will significantly increase your distance. I say that because more often than not it does. Look at all of the first hand accounts in here alone. Look at the second and third hand accounts of people and tour players. Is it hard to isolate and measure exactly how much it helps? It sure is because often times it is paired with other changes to a swing, or flexibility what have you. I know however, of VERY few pro's, friends, acquaintances that have gotten in shape, or become stronger and not gained speed and distance. I have a good friend that got lessons for a while and then hit the gym. His swing didn't change, swings the same way as always but I used to be able to hit a 7 iron further than his driver. He swings it much faster now according to the measurements we have done of his swing speed. That is just one example of course but it has held very true in this thread and others like it.
I mean nobody is going to make a thread called, strength training does nothing significant for your distance. Ok well, maybe one person I know on here would lol.

[crapula]

The general statement is not true, it's a maybe.

[clevited]

LOL, I guess we agree to disagree on the interpretation of the OP. I see it as more of a sure thing that I do for instance, buying a new driver or something.

[LCGALBERTA]

Okay so it seems like the OP question has brought many different views as to, will strength training significantly increase distance?

Here's a slightly different train of thought.

We all have our own unique individual golf swing, right?

But the one variable that pretty much dictates distance is the radius of your swing. So in theory if you just focused on increasing the width/radius + the physics of your swing you would potentially increase your distance and improve your ball striking, right?

Strength training and having a good overal balanced golf fitness would obviously help give you a more stable base, which would help keep you planted and swing in balance while creating speed.

Just simply think about a golf swing robot, and remove the human component just to think about my view here. As it is obviously a more complex process, but let's keep it going in the general direction of going for more distance, and not turn this thread into a physics debate lol.

What do you guys think? Lol

[Trav1989]

I can’t believe that it is 2020 and people are still debating on if working out with weights improves a athletic movement. I am mind boggled. Golf is the only sport where the people even question this so either golfers are smarter than everyone else or lazy I don’t know which one lol

[TigerDoc]

It makes a difference for me. Strength isn’t an issue, but learning to be more explosive has definitely helped me add a few yards.

[bluedot]

I agree with you 100%; in most cases, guys who say "I don't need to work out." really mean "I don't want to work out." I don't know of any other sport where it comes up as much as it does with golfers.

I've been working out religiously for my entire adult life, now age 67, so I believe in weight training. BUT there is a catch; a lot of the golf benefits of weight training are NOT going to increase length. The benefits might include the ability to power the ball out of the rough, or to maintain angles, or stamina, or a number of other things, but length may not be one of them.

UNLESS the workouts include components that help you move your body faster thru the range of motion, and that isn't true of "conventional" weight lifting. So a golf-specific workout might combine deadlifts with a medicine ball slam, and then light weight-high reps bench press with rapid fire medicine ball chest passes off a wall, and on. High weight, low rep or max out sets probably won't help with swing speed, and probably won't be in a workout routine setup by a TPI-type instructor.

So it really all depends on what the question is, and what workout we're talking about.

[Pepperturbo]

Dang, some guys will debate a Gnats azz till he gets bed bugs and says the itching is anecdotal.

Sure various forms of exercise will improve distance, especially for puny guys that are out of shape and breath hard getting up to go to the head. But that does not necessary mean a guy with a beer belly isn't going out drive your azz and take your money. There is no absolute guarantee that strength training will overcome genetics. I've seen a few guys with brick sh**house muscle not be able to out drive a man (me) 30yrs older. But keep beating that , in hopes he rises from the dead.

[oikos1]

Hmmm...

 

CONCLUSIONS FROM THE DISTANCE INSIGHTS PROJECT: IMPLICATIONS OF HITTING DISTANCE IN GOLF, FEBRUARY 4, 2020

A Joint Initiative by the USGA and The R&APlayer improvements. It is expected that players will continue to pursue and achieve improvements in various ways that will result in further distance:

•Many golfers, as with athletes in other sports, will continue to focus on strength, flexibility and overall health and fitness to improve their performance and help generate more distance. The potential also exists for further improvement in human physical capabilities through continuing advances in science and medicine.

•Such improved athleticism together with revised swing techniques has helped lead to higher swing and ball speeds that in turn lead to more distance, and there is room for this to continue. As an example of what is possible, competitors in long-drive contests are able, with today’s conforming equipment, to generate swing speeds in excess of 145 mph, ball speeds in excess of 215 mph and driving distances in excess of 400 yards.14

[dpb5031]

I am a huge proponent of weight training, but I think there's some flaws in many of the conclusions people are drawing from personal experience.

Golf swings evolve over time. Many of those crediting strength training for their CHS gains are claiming no change to their golf swing. This is nearly impossible to substantiate.

The golf swing is a very nuanced sequence of athletic movements. Subtle improvements in sequencing and technique can yield huge speed increases that some may be unwittingly attributing to strength gains.