Monty says a new tour ball is needed to counter Bryson DeChambeau's crazy distance

[gvogel]

Uh, one guy shot 60 yesterday, and there sure were a lot of 63's, 64's and 65's. Lots. And DeChambeau drove it hole high on a par 4 over water.

I would say that the course they are playing has been reduced to a pitch and putt; thank you for making my argument!

[trilerian]

I'm 43, and while I am not in favor of a rollback, I'm not apposed to one at the tour level. I am 100% against one that affects the everyday golfer. I've been playing modern equipment and modern golf balls all my golfing days, and I have no desire to speed up what age will eventually do for me (hit the ball shorter). The pros on the other hand, well, they are pros. And while I enjoy watching the modern game of golf, I can understand the arguments made by some others.

[Ferguson]

Paul DeMaulte from the Florida Tribune writes:

The thread “monty says tour needs new ball" shows life is beautiful, in a way reality never is.  All is permitted, and forgiven, in the name of distance and self-expression. The power game of 2020 is exquisitely picturesque. Stardom is around the corner for the gifted and hungry. And even posts you thought you never wanted to see again pulse with irresistible new appeal. What this emporium of impure temptations is really selling is pure escapism. You may not believe in it all by the next morning after reading the thread, but I swear you'll feel nothing like regret after.

 Kay Macky of the NY Times touts:

These days, most thread-readers don't so much want to read an entire thread as take a warm bath inside of one. We crave relief from our growing terror of physical intimacy and our technology-fueled loneliness. What used to pass as immersive theatrical entertainment is, as we end this panicked second decade of the 21st century, no longer immersive enough. The bar has risen with the “Monty says the tour needs a new ball” thread.  Yes, baby, you're a firework.

  Adam “Feldy” Marshcram of the St. Louis Journal for Entertainment shouts:

 Red alert! Red alert! If you're the kind of person who frets that jukebox selective style posting is taking over WRX, prepare to tilt at the windmill that is the gorgeous, gaudy, spectacularly overstuffed “Monty says the tour needs a new ball” thread!  Directed with opulent showmanship by masters of the posting craft, this adaptation of previous “dial-back” threads may be costume jewelry, but its shine is dazzling.

  Karen Bigonions from the Rochester D&C states:

For all its splashy, glittery, high-kicking, butt-cheek-baring, sword-swallowing maximalism, “Monty says the tour needs a new ball” thread is something more unsettling than not good.   It's not even very interesting. There's a shapelessness about it, a weird enervation underneath the flash and bang. It appears as an ordinary forum thread, but it feels like it was assembled by committee, even by algorithm. The thread veers broadly away from its everywhere source material, which in itself is no crime. But the path its creators have taken is one long trip without multiple pit stops in the Meadows of Cutesiness and the Forest of Flat Characters.  Everywhere it should be filthy, it's scrubbed aggressively clean, yet somehow, it's still a hot mess.

 

 Don Kopecknick of the Atlanta Chronicle exclaims:

 The thread is A LOT, in every sense, both intoxicating and exhausting in its unrelenting visual and sonic assault. The “Monty says the tour needs a new ball” thread virtually defies you not to be entertained.

 

 

[OrangeGravy]

At some point though, you have to rip the band-aid off at the tour level. You can either do it right away and everyone in golf can adapt or you bring it along from the youth level. There's still gonna be tour players that haven't used it whenever you make the change. I'm not sure which would be better. Maybe there would be less players on tour that would be "holdovers" having never played the new ball, but in that case those players would be older and at very high risk of being pushed out en mass. If you make the change right away, everyone on tour starts from the same place as far as adapting to the ball.

[Dpavs]

You know after my experience with putting yesterday, I might be in favor of slowing the ball if they would increase the hole size at the same time..lol.

[smashdn]

Now we know Monty is not the only bilious windbag.

[bscinstnct]

 

You do it in in two ways.

 

First, you introduce the new ball for all competitive (and maybe all in general) junior golfers under the age of say 10.

 

Then, you make a deal with the tour that the tour will go to the new ball ***after their 9-year TV deal with all the networks is over.

 

 

[Titleist99]

You have no point......they're having a tournament on a golf course in which you stated was to short, obsolete 6841 yards........NOW YOU WANT TO MOVE THE GOAL POST. You are wrong!

[mahonie]

I don’t disagree. However, when ‘keeping it in play’ could mean missing the edge of the fairway by 30 yards, the level of skill required is not as great as you might think. The PGA Tour counts the first cut of rough as ‘fairway’ for Shots Gained and recorded stats. Why? The only reason I can think of is to make the long game look more difficult than it actually is. Fairways hit up at 75% looks a lot better than 50%. Watch the 2nd round today and see how many drives finish in the first cut. Remember to call it ‘fairway’ and then you can see how good the 345 yard drives really are.

 

[clevited]

Not sure if you have ever tried to keep a 300+ yard carry drive in play on any golf course, but it is no easy task. The unseen breeze alone can push that ball many yards offline not to mention the amount of roll that happens on courses these days is absurd and can definitely help sling a would be good drive into the rough. I disllike how often the skill to hit a ball as hard as these players do and keep it in play is overlooked. You have to be even more precise with strike and path and face angle than the guy bopping it out there 250-275. I dare say the amount of risk goes up exponentially the harder you try and hit the ball with a driver today.

[Titleist99]

If you want the answer to this thread debate Look no further than the first hole of the travelers tournament: Phil, Rory, and Bryson tees off>>>Rory land in the thick rough to the right, Bryson land in the thick rough on the left, Phil pipes it down the middle. Second shot>>Rory hit shot barely on the front on the green 40 feet away. Bryson miss the green chipping to the pin. Phil hitting rom the fairway has a 12 footer or birdie. While Phil had a nice look at birdie the other two was struggling for Par......that's what should happen on all hole on the PGAtour unless you want to se birdies and entertain the fans. Remember the tour is in the entertainment business, not saving classic golf courses........

[Titleist99]

Still waiting on my question to be answered. they're having a tournament on a 6841 yard golf course.....What classic course is obsolete and can't played due to yardage being to short because pros hit it to far?

[smashdn]

447 R1 and 442 R2.

Rory parred #1 both days. Had 160ish left both days. He took less than driver.

BD birdied it day 1 and parred day 2. 160ish R1 and 135 R2.

(50 year old) PM drove it 330 in R1 for par. R2 307 for par.

 

I don't follow what the takeaway here is?

[mahonie]

Again I don’t disagree. The issue for me is that there has to be a balance between risk and reward. If you miss the shot as you intended to hit it, you should be penalised, not with par but with bogey or worse (unless you play a great recovery).

BCD compared Colonial with Harbour Town last week and although I didn’t see the whole interview what I got from it was that Colonial was wide open so he could flail away...it took him 2 rounds to work out that 3-wood was the club at Harbour Town.

From the course architect’s viewpoint, if the optimum width of fairway at the optimum position to hit your 2nd shot, say at 300 yards is 25 yards wide, if you risk hitting driver 345 yards to get closer, your optimum landing area should only be say 15 yards wide...risk vs reward. What you actually see on PGA Tour courses is nothing like that...there is probably much less risk at 345 yards than there is at 300 yards which is totally backwards and just drives the game towards more distance.

[15th Club]

“...Remember the tour is in the entertainment business, not saving classic golf courses........”

 

Which is why the Tour (you forgot your capitalization!) should never, ever be allowed to dictate the Rules of Golf.

[mahonie]

The PGA Tour is in the money-making business...don’t think for a second that entertainment comes into it.

[Titleist99]

I've said that many, many times in the past........I'm well aware of that fact. TPC golf courses are operated by the PGATOUR.

[Titleist99]

And you forgot to add the disclaimer: "In my opinion"

[mahonie]

We’re not that far away from the ‘Titleist PGA Tour’ ?.

Every ad on Sky Golf over here in the UK is Titleist...it couldn’t be more blatant.

[clevited]

It depends on the golf course heavily right? Many different course designs for many different reasons. I also think that courses evolved over the years to make those approach shots and then the putting much harder than they once were. Problem is, these guys are so good, even that isn't enough to stop them from scoring on any given day. I just think we poo poo too often the skills that elite players today have over the talents of the past. They have a different set of challenges today than yesteryear. I for one am a serous believer that the overall talent in all aspects of the game is much higher on average today than it was back back in the day. I don't know a single elite player that can't shape a long iron at will for instance, or hit a stinger on command, or hit the exact middle of their clubs with almost robotic consistency. Sure there are some that struggle but they generally don't win on tour, nor are they ever going to be #1. These players don't pull those bendy, or specialty shots out of the bag often not because they can't do it, but because it isn't the highest percentage shot imo. Like water flowing downhill, players will always take the path of least resistance. Unless your name is Bubba, then you do crazy crap just to satisfy your ADD lol.

Edit: I just wanted to add that players hit all different distances. You can't design a course really to account for that when playing tour style from the same tee. Always going to be a guy that has a max distance of 275 that doesn't have to worry one bit off the tee on one hole, while the longer player has to club down in order to not risk hitting out of play in order to get that wedge shot advatage. Then there willl be another hole where the 275 guy is at risk of hitting it OB or something so he has to club down while the longer guy can carry the OB and have no worryies really. This happens all the time. You would literally have to force people to play certain tees based entirely on there distance capabilities, or dictate to them directly what club they have to hit and when. That is almost what this ball roll back stuff to me is trying to accomplish to a certain extent.

[bscinstnct]

 

Sports is entertainment.

 

The tour wants “Terminator”, big blockbuster stuff, fast moving, pow!

 

The roll back proponents want more Citizen Kane, thoughtful, mysterious.

 

Citizen Kane is arguably a much finer film, but not a box office hit.

[mahonie]

The Good, the Bad and the Ugly would do for me ??

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

Hey, I’m old, but definitely NOT for rollback Hahaha!

[mahonie]

I've analysed my position on this issue over the lockdown when I’ve not had the opportunity to actually go out and play. It appears my mine gripe is with the anodyne design of the TPC courses that are the bedrock of the PGA Tour ‘experience.’ As the European Tour seems hell bent on following the PGA Tour template, the televised offering over here in the UK is now all much of a muchness and it bores me to tears.

Looking back at when I started playing, all I needed to watch to maintain my golf enthusiasm was the Masters to get the season going and the Open to take me through the middle of the season. That was all the televised golf we had. Unfortunately we don’t get any golf on terrestrial TV anymore, so to watch the Masters and Open I have had to subscribe to Sky Sports. To get value for money for my subscription, I am duty bound to watch whatever golf has been on offer. As there has been no live golf for the last 3 months I’ve noticed that I haven’t missed it all...there have been other far more entertaining activities going on. So, I’ve concluded that I don’t need to watch the PGA Tour anymore and I can save myself a packet by not paying for the subscription service. I can concentrate on playing and getting my fix of proper golf on YouTube and the PGA Tour and OEMs can waste their advertising budget on some other schmuck. I don’t care if the game doesn’t grow, my lad plays the same game as me so as long as he can get a game akin to what we play now we’re good.

Epiphany realised it’s time to sign out and not worry about the PGA Tour ruining the game for the future ?

[FakeClubPro]

MLB wanted juiced bats and balls. If Bryson can keep it in the fairway then good for him. Anyone who can hit it that far and can find the fairway deserves the benefit.

[Titleist99]

And the sooner they realize this the soon we can stop having stupid debates like this......LOL!

[Titleist99]

PGA's Travelers Tournament.......6841 yards. Korn Ferry Tour's Utah Championship Tournament 6929 yards and that's with high elevation.

Can we please stop saying and having debates that the ball goes to far and it is making classic courses obsolete. Today they're having tournaments at these shorty's and a champion will be crowned.

 

[gvogel]

They are playing a course which is really a par 69, if that. It has a 269 yard par 4, on which Rory was using a 5-wood. Is that not a par 3?

For the best players in the world, it is a very short course, only made honest by a lot of water. It would play even better with a reduced distance ball. But you don't get it.

[J13]

Merion put up a helluva fight in the US Open so it can be done without being 7500+ yds. Out of all the solutions I think rolling the ball back a bit for pro's makes the most sense but Titleist would melt down and sue everyone. That's just a fact.

[Titleist99]

Your case gets weaker and weaker, now you are inventing par 69's. please stop your foolishness' by saying I don't get it, there is nothing to get. The tour can have a tournament on any track in the country providing it makes money. Yardage is so far down on the list that it don't come into play.

The tees at the 6841 Travelers tournament will be moved up tomorrow (Saturday) due to inclement weather.

YES they will be moving the tees up!