Chasing distance

[Cbfodalo]

I am usually the longest ball striker in my groups.  I avg 268 off tee and can generally out drive most of my playing partners and strangers I get paired with.  I generally do not care how others hit the ball, but I do get a certain amount of satisfaction when I out drive the group.

The funny thing is I got paired up with two guys last week. They where both 20 years younger. I am 57 and they where both in mid 30s. 

They where good Players and we started on first hole with those two hitting bombs on the fairway about 280 or so.  I proceeded to hit right down next to them both, right down the middle.  But as the round went on, I started to struggle with consistency off tee. I did hit one bomb 280 to right side of fairway, but I was really struggling with a high fade and a few bad slices. Falling off back foot, started to really dip into drive and swing way to hard. 

After round I looked at my drives and felt how sore my back and elbow were and realized that those guys bombing the drive had me trying waaay to hard to beat them off tee.  As a result I shot a poor score of 93 and had too many punch outs from slicing tee shot.. Complete mental Failure. 

I allowed my ego to get in the way of my equanimity. I was frustrated and stressed out instead of relaxed and calm.  I really try not to feel a need to chase distance, it comes natural when I swing easy and calm.  Lesson learned.  When others are playing well and I am not the long ball in the group, I need to have even more attention to mental focus and slow down preshot and breath. Swing easy and be calm. 

I see similar lack of focus and tension when I play skins with my brother. I get so tensed up I just suck it up. 

So the challenge now is to remain as calm as I can regardless of who I am playing with and how we are all playing.  It's not so hard when I am playing  well and winning some holes.  I really have to accept that I will not perfect and play calm. 

 

Edited May 21, 2023 by Cbfodalo
Typo

[NewToGolf19]

that’s awesome that you average 267 off the tee at age 57. I’m in my 40s and happy if I poke it out there to 220-240.

 

What do you attribute your length to? Resistance training, core, flexibility, mechanics, all of the above?

 

I have no interest in swing speed training but want to take a more holistic approach to health and golf (core, flexibility, strength) and hope it leads to distance gains.

 

 

[596]

Distance can easily be defined by genetics in a lot of cases. You can increase to an extent but you are limited by genetics.  If not for genetics, everyone would be the longest, fastest, strongest. 

 

I play with a 70 year old that plays only once each week.  He easily averages 270 or more off the tee.  He does nothing fancy to get that distance. He just has a faster club head speed. 

[MelloYello]

I play with a lot of different people who vary in skill and all hit the ball differently. Some are shorter hitters. Some are longer. 

 

If you're answering to a fixed challenge (some organized Tournament in your state) then yeah, obviously developing some combination of long & accurate is going to help a lot. 

 

For amateurs just having fun though, I think it's about getting what they want. Young guys want to control the ball because they can hit it far without much effort. Older guys are more experienced and usually care about score. Plus, they can't do much about distance as the years go by. 

 

I'll just say I know plenty of people who I hit it past who score great and really enjoy the game. It's not about distance or at least it's not the end of the world if you're not the longest hitter. It's about playing the best you can off whatever tees you're playing that day. 

 

.

Edited May 22, 2023 by MelloYello

[RobS]

It happens, and sometimes we don't even recognize it!  It's easier said than done, but playing your own game, within yourself, is going to put your best scores on the card.  I'm a reasonably long hitter for my age.  I probably hit it by 50% of the guys I encounter, even with another 25% and then there's the 25% that blow it by me.  I'd be lying if I said I didn't subconsciously reach for extra at times when I'm playing with guys that have a lot of firepower.  I had a very simple moment that stuck with me.  I was playing in a four ball event.  My partner was a revered head pro and a very good player.  On the first tee, one of our opponents takes an aggressive line and hits missile.  I'm getting ready to step on the tee and the pro taps me on the arm, smiles, and says, 'don't chase it'.  I've repeated that in my head countless times since then when I on the tee with guys that can airmail my drives.

[uitar9]

56 minutes ago, MelloYello said:

For amateurs just having fun though, I think it's about getting what they want. Young guys want to control the ball because they can hit it far without much effort. Older guys are more experienced and usually care about score. Plus, they can't do much about distance as the years go by. 

Played as a single on Saturday. Two young guns and another old guy, like me. 

 

We all played the mens whites. Hole # 1, about 310 par 4, we waited till the green cleared because...the guns can make the 310 uphill dogleg left. Never did happen.

 

Us two old guys hacked our way through 4 holes , played bogey golf, while the two groups behind us started backing up. Trouble was, their big drives never made the fairway we were on. Wouldn't have hurt if they could scramble. Lost 4 balls between them.

 

I shot a 90. My fellow old guy an 86. They guessed at each hole.

 

We caught ourselves trying too hard the first  few holes. Gave that up real quick.

 

I gotta play my game.

 

 

 

 

[jholz]

When compared to you average muni hack - I'm pretty long. Like 240 carry. That's long in this field of players.

 

Every now and again, I will get paired with someone who legitimately hits the ball. The outdrive me by 50 yards, minimum.

 

It's tough not to get into the "I'm going to hit it long" mentality when paired with players like that.

 

But, if you are out on the muni or local club on a summer afternoon - anyone you get paired with is going to suck - no matter how far they hit the ball.

 

I love beating those "long-hitting" dudes with shorter drives.

[phizzy30]

8 hours ago, NewToGolf19 said:

that’s awesome that you average 267 off the tee at age 57. I’m in my 40s and happy if I poke it out there to 220-240.

 

What do you attribute your length to? Resistance training, core, flexibility, mechanics, all of the above?

 

I have no interest in swing speed training but want to take a more holistic approach to health and golf (core, flexibility, strength) and hope it leads to distance gains.

 

 

You need to do speed training in order to see any significant gains or else you'll be spinning your wheels.  The other things you mentioned are fine but the speed gains from those won't be as dramatic as you think it will.  What I'm saying is that in order to fully maximize speed, you need to do it all.  Strength, flexibility, speed, balance and an having an efficient swing. 

[Ri_Redneck]

Great replies here. I think my revelation on sequencing happened several years back while watching an LPGA tournament. Can't remember the player, but something just clicked and I grabbed my driver and went to the garage. Took several swings and then it fell together. Worked on that feel for about a month before it became ingrained. I literally felt like I was flinging the clubhead through with no effort. It created a lot of speed, but didn't feel like much effort. But after about ten swings, I'm breathing hard and sweating. So the effort is there without me knowing it. The key is the proper tempo between the backswing and downswing. Too fast or too slow and it falls apart. Wish I could be more specific, but I can't.

 

BT

[Nels55]

On 5/22/2023 at 2:10 PM, phizzy30 said:

You need to do speed training in order to see any significant gains or else you'll be spinning your wheels.  The other things you mentioned are fine but the speed gains from those won't be as dramatic as you think it will.  What I'm saying is that in order to fully maximize speed, you need to do it all.  Strength, flexibility, speed, balance and an having an efficient swing. 

 

I would say that the number one factor in speed for any golfer is learning their correct grip that will not cause their body to put the brakes on in order to hit the ball straight.  Number two is learning an efficient swing that uses the ground as well as possible.  Number three would be conditioning which would include speed training.  

 

In these two videos Fredrick who is an accomplished golfer who is already in good shape picks up significant clubhead speed (~10mph) and directional control by improving his grip and swing:

 

 

If a person already has excellent grip and swing mechanics, then speed training is a good idea if distance is the goal.

[golfinbrad]

32 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

 

I would say that the number one factor in speed for any golfer is learning their correct grip that will not cause their body to put the brakes on in order to hit the ball straight.  Number two is learning an efficient swing that uses the ground as well as possible.  Number three would be conditioning which would include speed training.  

 

In these two videos Fredrick who is an accomplished golfer who is already in good shape picks up significant clubhead speed (~10mph) and directional control by improving his grip and swing:

 

 

If a person already has excellent grip and swing mechanics, then speed training is a good idea if distance is the goal.

Great video!!!!  I can see weekend warriors not being able to get out of bed the next day after trying this.  Oh to be young.

[Pepperturbo]

I am 70+ and all about the score walking off 18.  Playing to a 4, low of 2, still carrying it 240-245+yds, and can out play most younger guys that are fascinated with hitting driver. 

 

Overcoming golf intimidation is all about pitting yourself against foes that hit it longer and maybe better than you.  Look at Michael Block in the PGA, he was a short hitter, playing with Rory, yet, at the end, look how many pros he bettered.  Why, he stepped up and played HIS game.  Hell, one Par 5 he used driver off the deck to reach the green in two.  In my world, I've always wanted to compete or play against superior opponents.  Easy wins don't have the same impact as beating or even almost beating a better opponent because to do that they force me to find it within myself to step up and overcome. 

 

Always exhibit self-control while playing your own game, and remember, most big hitters are overconfident, will grab for their driver and go looking for their ball in the junk, most don't have a recovery shot, and don't have a saving short game.  To beat them all you have to bring is a never give-up warrior's heart. 

 

PS, the reason I don't play any type of games for money with family or close friends, I don't like who I become in competition; I want to stomp my opponent's throat till the end, even in board-games.  Play well.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Pepperturbo

[Ghostwedge]

On 5/22/2023 at 7:52 AM, 596 said:

Distance can easily be defined by genetics in a lot of cases. You can increase to an extent but you are limited by genetics.  If not for genetics, everyone would be the longest, fastest, strongest. 

 

I play with a 70 year old that plays only once each week.  He easily averages 270 or more off the tee.  He does nothing fancy to get that distance. He just has a faster club head speed. 

This is the answer. Some guys no matter how many lessons or training stints taken will never hit the ball very far. By far I mean at least 280 yds consistently.

It takes hand+eye coordination, flexibility and most importantly fast twitch muscle. 

[Cbfodalo]

Wow, this thread realy blew up, I love it. 

I am 5'11" tall,  am about 15 lbs over what I would consider good weight for me, I am 210lbs. 

I should be around 195.

At any rate, I can really jack up swing speed and hit a few serious bombs out to 310 or even 330. In a best ball tournament last summer I almost won longest drive at 330,  But that's with zero concern and just absolutely letting it rip.  Under normal conditions with scoring on my mind, I really make an effort to clear my mind of all swing thoughts and let it happen.  When I think about the mechanics is when  tense up and start hitting wild tee shots.  When I say wild I mean  off fairway and occasionally into next fairway. But overall I really do no speed training or working out at all.  I walk on course at least 4 times a week and typically avg about 17k  steps walking on no golf days and 28k steps when I walk 18. I am in pretty good shape and have always been a pretty long hitter.  I hit one 287 right down middle today and several over 260.  I am after more distance and accuracy off tee.  I tried Going old man style conservative swing and poke it out there 220 and layup, but not only is it not any fun for me, it makes it so much harder..for me. 

Maybe when I get old and decrepit and can no longer make a full turn and swing free I will change my approach 😉. But for now and foresable future I am planning to swing free and fast off tee and live with results. 

Now on approaches, chips lobs etc., I am doing pretty much opposite of tee shots.  I am starting to really trust my irons, and taking half a back swing with very little shoulder turn, just enough to drop club head on ball with a good path. I am trusting the stroke but not forcing it. 

I still miss plenty of greens, but I am avoiding the big miss by swinging very easy with irons.

My 7i with a short turn and an easy swing is about 150. I could easy jack that thing out to 180 if I wanted to crank it up, but I am way to wild when I do that and I see no point. I can get to almost every par 4 and 5 in two without having to crush second shot.  So I let it rip off tee and play it easy with irons. I am OK if I miss green as long as I can avoid the nasty misses that make it very hard to get up and down.  When I am scoring well, I am hitting long off tee, staying close to fairway and then staying close to green on approach, my chipping and putting is where the rubber meets the road. If I am chipping well I usually putt well to. 

I do agree that some people just have athletic predisposition to swing a driver fast, others have other strengths like chipping, putting spinning up a wedge etc. 

The whole idea for me to to recognize my own talents and foster a mental equanimity to allow myself to be successful without all the judgment about missing shots.  I am quite capable of shooting 82 today then 96 tomorrow. 

In fact, two days ago I shot 88, 46 on front and 42 on back, that's with 4 doubles on front and 1 on back.  Today I shot 96, 49 on back and 46 on front, we had to start on 10 today.  I blew up on a par 5 and had a legit 10 on front.  That's was after a really nice start of birdie par par., then 10....

I did not get angry or freak out, I just took my medicine and proceeded to bogie out the round and left not exactly happy but not crucifying myself either. I am Getting close to putting this together and find myself really focusing on course a little better. I still make some serious bone head mistakes,  huge mishits on occasion or just poor decision making.  On the par 5  10 spot I dropped today, it started with a high pop up drive to wayy left over a small row of trees almost to other fairway. 

I was completely blocked out as it was a dogleg left, with a big clump of trees between me and 

Fairway.  I was maybe 60 yards to tree line. I don't have a draw but I did have a clear line to hit 7i back to my fairway leaving a managble 2 hybrid to green.  But I liked the lie and thought damn if I hit my 4hybrid over those trees I can cut this down and have a short iron to green. So I setup and hit a beautiful 4hybrid about 3ft too low, caught top of tree dropped straight down into some bushes under tree. So now I am laying 2 basically unplayable lie. But since I am already making poor decisions, I try to punch out to fairway, I do not make it so I am. Laying 3 and have to punch out again. So I finally to get back to fairway laying 4 still 230 from Green. I normally will hit my 2 hybrid on that lie and can reach 230 with it. But laying 4 already and struggling I should probable have laid up, at any rate I hit a high fade that landed 60 yards short and on right side of fairway laying 5. 

So OK, easy sand wedge to green 1 put for double  bogie. Nope, pulled sand wedge to front left bunker in 6. Hit lob on green 7, 3 puts for 10. Awesome. 

 

[naval2006]

As experience builds up and you get more and more competitive you learn to take it easy on drives during a round. You don’t feel proud when you outdrive the rest of the lot and you don’t get down when someone hits it 30 yards past you. Every golfer has their distance and no matter how hard you try to get longer, you’ll eventually come back to your distance. If you own your distance you add predictability to your game. 

[me05501]

It has taken *years* but I've gradually come to understand that all of the things my body does when I ask it for more distance are counter-productive. 

 

Trying to swing fast does not lead to me swinging faster. Not naturally, at least.

 

Making a full turn with good tempo and sequencing do add speed but they don't feel fast. 

 

Like hitting down on the ball to make it go up, like swinging out to the right to move the ball to the left, this is another one of those opposite deals. 

Edited May 26, 2023 by me05501

[Cbfodalo]

11 hours ago, naval2006 said:

As experience builds up and you get more and more competitive you learn to take it easy on drives during a round. You don’t feel proud when you outdrive the rest of the lot and you don’t get down when someone hits it 30 yards past you. Every golfer has their distance and no matter how hard you try to get longer, you’ll eventually come back to your distance. If you own your distance you add predictability to your game. 

I love this thread. Cleary chasing distance at the expense of consistency is a recipe for failure.  A good turn, a smooth transition and it does not feel fast, but it is.  Either way, the consistency on the drive and every other shot is difference maker.  When I am playing well, It feels so effortless, when struggling, well it's a struggle.  I played nine today, head was not completely in game, it's memorial day week and my service business is just so crazy this week.  I was having hard time focusing and swinging easy.  I can pretty much tell after first few swings, in fact I could tell while warming up, practicing chipping and putting that my mind was not free, my focus was off and my confidence was nil.  It showed up right away and believe me getting through that nine holes was more about grinding then having fun. When I am tense, or distracted old habits come to fore, chipping short, putting short,  approaches short, Lobs skulled. Just torture. I would like to say I am proud for sticking with it, but I am not.  I am dissapointed that I did not have the mental fortitude to settle down and focus. I hit like 4 doubles in a row, salvaged a few pars, but overall one of the worst 9 hole stretches I have put on card in a while

Ended up posting a 49, it was bad, but felt even worse. I will not allow that round to carry over to tomorrow.  I am playing with my favorite partner. We walk together about 1 or 2 times a week and I typically play well with him. We both are tinkerers and live to talk about building clubs and on course strategy. We help each other and I when facing big shots we discuss Ike we are caddying for each other. That part of the game, the shared experience, the competitive challenge, coupled with a genuine desire for the other guy to do well is very enjoyable. I am pretty good about leaving that bad round in the past. I will get better at leaving that bad shot in the past too, just not quite there yet. 

 

[ezra76]

You were overswinging, which doesn't lead to more clubspeed and definitely not more ballspeed on avg. if you are all over the face.

 

I did speed training, working out and flexibility training for about 8months. I went from 97 to 103club speed.

 

My swing now is drastically different with driver. I stay on the ball with a big coil. I had my prgr on the range about a month ago warming up. I hit a first 2 drives 97, 98 mph.. I tried to really go after it, 99 with a big slice. Regrouped and stayed on the ball with a big coil and arms made of garden hose, 102 with a 2yd. cut off the pole I was aiming at. I hit 3 more over 100 up the gut and good to go. I like to say I switched from Kyle to Nelly with my driver swing feel and it's longer, straighter, more consistent and easier on my body.

 

Last night I played 9 with my kid. I used driver 3x and hit fairway about 260-270 on 1st one, 2nd time was couple yards off the front on a hole that had a 286 marker (almost chipped in), then 72yds. in on 416 taking the agressive line downwind. I'll take those at 47yrs. old.

Edited May 27, 2023 by ezra76

[SollyinGA]

I’m about the same average driver length as OP. I also out drive most people I play with. To me, it doesn’t really matter anymore. I’m 54 now and I know the score matters way more than driving it far. 
 

I’ve been beaten by more than a few players that were 20 or more yard shorter. 
 

All I really care about with my tee ball is to get it in the short grass. I could hit it further, but I also want full shots into the green. I despise strange yardages into the green. My general rule is to leave myself 100 yards in and adjust my club selection off the tee based on that.

Edited May 29, 2023 by SollyinGA

[Cbfodalo]

I have been putting aomentime into studying my strokes gained data.  I see two areas of concern that I really need to focus on. 

 

1. I am only hitting like 43% of fairways, my avg has increased to 278 off tee, but I need to be more relaxed and swing a bit easier  and get my fairway hits up to 60% or close  to that anyway. 

 

2. Approaches

I just made a stupidly obvious revelation. I track all my distances with shot scope.  So I miss green short 50% of the time.. Well. Duh, I have been using my shot. Scope Avg distance to select clubs, well that distance is total. Distance not carry distance.  I am such an idiot. Approach shots is my biggest strokes gained deficit so I cannot. Wait to.play today and really be much careful with club selection. I am gonna hit more greens from 80 out. 

My short game chipping and putting is good. Not. Great but not a liability. I have pretty good feel for chips inside 80 and around the green, 

Putting is good, but I do suffer from a mental weakness, if the putt is to close out a blow up hole. I really lose focus and almost punish myself with lack of focus on putt. The reality is if I stayed focused I could qvojd blow up holes and maybe salvage a stroke or even 2.

But back to approaches, I feel like such an idiot for years I have known my yardages, but never really thought about why I am short on approaches, I always felt like I just got. Nervous when approaching green and miss hit it. 

For a long time I woykd hit all my irons seriously. High, ballooning is the term. 

Over past few season I have lowered my ball. Flight to a nice mid trajectory with a smoother and easier swing on all iron shots.  I am defintely. More accurate as far as left right dispersion. The problem is I never really even considered roll out, the concept eluded me for decades.  So yeah I know my 7i avg is around 150, but on approaches I really need to be hinging 140.  I am going to update my iron distances and lower everything 10 yards and really focus on carry distance.. 

 

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

On 5/22/2023 at 4:54 AM, NewToGolf19 said:

that’s awesome that you average 267 off the tee at age 57. I’m in my 40s and happy if I poke it out there to 220-240.

 

What do you attribute your length to? Resistance training, core, flexibility, mechanics, all of the above?

 

I have no interest in swing speed training but want to take a more holistic approach to health and golf (core, flexibility, strength) and hope it leads to distance gains.

 

 

 

If your username of "NewToGolf19" means you are new to the game of golf as of 2019, the most likely thing hindering your distance is basic mechanics. I.e. you're probably making moves in your swing that are dramatically leaking power, and with lessons and improving mechanics, would be able to get a LOT more distance. It's all about sequencing, not speed training, for most newer players. Especially those who didn't pick up the game as kids. 

 

IMHO just about all of us in our 40s (I'm 44) benefit from basic core, flexibility, and strength work, and that's not a golf statement. That's just good for life. But it's also good for golf, so if that's your motivation to actually get off the couch and do it, use it. 

 

For golf, working on a more effective and efficient swing with a good pro will help with distance. And accuracy. And consistency. 

 

Only work on "speed training" when you've improved the above. 

[golfarb1]

Let’s put this in prospective .
. Even though their physical capabilities have naturally diminished with age, the average driving distance of players on the Senior PGA Tour is 274 yards . Not only do these players have superior technique honed over decades of playing  ,most if not all senior PGA players have frequent  access to various combinations of club heads and shafts and testing equipment such as Trackman that allows them to optimize their distance . 

Many others and I would kill to average 268 yards off of the tee . Given that  the technique of most amateurs is inferior to that  of senior PGA players and very few of us have  the funds or access to maximize our equipment  choices , such distance off the tee is unrealistic . A better choice for many golfers would be to use the driving distance of LPGA players s a template . 
The average drive for LPGA players is 246yards. And unlike PGA players whose average AOA is (-1.5) , the AOA of LPGA players is >+3.

[betarhoalphadelta]

39 minutes ago, golfarb1 said:

Let’s put this in prospective .
. Even though their physical capabilities have naturally diminished with age, the average driving distance of players on the Senior PGA Tour is 274 yards . Not only do these players have superior technique honed over decades of playing  ,most if not all senior PGA players have frequent  access to various combinations of club heads and shafts and testing equipment such as Trackman that allows them to optimize their distance . 

Many others and I would kill to average 268 yards off of the tee . Given that  the technique of most amateurs is inferior to that  of senior PGA players and very few of us have  the funds or access to maximize our equipment  choices , such distance off the tee is unrealistic . A better choice for many golfers would be to use the driving distance of LPGA players s a template . 
The average drive for LPGA players is 246yards. And unlike PGA players whose average AOA is (-1.5) , the AOA of LPGA players is >+3.

 

 

Forgive me, but I've seen many people here suggest that ams should take something away from the game of the LPGA players. But I don't know what that even means?

 

Jin Young Ko is currently #1 in points on the LPGA tour. She's 5'7", weight unknown (and I'm not rude enough to ask), and 27 years old. She drives it 263. 

 

I'm 6'5", 260#, and 44 years old. Despite my trash golf skills, I can poke it out there 260 on a good strike. 

 

But I'd argue that in no world should I be looking at Jin Young Ko as a template. 

 

If I'm not hitting it well past her, it's because my technique sucks, and I should fix that. Because my potential distance ceiling is markedly higher than hers given my size and strength. 

 

 

[phizzy30]

3 hours ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

Forgive me, but I've seen many people here suggest that ams should take something away from the game of the LPGA players. But I don't know what that even means?

 

Jin Young Ko is currently #1 in points on the LPGA tour. She's 5'7", weight unknown (and I'm not rude enough to ask), and 27 years old. She drives it 263. 

 

I'm 6'5", 260#, and 44 years old. Despite my trash golf skills, I can poke it out there 260 on a good strike. 

 

But I'd argue that in no world should I be looking at Jin Young Ko as a template. 

 

If I'm not hitting it well past her, it's because my technique sucks, and I should fix that. Because my potential distance ceiling is markedly higher than hers given my size and strength. 

 

 

I agree that by improving your swing technique and making it more efficient, you should see an increase in distance.  However, Jin Young Ko is young, flexible and works out on a regular basis along with her efficient swing which makes her capable of hitting it as far as she does.  What robs most ams of power besides an inefficient swing is lack of overall mobility but more specifically, the hips.  You may very well be in this group.  Also, the belief that just because you're bigger and stronger than her doesn't mean that you will necessarily out drive her.  It's a common misconception.  Strength does play a role, but it's not as significant as you think.  It's more about flexibility, mobility, and being able able to get into certain positions and how many Type II fibers you have in your muscles IMO.  Let me give you an example.  I'm friends with a former Mr. Olympia competitor who is 5'8 and was over 200 lbs when he stepped on stage.  He can still 1 rep max 405 bench, 495 squat and 495 dead lift at 52 years old. He can get 250 max on a good drive.  He has all the strength and muscle mass in the world but lacks the mobility and flexibility needed to take advantage of all that power. 

Edited June 22, 2023 by phizzy30

[betarhoalphadelta]

11 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

I agree that by improving your swing technique and making it more efficient, you should see an increase in distance.  However, Jin Young Ko is young, flexible and works out on a regular basis along with her efficient swing which makes her capable of hitting it as far as she does.  What robs most ams of power besides an inefficient swing is lack of overall mobility but more specifically, the hips.  You may very well be in this group.  Also, the belief that just because you're bigger and stronger than her doesn't mean that you will necessarily out drive her.  It's a common misconception.  Strength does play a role, but it's not as significant as you think.  It's more about flexibility, mobility, and being able able to get into certain positions and how many Type II fibers you have in your muscles IMO.  Let me give you an example.  I'm friends with a former Mr. Olympia competitor who is 5'8 and was over 200 lbs when he stepped on stage.  He can still 1 rep max 405 bench, 495 squat and 495 dead lift at 52 years old. He can get 250 max on a good drive.  He has all the strength and muscle mass in the world but lacks the mobility and flexibility needed to take advantage of all that power. 

 

Agreed with everything you've said. I am actually quite flexible for a man of my age and size, owed to my tween and teen years doing martial arts and now at 44 coming back to a pretty decent mobility regimen along with strength and cardio training.

 

But the question was for @golfarb1 and others who keep suggesting that male ams should "look to the LPGA" as a template. And you succinctly made my point--I shouldn't look at Jin Young Ko as a template. 

 

Even if it's just restricted to distance... What's the purpose of looking at the LPGA for distance? Is the idea that male ams should just throw in the towel because they'll never get more distance? I reject that. I know my body and I see no physical limitation that should restrict me from getting at least to Champions Tour averages (277) rather than say I'm limited to LPGA average (low 250s). 

 

I don't understand what people are trying to get across when they say male ams should "look to the LPGA". That's what I'm looking for clarification on. What does that even mean?

 

[MountainKing]

My regular group consists of 8 people total, depending how it rotates some days I'm the longest guy in the group, other days I'm the shortest, most of the time I'm in the middle.  Either way I rarely pay much attention to what the other guys are doing, all I care about is getting the low number on the card.  When you talk ego and that game, IMO there's way more satisfaction to beating somebody 30 yards longer than you than there is out driving them.

Edited June 22, 2023 by MountainKing

[me05501]

18 hours ago, golfarb1 said:

Let’s put this in prospective .
. Even though their physical capabilities have naturally diminished with age, the average driving distance of players on the Senior PGA Tour is 274 yards . Not only do these players have superior technique honed over decades of playing  ,most if not all senior PGA players have frequent  access to various combinations of club heads and shafts and testing equipment such as Trackman that allows them to optimize their distance . 

Many others and I would kill to average 268 yards off of the tee . Given that  the technique of most amateurs is inferior to that  of senior PGA players and very few of us have  the funds or access to maximize our equipment  choices , such distance off the tee is unrealistic . A better choice for many golfers would be to use the driving distance of LPGA players s a template . 
The average drive for LPGA players is 246yards. And unlike PGA players whose average AOA is (-1.5) , the AOA of LPGA players is >+3.

 

 

Seems like when most handicap players give their "average distance" they're actually providing their "solid drive in the fairway" distance. They're not counting the ones that miss the fairway and come to rest at their carry distance, which are certainly part of their overall average. 

 

I use Garmin club sensors so I end up with reliable data. The app tells me my average drive is 243 but I'd much rather talk about the ones that land in the middle of the fairway and roll out to 255. 🙂 

[SNIPERBBB]

Just need to play your own game. Getting caught up with where your fellow competitors,partners , or opponents isn't generally helpful.  You can adjust strategy based on where they hit the ball but trying to match or better what they do is rarely conducive to good swings. 

[hackeraz]

On 5/24/2023 at 1:23 PM, Pepperturbo said:

I am 70+ and all about the score walking off 18.  Playing to a 4, low of 2, still carrying it 240-245+yds, and can out play most younger guys that are fascinated with hitting driver. 

 

Overcoming golf intimidation is all about pitting yourself against foes that hit it longer and maybe better than you.  Look at Michael Block in the PGA, he was a short hitter, playing with Rory, yet, at the end, look how many pros he bettered.  Why, he stepped up and played HIS game.  Hell, one Par 5 he used driver off the deck to reach the green in two.  In my world, I've always wanted to compete or play against superior opponents.  Easy wins don't have the same impact as beating or even almost beating a better opponent because to do that they force me to find it within myself to step up and overcome. 

 

Always exhibit self-control while playing your own game, and remember, most big hitters are overconfident, will grab for their driver and go looking for their ball in the junk, most don't have a recovery shot, and don't have a saving short game.  To beat them all you have to bring is a never give-up warrior's heart. 

 

PS, the reason I don't play any type of games for money with family or close friends, I don't like who I become in competition; I want to stomp my opponent's throat till the end, even in games.  Play well.

This was really good stuff, thank you for posting those vids. Took some of those practices to the range yesterday and bloody hell! 

[golfarb1]

20 hours ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

Forgive me, but I've seen many people here suggest that ams should take something away from the game of the LPGA players. But I don't know what that even means?

 

Jin Young Ko is currently #1 in points on the LPGA tour. She's 5'7", weight unknown (and I'm not rude enough to ask), and 27 years old. She drives it 263. 

 

I'm 6'5", 260#, and 44 years old. Despite my trash golf skills, I can poke it out there 260 on a good strike. 

 

But I'd argue that in no world should I be looking at Jin Young Ko as a template. 

 

If I'm not hitting it well past her, it's because my technique sucks, and I should fix that. Because my potential distance ceiling is markedly higher than hers given my size and strength. 

 

 

A significant difference between PGA and LPGA pros is their AOA  with a driver 
I am suggesting that most average golfers emulate the LPGA positive AOA ~+3 to +3.5 . Much above that number is doable but can create problems which require compensations  and make the swing more complicated. 

. 
 

Edited June 22, 2023 by golfarb1