You hit the ball where you look. Eyeline

[Nickb333]

21 hours ago, JayMas said:

Still curious as to whether those that implemented changes here are literally changing where they are looking or just the tilt of their eye line?

For me it was just getting my eye line to match my target line. I believe my shoulders and hips are fairly square, but found my eye line pointing right of the target. 
 

Still sure I’m doing it correctly, but what I’m doing sure feels better. 

[Long_Left]

On 1/12/2024 at 5:22 AM, iceman1118 said:

Curious if this is an eye dominance thing? The OP did mention he is left eye dominant who plays righty.

 

I happen to be a right hand, right eye dominant golfer. I feel like this is something that isn’t talked about enough. For me, I need an intermediate point for every shot I hit from driver to putter. And it feels like I am aimed way left, but I’m not. If I use my eyes to step into the shot and look at the target, I end up aiming 40 yards right of the target. 
 

And if I sway my head off the ball at all, my nose gets in the way and I lose sight of the ball.
 

If I am way off, please ignore  

Bumping this, righty playing lefty and left eye dominant here... I feel like I'm so far left of target if I don't lock in to an intermediate. I also have a big nose 🙂

[MonteScheinblum]

Here’s one of your brethren 

[Rbsiedsc]

7 minutes ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Here’s one of your brethren 

just want some clarification. left image looks like he is looking behind the ball and eyeline is to the right? then you adjust so his head is more above the ball and eyeline is more left? thanks.

[MonteScheinblum]

Yes

[bortass]

And it looks like it helped fix his shift if I am interpreting the vertical line correctly.

[Pepperturbo]

On 1/11/2024 at 4:04 PM, betarhoalphadelta said:

I think I've got a dozen different pairs

Fine for OSO, otherwise, not so. 🙂

 

[bladehunter]

Left hand dominant righty player who’s left eye dominant. How on earth have I never heard of this before???    Haven’t read past the 1st page. But am eager to. 

[betarhoalphadelta]

12 minutes ago, Pepperturbo said:

Fine for OSO, otherwise, not so. 🙂

 

 

Hell, they used to let my homebrewing buddy (who since moved to Vegas) onto Oso in a Raiders t-shirt. I don't know how they managed to raise their prices after people saw him out there...

 

But no, I don't consider cargo shorts fine for Oso Creek... Now for a quick 9 at Lake Forest, that's a different story 😉

 

[MonteScheinblum]

1 hour ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

Hell, they used to let my homebrewing buddy (who since moved to Vegas) onto Oso in a Raiders t-shirt. I don't know how they managed to raise their prices after people saw him out there...

 

But no, I don't consider cargo shorts fine for Oso Creek... Now for a quick 9 at Lake Forest, that's a different story 😉

 

Too many people talking about how to get Sergio’s Lag, DJ’s Wrist, Hideki’s Pause, Freddie’s slow Smooth Tempo, Rory’s double hip decel, Wolfe’s backswing, Nieman’s side bend and getting wide open to worry about something that is easy to fix and actually helpful. 😜

[bladehunter]

7 minutes ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Too many people talking about how to get Sergio’s Lag, DJ’s Wrist, Hideki’s Pause, Freddie’s slow Smooth Tempo, Rory’s double hip decel, Wolfe’s backswing, Nieman’s side bend and getting wide open to worry about something that is easy to fix and actually helpful. 😜

Thank you for posting this. I’ve always been a guy who hit wedges dead straight and only worried about distance control.  For a month I’ve had a pull/push situation  that I couldn’t figure out.  Was a pull that I could only correct to  a push.  When I read your post A light bulb went off. I recall where the bad habit started. Head following the club back to “ see backswing “   I didn’t realize I was doing it still.   I just came off  the wedge range where I stood and hit targets till I couldn’t see anymore. ( because  it was fun again )  Dead straight. Didn’t change a thing except my view on the backswing.

 

   Thanks again.  I’m a grouch at times but I believe in praising folks loudly who do good.  You’re one of the best !  Evidence to that is that I  have absolutely never seen this addressed on any golf instruction before.  And I’m a curious guy who reads and watches allot.  

[Nickb333]

So, as I continue to make eye line a priority, I’m finding much more success during practice than on the course. Why? 

[MonteScheinblum]

21 minutes ago, Nickb333 said:

So, as I continue to make eye line a priority, I’m finding much more success during practice than on the course. Why? 

https://www.instagram.com/p/CwGN_Swv8Kk/?igsh=NzBmMjdhZWRiYQ==

[Nickb333]

1 hour ago, MonteScheinblum said:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CwGN_Swv8Kk/?igsh=NzBmMjdhZWRiYQ==

Thanks Monte,

 

I don’t have insta or fb. 🫣

[MonteScheinblum]

3 minutes ago, Nickb333 said:

Thanks Monte,

 

I don’t have insta or fb. 🫣

 

[Nickb333]

16 minutes ago, MonteScheinblum said:

 

Thank you sir! 
 

perhaps I should have added…

 

When practicing I can see my eye line easily. On the course, so far it’s next to impossible. Trusting Tiger above, I’m hoping it gets better. 

Edited February 23 by Nickb333

[MonteScheinblum]

1 minute ago, Nickb333 said:

Thank you sir! 

This is such a huge concept from arguably the most skilled and one of the hardest workers of all time.  It is such an important concept to buy into if you want to improve.

 

There is dissension across golf and on this forum that changes that don’t show immediate improvement are snake oil.

 

Yes, a good lesson will definitely improve what the swing looks like (step 2), there will be improvement on random shots and there will be improvements with the LM and 3D numbers, but it takes time for these steps to play out.

 

Many people are shocked that steps 3 and 4 exist.  I hear, “This feels weird,” all day every day.  Golfers that were hitting it fat will hit a thin shot after 3 great strikes and be appalled with themselves.  
 

I spend all day talking people off the ledge that they aren’t robots….lol

 

Worse is the small, but ignorant section of the golf community that scoffs at the idea that a swing change should feel weird and not perform at an elite level immediately.  Can’t help those.  I assume they think a diet and exercise program should shed 20 pounds in one day.😜  

[rooski]

Related to @Obee's post and in the same vein as the thread in general..

 

I've always noticed that for many good golfers as well as myself, if one is aiming safely away from a tucked pin towards the center or opposite side of the green, for example a tucked right pin aiming at the left side of the green, it is at least for me nearly an undeniable truth that I will end up pushing it towards the pin a little bit. Sometimes it can feel like magic and sometimes it really f's you over.

 

I wonder how much of that is because you're subconsciously looking/adjusting your eyeline towards the pin rather than truly and honestly aiming where you have "decided" you were going to aim. Something to ponder at least

Edited February 23 by rooski

[Nickb333]

13 minutes ago, rooski said:

Related to @Obee's post and in the same vein as the thread in general..

 

I've always noticed that for many good golfers as well as myself, if one is aiming safely away from a tucked pin towards the center or opposite side of the green, for example a tucked right pin aiming at the left side of the green, it is at least for me nearly an undeniable truth that I will end up pushing it towards the pin a little bit. Sometimes it can feel like magic and sometimes it really f's you over.

 

I wonder how much of that is because you're subconsciously looking/adjusting your eyeline towards the pin rather than truly and honestly aiming where you have "decided" you were going to aim. Something to ponder at least

No doubt in my mind. The first thing I learned racing mountain bikes was “don’t look at the rock, don’t look at the rock”! 

[iNeedMoreGolf]

So i feel... shoulders at adress.. feet line.. shaft position and grip all go hand and hand to your strike you end up making which determins the end up of your ball flight and ball to target. If my eyes are square to target thinkin in like train tracks terms... it probably means my shoulders are square.. i find when my shoulders are to square i come more over the top.. so i like my shoulders a bit to the right or closed and i guess that also correspondes to eye position as well. If the face doesnt sqaure up though it can get pushy leaky fadey though But my strike is more flush.

[mmbaines1982]

This is an issue that I often struggle with and it's validating and enlightening to see it addressed. Monte, do you find that working on keeping the eyeline parallel to target line also promotes a steeper (better) shoulder turn on the backswing? One of my faults is a too-flat backswing and it seems like the "feel" of eyes square to the target line promotes a better shoulder turn. Is that something you've found in your students?

[SNIPERBBB]

12 hours ago, rooski said:

Related to @Obee's post and in the same vein as the thread in general..

 

I've always noticed that for many good golfers as well as myself, if one is aiming safely away from a tucked pin towards the center or opposite side of the green, for example a tucked right pin aiming at the left side of the green, it is at least for me nearly an undeniable truth that I will end up pushing it towards the pin a little bit. Sometimes it can feel like magic and sometimes it really f's you over.

 

I wonder how much of that is because you're subconsciously looking/adjusting your eyeline towards the pin rather than truly and honestly aiming where you have "decided" you were going to aim. Something to ponder at least

You almost have to close your eyes when you're getting ready to hit towards a green when that sucker right pin, left for lefties, pops up.  Ditto for left to right breaking putts  . You want subconsciously are trying to guide the ball to the hole. Gotta find the trick that keeps you from doing it. Simply aiming more left rarely works. 

[Pepperturbo]

15 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CwGN_Swv8Kk/?igsh=NzBmMjdhZWRiYQ==

I agree with those six steps.  👍

 

You are one of the few that brings actual value to this DB.  Thank you.

[MonteScheinblum]

32 minutes ago, mmbaines1982 said:

This is an issue that I often struggle with and it's validating and enlightening to see it addressed. Monte, do you find that working on keeping the eyeline parallel to target line also promotes a steeper (better) shoulder turn on the backswing? One of my faults is a too-flat backswing and it seems like the "feel" of eyes square to the target line promotes a better shoulder turn. Is that something you've found in your students?

It certainly doesn’t hurt.

[Pepperturbo]

On 2/18/2024 at 10:03 AM, Obee said:

A better though process is:

• I want this ball to finish even with or under the hole, so...
  • "I'm going to take one full less club (PW instead of 9i) because the R to L wind is going to help my draw a bit and the greens are firm, and balls are taking a significant hop first before checking. Might even be a GW today."
• "I'm going to aim 10 to 12 yards right. That's right on the right edge of the green or just outside.

You articulated that well, Obee.  I am such an instinctual feel player, it's difficult for me to express such details. 

 

What you did is factor in all influential conditions, then selected the club, as it should be; while most people focus on the shot, alone.  

 

This eye line discussion reminds me of tracking my car or motorcycle at speed, and combat shooting scenarios.  Where we look is where the car and motorcycle goes, and barrel aims.

Edited February 23 by Pepperturbo

[MK7Golf21]

13 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

This is such a huge concept from arguably the most skilled and one of the hardest workers of all time.  It is such an important concept to buy into if you want to improve.

 

There is dissension across golf and on this forum that changes that don’t show immediate improvement are snake oil.

 

Yes, a good lesson will definitely improve what the swing looks like (step 2), there will be improvement on random shots and there will be improvements with the LM and 3D numbers, but it takes time for these steps to play out.

 

Many people are shocked that steps 3 and 4 exist.  I hear, “This feels weird,” all day every day.  Golfers that were hitting it fat will hit a thin shot after 3 great strikes and be appalled with themselves.  
 

I spend all day talking people off the ledge that they aren’t robots….lol

 

Worse is the small, but ignorant section of the golf community that scoffs at the idea that a swing change should feel weird and not perform at an elite level immediately.  Can’t help those.  I assume they think a diet and exercise program should shed 20 pounds in one day.😜  

 

Swinging with the change at a very slow speed over and over I would imagine is one of the most difficult concepts for golfers to grasp, they jump right to nearly full speed. I think if you actually want to get the change down, most of your practice has to be extremely slow swings. 

[MonteScheinblum]

1 minute ago, MK7Golf21 said:

 

Swinging with the change at a very slow speed over and over I would imagine is one of the most difficult concepts for golfers to grasp, they jump right to nearly full speed. I think if you actually want to get the change down, most of your practice has to be extremely slow swings. 

If golfers would adapt how change and improvement is done in every other sport………but sadly they don’t.

[SNIPERBBB]

25 minutes ago, MonteScheinblum said:

If golfers would adapt how change and improvement is done in every other sport………but sadly they don’t.

One problem with golf compared to other sports is there's no way to get washed out of it. At least if you enter it as an adult. If you play scholastically and hope to get on tours you can washout 

[Acooke2434]

@MonteScheinblum so even with a lot of us golfers who close the feet/stance and shoulders slightly at setup, you don't want the eyeline aligned with that. You prefer it square? Very interesting topic!

[MonteScheinblum]

41 minutes ago, Acooke2434 said:

@MonteScheinblum so even with a lot of us golfers who close the feet/stance and shoulders slightly at setup, you don't want the eyeline aligned with that. You prefer it square? Very interesting topic!

That’s a different question.  Why do you do that?