Can a 4-handicap man beat an LPGA pro?

[EntourageLife]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

There is no math needed. A scratch golfer wouldn't make the cut. A 4 handicap wouldn't break 80.

 

-Now we've moved on to debating how well they'd score in a tournament. Haha

 

-People have no clue how great PGA/LPGA Tour players are. Also, people have no clue how difficult actual tournament golf can be.

 

Generalize much?

 

Plenty of people on this site know exactly how good they are. Plenty of people on this site have played with them.

 

and yet there are still buffoons who think they can compete...

[Obee]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

There is no math needed. A scratch golfer wouldn't make the cut. A 4 handicap wouldn't break 80.

 

-Now we've moved on to debating how well they'd score in a tournament. Haha

 

-People have no clue how great PGA/LPGA Tour players are. Also, people have no clue how difficult actual tournament golf can be.

 

Generalize much?

 

Plenty of people on this site know exactly how good they are. Plenty of people on this site have played with them.

 

and yet there are still buffoons who think they can compete...

 

Depends what you mean by compete. And greatly depends on whether you mean the women or the men. Read through the thread and look for Isaac's posts. They will help to enlighten you.

[jt2gt]

Hmmm...check out some of the scores from the Diamond Resorts this past weekend. The top celebrities (scratch or close) were pretty close to some of the top ladies that played over the 3 day tournament and these weren't random ladies either -- lexi,Lincicome, Henderson, lang.

[isaacbm]

Does anyone know how I can make it so a thread doesn't come up for me anymore ?

 

This thread has given me head aches!!

[Obee]

Does anyone know how I can make it so a thread doesn't come up for me anymore ?

 

This thread has given me head aches!!

 

Prolly time to finally close this one.

[EntourageLife]

Hmmm...check out some of the scores from the Diamond Resorts this past weekend. The top celebrities (scratch or close) were pretty close to some of the top ladies that played over the 3 day tournament and these weren't random ladies either -- lexi,Lincicome, Henderson, lang.

 

Shocking you'd even use a "loose" event like that to try and compare. Very very easy golf course. Also, once you reach a double-bogey score you just pick up. Come on?

 

You're severely insulting Lexi, Lang, Lincicome, etc...

[EntourageLife]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

There is no math needed. A scratch golfer wouldn't make the cut. A 4 handicap wouldn't break 80.

 

-Now we've moved on to debating how well they'd score in a tournament. Haha

 

-People have no clue how great PGA/LPGA Tour players are. Also, people have no clue how difficult actual tournament golf can be.

 

Generalize much?

 

Plenty of people on this site know exactly how good they are. Plenty of people on this site have played with them.

 

and yet there are still buffoons who think they can compete...

 

Depends what you mean by compete. And greatly depends on whether you mean the women or the men. Read through the thread and look for Isaac's posts. They will help to enlighten you.

 

This is crazy. Enlighten me? Just rename this thread: "Should you argue with a fool?..."

[BrianB]

Hmmm...check out some of the scores from the Diamond Resorts this past weekend. The top celebrities (scratch or close) were pretty close to some of the top ladies that played over the 3 day tournament and these weren't random ladies either -- lexi,Lincicome, Henderson, lang.

 

Yeah, but the top celebrities are really good, too.

 

The lowest scoring Pro there, John Cook, with 62 points, was only beaten by four of the celebrities (Mark Mulder 77, Mardy Fish 67, Ryan Longwell 67, and Ray Allen 66). And none of the 10 amateurs to earn spots (the best 10 from the Brian Gay Invitational) scored better than 62 points, either. Lexi Thompson (83) was 11th overall, ahead of players like Billy Mayfair (82), Colin Montgomery (78), John Daly (77), and Grant Waite (76). Brittany Lincicome (74) and Brooke Henderson (73) easily outscored any celebrity not named Mark Mulder. Brittany Lang (66), the worst performer of the LPGA ladies, was still only beaten by the top three celebrities, and tied with Ray Allen.

 

And Ray Allen is a +0.8, who retired from basketball in November in order to focus on golf.

 

So this just reinforces most of what has already been said, a true scratch male tournament golfer can maybe hang with these ladies, but the 4 handicapper can probably forget it.

[Obee]

 

This is crazy. Enlighten me? Just rename this thread: "Should you argue with a fool?..."

 

I may be a fool in many ways, but mot so much when it comes to golf. Pretty grounded there.

 

Sorry we got off on the wrong foot. I'll leave it at that in this thread.

 

Happy to take this to PM.

[nsxguy]

I'm all for having a great topic or debate.

 

But understand...it's an insult to even compare a 4 handicap man to an LPGA player.

 

Well, you could exercise some self control and not click on the thread,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

But anywho, the question is CAN a 4 beat an LPGA Pro. The pro doesn't have to be Ko, Park, or Thompson. There are plenty of middle-of-the-roaders.

 

It doesn't have to be 2 rounds to make a cut, nor over a 3 or 4 round tournament.

 

18 holes. On "any given day".

 

Below you have a firsthand account by 3.3 who lost by 3 and the lady's short game was "amazing".

 

You don't think on another day HE might make a few of those putts instead of 2 putting and she mightn't be quite so "amazing" ? :wave:

 

 

I've been fortunate to play a few rounds with both PGA and LPGA Pros, to be honest the LPGA Pros are amazing golfers, we played from blue tees at Ko'Olina (not tips) and Kim Kaufman played -4 and I played -1...she hit every fairway and averaged 260 off the tee, I was outdriving her by 20-30 yards, the difference between us was her short game and putting was amazing, I would 2 putt par and she would birdie, very consistent and accurate...I also played with James Hahn (close friend) in Hawaii and we played Turtle Bay from tips, he played to -5 and I ended +1, here the difference was distance off the tee, he outdrove me easily by 20-25 yards only missed a few fairways, short game and putting amazing as well...

[CallawayLefty]

I'm all for having a great topic or debate.

 

But understand...it's an insult to even compare a 4 handicap man to an LPGA player.

 

Well, you could exercise some self control and not click on the thread,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

But anywho, the question is CAN a 4 beat an LPGA Pro. The pro doesn't have to be Ko, Park, or Thompson. There are plenty of middle-of-the-roaders.

 

It doesn't have to be 2 rounds to make a cut, nor over a 3 or 4 round tournament.

 

18 holes. On "any given day".

 

Below you have a firsthand account by 3.3 who lost by 3 and the lady's short game was "amazing".

 

You don't think on another day HE might make a few of those putts instead of 2 putting and she mightn't be quite so "amazing" ? :wave:

 

 

I've been fortunate to play a few rounds with both PGA and LPGA Pros, to be honest the LPGA Pros are amazing golfers, we played from blue tees at Ko'Olina (not tips) and Kim Kaufman played -4 and I played -1...she hit every fairway and averaged 260 off the tee, I was outdriving her by 20-30 yards, the difference between us was her short game and putting was amazing, I would 2 putt par and she would birdie, very consistent and accurate...I also played with James Hahn (close friend) in Hawaii and we played Turtle Bay from tips, he played to -5 and I ended +1, here the difference was distance off the tee, he outdrove me easily by 20-25 yards only missed a few fairways, short game and putting amazing as well...

 

Glad to see we've come full circle back to what the definition of "can" is. I don't recall seeing you earlier in this thread, so you might check out the nice discourse of the first 33 pages or so, which covers this and other classic topics. Did you know, by the way, that Lydia Ko CAN get mauled by a grizzly bear mid-round, thereby rendering her unable to finish? Followed to its logical end, that means even like a 50 handicap can beat her. Even a 50 handicap. Just let that one percolate for a minute!

[PowderedToastMan]

I'm all for having a great topic or debate.

 

But understand...it's an insult to even compare a 4 handicap man to an LPGA player.

 

Well, you could exercise some self control and not click on the thread,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

But anywho, the question is CAN a 4 beat an LPGA Pro. The pro doesn't have to be Ko, Park, or Thompson. There are plenty of middle-of-the-roaders.

 

It doesn't have to be 2 rounds to make a cut, nor over a 3 or 4 round tournament.

 

18 holes. On "any given day".

 

Below you have a firsthand account by 3.3 who lost by 3 and the lady's short game was "amazing".

 

You don't think on another day HE might make a few of those putts instead of 2 putting and she mightn't be quite so "amazing" ? :wave:

 

 

I've been fortunate to play a few rounds with both PGA and LPGA Pros, to be honest the LPGA Pros are amazing golfers, we played from blue tees at Ko'Olina (not tips) and Kim Kaufman played -4 and I played -1...she hit every fairway and averaged 260 off the tee, I was outdriving her by 20-30 yards, the difference between us was her short game and putting was amazing, I would 2 putt par and she would birdie, very consistent and accurate...I also played with James Hahn (close friend) in Hawaii and we played Turtle Bay from tips, he played to -5 and I ended +1, here the difference was distance off the tee, he outdrove me easily by 20-25 yards only missed a few fairways, short game and putting amazing as well...

 

Glad to see we've come full circle back to what the definition of "can" is. I don't recall seeing you earlier in this thread, so you might check out the nice discourse of the first 33 pages or so, which covers this and other classic topics. Did you know, by the way, that Lydia Ko CAN get mauled by a grizzly bear mid-round, thereby rendering her unable to finish? Followed to its logical end, that means even like a 50 handicap can beat her. Even a 50 handicap. Just let that one percolate for a minute!

I also love how deceptive the "only lost by 3 strokes is" considering she shot -4 and the 3.3 WAY outperformed his handicap.

[jt2gt]

Hmmm...check out some of the scores from the Diamond Resorts this past weekend. The top celebrities (scratch or close) were pretty close to some of the top ladies that played over the 3 day tournament and these weren't random ladies either -- lexi,Lincicome, Henderson, lang.

 

Shocking you'd even use a "loose" event like that to try and compare. Very very easy golf course. Also, once you reach a double-bogey score you just pick up. Come on?

 

You're severely insulting Lexi, Lang, Lincicome, etc...

 

Uhhh...not an insult at all. I'm just bringing up an actual real world playing situation. There aren't that many out there. The Diamonds had LPGA stars and Blair O'neal playing alongside low handicap men. Same tees, same course. Three Days. Money on the line. Gallery. Pressure. Not at a club for one day and no one watching. Tell me what else you would want, if you were to really set up a playing scenario. The LPGAers beat some seniors, but some scratchers finished pretty close to the LPGAers. Seems to be a pretty good source of actual playing.

 

And don't tell me everyone in the money wasn't competing. Its about as close as you will get to an actual tourney situation with all parties involved. Pretty sure not as "loose" as you would like to think it was out there.

[EntourageLife]

Hmmm...check out some of the scores from the Diamond Resorts this past weekend. The top celebrities (scratch or close) were pretty close to some of the top ladies that played over the 3 day tournament and these weren't random ladies either -- lexi,Lincicome, Henderson, lang.

 

Shocking you'd even use a "loose" event like that to try and compare. Very very easy golf course. Also, once you reach a double-bogey score you just pick up. Come on?

 

You're severely insulting Lexi, Lang, Lincicome, etc...

 

Uhhh...not an insult at all. I'm just bringing up an actual real world playing situation. There aren't that many out there. The Diamonds had LPGA stars and Blair O'neal playing alongside low handicap men. Same tees, same course. Three Days. Money on the line. Gallery. Pressure. Not at a club for one day and no one watching. Tell me what else you would want, if you were to really set up a playing scenario. The LPGAers beat some seniors, but some scratchers finished pretty close to the LPGAers. Seems to be a pretty good source of actual playing.

 

And don't tell me everyone in the money wasn't competing. Its about as close as you will get to an actual tourney situation with all parties involved. Pretty sure no as "loose" as you would like to think it was out there.

 

Someone please end this thread. Crazy

[EntourageLife]

 

This is crazy. Enlighten me? Just rename this thread: "Should you argue with a fool?..."

 

I may be a fool in many ways, but mot so much when it comes to golf. Pretty grounded there.

 

Sorry we got off on the wrong foot. I'll leave it at that in this thread.

 

Happy to take this to PM.

 

No worries bro. It all makes for great discussion. Hit me up anytime.

[nsxguy]

I'm all for having a great topic or debate.

 

But understand...it's an insult to even compare a 4 handicap man to an LPGA player.

 

Well, you could exercise some self control and not click on the thread,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

But anywho, the question is CAN a 4 beat an LPGA Pro. The pro doesn't have to be Ko, Park, or Thompson. There are plenty of middle-of-the-roaders.

 

It doesn't have to be 2 rounds to make a cut, nor over a 3 or 4 round tournament.

 

18 holes. On "any given day".

 

Below you have a firsthand account by 3.3 who lost by 3 and the lady's short game was "amazing".

 

You don't think on another day HE might make a few of those putts instead of 2 putting and she mightn't be quite so "amazing" ? :wave:

 

 

I've been fortunate to play a few rounds with both PGA and LPGA Pros, to be honest the LPGA Pros are amazing golfers, we played from blue tees at Ko'Olina (not tips) and Kim Kaufman played -4 and I played -1...she hit every fairway and averaged 260 off the tee, I was outdriving her by 20-30 yards, the difference between us was her short game and putting was amazing, I would 2 putt par and she would birdie, very consistent and accurate...I also played with James Hahn (close friend) in Hawaii and we played Turtle Bay from tips, he played to -5 and I ended +1, here the difference was distance off the tee, he outdrove me easily by 20-25 yards only missed a few fairways, short game and putting amazing as well...

 

Glad to see we've come full circle back to what the definition of "can" is. I don't recall seeing you earlier in this thread, so you might check out the nice discourse of the first 33 pages or so, which covers this and other classic topics. Did you know, by the way, that Lydia Ko CAN get mauled by a grizzly bear mid-round, thereby rendering her unable to finish? Followed to its logical end, that means even like a 50 handicap can beat her. Even a 50 handicap. Just let that one percolate for a minute!

 

Taking a silly example to ridiculous extremes hardly proves your point - but then you already know that.

 

You have a firsthand account and yes, just 3 strokes. But no, couldn't possibly have a few putts go the other way, right ?

[nsxguy]

I'm all for having a great topic or debate.

 

But understand...it's an insult to even compare a 4 handicap man to an LPGA player.

 

Well, you could exercise some self control and not click on the thread,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

But anywho, the question is CAN a 4 beat an LPGA Pro. The pro doesn't have to be Ko, Park, or Thompson. There are plenty of middle-of-the-roaders.

 

It doesn't have to be 2 rounds to make a cut, nor over a 3 or 4 round tournament.

 

18 holes. On "any given day".

 

Below you have a firsthand account by 3.3 who lost by 3 and the lady's short game was "amazing".

 

You don't think on another day HE might make a few of those putts instead of 2 putting and she mightn't be quite so "amazing" ? :wave:

 

 

I've been fortunate to play a few rounds with both PGA and LPGA Pros, to be honest the LPGA Pros are amazing golfers, we played from blue tees at Ko'Olina (not tips) and Kim Kaufman played -4 and I played -1...she hit every fairway and averaged 260 off the tee, I was outdriving her by 20-30 yards, the difference between us was her short game and putting was amazing, I would 2 putt par and she would birdie, very consistent and accurate...I also played with James Hahn (close friend) in Hawaii and we played Turtle Bay from tips, he played to -5 and I ended +1, here the difference was distance off the tee, he outdrove me easily by 20-25 yards only missed a few fairways, short game and putting amazing as well...

 

Glad to see we've come full circle back to what the definition of "can" is. I don't recall seeing you earlier in this thread, so you might check out the nice discourse of the first 33 pages or so, which covers this and other classic topics. Did you know, by the way, that Lydia Ko CAN get mauled by a grizzly bear mid-round, thereby rendering her unable to finish? Followed to its logical end, that means even like a 50 handicap can beat her. Even a 50 handicap. Just let that one percolate for a minute!

I also love how deceptive the "only lost by 3 strokes is" considering she shot -4 and the 3.3 WAY outperformed his handicap.

 

How many shots in a "WAY" ? (Roughly) 4 shots better ? A bit unusual but hardly "WAY" IMO

 

"Short game and putting was amazing".

 

Perhaps it's not so amazing every day ?

[CallawayLefty]

I'm all for having a great topic or debate.

 

But understand...it's an insult to even compare a 4 handicap man to an LPGA player.

 

Well, you could exercise some self control and not click on the thread,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

But anywho, the question is CAN a 4 beat an LPGA Pro. The pro doesn't have to be Ko, Park, or Thompson. There are plenty of middle-of-the-roaders.

 

It doesn't have to be 2 rounds to make a cut, nor over a 3 or 4 round tournament.

 

18 holes. On "any given day".

 

Below you have a firsthand account by 3.3 who lost by 3 and the lady's short game was "amazing".

 

You don't think on another day HE might make a few of those putts instead of 2 putting and she mightn't be quite so "amazing" ? :wave:

 

 

I've been fortunate to play a few rounds with both PGA and LPGA Pros, to be honest the LPGA Pros are amazing golfers, we played from blue tees at Ko'Olina (not tips) and Kim Kaufman played -4 and I played -1...she hit every fairway and averaged 260 off the tee, I was outdriving her by 20-30 yards, the difference between us was her short game and putting was amazing, I would 2 putt par and she would birdie, very consistent and accurate...I also played with James Hahn (close friend) in Hawaii and we played Turtle Bay from tips, he played to -5 and I ended +1, here the difference was distance off the tee, he outdrove me easily by 20-25 yards only missed a few fairways, short game and putting amazing as well...

 

Glad to see we've come full circle back to what the definition of "can" is. I don't recall seeing you earlier in this thread, so you might check out the nice discourse of the first 33 pages or so, which covers this and other classic topics. Did you know, by the way, that Lydia Ko CAN get mauled by a grizzly bear mid-round, thereby rendering her unable to finish? Followed to its logical end, that means even like a 50 handicap can beat her. Even a 50 handicap. Just let that one percolate for a minute!

 

Taking a silly example to ridiculous extremes hardly proves your point - but then you already know that.

 

You have a firsthand account and yes, just 3 strokes. But no, couldn't possibly have a few putts go the other way, right ?

 

So now you're calling an on-course grizzly bear mauling a ridiculous extreme? What is this thread coming to????

 

 

Mods, please lock this thread so we can all just move forward with our lives.

[moegolfer11]

This is ridiculous...no no no absolutely not...

[jsixman]

I went to an LPGA event a couple years ago. They were the 3rd best players I've ever seen behind (1) PGA players and (2) web.com players. Maybe elite level amateurs and mini tours would have some chance to contend with them. But scratch players, your average +1 or +2, and most certainly a 4 handicap, have absolutely no chance whatsoever. Your average +1 or +2 would make an occasional cut on the LPGA. Nobody worse than that would even be close. It's hilarious that some people would even think that a 4 handicap could do anything close to what LPGA tour players do. How in the hell is a guy who probably averages 82 going to go shoot 71 from a tournament prepared 6,600 yard course. No chance.

 

You have no idea how good pro golfers are. Male or female - doesn't matter. They're really, really good. And if you don't understand how good they are, it probably means that you yourself just aren't good enough at golf to get it.

100% agree

[CallawayLefty]

It depends on what your definition of the word "is" is.

[dhc1]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

I'm highly doubtful that the LPGA plays from 6500 yards actual during their tournament. I think that they set up the course significantly shorter to add some risk/reward short holes. My guess is that they'll play the Volvik from somewhere close to 6200 yards average over the four days. That changes the rating significantly (6150 yards is rated 69.9).

 

I do agree that somewhere around scratch to +1 is the comparable for a male. Would love to see a Bobby Riggs/King event with lots of money on the line.....

[farmer]

One more try. A 4 hdcp probably shoots right around 80 on a reasonable day. The 75th LPGA scoring avg is a smidge above 72. Tournament rounds, all rounds accounted for, every tiny rule followed. Ms. Leblanc takes Joe Four to the cleaners.

[PowderedToastMan]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

I'm highly doubtful that the LPGA plays from 6500 yards actual during their tournament. I think that they set up the course significantly shorter to add some risk/reward short holes. My guess is that they'll play the Volvik from somewhere close to 6200 yards average over the four days. That changes the rating significantly.

 

I do agree that somewhere around scratch to +1 is the comparable for a male. Would love to see a Bobby Riggs/King event with lots of money on the line.....

Why in the world do you think a scratch or +1 is comparable for a male? This logic makes zero sense. What scratch or plus 1 in existence has the ability to go double digits under par in a four round tourney. Better yet, why is a scratch or +1 male equivalent to a +5 or better female? Do you understand how the handicap system works? It's just complete nonsense.

[CallawayLefty]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

I'm highly doubtful that the LPGA plays from 6500 yards actual during their tournament. I think that they set up the course significantly shorter to add some risk/reward short holes. My guess is that they'll play the Volvik from somewhere close to 6200 yards average over the four days. That changes the rating significantly.

 

I do agree that somewhere around scratch to +1 is the comparable for a male. Would love to see a Bobby Riggs/King event with lots of money on the line.....

Why in the world do you think a scratch or +1 is comparable for a male? This logic makes zero sense. What scratch or plus 1 in existence has the ability to go double digits under par in a four round tourney. Better yet, why is a scratch or +1 male equivalent to a +5 or better female? Do you understand how the handicap system works? It's just complete nonsense.

 

I'm sorry that analysis is far too rational to apply here. It's imperative that we run off pure emotions to make this thread work. Are you familiar with the definition of "can?" Also, perhaps you haven't encountered the 4 handicap that routinely breaks par from inside of 6,500 yards, but I'm sure one exists somewhere.

[North Texas]

One more try. A 4 hdcp probably shoots right around 80 on a reasonable day. The 75th LPGA scoring avg is a smidge above 72. Tournament rounds, all rounds accounted for, every tiny rule followed. Ms. Leblanc takes Joe Four to the cleaners.

 

Here's some more perspective.

 

Grace Na finished dead last (158th) in scoring average at 75.421.

Played in 19 tournaments and made only 1 cut with a total of 38 rounds.

Her worst rounds were an 80 and an 82. These were her only rounds in the 80's, btw.

Her best rounds were 2 rounds of 1 under 71 and another round of 72.

She shot 75 or better 21 rounds out of 38.

[dhc1]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

I'm highly doubtful that the LPGA plays from 6500 yards actual during their tournament. I think that they set up the course significantly shorter to add some risk/reward short holes. My guess is that they'll play the Volvik from somewhere close to 6200 yards average over the four days. That changes the rating significantly.

 

I do agree that somewhere around scratch to +1 is the comparable for a male. Would love to see a Bobby Riggs/King event with lots of money on the line.....

Why in the world do you think a scratch or +1 is comparable for a male? This logic makes zero sense. What scratch or plus 1 in existence has the ability to go double digits under par in a four round tourney. Better yet, why is a scratch or +1 male equivalent to a +5 or better female? Do you understand how the handicap system works? It's just complete nonsense.

 

jacksonalex,

 

I'd kindly suggest that you dial it down a couple notches.

 

I am very familiar with the handicap system and my point is that the specific tee boxes the LPGA players play from are shorter distances than what is stated when marketing the event and therefore from a men's perspective, they will be rated below par. For example, let's use Travis Pointe CC as an example. I posited that they'll actually play from 6150-6200 yards (I could be wrong but that's generally how I see it them use forward tee boxes when I watch the LPGA - which is quite frequently btw). The men's rating from the senior tees is 69.9 for 6140 yards so that means that a male scratch player is likely shooting below par on the best 10 of his last twenty average. (Note: the 0.96 differential and 121 slope have limited impact for scratch players). I don't know what the cut will be but I wouldn't be surprised to see several ladies shoot a lot worse than par over two rounds.

 

Here's another way of looking at this. For Pinehurst #2 (I couldn't find Travis Pointe rating for ladies), the men's rating for the White tees is 70.7 while the women's rating (from the exact same set of tees) is 76.6. This means that if a scratch male and female were playing against each other, the man would give up about 6 strokes to the scratch women off of the same set of tees. (http://cdn1.pinehurs...ds2014-9314.pdf). This is exactly why a scratch male player is roughly equal to a +5 woman from the same tees.

 

I'll sheepishly apologize if I'm far off base but understanding what tees the LPGA plays from is essential to understanding what they would compare to (which isn't even close to a 4). I've asked the question several times on the LPGA tour talk forum as it's pretty clear that they're often not using the tee box associated with the stated length of the hole but I've never gotten a response.

[pinhigh27]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

I'm highly doubtful that the LPGA plays from 6500 yards actual during their tournament. I think that they set up the course significantly shorter to add some risk/reward short holes. My guess is that they'll play the Volvik from somewhere close to 6200 yards average over the four days. That changes the rating significantly.

 

I do agree that somewhere around scratch to +1 is the comparable for a male. Would love to see a Bobby Riggs/King event with lots of money on the line.....

Why in the world do you think a scratch or +1 is comparable for a male? This logic makes zero sense. What scratch or plus 1 in existence has the ability to go double digits under par in a four round tourney. Better yet, why is a scratch or +1 male equivalent to a +5 or better female? Do you understand how the handicap system works? It's just complete nonsense.

the bottom end lpga pros do not have the ability to go double digit under par in those tournaments. no way.

 

it's a pretty simple math problem. not sure why so many people have such a hard time understand that there is a difference between a mens handicap and a womens handicap.

[PowderedToastMan]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

I'm highly doubtful that the LPGA plays from 6500 yards actual during their tournament. I think that they set up the course significantly shorter to add some risk/reward short holes. My guess is that they'll play the Volvik from somewhere close to 6200 yards average over the four days. That changes the rating significantly.

 

I do agree that somewhere around scratch to +1 is the comparable for a male. Would love to see a Bobby Riggs/King event with lots of money on the line.....

Why in the world do you think a scratch or +1 is comparable for a male? This logic makes zero sense. What scratch or plus 1 in existence has the ability to go double digits under par in a four round tourney. Better yet, why is a scratch or +1 male equivalent to a +5 or better female? Do you understand how the handicap system works? It's just complete nonsense.

the bottom end lpga pros do not have the ability to go double digit under par in those tournaments. no way.

 

it's a pretty simple math problem. not sure why so many people have such a hard time understand that there is a difference between a mens handicap and a womens handicap.

Do you really think these LPGA'ers are using a women's handicap? How would that make sense when they are essentially playing the tips? Ordinarily, a +4 lady would be a plus +1 or so male, but we are talking about LPGA tour pros.

 

It's not simple math. There's digging and using the right information.

[dhc1]

I've done the math ...

 

Using the location of LPGA Volvik Championship Travis Pointe CC in 2017.

 

FACT: average yardage LPGA plays from 6,500 yards

(source LPGA's own website)

 

FACT: +3 was the cut line in 2016

(source LPGA website)

 

FACT: Travis Pointe's WHITE tees are 6,545 yrds. The course rating from the TIPS is 73.8

 

so..... A scratch male golfer could MAYBE stand a chance to make the cut in the LPGA Volvik championship. By doing that he would've beaten a number of LPGA pros at that tournament on his way up the leaderboard

 

I'm highly doubtful that the LPGA plays from 6500 yards actual during their tournament. I think that they set up the course significantly shorter to add some risk/reward short holes. My guess is that they'll play the Volvik from somewhere close to 6200 yards average over the four days. That changes the rating significantly.

 

I do agree that somewhere around scratch to +1 is the comparable for a male. Would love to see a Bobby Riggs/King event with lots of money on the line.....

Why in the world do you think a scratch or +1 is comparable for a male? This logic makes zero sense. What scratch or plus 1 in existence has the ability to go double digits under par in a four round tourney. Better yet, why is a scratch or +1 male equivalent to a +5 or better female? Do you understand how the handicap system works? It's just complete nonsense.

the bottom end lpga pros do not have the ability to go double digit under par in those tournaments. no way.

 

it's a pretty simple math problem. not sure why so many people have such a hard time understand that there is a difference between a mens handicap and a womens handicap.

Do you really think these LPGA'ers are using a women's handicap? How would that make sense when they are essentially playing the tips? Ordinarily, a +4 lady would be a plus +1 or so male, but we are talking about LPGA tour pros.

 

It's not simple math. There's digging and using the right information.

 

I notice that you haven't addressed my post above but in any case, why do you think that the ladies are essentially playing the tips? Perhaps we are using a different definition of tips

 

Also, where are you getting that there's a 3 stroke swing between men and women (by saying that a +4 is equal to a +1)?