Need advice on getting it up

MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭

Like most people, i've begun to suffer from a pretty common problem. And that is that i am starting to notice negligible carry distances between some of my longer irons. For example on a trackman now i'm not really carrying my 4 iron any further than my 5 iron. Total distance is a good 7-10yds longer but on a course that doesn't really help me. It's not a swing speed thing it's a launch thing which is the problem, i tend to hit low draws. So i just can't hit my 4 iron high enough to maximize carry for my swing speed, i am putting up "driver numbers" with my 4 iron (like 11 degree launch with 3300RPM and stuff like that LOL). So i hit my 4 iron and 5 iron each about 200yds, just the 4 iron rolls a lot more.

I don't really want hybrids because those give me too big a gap. So i'm kicking around the idea of going to SGI irons again (Ping G410 maybe) to help with launch in the longer irons.

But i'm also wondering if shafts would play a larger role. For example if i got the new 2019 Apex pros, except with Nippon Modus 130's which is a higher launch shaft. I'm leaning more towards the SGI option since i hit my 18 degree Steelhead iron high enough

I have a fast swing speed so i can't use high launch/high spin stuff because that kills me in the mid irons. Obviously the best thing to do is test a bunch of stuff.....i'm just curious if anyone has had similar issues and what they did

Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
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Comments

  • gentlesgentles Members Posts: 1,867 ✭✭

    Do you need a matching set? Could you find some Apex non-pro 4 5 and 6 irons? Other option could be to pick up an X Forged driving iron and put your same iron shafts in it...little bit hotter face which will tend to launch a bit easier.

    Have you tried an Apex 23 with an S300 shaft at the same length as your 4i? You might surprised how short it goes compared to a graphite (longer shafted) 20*

    Taylormade 2016 M2 10.5 Aldila Tour Blue 75x
    Taylormade 2016 M2 DF 3hl Aldila Tour Blue 85x
    Callaway Apex 20* Aldila Tour Blue 85x
    Taylormade RSI UDI 4i DG AMT x100
    Taylormade P770 5-P DG AMT x100
    Ping Glide 51,55, 59 DG S400
    Ping Anser Milled 5

    On the bench/testing: G400 LST, Callaway 3deep, Cobra LTD 3-4, Callaway Apex 23*, UDI 2 and 3 irons, Ping Glide 53, PM Grind 64
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,223 ✭✭

    Utility iron.

    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭

    I've considered the non-matching sets for sure. But i'm not really that married to needing "players" clubs in the shorter irons which is why i probably wouldn't get them. Like if i was gonna get G410 long irons i'd just get the whole set. Same with Apex's, i'd just get a full Apex set. I'm not too worried about flighting an SGI 7 iron if i have an S300 in it.

    I could try some hybrids, i'm not completely opposed to it. I just find if i was gonna buy new it's like 300$ here for a Hybrid. I could trade in my Apex Pros and get a Full G410 set for like 600$. Seems like a better deal if it works for me.

    Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
    Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
    SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
  • PetethreeputPetethreeput Members Posts: 1,430 ✭✭

    Shorter than you but also play a low draw.
    I replaced my 4i with a 4h and now have a 20-30 yd gap. I have played like this for more than a year. I am mulling over dropping my 3w or 60 to get a 5h, so I would carry a 5i and a 5h.
    Note “mulling” not doing, but I believe it would fill the top end for those 190-210 par 3s, and my home course has 2 of them.

  • MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭

    @Jagpilotohio said:
    Utility iron.

    Yeah, it's just annoying with the pricing here. Like a G410 crossover is 350$, the Callaway Apex is 379$. A full set of G410 irons with S300's is 1300$ plus i could trade in my Apex Pros. I could pay a few hundred more and get a full new set. And who doesn't like shiny new things!!!!

    First and foremost i want this to fit my game of course. But i'm thinking a SGI set would be a good choice for what i need

    Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
    Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
    SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,223 ✭✭

    Srixon U series or Cally Apex UT off the Bay.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Srixon-Z-U85-3-Iron-X-Flex-/323778063364

    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭
    edited Apr 21, 2019 4:34pm #8

    If i hit it too short now, i definitely will hit it too short right handed!

    LOL

    I will look into the driving iron option though, i appreciate the suggestion. Interested in hearing from guys using Modus 130's if they are out there too. Because i wonder if a Players set with Modus, would launch similar to a SGI set with S300

    Yes, obviously i should get off my *** and go test. But it's easter, stores are closed and not all of them have Modus to test anyway

    Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
    Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
    SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
  • ex0dusex0dus Members Posts: 500 ✭✭
    edited Apr 21, 2019 4:38pm #9

    Best thread title ever lol. I went through the same thing. I like mbs up but i found out years ago that the 5 iron is my cutoff for them. After that the yardage gaps are too narrow. I went to a more forgiving 4 iron that launches higher with less loft and gives me a workable gap..

    I am experimenting with a driving iron at the 3 spot to bridge the gap to my hybrid. Most of the time that gap really doesn't come into play so it isn't a priority.

    Cobra King Ltd Pro
    Nike SQ2 13*
    Mizuno MP630 clk hybrid 20*
    Bstone J40 DPC 4 iron
    Cleveland 588 mb 5-pw
    Ping Gorge wedges 56*, 52*
    Cally Mack Daddy PM grind 60*
    Machine adjuster putter
    Bridgestone 330 ball
  • farmerfarmer Members Posts: 7,853 ✭✭

    The thing with hybrids is that they are typically graphite shafted and longer than their steel shafted counterparts in irons. You might try a shorter 4 hybrid to more closely match your 4 iron.

  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,223 ✭✭

    I have a Titleist hybrid that I shortened an inch by tipping it and hot melted it through the weight port screw. Super controllable and not overly long now.

    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,223 ✭✭
    edited Apr 21, 2019 4:57pm #12

    You can’t write Skrew the proper way anymore? Come on cursing filter. That’s a bit much.

    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • starrman77starrman77 Starrman Members Posts: 410 ✭✭

    "Need advice on getting it up".........Viagra

    Ping G SFT 10* 44.5"
    Ping i3OS Irons 3 thru UW
    Cobra Speed LD 15* 3 Wood
    Ping G #4 crossover
    Titleist Vokey 56* SW
    Ping Cadence Tomcat C putter 34-3/4"
    B330RX Ball
  • LaymanMLaymanM Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 2,123 ✭✭

    I would simply reshaft your 4 iron 1st to higher launching light weight steel. Believe it or not there are a few pros that play KBS Tour 90 in a long iron just for this reason.

    With saying that, I love my G410 irons. They are really special.

    PING G410 9* PX Evenflow Black 75 6.0
    PING G410 LST 3w PX Evenflow Black 85 6.0
    PING G410 5w PX Evenflow Black 85 6.0
    PING G410 4-PW AWT 2 0 stiff
    PING Stealth Glide 2.0 50ss/54ss/58ss
    PING Sigam G Tyne
  • MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭

    @LaymanM said:
    I would simply reshaft your 4 iron 1st to higher launching light weight steel. Believe it or not there are a few pros that play KBS Tour 90 in a long iron just for this reason.

    With saying that, I love my G410 irons. They are really special.

    Probably the most reasonable, albeit least fun , suggestion LoL

    Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
    Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
    SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
  • gvogelgvogel Members Posts: 7,327 ✭✭

    Try a G410 4-iron or the non-Pro Apex, with a lighter shaft. Lots of Titleist guys used to use an AP1 4-iron.

    Boyhood, like measles, is one of those complaints which a man should catch young and have done with it, for when it comes in middle life it is apt to be serious. - P. G. Wodehouse
  • MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭

    On their site golftown is saying you get a free Ping wedge with the purchase of select iron sets.

    Oh boy. The plot thickens.

    Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
    Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
    SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
  • JoelsimJoelsim Members Posts: 803 ✭✭

    Why don’t you look at graphite shafts?

    Ping G400 Driver 10.5 Regular Alta CB 44.5”
    TaylorMade Original One Mini Driver 13.5 Regular Diamana F Ltd
    Titleist 818 H1 18 and 23 Hybrids Regular Tensei Blue
    Ping G400 4-UW Regular Alta (#4 at power spec loft)
    Ping G410 SW Regular Alta
    Callaway Mack Daddy 4 58 X
    Callaway Mack Daddy 4 64 S
    Bettinardi Studio Stock #3 2017
    Bettinardi Studio Stock #2 2019
    Odyssey Stroke Lab V-Line
    Odyssey Exo 7s
  • GMR2ironGMR2iron Members Posts: 1,525 ✭✭

    @Jagpilotohio said:
    You can’t write Skrew the proper way anymore? Come on cursing filter. That’s a bit much.

    Good thing you didn't try to say ****.

    Titleist 915D4 9.75 Matrix Black Tie
    Titleist 915F 15.5 Matrix Black Tie
    Titleist TMB 2 iron Tensei Pro White
    Titleist 718CB 3 thru PW
    Titleist SM7 50-08 and 56-08
    Yes! Tracy
  • Chuck905Chuck905 Members Posts: 1,148 ✭✭

    @Joelsim said:
    Why don’t you look at graphite shafts?

    I second that.

    I switched from the stock Nippon 98 to a recoil 110 in my two iron and extra carry gained. The shaft was 3/4” longer as well but with the same swing weight.

    Epic SZ 10*, Tensei White 75
    Epic SZ Strong 3 Wood, 13.5*
    U45 17*, Recoil 110
    3-PW Mizuno MP18 Blades
    Mizuno T7s 54-8 SW and 58-12 LW
    Odyssey RX9
  • MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭

    I probably won't go graphite. It's a big change. Right now my problem is just one club. I'll probably reshaft my 4 iron....or just get the G410s because I want shiny new things.

    Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
    Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
    SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
  • PowderedToastManPowderedToastMan Members Posts: 3,788 ✭✭

    Dare I say you’ll have the same issue with an SGI set? What you need is a progressive set, like the i210’s. The launch is progressively higher as you get through the set. It will fix your problem in as little as 30 minutes, Cialis style.

    Former professional golfer. Current amateur human being. Reformed club ho.

    In the bag:

    PING. Lots of PING.
  • LaymanMLaymanM Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 2,123 ✭✭

    @MtlJeff said:
    I probably won't go graphite. It's a big change. Right now my problem is just one club. I'll probably reshaft my 4 iron....or just get the G410s because I want shiny new things.

    Get the G410, I did. Amazing. I went with AWT 2.0 in stiff. I can hit any shot I want with them. I was playing Srixon Z785 with Modus 120s. G410 numbers are exactly where you'd want them to be.

    PING G410 9* PX Evenflow Black 75 6.0
    PING G410 LST 3w PX Evenflow Black 85 6.0
    PING G410 5w PX Evenflow Black 85 6.0
    PING G410 4-PW AWT 2 0 stiff
    PING Stealth Glide 2.0 50ss/54ss/58ss
    PING Sigam G Tyne
  • agolf1agolf1 Members Posts: 781 ✭✭

    @MtlJeff said:

    @LaymanM said:
    I would simply reshaft your 4 iron 1st to higher launching light weight steel. Believe it or not there are a few pros that play KBS Tour 90 in a long iron just for this reason.

    With saying that, I love my G410 irons. They are really special.

    Probably the most reasonable, albeit least fun , suggestion LoL

    My swing speed is a little lower than yours, so the questionable club for me is a 25* 5-iron. I've thought about putting in a softer shaft. However, some of the club fitters seem to say this is just adding dynamic loft and could essentially be done via weakening the loft on the lowest lofted iron (not sure we'd really think this is the right or cool fix). I.e. maybe I would get a bit more carry / higher ball flight with a softer shaft (i.e. more loft), but I have a worry/sense that the distance gap vs the next lofted iron (6-iron in my case) may still be compressed (vs. the rest of the set). Hence, I'm starting to think this is just a speed vs. loft problem that can be band-aided but not really fixed.

    Titleist 915 D4 10.5*, Diamana S+ Blue 60 S-Flex
    Callaway X Hot Pro 19* Fairway, Project X Velocity 6.0
    TaylorMade Raylor 22*, Raylor RE*AX S-Flex
    Ping G25 5-PW (25*-44*), UW (49*), SW (54*), CFS R-Flex
    Ping Zing 2 L/S (57*)
    Ping Cadence TR Ketsch Putter
  • JustsomeguyJustsomeguy Members Posts: 995 ✭✭

    Help doing what? That's what she said.
    Have u tried moving the ball up a tiny bit in your stance to present more loft to the ball?
    Or a lower cg head?

    Titleist 915D3 9.5*, Diamana S+ Blue 60, R, @11*
    Titleist 915F 15* Diamana S+ Blue 70, R
    Titleist 915H 20* Diamana S+ Blue 70, R
    Titleist 716 AP1 4-W52, Kuro Kage Tini 65, S
    Cleveland CBX, 56*/12, Rotex Graphite Wedge Flex
    Cleveland Smart Square Blade
  • anthanth From the Land Down Under Members Posts: 2,773 ✭✭

    I’d look at a lightweight shaft alternative before I changed my whole set. Then again, I’d go with a utility iron at 23 or 24 degrees instead of the standard 4 iron

    Callaway Rogue 10.5
    Callaway BB Alpha 816 16
    Srixon Z H45 19 Hybrid
    Srixon Z U45 23 Utility
    Srixon Z 765/965 5 - PW
    TaylorMade Milled Grind 50 & 54
    TaylorMade Milled Grind Hi Toe 58
    TaylorMade Spider Tour Red
    TaylorMade TP5
  • MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭

    @PowderedToastMan said:
    Dare I say you’ll have the same issue with an SGI set? What you need is a progressive set, like the i210’s. The launch is progressively higher as you get through the set. It will fix your problem in as little as 30 minutes, Cialis style.

    Right now I have an 18 degree steelhead Xr with an S300 and the launch is ok with it. That's why I have the SGI hypothesis!

    I have low launch in general and the players club+s300 makes it too much

    Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
    Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
    SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
  • MelloYelloMelloYello Upstate, SCMembers Posts: 3,262 ✭✭

    TBH, most of it is shaft-related. I think that's where you'll see the biggest difference.

    I've seen tons of guys on here buy long-iron replacements yet stick with heavier shaft options. They try it out only to wonder why the new club still launches low.

    If you can't correct the problem with swing adjustments and you need the club to help you out, you're going to have to sacrifice with a lighter shaft.

    I'll give you some examples from my own play. Last year I played the Titleist 716 MB and definitely noticed a lack of height in the longer irons. So this year I switched. My current Titleist 716 CB irons have the Dynamic Gold AMT shafts which go from a standard 130g down to around 110g in the long irons and it makes a difference. I have more confidence with my current long irons.

    Here's another example. Back when I had a set of 714 AP2 irons with KBS Tour 90 shafts they launched high. I just bought them as an experiment so I sold them. No matter how I hit them, they wanted to go way up in the air. Recently I tried a set of 714 AP2 irons with Dynamic Gold S300 shafts and they launched low, like any Tour-style iron with a heavy shaft.

    It's really in the shaft and more specifically, the shaft weight.

    The smoothest, lightest and easiest to launch shaft I've tried has been the KBS Tour 90. That would be a good place to start.

    Driver: TaylorMade M3 (10.5) w. Tensei Pro Orange 60-X
    Fairway: TaylorMade RBZ Black (16.5)
    Hybrid: Tour Edge Exotics E8 (19)
    Hybrid: Adams Pro Black (23)
    Irons: Titleist 716 CB (5-Pw)
    Wedges: Vokey SM6 52-F / 56-F / 60-S
    Putter: Nike Method Milled 003
  • mantanmantan Members Posts: 2,518 ✭✭
    edited Apr 22, 2019 12:03pm #29

    @starrman77 said:
    "Need advice on getting it up".........Viagra

    The only thing more 'dad joke' than the thread title was the inevitable 'dad joke' level response it begged. I'm surprised it took 13 posts to get there.
    Agree with reshafting with a lightweight high launching steel shaft. It would play at the same length, but me a lot easier to elevate.

    WITB (as of 3/28/19)
    PING G400 Max 10.5*
    PING G400 5-Wood
    PING G25 20* Hybrid
    PING G25 23* Hybrid
    Srixon Z565 5-AW
    PING Stealth ES Glide 54*
    PING Glide ES 58*
    PING Sigma 2 Fetch
    Callaway Chrome Soft TruVis
  • MtlJeffMtlJeff MontrealMembers Posts: 28,368 ✭✭

    @mantan said:

    @starrman77 said:
    "Need advice on getting it up".........Viagra

    The only thing more 'dad joke' than the thread title was the inevitable 'dad joke' level response it begged. I'm surprised it took 13 posts to get there.
    Agree with reshafting with a lightweight high launching steel shaft. It would play at the same length, but me a lot easier to elevate.

    I am a dad. Hence the jokes.

    The KBS tour 90 sounds like a nice option for long irons

    Ping G400 Max 9 w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w/Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56 w/S300
    Callaway MD 2.0 60 PM grind w/s300
    SGC Northwood Center Shaft 400g
  • JAMH03JAMH03 Members Posts: 445 ✭✭

    I just have to say it and I don't know how it can help but an entirely new set of irons for the performance of one 4 irons seems questionable.

    Beyond that, worrying too much about long iron performance seems like a fools errand in general based not on being foolish but on diminishing return, since we don't make the next putt after 4iron nearly often enough to matter.

    Like the guys are suggesting if you can find a shaft you like or a single utility iron that seems a simpler solution to the problem and more likely to keep your scores and performance steady albeit not shinier. I love shiny too!
    I get it the cost of new set is NOT that bad. But it's worse than just getting a lighter shaft, lighter steal or maybe graphite you can extend the length a bit for a club someone with your SS rarely has into greens anyways I imagine.

    Just for fun I pulled up TW's specs and I wonder if he is utilizing similar loft in his 3iron as you are with your 4?

    ">

    FWIW Pardraig isn't beyond getting a lil help with his 4 either. I understand very few aspire to be him anymore but he has won 3 majors and played for a living he's probably a decent ball striker.

    Anyways F&G's!


    Comparisons are odious.

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