Blade users thread (NO DEBATING CLUBHEADS! NO Buy Sell Trade!)

[Bigmean]

I am not into doing things half a**.....

[wmblake2000]

> @Bigmean said:

> > @wmblake2000 said:

> > I practice with a gc quad (I rent time) and it gives clubhead data, too. Path/head - your data looks like hook spin too. Be good to see club data or video but closed head to path and path pretty close to down the line or left is my guess. Does your r elbow get high/outside the plane sometimes (ott)?

>

> Yes, that is my struggle, I have a super neutral path, and tend to close face a smidge early on the bad ones. What do you mean by right elbow out of plane? I think mine drifts away from my body in tendency.

 

Your big pull hooks (path closed, face closed to path) make me wonder if you were trying to get a little extra and maybe at the top/transition your r elbow got a little higher - rather than coming down and under so the shaft shallows, it was a little ott, outside the elbow plane causing path to go left.

 

I know enough about this just to be dangerous so take with grain of salt.

 

 

[wmblake2000]

I am really excited by the MP4’s. Feels like this was the most well-reasoned buy of irons based purely on performance than maybe any. I get my second eye surgery today so it’ll be 10 days or so before I can really swing at it again.

 

I like the look at address so much I was hoping Mizuno made a gap wedge that had same basic design.

[Bigmean]

MP4 is their best offering in last decade.

 

 

So dropped off driver to pga superstore, dude acts like I am an idiot for doing my own shafting, I was like well I am batting a pretty good percentage until this, but yes why I am here. He then grabs the head and starts trying to twist it in his hand, like hard to point I am like “stop, I am here to save the tip, it is not seated right and needs to be properly pulled I don’t have a proper shaft puller to have a chance at this” I mean I know well enough that what is he going to do other than snap the fuxking tip doing that.....

 

He then tells me I didn’t spline it properly, before I could ask him how he knows that without finding the spline on a high dollar shaft that should not even really have one he shows how the labels are not lined up...SERIOUSLY???? he just rotated the shaft 1/4 turn in front of me in his attempt to snap the f****** tip, which I pointed out as I had it shafted graphics aligned until that point and that isnt even likely the the damn spline but ok.......

 

Then he tells me I am going to lose the grip, I am like it is put on with air so it should be easy, he says “our compressor has been down so I need to cut it”. I am like whatever, don’t care....

 

So then I am just begging, all I care about is please, please, this is an expensive shaft that is hard to get.... please just carefully pull this and reinstall properly with needed shim or proper ferrule or glues or whatever and do what you can if the tip is a little damaged if you can work with it...

 

He then says “we are out of shims, but they are on the way”. I say like a woman trying to get out of a speeding ticket “please take your time, I just want it to be right, I don’t care if it is next month, please just do it with care and try to save this”

 

To the best answer ever.......

 

“I make pga your players happy with my work, I am sure it will be good enough for you”

 

Now normally I would leave there thinking that I should have gone to Edwin watts, and what a complete unprofessional shitshow pga superstore was in general, and how uncomfortable I really was with it, but I figured I made this mess and it can be replaced if need be, so let fate do it’s thing and see what happens.....

[wmblake2000]

> @04majorhmgc said:

> I have got some Srixon Z Forged on the way. Really excited about these. I have played the 765 and 785 for the past 3 or so years but I decided its time to have something that Im dying to hit, which is these, at least 5-p. Keeping 785 4iron. Also making a switch of shafts which has me stoked/scared. Going from 6.5 LZ's to x100 AMT Whites. Through fitting, dispersion was comparable but the little bit of extra apex and improved descent angle on long irons has me pretty confident its the right thing to do, until its not.

> Anybody out there have Z Forged in the bag? What do you think? What made you go there? Also, opinions of V-sole?

 

I spent some time trying the Srixon’s out. Somehow they didn’t click. The shafts in the MP4 are DG s300 - I really like heavy shafts but these are maybe a little too heavy. I was thinking amt white also.

 

It now seems to me that the sole design is a huge deal in how well a club head fits a person..

 

[BIG STU]

> @No_Catchy_Nickname said:

> > @Bigmean said:

> > > @wmblake2000 said:

> > > I practice with a gc quad (I rent time) and it gives clubhead data, too. Path/head - your data looks like hook spin too. Be good to see club data or video but closed head to path and path pretty close to down the line or left is my guess. Does your r elbow get high/outside the plane sometimes (ott)?

> >

> > Yes, that is my struggle, I have a super neutral path, and tend to close face a smidge early on the bad ones. What do you mean by right elbow out of plane? I think mine drifts away from my body in tendency.

>

>

> A 26-yard hoik left with a nine iron is pretty impressive! My personal best is a 40+ yard hook with a 7i*. The guy checking the monitor was surely impressed. To be fair, I wasn't sure where I was supposed to aim, and was already starting it off left.

>

> *not counting drivers here. I've hooked those on launch monitors into the next dimension.

 

HA HA that ain't nothing back when I could really swing my rope hook was a left lateral no joke. One thing positive about getting older I do not swing as fast or hard so my rope hook is not as bad. But I will admit it does crop up once in a while and it ain't pretty but not as ugly as it used to be

[Christen_The_Sloop]

 

> In terms of the wide soles and look of some of the more extreme GI stuff, I think there's merit in the idea that the look of the club can actually influence how some players swing at the ball. I think two things happen. First, some players will get scoopy with those wide bladed designs, and second better players may start changing their AOA because the immediate high launch of GIs is disconcerting to them as the ball is not departing in the visual window they're accustomed to. In either case, it can be destructive to the player's swing and certainly negatively affect scoring. Is is psychological? Perhaps, but really doesn't matter.

>

> A club with a more compact profile, like a true MB blade, can encourage striking the ball first with a descending blow, as opposed to hanging back and dump-scooping it with a wide soled GI. Those "dump-scoops" are moderately effective with a fat soled GI, but won't work at all with a thin soled blade.

 

I noticed your irons have 105x. Can I ask what you think of them? How long have you used them? What did you use before?

I've got a set of them and I find they hold their line pretty well. The ball rises kind of gradually off the face too, wondering if they balloon at all. Thanks!

 

As I mentioned in a post above the set with 105x came in slightly over length (like a half inch) and it had me thinking - the 4-P were 105x and the 3iron was 120x for some reason. I matched up a Founders club 1-iron with the 3 iron from the set and the 1 was ever so slightly longer. I'm thinking that 1 iron will get a modern upgrade, for giggles and what have you. Might be a little project for tomorrow.

 

The grass on my little putting green is starting to come in too, it's turned completely green. There are some sandy spots yet and I've probably spent too much time walking on it, so the surrounding grass is a little patchy, but I'll be picking up a mower soon and I am getting psyched as hell to see how it will play. Looking at getting a real feel mat shipped out off e-bay too - I've already got a nice 5x5 square concrete station ready and then I'll string up a net, so I can bash a few balls every day. I can't wait to wear out a set of irons.

 

 

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

> @wmblake2000 said:

> I am really excited by the MP4’s. Feels like this was the most well-reasoned buy of irons based purely on performance than maybe any. I get my second eye surgery today so it’ll be 10 days or so before I can really swing at it again.

>

> I like the look at address so much I was hoping Mizuno made a gap wedge that had same basic design.

 

I much prefer the MP4s to the MP18s, so much so that I am going to sell my 18s. I agree with Biggie. They're Mizuno's best blade offering in the last decade or so. However, I will say that the MP5s have grown on me. I also liked the 37s, though the PW and 9i were a bit on the large side from what I remember.

 

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

**C_T_S**

 

What sort of difference did you see between the 120X and 105X? I was comparing 105 and 120 shafts in the shop, and I noticed that the 105 shaft has a very different stepping pattern, with lots more steps and less of a gap from the first step to the tip. I've just got a Bridgestone 4i with a 105S in it, and I was surprised how stable it was. Lighter than the DG S300s in my FG62s I was hitting at the same time, but the ball was not turning over like I get with some lighter shafts.

[Nard_S]

 

>

 

> @wmblake2000 said:

> > @04majorhmgc said:

> > I have got some Srixon Z Forged on the way. Really excited about these. I have played the 765 and 785 for the past 3 or so years but I decided its time to have something that Im dying to hit, which is these, at least 5-p. Keeping 785 4iron. Also making a switch of shafts which has me stoked/scared. Going from 6.5 LZ's to x100 AMT Whites. Through fitting, dispersion was comparable but the little bit of extra apex and improved descent angle on long irons has me pretty confident its the right thing to do, until its not.

> > Anybody out there have Z Forged in the bag? What do you think? What made you go there? Also, opinions of V-sole?

>

> ....................... The shafts in the MP4 are DG s300 - I really like heavy shafts but these are maybe a little too heavy. I was thinking amt white also...........

>

 

>

 

Give the S300 a go for a while. Going heavier takes longer to take than lighter but it can be worth the wait.

I took out my FG59 #7i last range trip. Great club but it's nearly 20g lighter than everyday iron. I was everywhere with it, path and face wise. Certainly easier to swing and motor but everyday club was big winner. What I find is that heavier imposes more body participation and exposes the lack of it in a pass. What goes on from knee to shoulder joints has been under scrutinized by myself for decades, heavier made that plain as day and pulled my swing to a better path.

[JoeFrigo]

I live just outside Chicago and there's a small start up about 1.5 hrs away. Found these guys on another website and went and hit them in person. Felt just as good as the Z965's I used to have and recently fit for the Z forged. Brand is called Sub 70 and I ended up ordering them b/c they were so consistent distance wise and accurate! Best part.... 4 - P are $599!! Dynamic Gold or PX are upcharge but in general the set cost me $730 for forged blades. Highly suggest checking out their demo program. Cavity back's are available now on the website, but the muscle backs I ordered are 4 weeks away.

 

[wmblake2000]

> @Nard_S said:

> Give the S300 a go for a while. Going heavier takes longer to take than lighter but it can be worth the wait.

> I took out my FG59 #7i last range trip. Great club but it's nearly 20g lighter than everyday iron. I was everywhere with it, path and face wise. Certainly easier to swing and motor but everyday club was big winner. What I find is that heavier imposes more body participation and exposes the lack of it in a pass. What goes on from knee to shoulder joints has been under scrutinized by myself for decades, heavier made that plain as day and pulled my swing to a better path.

 

Warning: still a little loopy from anesthesia from yesterday. I may end up writing about flying elephants or politcal/spiritual philosophy before the end.

 

One of the hardest things I am learning in golf is when to trust my instincts and when to abandon them. With the swing, I had to fully abandon my instincts and learn from others. (That took/is taking a while). Same with driver. (G400 Max is awesome but a long way from esoteric Japanese heads that were my preference.)

 

But with irons I am as fully convinced as a analytical skeptic like me can be that these (easy to hit for blades) blades are optimal.. even down to the 3 iron. Which makes no rational sense to me, ( Deninney be damned.) I should be rolling into a bag full of hybrids. The ‘sensible shoes’ that a woman finally buys as she admits to comfort over style. But no. There is a connection to blades that if I embrace my most confident inner golfer that is strong with the Force.

 

So now comes the shaft. Before eye surgery yesterday I had one last little practice session. A mini-party. (I’m typing with one eye right now, about to go to doc to get patch removed and two well-functioning eyes!) I hit tight little draws one after another, ball compressed. But as I left on a high note with a blistered 3 iron (is there anything more fun in golf than a well struck butter knife?) I also had the sense that the club felt heavy. And then the idea struck me of progressive shaft weights. I had the aerotech progressive weight shafts (which I should have never sold!) and can’t recall loving or hating them.

 

So here’s the question: how do you explore this? Frankly I have tried every approach - expensive fittings, cheap ones, my own launch monitor assessment, swap shafts in and out, the Mizuno shaft device. Only playing a club on the course can really answer the question. Maybe one of the most gifted fitters could but those are even harder to find than a gifted teacher.

 

Here’s what I understand: too heavy and too stiff works for me. Like you said, they inspire a better swing (but maybe a little slower in spite of a more aggressive and assertive move). Better path and better sense of how the release works.

 

But I also have this sense for longer irons more speed is a good thing so the ball gets a little higher. Maybe I’ll buy just a couple of long iron AMT white shafts and see... Can’t really play again for a couple of weeks so plenty of time to stew.

 

Oh... anyone use Arccos? I am thinking this is a good thing - get real data about how long, what kinds of patterns for each club...

 

Good lord that was a lot of rambling.

 

 

 

 

 

[Bigmean]

But no elephants and politics!!!!!

 

 

Weight is not bad. It lets you feel, it sets the tempo for you, and it slows your transition.

 

I hit sim again last night (focused on right elbow) and while my recent few weeks off has left me missing left I hit some positive irons as well. I think my problems are from holding off as I feel like that protects but it doesn’t, it almost makes my rotating wrists just hood it closed sometimes when not timed right. So oddly in “snapping” the head through impact zone with No chance feeling where face is most turned out really straight. I think my over focus of face is forcing me to just be tight. New focus is just let it go, let it go and let it go snap it through impact zone, forget face just release it through the ball. This was really working with my driver which save for two big hooks was very playable across 18.

 

Looking to get on course this weekend of rain let’s up...I am really taking for granted I remember how to putt, haven’t done that since September ?.....first weekend of cheap rates for us Floridians!!!!!!

[NRJyzr]

Will be playing this afternoon, I am taking my TW282's with me. Will be hitting them on range beforehand to see if I want to play them. Swing has been very spotty this year, the longer winter apparently really affected my golf game this year.

 

They do look a bit intimidating, with that super square toe. ;)

[wmblake2000]

Ha! THE key for blades for me is to ‘let it go.’ I focus a lot pre shot even on the range at being relaxed - jaw, face, shoulders, back, arms

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

> @NRJyzr said:

> Will be playing this afternoon, I am taking my TW282's with me. Will be hitting them on range beforehand to see if I want to play them. Swing has been very spotty this year, the longer winter apparently really affected my golf game this year.

>

> They do look a bit intimidating, with that super square toe. ;)

 

last year, starting from about July, I went through about 6~8 months of not having a damn clue of what my swing was doing. Self-inflicted, too.

A comment from someone I had never played with before actually set me on the path back to a proper swing.

All I can say is remember what worked for you in the past.

[Nard_S]

 

 

 

 

> So here’s the question: how do you explore this? Frankly I have tried every approach - expensive fittings, cheap ones, my own launch monitor assessment, swap shafts in and out, the Mizuno shaft device. Only playing a club on the course can really answer the question. Maybe one of the most gifted fitters could but those are even harder to find than a gifted teacher.

>

> Here’s what I understand: too heavy and too stiff works for me. Like you said, they inspire a better swing (but maybe a little slower in spite of a more aggressive and assertive move). Better path and better sense of how the release works.

>

 

First off, hope the eye procedure works out well, my Dr. told me I'll need the same someday.

 

How I went about this is spent time with short irons, then progressed to mids and finally long. The time is key, hundreds of strikes for each step. The first time I did a full session with the really heavy 681's, it knocked my body hard. Mind that in that set the #4i weighs in @435g and average on my others is 420g

What I've come to appreciate is that longer irons in a heavier configuration are harder to master but once you adjust they become easier to utilize and get good results. That lighter is short term more enticing but long term is a loser because the body is adjusting to a different club altogether in both length and weight. So the whole progressive weight thing ends up being regressive because going up & down bag becomes harder. Since real play requires pulling a 3-4 club differential all the time, I'm way better off keeping entire weight differential of set tighter and beefing up swing to handle that. Took 6 weeks, but since I'm more comfortable in higher weight class, can still mis fire but the dispersion is much better, cluster of impact is tighter too. I use a S300 #5w to transition to metals, my driver has an added 10 gram plug to 65g shaft, so my #3w is the odd ball and not surprisingly one of my harder clubs to poke properly. That one is getting replaced or "fixed" with a plug too.

[wmblake2000]

I swung someone’s tw (or "t"... I forget) branded 680 or 681 several years ago and it was heavy, to be sure. But I quite liked it...

 

Well, hmmm. That (just play s300 for a while) makes as much sense as anything else, that’s for sure. If you’re right and we accommodate to the club/weight (which I believe) then I think your ‘more consistent, better swing’ is likely. Good stuff, thx.

 

And my overall 4 iron is 420, like all your others...

 

Patch is off - vision is still a little blurry but I won’t need glasses (except for reading - no near vision as a result. Am wearing $1 magnifying ‘readers’ as I type this.) No golf for 2 weeks is the worst part.

 

One thing that also matters to me... is after all this - I mean, I have bought and sold a lot of pretty high end stuff. And where I have landed is two sets of irons with a combined value of maybe $500, maybe less. AND... if my confidence slips away, I have a set of Game Freaking Improvement irons (Mac 1025M) at the ready. So says Ralph Maltby and that's good enough for me.

 

Sweet.

[tgoodspe1991]

Thought I’d post the latest sticks that just arrived today. New 2019 BB’s with new satin/white chrome finish!

 

 

[edgerat]

nice! My MB001 set should be here early next week.

[Kingcat990]

> @wmblake2000 said:

 

>

> I have bought and sold a lot of pretty high end stuff. And where I have landed is two sets of irons with a combined value of maybe $500

 

 

Thats how it goes all the time. Appearance purchased irons come with a stigma of superiority. Deduce it all down to just plated mild carbon steel. I shot one of my best scores with cast 304SS no named blades that clicked worse than clogs and felt more mute than any other piece alloy. Glad you're on the right track with golf and onto recovery bud.

[Christen_The_Sloop]

> @No_Catchy_Nickname said:

> **C_T_S**

>

> What sort of difference did you see between the 120X and 105X? I was comparing 105 and 120 shafts in the shop, and I noticed that the 105 shaft has a very different stepping pattern, with lots more steps and less of a gap from the first step to the tip. I've just got a Bridgestone 4i with a 105S in it, and I was surprised how stable it was. Lighter than the DG S300s in my FG62s I was hitting at the same time, but the ball was not turning over like I get with some lighter shafts.

 

Yeah, the 105x are pretty stable - far more than say, an s200. The weight with the 120s and the 105x is about the same too one is 112g the other 114. - I like the flight and feel with the 120s to be honest, for me it's pretty mid-flight, just have to be

careful as I can overpower them. These days, I don't really go hard at anything, so it works. The 105x is really different. I have to take them out again and really see. Actually I would like to swap out the yamaha heads with some Founders Club 200 series I have collecting dust - they are maybe the nicest all around set I have.

 

 

 

 

[BIG STU]

> @JoeFrigo said:

> I live just outside Chicago and there's a small start up about 1.5 hrs away. Found these guys on another website and went and hit them in person. Felt just as good as the Z965's I used to have and recently fit for the Z forged. Brand is called Sub 70 and I ended up ordering them b/c they were so consistent distance wise and accurate! Best part.... 4 - P are $599!! Dynamic Gold or PX are upcharge but in general the set cost me $730 for forged blades. Highly suggest checking out their demo program. Cavity back's are available now on the website, but the muscle backs I ordered are 4 weeks away.

>

>

 

That is one nice looking set of irons--- For the life of me I can not figure what irons they remind me of though

[BIG STU]

> @Bigmean said:

> But no elephants and politics!!!!!

>

>

> Weight is not bad. It lets you feel, it sets the tempo for you, and it slows your transition.

>

> I hit sim again last night (focused on right elbow) and while my recent few weeks off has left me missing left I hit some positive irons as well. I think my problems are from holding off as I feel like that protects but it doesn’t, it almost makes my rotating wrists just hood it closed sometimes when not timed right. So oddly in “snapping” the head through impact zone with No chance feeling where face is most turned out really straight. I think my over focus of face is forcing me to just be tight. New focus is just let it go, let it go and let it go snap it through impact zone, forget face just release it through the ball. This was really working with my driver which save for two big hooks was very playable across 18.

>

> Looking to get on course this weekend of rain let’s up...I am really taking for granted I remember how to putt, haven’t done that since September ?.....first weekend of cheap rates for us Floridians!!!!!!

 

Glad to see you are feeling better and considering playing again. Like you guys I think the winter/spring tourist season is over for us too. Being a member of a group that owns 21 courses our rates were up a little during the tourist season. Our problem was course overcrowding and trying to get tee times. My home course they were still double teeing at 3:30 last Saturday afternoon! Today I am playing in a scramble that is company related since my company sponsors a couple of holes and a team. Usually when that event occurs it marks the end of the Tourist season golf wise for us. My buddy Tim V over in the Classics forum of WRX lives somewhere in Florida and he does like me gives the tourists a lot of sheet. I have not played a lot lately I think 13 holes in the last month but have hit balls and practiced some. 5 hour rounds and putting up with asine and stupid drunks is not my cup of tea.

[wmblake2000]

> @Kingcat990 said:

> > @wmblake2000 said:

>

> >

> > I have bought and sold a lot of pretty high end stuff. And where I have landed is two sets of irons with a combined value of maybe $500

>

>

> Thats how it goes all the time. Appearance purchased irons come with a stigma of superiority. Deduce it all down to just plated mild carbon steel. I shot one of my best scores with cast 304SS no named blades that clicked worse than clogs and felt more mute than any other piece alloy. Glad you're on the right track with golf and onto recovery bud.

 

Thx!

Ok, golf in June, together. Seriously.

 

[Bigmean]

Not going to lie Stu, the whole GC2 and projector screen in garage combined with family and life in general makes it hard to play real rounds, which is likely both good and bad for real rounds. I want to make a habit this summer to get out on grass more.

 

The Sub70 advertisement posted reminds you of heads you see a lot of on Ali baba etc. I don’t mean that as a knock, just saying. While I dislike the blatant advert, I am always a fan of new startups and better value. I would be curious on a few things with it though. Like how is it really made, did they pick the heads from predetermined options or work on their own designs here and commission an overseas partner to fabricate, how that process goes. Etc. I am just fascinated by the business and machining end of things. I think it would be cool to start a golf company but literally impossible to design functioning gear from scratch without R and D behind what works and doesn’t etc. but then again what kind of R and D does someone like Modart or Jean Baptiste really have behind their very expensive gear?

 

That is where golf crosses into a realm where I can relate from my line of work sorta, it is interesting.

[craz-e]

> @tgoodspe1991 said:

> Thought I’d post the latest sticks that just arrived today. New 2019 BB’s with new satin/white chrome finish!

>

>

>

 

 

Very nice!

Might have to buy another set ?

 

[Christen_The_Sloop]

I think if you make something expensive enough people will buy it for that very reason. It helps if you have a professional golfer win with one of your designs. You are set for life.

 

I kind of chase the clubs that one big events. It's part of the historian in me. Funny thing is, all the clubs they used perform. And, other clubs that never had anyone win with them also perform. It's almost like they don't matter. Almost.

 

I've been up all day - daughter woke at 4 something a.m. and I had enough sleep. Once she got back to bed, I went for one of them runs I might have written about up and down the Katsura river - a solid 10km. Between that and this beer here, I got to wedge it around my front yard with the pitching wedge from those Founders club 200 series I was also writing about. And, I've got a say, they just perform and they feel so good - made me remember some a chipping lesson I got as a junior golfer - about maintaining the wrist angle after impact.

 

I started working with only two balls. Trying to leave the first ball short of the target and then attack with the next ball. Started out like it was my first time chipping. But, slowly got in a groove with it. and by the time I finished I was chipping them pretty much the way I wanted with almost no distance gap. Just pure at the hole - thinking each one had a chance from the inside 15 yards I've got to play with.

[Bigmean]

Can’t make this up....

 

Call pga superstore, just Incase the epic is done so I may be able to play with it.....nothing under my name, no epic drivers no black crazy shafts...

 

I was Like I tell you what, I will come down there and find it. and if it is done, cool and if not then I am going to take it someplace else...

 

Not that I am a big believer in yelp, but this location has 2 stars and all bad reviews for rude/bad employee/managers....duh... I mean even if I am in the set up for 200 bucks it is still a retail $800 driver in shaft and I feel like if I took it to freaking Dick’s it would be more professionally handled and cared for FFS....

[wmblake2000]

10k run after awakening at 4 am is impressive!

 

Biggie, reach out to corporate. They will care ... hopefully. All us nerds should buy shaft pullers. I do 95% of my own work. Loft/lie/pull graphite shafts need pricey tools that I can never justify. But if I ever put graphite in irons I’m gonna buy a decent puller.

 

Can’t believe I can’t swing a club for 2 weeks. I’ll cheat a little but not much. I can chip which is maybe a good thing.

 

Now... thoughts turn to wedges. Here is a quick pic - these are in pristine shape.

 

.