who has actually played with a legit scratch golfer/pro level player?

[maxcov922]

I work at a a private club and play pretty regularly with one of the assistants. He doesnt keep a handicap anymore since being a part of the pga, but before he was playing at around a +1.5. He is relatively long off of the tee, but his irons seem to be a pretty regular distance. 150 9 iron and so on. His accuracy and height with the long irons is unbelievable. Seems like he doesn't miss the green from anywhere inside of 200 yards. If he is within 30 yards of the green theres just no need for him to bring a putter, Always within a foot or two. 

[Hkovo17]

On 9/15/2018 at 12:43 PM, MtlJeff said:

Legit scratch and Pro level are 2 very different things. I am a legit scratch, have a few under par rounds this year on a 75/140 course and 7-8 other 72's.

 

I have played with many of the top amateurs in Quebec, one of the top juniors in Canada, one of the top seniors in Canada.

 

Have not played with a PGA pro, which is a whole other level

 

A top AM, like a +3 or whatever, they often look like scratches to the casual golfer. But in truth they just miss far less shots

I'm a +2 as-is in Philly where I don't get to play in the winter. I'm telling you tour pros don't "hit the ball" differently than we do - you probably feel the same. A striped 4-iron looks the same, unless you're getting some serious ball speed, then you start getting that Tour-esque rising flight. 

However, you hand them anything lower than a 48-degree and you will quickly start walking with your tail between your legs. 

It's not even their "short game" as a whole, it's their wedge play. Their wedge play is unreal and that's what separates them (it's not even putting...). 

[Hkovo17]

Posting twice just to emphasize how sick their wedge play is. I feel like it's not talked about enough.

Edit- also didn't realize I'm replying to a dude that posted in 2018... Sorry

Edited February 3, 2023 by Hkovo17

[MtlJeff]

On 2/2/2023 at 8:31 PM, Hkovo17 said:

Posting twice just to emphasize how sick their wedge play is. I feel like it's not talked about enough.

Edit- also didn't realize I'm replying to a dude that posted in 2018... Sorry

 

That's "Mr" Dude thank you very much. I didn't spend 15 years here posting 30,000 times, sacrificing all real world human connection in exchange for cheap likes from faceless internet avatars only to be calls "A dude"

[Rosco1216]

On 2/2/2023 at 7:29 PM, Hkovo17 said:

I'm a +2 as-is in Philly where I don't get to play in the winter. I'm telling you tour pros don't "hit the ball" differently than we do - you probably feel the same. A striped 4-iron looks the same, unless you're getting some serious ball speed, then you start getting that Tour-esque rising flight. 

However, you hand them anything lower than a 48-degree and you will quickly start walking with your tail between your legs. 

It's not even their "short game" as a whole, it's their wedge play. Their wedge play is unreal and that's what separates them (it's not even putting...). 

Yes their wedge play is better but that’s not what really sets them apart.  Of course a stripped 4i looks the same whether you’re a tour pro or scratch or low single(if speed is comparable). A pro can hit 10 straight 4i and can say he missed a couple but you wouldn’t have been able to tell much difference in real time unless you were at the green and saw a couple 10-15ft shorter than the others.  What sets them about is that their “miss” is barely off from the stripped ones.

[golfortennis]

I've told this story before, but I had a guy come up to the tee box on a course in Florida.  I tend to play the tips at a number of courses, so I am well practiced at the "don't feel you need to play back here just because I am speech."   Dude says it'll be fine.  After a drive I felt pretty good about, he pounds it by me 30 yards without even trying.  Turns out he had twice qualified for the US Am.  Fun to watch a stick.

 

I've also had the good fortune to play with the son of wrx member who is headed to college in the fall to play.  Another stick.

[Mtn_Mikey]

Back years ago, while working at a Nicklaus course in the Colorado mountains, A gentleman joined three us on the Nicklaus Tees (Championship tees playing at 7,258 yards and 73.3/146 course /slope ratings (Sigh, miss those days as age and health has chased me out of the CO mountains). He had conditional status on the PGA Champions Tour and had played in Europe too. Shot a 73 never having seen the course and was bedeviled a bit by altitude and distance as well as by some of the subtle breaks on the greens. Fortunately, we didn't have the buried elephant greens. 

 

It was a great and enjoyable morning. 

[LiftingGolfer]

Played against Morikawa in high school. Not particularly long off of the tee, and he didn’t need to be. He’s absolutely money with his irons and wedges. Always set himself up for short, makeable putts. Not to be cliche, but he definitely eliminated the big miss in his game. His bad shots were not nearly as bad as the bad shots everyone else hit. Overall, a very controlled player in those days. Was also my first exposure to a high-level amateur. He’d already committed to Cal and had a bag full of fitted Taylormades from The Kingdom (man is a loyalist). Also, he didn’t wear his school’s issued hat, shoes, or gloves (wore his Taylormade/adidas swag) so make of that what you will.

[Hawkeye77]

On 2/4/2023 at 4:51 PM, MtlJeff said:

 

That's "Mr" Dude thank you very much. I didn't spend 15 years here posting 30,000 times, sacrificing all real world human connection in exchange for cheap likes from faceless internet avatars only to be calls "A dude"

Come on bro, he prolly didn’t know!

[Hawkeye77]

I don’t mind “dude” as long as I don’t have to see “wipes” after it. I won’t verbalize what I’m thinking about Harry Higgs’ pants whenever he’s on camera. 

[TiScape]

2 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

I don’t mind “dude” as long as I don’t have to see “wipes” after it. I won’t verbalize what I’m thinking about Harry Higgs’ pants whenever he’s on camera. 

If he’s using the product, at least you know he’s skid mark free! 😂 

[TiScape]

5 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

Come on bro, he prolly didn’t know!

Ur prolly right fo sho 

[Hawkeye77]

9 minutes ago, TiScape said:

If he’s using the product, at least you know he’s skid mark free! 😂 

Until he misses a three footer for par!

[tomc262]

Working on a golf course in HS I was around couple of pros.  One eventually won the Senior British Open and the other won on the mini tours and is still kicking butt in PGA sectional events.  Their level of ball striking was other worldly and it got even better around the greens.  I tell people those guys/gals out on the tours don't play the same game! 🙂

[usqebach]

A few years back, we had a fella join our club who was a former division 1 collegiate golfer at the same school I attended (separated by 4-5 years - I of course didn't play college.)  He had attempted to make a living overseas, but gave that up and was content to be state-level amateur contender.  We would go out on Tuesday mornings some times before I went to work.  I would play golds with him, and it was usually a struggle for me.  One very windy day, I gutted out a great round of about 82-ish.  I didn't keep his card, but I knew he threw at least 3 OB, so I thought I might have got him.

The next time we played, he hit 17 greens and shot a 67!  That was it for me!

[Triple Putt]

On 2/9/2023 at 5:18 AM, LiftingGolfer said:

Played against Morikawa in high school. Not particularly long off of the tee, and he didn’t need to be. He’s absolutely money with his irons and wedges. Always set himself up for short, makeable putts. Not to be cliche, but he definitely eliminated the big miss in his game. His bad shots were not nearly as bad as the bad shots everyone else hit. Overall, a very controlled player in those days. Was also my first exposure to a high-level amateur. He’d already committed to Cal and had a bag full of fitted Taylormades from The Kingdom (man is a loyalist). Also, he didn’t wear his school’s issued hat, shoes, or gloves (wore his Taylormade/adidas swag) so make of that what you will.

I beat Dechamcheau in a Valley tournament by 5 strokes my junior yr of highschool lol. On his home course even. My high school teammates still joke to this day about it. When someone pulls the BS card I pull out my phone and bring up the tournament results lol. 

[Retrop1]

On 2/4/2023 at 6:20 PM, Rosco1216 said:

Yes their wedge play is better but that’s not what really sets them apart.  Of course a stripped 4i looks the same whether you’re a tour pro or scratch or low single(if speed is comparable). A pro can hit 10 straight 4i and can say he missed a couple but you wouldn’t have been able to tell much difference in real time unless you were at the green and saw a couple 10-15ft shorter than the others.  What sets them about is that their “miss” is barely off from the stripped ones.

Totally agree. I know a former college golf coach at a mid sized school with some very good players having been through there and I have been fortunate enough to play with a lot of them and watch qualifying and competition rounds. What seperates a scratch from the college kid that can't make the top 5 is short game and their misses are way better. What seperates them from the kids in the top 5 is short game and misses still better. What seperates the ones that have won college and big regional events is the majority of their misses I wouldn't call a miss. It really is such a fine line. A good friend who has won multiple state opens and PGA section events can literally go out and shoot 68 on a super difficult setup and his perception could very well be a terrible ball striking day but the reality is his misses were just still really good shots. 

[becoh]

Had a random join our group at the end of last season. Younger guy, maybe 25 from out of town for some family stuff. Air Canada "misplaced" his golf clubs, so he was picked up a partial set from a pawn shop. If I recall he had Callaway Big Bertha steelhead 3 & 5 woods, some haggard blade 2-10 irons (I forget the brand) and a right handed putter, even tho he was a lefty.

 

He said he was a +2 handicap, and it showed. Smooth swing and tempo, and really smart getting around a course he never played before. He was bombing drives with this 3 wood 250ish carry, and dead accurate with the irons.

 

Even with the clubs, he still shot 40.

 

[hagimihale]

A guy I know played for a few years on the pro tennis circuit.  Don't think he ever made it to the semis in any major, but his elite level of coordination when we play is very apparent.  

 

First time I ever played with him, he missed a makeable birdie putt.  Was very angry with himself.  He channeled his anger into 5 straight birdies.  Coasted his way to a 65, if there is such a thing.  

 

I've watched him look at the corner of a dogleg, where there was a tall oak tree to clear or get around, and say "I'm going to go over that tree".  Um, that tree is 260 yards out at least and probably 60 feet tall.  "yep, I know".  And then hammers his drive over the tree, leaving < 50 yards to the pin on a 380+ par-4.  

 

I can't imagine putting that much force into every swing, and hitting it on the screws basically every time.  Humbling to watch...

[Texasaggie2016]

Played with a few scratch course pros when I was working at a golf course in college. My biggest takeaway is their misses would be considered good shots if I hit them. I play around a 10 hcp 

[MR920]

About 20 years ago, I was vacationing in Hawaii and played with a younger guy in his mid 20s from Pennsylvania, real nice kid. He said he was a US Amateur qualifier and grew up playing golf with Sean O'Hair. If I remember correctly, he was there for a wedding and didn't bring his clubs. Don't remember which course, but he played in his sneakers with rental clubs, and shot an easy looking 67.

[daegyu]

On 2/9/2023 at 5:18 AM, LiftingGolfer said:

Played against Morikawa in high school. Not particularly long off of the tee, and he didn’t need to be. He’s absolutely money with his irons and wedges. Always set himself up for short, makeable putts. Not to be cliche, but he definitely eliminated the big miss in his game. His bad shots were not nearly as bad as the bad shots everyone else hit. Overall, a very controlled player in those days. Was also my first exposure to a high-level amateur. He’d already committed to Cal and had a bag full of fitted Taylormades from The Kingdom (man is a loyalist). Also, he didn’t wear his school’s issued hat, shoes, or gloves (wore his Taylormade/adidas swag) so make of that what you will.

Which school in CIF did you go to? Glendale High here!

[LiftingGolfer]

21 hours ago, daegyu said:

Which school in CIF did you go to? Glendale High here!

Monrovia! Rio Hondo League here!

[SamboRoll]

What I’ve seen that separates the +golfers from scratch players and us mortals who are happy to break 80 on a good day, there are certain commonalities.

 

1. They find the ball with the center of their club face more consistently, and they don’t have swing flaws that would cause it to break down under pressure. Therefore, their misses are way better and they play with confidence knowing they can trust their swing even in tight situations.

2. Wedge game, especially distance and trajectory control. From 120yds and under they are going at it aggressively creating ton of birdie opportunities. 
3. Putting. This sounds kind of self evident, but they can putt the ball on a straight line where they are aiming at, which is actually quite a rare skill among average golfers. If you can putt straight with sound mechanics, the game on the greens is all about distance control and reading the breaks right. Also, they understand the importance of lag putting and avoiding three putts.

4. Course management. They jus’t don’t do stupid mistakes or blow ups. If they take a risk, it is a calculated one and they understand what is the right side to miss a green, or a fairway. They know during the round when it is time to attack or defend your score. This comes out in demeanour, they are never in a hurry at the golf course!

5. Athletic talent and skill. At this level you rarely see any of the common mechanical flaws of the average golfer anymore, but instead you start to come across with real genuine talent on some area of their game. May it be striping the irons, deadly wedge game or not missing a putt under six feet. Really cool to watch in close if you get to play with them! This skill may well be on par with the Tour Pros, but then they are compensating it in some other area of their game.
6. Competitiveness and mindset. They become different animals when playing money games or competitive tournaments. Instead of choking on big moments they thrive in them and feed off from them. 

Edited March 25, 2023 by SamboRoll

[Cwing]

Yes, a few times. Same guy. He played on the nike tour before it became the web.com and now kornferry tours. His sponsor passed away so he decided to move on from golf vs trying to get a new one.

 

300 yd bombs off the tee without ever looking like he was trying. He never seemed to take anytime to line up a putt.  He shot in the 60’s every time I played with him. 
 

At one point he played left handed “just because”.

 

I asked him what the difference between him and a pga tour player was. He said about 6-8 hrs of distance control practice a day.

 

I played with a high level female at one point as well. Just really, really good.

[ShowMe]

Played in a college amateur/civilian amateur event the day before the East Lake Cup tournament with Leona McGuire when she was a student at Duke several years ago.  It was similar to a pro-am, but with the top college golfers (men and women).  She was like a freaking robot.  Long and straight off the tee...longer than any of us grown men.  Great around the greens.  She gave me a tip for hitting out of wet bunker sand that I still use to this day.  Not at all surprising that she's been successful on the LPGA.  Celine Boutier was on the Duke team, too.  Sam Burns participated on the LSU team.

[BDubya]

In 1995-1996, while a teen living at home southeast of Houston, TX, I worked on the cart staff of a very nice country club near League City. On weekdays if it was our day off, we were allowed to play the course now and then if it was slow.  The head pro was great, and he had been the one to give me lessons how to play golf 6 years prior.  One of the head pro's good friends, who actually lived near the club, was PGA Tour pro Mike Standly, who had played at the University of Houston. When he wasn't out of town at a tournament, many times he could be found hanging out in the pro shop of the country club. I was pretty good for my age and the head pro and I would play 9 or 18 every now and then when he could get away. Once, I got to play a round with Mike and the head pro.  As many have said in previous posts, the pros' misses just seem more accurate than regular misses.  Where I was content to focus on larger targets, they seemed disappointed if the approach wasn't exactly where they wanted it.  It was great having that opportunity to play with those caliber of players for that time.

[texcellence86]

One of my golf buddies play once a week with for 10sih years now, 15 years older than me always hurt or injured. Shows up 10 min before the Tee time and never warms up, always starts out with 2-3 bogeys. He's been playing 40 years easily and not once have I ever seen him shoot over 75.

 

Needless to say he alone as drastically improved my game over the years with the most minute adjustments/tips that I would have never even thought of.

[jak77]

On 3/15/2023 at 12:13 AM, daegyu said:

Which school in CIF did you go to? Glendale High here!

 

On 3/15/2023 at 10:05 PM, LiftingGolfer said:

Monrovia! Rio Hondo League here!

LCHS here. 
 

Pretty crazy to have two PGA tour players from our small school. 

[needfasp3ed]

On 2/10/2023 at 9:07 AM, tomc262 said:

Working on a golf course in HS I was around couple of pros.  One eventually won the Senior British Open and the other won on the mini tours and is still kicking butt in PGA sectional events.  Their level of ball striking was other worldly and it got even better around the greens.  I tell people those guys/gals out on the tours don't play the same game! 🙂

Gene Elliott?