Here's what irks me about golf....

[lowheel]

> @"A.Princey" said:

> All this commotion about a person that none of us knows personally, why so serious???? Who cares what Finau chooses to do, if a recipe for the HOF(which BK is already cemented in btw....) makes players care less about small tour stops, then so be it. There truly is no country for old men....

 

Well said. Tony has completely transformed his game in the last 6 years.His work ethic is great. He has the game to bag major so if he thinks doing this will help him do that power to him.

[LICC]

One issue with lessons is that there are dozens or more ways to swing a club well with dozens of variations and what mix of those works for different people will differ. Different instructors will stress different things and it’s luck of the draw if what a particular instructor teaches works for you or not.

[bladehunter]

> @lowheel said:

> > @physasst said:

> > > @lowheel said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @Ferguson said:

> > > > > > @lowheel said:

> > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I second that AMEN.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Re: I can be a manager!!

> > > > > I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

> > > > >

> > > > > For example: Did I get the promotion?

> > > > > No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > In your case:

> > > > > During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

> > > > > Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

> > > > > Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

> > > >

> > > > Very true. I use that very tactic to shoot down the outrageous goals of perspective clients all the time . I ask their time frame expectations and cost. And then quickly shoot them down. Sounds harsh. But it works. Randomly lose someone here or there. But I’ve found that weeding those out makes a healthier bottom line in the long run. You cannot please everybody and blunt reality is a better practice to live under than unrealistic expectations and the shuck and jive act it takes to appease them.

> > >

> > > Exactly, well said. I recently refunded a student who purchased 6 lessons and after lesson 3 he was simply whining and complaining for 45 minutes about the lack of improvement in his scores after we specifically discussed how unrealistic his goal was in the time frame he wanted. Hes never broken 95 and wanted to break 80 within 30 days.I laughed and told him its not going to happen ( of course prior to him signing up) he laughed and said im kidding but id eventually like to get there. I stone cold told him pick another goal thats attainable in the next 60 days. he said id like to break 100 every single time.i told him thats very doable but there will be outliers until you start hitting the ball more squarely and solidly. After lesson 3 he looks at me and says "im hitting the ball so much better and longer but my scores still suck, why cant you fix that?"

> > > I told him thats golf. We start hitting the ball better in a more consistent/predictable pattern and then we learn to score from there.it takes time. youve only been playing for 6 months and when you came to me you were skulling 2/3rds of your chips and pitches and never getting out of bunkers. he then verbatim said maybe I need another set of eyes who can fix me quicker

> >

> > Exactly, it is frustrating, but that's the game of golf. I went from being decent in my early 20s when I had lots of time to play to being a mid 20s cap. This year, I got tired of sucking, and I took lessons. My ball striking has gotten so, SO much better, but my scoring is still not what I want it to be. Instead of being upset, I know that that is simply the way things go. I might not see the benefits of all of this practice and lessons for a year or two. I would never blame my coach. Down to a 15 cap at the moment, so have dropped almost 10 strokes this season.

>

> thats fantastic and you have a great attitude. Golf IQ and course management costs alot of my students 8-12 shots a round. If youre commited the scores will come down but its a slow process for most. i move alot of my students up 2 sets of tees to put 10 wedges in their hands per round so they learn how to score. their scores drop dramatically and they slowly build confidence. They have 6-7 birdie chances a round and theyve never felt that before, its a different kind of pressure.Youre tricking your mind by giving it so many chances.

> Keep up the great work and enjoy the journey

 

Soooo true. And a great idea to learn to score

 

People don’t realize that one break through leads to another type of pressure. There is no such thing as figuring this game out and playing pressure free. I was just saying this a couple weeks ago. I’ve had putting woes galore. And long story short I’ve found the recipe for a setup and stroke that I can see The line with and now every putt looks like it’s going down. And a lot have. You’d think it would all be roses now. But just after that revelation I had a round with 16 hit greens 4 birdies and an eagle. And somehow that managed to scramble my brain and I also turned in a triple bogey on a hole that has a 70 yard wide fairway and no OB. Then followed it two holes later with a double bogey from blowing a driver OB when I could have easily played long iron 9 iron to a easy pin. My point. Making putts actually pressurized the round. Before I expected to make nothing. So I didn’t blow up when I missed. I just kept plugging along. Turning in good scores with no help from putter. Easy. But you change that and somehow it moves the minds focus and now you have a new hurdle to clear. How to play with a big lead vs chasing.

[bladehunter]

> @LICC said:

> One issue with lessons is that there are dozens or more ways to swing a club well with dozens of variations and what mix of those works for different people will differ. Different instructors will stress different things and it’s luck of the draw if what a particular instructor teaches works for you or not.

 

Agree there. Which is why I just don’t know how people listen to that stuff ?

 

I think you have to find your swing first. I’m just not sure how you’d learn to swing a club from someone else? In thinking back on my own learning of my swing. I had many days of cold shanks , toe only strikes etc. I think the major ingredient is the inability to quit. Like i just don’t process the ability to quit , anything. It becomes an ocd fueled quest for me. Which isn’t a brag. It’s a very bad thing sometimes. And I know that most people are not this way. It just happens to be a positive with golf. This game just isn’t for many to be good at. It’s that maddening. But. You’ll reach a place where the swing itself becomes easy too.

 

I guess my point is , that it’s not instructors fault. It falls back to the player. It’s a combo of aptitude , and drive. Period. People have unrealistic expectations on aptitude , and they lack the drive it takes to even reach the aptitude they have much less the aptitude they think they have.

 

 

[Titleist99]

> @"A.Princey" said:

> All this commotion about a person that none of us knows personally, why so serious???? Who cares what Finau chooses to do, if a recipe for the HOF(which BK is already cemented in btw....) makes players care less about small tour stops, then so be it. There truly is no country for old men....

 

It's not about Tony Finau…… I don't know Finau from a can of paint. It's about having an opinion on this board. Some seems to think that their opinion is the only one that matters and others have no opinion at all they think that they should be the judge as to what is discussed on this golf forum. Others seem to take pride in telling everyone how ridiculous a posters thread is yet some of the more intelligent banter and debate always takes place...… If we could remove those that bring nothing to the conversation this would be a better golf forum.....(IMO)

[braincramp52]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @"A.Princey" said:

> > All this commotion about a person that none of us knows personally, why so serious???? Who cares what Finau chooses to do, if a recipe for the HOF(which BK is already cemented in btw....) makes players care less about small tour stops, then so be it. There truly is no country for old men....

>

> It's not about Tony Finau…… I don't know Finau from a can of paint. It's about having an opinion on this board. Some seems to think that their opinion is the only one that matters and others have no opinion at all they think that they should be the judge as to what is discussed on this golf forum. Others seem to take pride in telling everyone how ridiculous a posters thread is yet some of the more intelligent banter and debate always takes place...… If we could remove those that bring nothing to the conversation this would be a better golf forum.....(IMO)

 

That's just your opinion. ?

[oikos1]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @"A.Princey" said:

> > All this commotion about a person that none of us knows personally, why so serious???? Who cares what Finau chooses to do, if a recipe for the HOF(which BK is already cemented in btw....) makes players care less about small tour stops, then so be it. There truly is no country for old men....

>

> It's not about Tony Finau…… I don't know Finau from a can of paint. It's about having an opinion on this board. Some seems to think that their opinion is the only one that matters and others have no opinion at all they think that they should be the judge as to what is discussed on this golf forum. Others seem to take pride in telling everyone how ridiculous a posters thread is yet some of the more intelligent banter and debate always takes place...… If we could remove those that bring nothing to the conversation this would be a better golf forum.....(IMO)

 

I've never understood why people cry out for censorship in a "public" forum.

[Warrior42111]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @"A.Princey" said:

> > All this commotion about a person that none of us knows personally, why so serious???? Who cares what Finau chooses to do, if a recipe for the HOF(which BK is already cemented in btw....) makes players care less about small tour stops, then so be it. There truly is no country for old men....

>

> It's not about Tony Finau…… I don't know Finau from a can of paint. It's about having an opinion on this board. Some seems to think that their opinion is the only one that matters and others have no opinion at all they think that they should be the judge as to what is discussed on this golf forum. Others seem to take pride in telling everyone how ridiculous a posters thread is yet some of the more intelligent banter and debate always takes place...… If we could remove those that bring nothing to the conversation this would be a better golf forum.....(IMO)

 

This is the internet, welcome to the thunderdome

[ZAP]

I am pretty sure if I was famous and people asked me the same questions over and over I would just be making up obtuse stuff just for fun.

[Titleist99]

> @Warrior42111 said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @"A.Princey" said:

> > > All this commotion about a person that none of us knows personally, why so serious???? Who cares what Finau chooses to do, if a recipe for the HOF(which BK is already cemented in btw....) makes players care less about small tour stops, then so be it. There truly is no country for old men....

> >

> > It's not about Tony Finau…… I don't know Finau from a can of paint. It's about having an opinion on this board. Some seems to think that their opinion is the only one that matters and others have no opinion at all they think that they should be the judge as to what is discussed on this golf forum. Others seem to take pride in telling everyone how ridiculous a posters thread is yet some of the more intelligent banter and debate always takes place...… If we could remove those that bring nothing to the conversation this would be a better golf forum.....(IMO)

>

> This is the internet, welcome to the thunderdome

 

LOL! …..You're right...

[lowheel]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @lowheel said:

> > > @physasst said:

> > > > @lowheel said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @Ferguson said:

> > > > > > > @lowheel said:

> > > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I second that AMEN.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Re: I can be a manager!!

> > > > > > I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > For example: Did I get the promotion?

> > > > > > No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In your case:

> > > > > > During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

> > > > > > Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

> > > > > > Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

> > > > >

> > > > > Very true. I use that very tactic to shoot down the outrageous goals of perspective clients all the time . I ask their time frame expectations and cost. And then quickly shoot them down. Sounds harsh. But it works. Randomly lose someone here or there. But I’ve found that weeding those out makes a healthier bottom line in the long run. You cannot please everybody and blunt reality is a better practice to live under than unrealistic expectations and the shuck and jive act it takes to appease them.

> > > >

> > > > Exactly, well said. I recently refunded a student who purchased 6 lessons and after lesson 3 he was simply whining and complaining for 45 minutes about the lack of improvement in his scores after we specifically discussed how unrealistic his goal was in the time frame he wanted. Hes never broken 95 and wanted to break 80 within 30 days.I laughed and told him its not going to happen ( of course prior to him signing up) he laughed and said im kidding but id eventually like to get there. I stone cold told him pick another goal thats attainable in the next 60 days. he said id like to break 100 every single time.i told him thats very doable but there will be outliers until you start hitting the ball more squarely and solidly. After lesson 3 he looks at me and says "im hitting the ball so much better and longer but my scores still suck, why cant you fix that?"

> > > > I told him thats golf. We start hitting the ball better in a more consistent/predictable pattern and then we learn to score from there.it takes time. youve only been playing for 6 months and when you came to me you were skulling 2/3rds of your chips and pitches and never getting out of bunkers. he then verbatim said maybe I need another set of eyes who can fix me quicker

> > >

> > > Exactly, it is frustrating, but that's the game of golf. I went from being decent in my early 20s when I had lots of time to play to being a mid 20s cap. This year, I got tired of sucking, and I took lessons. My ball striking has gotten so, SO much better, but my scoring is still not what I want it to be. Instead of being upset, I know that that is simply the way things go. I might not see the benefits of all of this practice and lessons for a year or two. I would never blame my coach. Down to a 15 cap at the moment, so have dropped almost 10 strokes this season.

> >

> > thats fantastic and you have a great attitude. Golf IQ and course management costs alot of my students 8-12 shots a round. If youre commited the scores will come down but its a slow process for most. i move alot of my students up 2 sets of tees to put 10 wedges in their hands per round so they learn how to score. their scores drop dramatically and they slowly build confidence. They have 6-7 birdie chances a round and theyve never felt that before, its a different kind of pressure.Youre tricking your mind by giving it so many chances.

> > Keep up the great work and enjoy the journey

>

> Soooo true. And a great idea to learn to score

>

> People don’t realize that one break through leads to another type of pressure. There is no such thing as figuring this game out and playing pressure free. I was just saying this a couple weeks ago. I’ve had putting woes galore. And long story short I’ve found the recipe for a setup and stroke that I can see The line with and now every putt looks like it’s going down. And a lot have. You’d think it would all be roses now. But just after that revelation I had a round with 16 hit greens 4 birdies and an eagle. And somehow that managed to scramble my brain and I also turned in a triple bogey on a hole that has a 70 yard wide fairway and no OB. Then followed it two holes later with a double bogey from blowing a driver OB when I could have easily played long iron 9 iron to a easy pin. My point. Making putts actually pressurized the round. Before I expected to make nothing. So I didn’t blow up when I missed. I just kept plugging along. Turning in good scores with no help from putter. Easy. But you change that and somehow it moves the minds focus and now you have a new hurdle to clear. How to play with a big lead vs chasing.

 

you explained it way better than i could. You have to constantly challenge yourself and feel different pressures.its the only way you get better.How many people shoot 7-8 over on their front 9 then at the turn they literally stop caring and shoot 1 over or par coming in because theres no pressure anymore. you have to feel what its like to bogey 3-4 holes in a row and you have to feel whats its like to par or birdie 3-4 holes in a row. the lower your handicap gets the slower and smaller the gains are so you have to find ways to get an edge on your own tendencies. what you said is the most underrated aspect of getting better, you have to trick your mind and get used to having chances until it becomes routine. Some days youll make more than others but the increased chances will sharpen your focus and skills.

[golfer07840]

Must be the off season already...

[Golf Scientist]

> @LICC said:

> One issue with lessons is that there are dozens or more ways to swing a club well with dozens of variations and what mix of those works for different people will differ. Different instructors will stress different things and it’s luck of the draw if what a particular instructor teaches works for you or not.

 

On an off shoot of that: the _so-called_ scientific analysis of what the majority of pro do in there swings. While there is some good information out there about the positions and movement pro get into the interpretation of what causes those positions, movements, and sequencing is often very flawed concepts. It's also annoying that while there has apparently been many _scientific_ studies done on the full swing there is very little done on other parts of the game like chipping and putting.

 

I agree that there are different ways swings can be made, and that prescribing the same positions and movements for someone who setups and swings like Dustin Johnson and David Duval (very strong grip, lots of body rotation, and lots of side bend) is different from someone who sets up and swings like Justin Rose, Ernie Els, and Nick Faldo (neutral grip, arm swinger, and less side bend).

 

Far too often there are instructors that latch on to whoever is #1 in the world at the time (or who most recently won a tournament), and try to tell all their students to setup and swing like that person acting like that person has the best swing to ever exist in the game, and that their swing is more efficient than any other type of swing that has ever existed or ever will exist.

 

Likewise the media latching on to who ever won, and saying what a great person that individual is even when that person is a %@. Then there is some media that jumps on a person that doesn't win and wants to tell everyone what a _looser_ and _failure_ that person is, and that media sometimes goes on to say that if said looser lived life the way said media person says, or the way the _winner_ did they would be better.

[llewol007]

Easy to get irked about anything in life. I figure if it doesnt affect me directly, it probably doesnt deserve much of my attention. For me, the thing that irks me is that courses are so inconsistent in terms of player expectation that you get things like slow play, damaged greens and other things that are now showing up on a regular basis. You will have ban wagon golfers anyhoo but keep the message consistent for those that love the game enough to show up even when the economy is bad or life is bad and things arent going right. Give me a course that has the simple thing as slow play is not tolerated and Marshals/ambassadors will enforce this during your round. If I see that at check in, I know Im at a course that cares enough for all its patrons.

[Titleist99]

> @llewol007 said:

> Easy to get irked about anything in life. I figure if it doesnt affect me directly, it probably doesnt deserve much of my attention. For me, the thing that irks me is that courses are so inconsistent in terms of player expectation that you get things like slow play, damaged greens and other things that are now showing up on a regular basis. You will have ban wagon golfers anyhoo but keep the message consistent for those that love the game enough to show up even when the economy is bad or life is bad and things arent going right. Give me a course that has the simple thing as slow play is not tolerated and Marshals/ambassadors will enforce this during your round. If I see that at check in, I know Im at a course that cares enough for all its patrons.

 

They should also be more consistent with the beverage carts as well...beautiful cart girls optional (joke) …. but seriously, during some of those long waits on the tee can be tolerated more if beverages were involved ….. IMO

[Krt22]

Tony is 12th in the world, by all means he should have won more than he has already. The pay off for winning (major or otherwise) is far more than a lot of top 10s, so I can understand exactly why he (and others) focus big tournaments and potentially play less overall. Even Tiger has touched on this as the strategy of many players today.

 

As for regulating golf instruction, well that is laughable at best. Yes there are bad teachers, but there are also tons of terrible students. That is like saying every student who pays their college tuition should be given a diploma

[smashdn]

Things that irk me.

 

Underwear bunching up.

Warm season fairway grass and bent greens on the same course. About the time the fairways are nice and full in the spring the greens get stressed. When the greens recover in the fall they get punched and then the fairways go dormant.

Starting on #10 tee.

Soggy approaches.

Fivesomes.

Dollar spot.

Hard to find lead tape these days.

I lose a $4 ball in the gunch, all I ever find are rock flites.

[KRAMER1997]

I wonder what the reaction from the OP would be if Tony said, "I wanna peak at the John Deere Classic every year and I'll set my schedule accordingly. If needed I'll skip the US Open, in order to practice an extra week at TPC Deere Run."

[Titleist99]

> @KRAMER1997 said:

> I wonder what the reaction from the OP would be if Tony said, "I wanna peak at the John Deere Classic every year and I'll set my schedule accordingly. If needed I'll skip the US Open, in order to practice an extra week at TPC Deere Run."

Slightly amused...…. that's the new trend nowadays.....

 

[dlygrisse]

> @Titleist99 said:

> It also irks me when my playing partner is lining up for an eight....

 

It irks me when my playing partner looks 7 minutes for a ball when he only gets 3....then he only helps me for 2 minutes.

[Titleist99]

> @dlygrisse said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > It also irks me when my playing partner is lining up for an eight....

>

> It irks me when my playing partner looks 7 minutes for a ball when he only gets 3....then he only helps me for 2 minutes.

 

LOL! It irks me when I'm playlng at the local Muni and it is packed, nobody is going anywhere......yet the group behind me keeps hitting into my group. (madness ensues) …..LOL!

[Golf Scientist]

> @smashdn said:

> Things that irk me.

>

> Warm season fairway grass and bent greens on the same course. About the time the fairways are nice and full in the spring the greens get stressed. When the greens recover in the fall they get punched and then the fairways go dormant.

 

Does said course then spray paint the dormant grass blue / green (which turns your hands/balls/etc blue/green), say that chemicals just happen to be that color, and then act like the grass is healthy and growing?

 

 

[smashdn]

> @"Golf Scientist" said:

> > @smashdn said:

> > Things that irk me.

> >

> > Warm season fairway grass and bent greens on the same course. About the time the fairways are nice and full in the spring the greens get stressed. When the greens recover in the fall they get punched and then the fairways go dormant.

>

> Does said course then spray paint the dormant grass blue / green (which turns your hands/balls/etc blue/green), say that chemicals just happen to be that color, and then act like the grass is healthy and growing?

>

>

 

Mercifully no. I have actually never played nor seen a course that does that in winter. I know it is a thing though. We just let the grass naturally turn brown here.

 

It is actually nice to play on in the fall until it rains. Once it rains it becomes a soggy muddy mess. The zoysia is especially nice to play on dormant.

[billh17]

Having threads about a pro playing slow is very irking( is that a word?) . How can someone playing slow,while you watch on TV,irk you? We should be irked about irkiness only on Tuesdays.

[billh17]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @lawsonman said:

> > OP, not sure what you expected. Started a thread that only had one way to go. Downwards. You can't tell me you didn't know the responses you'd get when you started it. And then you get defensive about it.

> I have no idea what you're talking about...… It's silly to me that adults think that their opinion is the only one that matter. I post a thread and get childish responds yet you think that I should have foreseen that....I don't get it.

> Please enlighten me....

 

Maybe you should examine your posts/responses,and be honest with yourself.

You may truly find someone who seems to believe his opinion is the only one that matters.

[tiderider]

> @lowheel said:

> > @"A.Princey" said:

> > All this commotion about a person that none of us knows personally, why so serious???? Who cares what Finau chooses to do, if a recipe for the HOF(which BK is already cemented in btw....) makes players care less about small tour stops, then so be it. There truly is no country for old men....

>

> Well said. Tony has completely transformed his game in the last 6 years.His work ethic is great. He has the game to bag major so if he thinks doing this will help him do that power to him.

 

as rolfing talked about this morning, he played conservatively off the tee against fleetwood in france ... bout the only american to do so ... won handily ...

[Titleist99]

> @billh17 said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @lawsonman said:

> > > OP, not sure what you expected. Started a thread that only had one way to go. Downwards. You can't tell me you didn't know the responses you'd get when you started it. And then you get defensive about it.

> > I have no idea what you're talking about...… It's silly to me that adults think that their opinion is the only one that matter. I post a thread and get childish responds yet you think that I should have foreseen that....I don't get it.

> > Please enlighten me....

>

> Maybe you should examine your posts/responses,and be honest with yourself.

> You may truly find someone who seems to believe his opinion is the only one that matters.

 

Self examination is always a priority with me, but I will believe what I believe until someone convinces me otherwise...… that's where the debate part comes in....not childish banner about how "terrible my thread is" If a grownup has something to add to the conversation he or she post something pertaining to the subject, if not they contain themselves from posting something immature and move on.....What part of this do you disagree with?

[braincramp52]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @billh17 said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @lawsonman said:

> > > > OP, not sure what you expected. Started a thread that only had one way to go. Downwards. You can't tell me you didn't know the responses you'd get when you started it. And then you get defensive about it.

> > > I have no idea what you're talking about...… It's silly to me that adults think that their opinion is the only one that matter. I post a thread and get childish responds yet you think that I should have foreseen that....I don't get it.

> > > Please enlighten me....

> >

> > Maybe you should examine your posts/responses,and be honest with yourself.

> > You may truly find someone who seems to believe his opinion is the only one that matters.

>

> Self examination is always a priority with me, but I will believe what I believe until someone convinces me otherwise...… that's where the debate part comes in....not childish banner about how "terrible my thread is" If a grownup has something to add to the conversation he or she post something pertaining to the subject, if not they contain themselves from posting something immature and move on.....What part of this do you disagree with?

 

Bro, if you really think that's gonna happen I have some nice lake front property down in Florida to sell you cheap!! :D Not saying it's right but .....

[Krt22]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @billh17 said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @lawsonman said:

> > > > OP, not sure what you expected. Started a thread that only had one way to go. Downwards. You can't tell me you didn't know the responses you'd get when you started it. And then you get defensive about it.

> > > I have no idea what you're talking about...… It's silly to me that adults think that their opinion is the only one that matter. I post a thread and get childish responds yet you think that I should have foreseen that....I don't get it.

> > > Please enlighten me....

> >

> > Maybe you should examine your posts/responses,and be honest with yourself.

> > You may truly find someone who seems to believe his opinion is the only one that matters.

>

> Self examination is always a priority with me, but I will believe what I believe until someone convinces me otherwise...… that's where the debate part comes in....not childish banner about how "terrible my thread is" If a grownup has something to add to the conversation he or she post something pertaining to the subject, if not they contain themselves from posting something immature and move on.....What part of this do you disagree with?

 

The issue is the dunning-kruger effect is a very real thing.

[Bad9]

I don't know why some even play the game it seems so stressful and ungratifying.