Low spin wedges?

[BallerNate]

I know everyone always talks about the wedges with the highest spin rates, but just wanted to ask you guys if there are any wedges that are designed to be lower spin?

 

I’ve found that I’m a high spin player, and my current RTX Zipcore wedges in 50-54-58 Mid with DG Spinner shafts are spinning too much and launching too high which is causing me to lose a lot of distance with each of those clubs compared to my previous TM Milled Grind’s.

 

Is that something that is mainly addressed with changing shafts, or are there heads that are lower spin?

[justcallmemoses]

Launching high can be bounce and or technique related. Are the lofts and bounces the same to your old set?

[BallerNate]

20 minutes ago, justcallmemoses said:

Launching high can be bounce and or technique related. Are the lofts and bounces the same to your old set?

Absolutely could be for sure. Last season I played 47-52-56-60 in TM MG’s with DG S400 shafts. And this season I’m playing 46-50-54-58 in RTX Zipcores.

 

My MG’s were all Standard Bounce/SB and my Zipcore’s are all Mid Bounce. The MG’s were slightly lower bounce I believe, but the Zipcore’s have the V-sole which is also a big difference.

 

I love the extra spin in the 58* and the control on partial shots is awesome. The problem is more in the 54* and 50* (previously had a 52* Zipcore also with the same issue).

[Mitchell]

DG spinner shaft could be influencing the manner in which you deliver the club, my suggestion would be to test a 50* or 54* zipcore with s400 and then would have a better idea by isolating a variable. 

[BallerNate]

2 minutes ago, Mitchell said:

DG spinner shaft could be influencing the manner in which you deliver the club, my suggestion would be to test a 50* or 54* zipcore with s400 and then would have a better idea by isolating a variable. 

Yeah, I was thinking that too. I should’ve added that I ordered my 50* Zipcore directly from Cleveland with a DG S400 shaft. Thought there was something wrong with the specs though because I’ve been having a lot of difficulty hitting it, but got it checked out at the shop today and they said the loft, lie angle, and length were all to the specs that I ordered (+1.5” long, 2* upright, and 50* of loft).

 

I’m 6’7 and have to get all my clubs customized. I am also a sweeper who leaves minimal divots and am a high spin player.

[Golfrnut]

Lot easier to learn how to take spin off and not try to hit full shots than to need spin and not have it. 

[Mitchell]

Could very well be a technique issue as well that could be exacerbated by shaft choice, how often due you hit “fullish” shots with the clubs that are causing concern?

[goje22]

Throw in a modus 130X or 125X and that would likely not happen. Keep in mind the shaft you play is fighting against your overspin and not helping it. 
 

with that being said, I am a super high spin player and instead of worrying about it I work super hard on trajectory/spin control (shaft and lofts are optimized). There are days and conditions where that spin will be the envy of everyone else and lead to way more close approaches. 
 

fairways/greens brotha man!

[goje22]

34 minutes ago, Golfrnut said:

Lot easier to learn how to take spin off and not try to hit full shots than to need spin and not have it. 

Fantastic answer! 

[phizzy30]

DG Spinners spin the ball like crazy.  Tried them and hated them.  Same thing for KBS Hi-Rev.  I find that the lower launching and spinning shafts work best for me in irons but especially in wedges.  I have the the KBS 610 in my 54* which is considered lower launching and spinning.  Perfect for me.  I have the KBS Tour in my 58* on purpose because with that wedge I want to launch it higher and have it spin more on greens where the pin is tucked. 

[ChipNRun]

1 hour ago, BallerNate said:

 

I’ve found that I’m a high spin player, and my current RTX Zipcore wedges in 50-54-58 Mid with DG Spinner shafts are spinning too much and launching too high...

 The RTX wedge page shows DG S400 as stock shaft. Did you order with DG Spinner, or did you swap out after purchase?

 

 

Note that the Spinner wedge shaft has a bit of history surrounding it. In the early 2000s, a company called Royal Precision was producing golf shafts and inventing ways to measure shaft dynamics. Dr. Joseph Braley and son Kim Braley - now mainstay of KBS shafts - handled shaft design, which included the original Project X and Rifle shafts. Rifle also contained a Spinner wedge shaft, designed to give more spin on partial shots.

 

In 2006, True Temper bought Royal Precision. A look at The GolfWorks components catalogs shows the progression of the Spinner line. 2010 shows the Rifle Spinner with a distinctive Blue and White label. By 2012, it's the DG Spinner with a 3" flex joint just below the grip. It promises lower launch and higher spin than the standard DG.

 

But, 2019 is the last GolfWorks catalog mention of Spinner shafts. Spinner is now absent from both the True Temper site and GolfWorks online inventory.

----------------------------

I would suggest both a tune-up lesson and a fitting for new shafts. Lesson focus: Your move into impact could be a problem if you're ballooning low-launch shafts.

 

The Spinner Wedge was 124 grams, and the Wedge+ was 131 grams (SW and LW). But it had medium bend point and a somewhat flexible tip.

 

Did you have the 124-gram spinner in all three? I would suggest you need new shafts on your wedges. Something a bit heavier, and a firmer tip. A fitting would help.

[BallerNate]

1 hour ago, Mitchell said:

Could very well be a technique issue as well that could be exacerbated by shaft choice, how often due you hit “fullish” shots with the clubs that are causing concern?

It absolutely could be a technique issue for sure. I’d say I use the 50* as a full swing club 100% of the time, the 54* around 50%, and the 58* 0%.

[BallerNate]

1 hour ago, goje22 said:

Throw in a modus 130X or 125X and that would likely not happen. Keep in mind the shaft you play is fighting against your overspin and not helping it. 
 

with that being said, I am a super high spin player and instead of worrying about it I work super hard on trajectory/spin control (shaft and lofts are optimized). There are days and conditions where that spin will be the envy of everyone else and lead to way more close approaches. 
 

fairways/greens brotha man!

 

Yeah, I’ve got Modus Tour 120’s in my irons and like them a lot for sure.

 

Trajectory and spin control is definitely a work in progress for me. Making progress little by little.

Edited June 12, 2021 by BallerNate

[JeffreySpicoli]

Could be a steep swing.

[BallerNate]

1 hour ago, phizzy30 said:

DG Spinners spin the ball like crazy.  Tried them and hated them.  Same thing for KBS Hi-Rev.  I find that the lower launching and spinning shafts work best for me in irons but especially in wedges.  I have the the KBS 610 in my 54* which is considered lower launching and spinning.  Perfect for me.  I have the KBS Tour in my 58* on purpose because with that wedge I want to launch it higher and have it spin more on greens where the pin is tucked. 

 

1 hour ago, ChipNRun said:

 The RTX wedge page shows DG S400 as stock shaft. Did you order with DG Spinner, or did you swap out after purchase?

 

 

Note that the Spinner wedge shaft has a bit of history surrounding it. In the early 2000s, a company called Royal Precision was producing golf shafts and inventing ways to measure shaft dynamics. Dr. Joseph Braley and son Kim Braley - now mainstay of KBS shafts - handled shaft design, which included the original Project X and Rifle shafts. Rifle also contained a Spinner wedge shaft, designed to give more spin on partial shots.

 

In 2006, True Temper bought Royal Precision. A look at The GolfWorks components catalogs shows the progression of the Spinner line. 2010 shows the Rifle Spinner with a distinctive Blue and White label. By 2012, it's the DG Spinner with a 3" flex joint just below the grip. It promises lower launch and higher spin than the standard DG.

 

But, 2019 is the last GolfWorks catalog mention of Spinner shafts. Spinner is now absent from both the True Temper site and GolfWorks online inventory.

----------------------------

I would suggest both a tune-up lesson and a fitting for new shafts. Lesson focus: Your move into impact could be a problem if you're ballooning low-launch shafts.

 

The Spinner Wedge was 124 grams, and the Wedge+ was 131 grams (SW and LW). But it had medium bend point and a somewhat flexible tip.

 

Did you have the 124-gram spinner in all three? I would suggest you need new shafts on your wedges. Something a bit heavier, and a firmer tip. A fitting would help.

I bought 52*, 54*, and 58* Mid Zipcore’s from Golf Town here in Canada, and the DG Spinner was the stock shaft in all of them.

 

Once I tried out those shafts and saw how much they were spinning and how high they were launching, I put in a custom order through Cleveland to get the 50* with a DG S400 shaft to decrease spin, lower launch, and increase distance.

 

For some reason I’ve been struggling with the 50* badly and brought it in to the shop today to see if there were any errors made in the assembly. All my wedges are bent upright by 2* and are +1.5” long.

 

I did a fitting in March, but only for irons, mostly to get the right specs for my clubs and best shafts.

 

The shafts I’ve had the most success with in the past were the Project X 6.0 Rifle, and the fitter recommended Project X LS shafts.  Tried placing an order with Srixon for ZX5’s with PX LS shafts, but they were back ordered until approximately August.
 

Do you guys usually get the same shafts in your wedges as in your irons?

Edited June 12, 2021 by BallerNate

[BallerNate]

8 minutes ago, JeffreySpicoli said:

Could be a steep swing.

Yeah, I’m 6’7 and have gone to all my irons and wedges being bent 2* upright, so naturally I have a very steep swing.

[Thayneil]

4 hours ago, Mitchell said:

DG spinner shaft could be influencing the manner in which you deliver the club, my suggestion would be to test a 50* or 54* zipcore with s400 and then would have a better idea by isolating a variable. 

The DG  Spinner is a soft stepped S200  not like the old spinner shafts

 

i would think neglible influence on spin etc

[Kale_m]

Old worn out ones. Those are the lowest spinning ones 

[BallerNate]

22 minutes ago, Kale_m said:

Old worn out ones. Those are the lowest spinning ones 

Yeah, I figured it was a long shot since I’ve only heard everyone in golf talking about the highest spinning wedges and finding new ways to create more spin. 
 

Sounds like the only thing I could do is get different shafts/other wedges with different shafts, or work on techniques to decrease spin and loft.

[ChipNRun]

13 hours ago, BallerNate said:

Do you guys usually get the same shafts in your wedges as in your irons?

 

At a 2016 golf expo I got some quality time with the then-Vokey marketing director. Shaft advice he heard from Vokey shop:

 

Unless you get unusual benefit from a particular wedge flex shaft, stay fairly close to your irons. Default wedge shaft-up (you'll see this a lot in various threads):

• Mainly full-shot clubs (usually PW and GW): match to your iron shafts
• Mainly partial shot clubs (usually SW and LW): go with softstepped iron shafts, maybe one weight heavier than iron shafts

@BallerNate, you would definitely benefit from a special wedge fitting. Since you are in Canada, any chance you could visit Ian and Matt at TXG in Ontario?

[BallerNate]

41 minutes ago, ChipNRun said:

 

At a 2016 golf expo I got some quality time with the then-Vokey marketing director. Shaft advice he heard from Vokey shop:

 

Unless you get unusual benefit from a particular wedge flex shaft, stay fairly close to your irons. Default wedge shaft-up (you'll see this a lot in various threads):

• Mainly full-shot clubs (usually PW and GW): match to your iron shafts
• Mainly partial shot clubs (usually SW and LW): go with softstepped iron shafts, maybe one weight heavier than iron shafts

@BallerNate, you would definitely benefit from a special wedge fitting. Since you are in Canada, any chance you could visit Ian and Matt at TXG in Ontario?

Yeah, that makes sense for sure. That’s why I ordered my 50* with a DG S400…I thought that would be the closest profile to the Modus Tour 120 that I have in 4-PW, in a DG shaft, and my 54* and 58* both have the DG Spinner.

 

Just went to the Driving Range and focused on some technical aspects of my swing and de-lofting and decreasing spin, and got good results.

 

I live 45 mins North of Toronto and did a fitting in March with Modern Golf. Was on a waiting list with TXG, but they are way behind on their waiting list because of Lockdowns/Stay at Home orders here in Ontario.

 

Honestly though, the DG Spinner shaft is kind of growing on me in the 54* and 58*, and I prefer the feel and control I have in those to the 50* w/ S400 shaft. Could end up just dropping the 50* and going PW-54-58 since I can hit a wider range of shots with my PW and 54*, and I would prefer carrying less clubs (or picking up another 52*). We’ll see.

Edited June 12, 2021 by BallerNate

[Jc0]

14 hours ago, BallerNate said:

Yeah, I’m 6’7 and have gone to all my irons and wedges being bent 2* upright, so naturally I have a very steep swing.

I would go to soft stepped X100. Sounds like I have a similar swing/specs to you and I struggled heavily with S400. The ball just did not want to stay low and would always shoot up. Going to X100 solved in for me.

[BallerNate]

6 minutes ago, Jc0 said:

I would go to soft stepped X100. Sounds like I have a similar swing/specs to you and I struggled heavily with S400. The ball just did not want to stay low and would always shoot up. Going to X100 solved in for me.

Yeah, not a fan of the S400 in the Zipcore for sure. Will probably drop the 50* and just go PW-54-58 or PW-52-58, or look at the options for re-shafting the 50*. Not sure it’s worth the trouble though since I’d prefer to drop a club anyway for carrying purposes.

[pinhigh27]

Sounds like a swing issue 

[BallerNate]

Thanks very much for the advice and insight everyone…I learned a lot from it and appreciate all your time.

 

I think you’re all right that it’s mostly a technical swing issue that I’m dealing with, and partly a shaft issue as well.

 

I’m going to keep working on de-lofting and controlling spin on full swings, and will either replace the shaft in my 50* wedge, or drop it completely and roll with 3 wedges.

[Pepperturbo]

I, too, am a high spin player.  Most of my spin comes from how hard I hit the ball.  The problem many people have is they don't hit the ball hard enough to create a lot of spin.  Even at 70yrs old, I can still make the ball dance and spin back, off some greens.  Further, reason I don't use wedge shafts designed to add spin, maybe have soft tips.  Those are for people that need help creating spin. 

 

If lower spin is desired I adjust my mechanics, and or how hard I hit the ball, maybe use a knock down shot, or chose a different club.  My wedge shafts are designed with stiff tips, so spin is kept within reason.

Edited June 12, 2021 by Pepperturbo

[Yoshifan151]

I'd say look into the ball you play too, I went from Tour B XS to Tour B X because my gap wedge was spinning shots back off the green, and now I don't have to worry about that but I still have plenty of check around the green. But since you mention height being way too high for your liking then I think the shaft is the main culprit. Just another thing to consider though.

[Jc0]

1 hour ago, BallerNate said:

Thanks very much for the advice and insight everyone…I learned a lot from it and appreciate all your time.

 

I think you’re all right that it’s mostly a technical swing issue that I’m dealing with, and partly a shaft issue as well.

 

I’m going to keep working on de-lofting and controlling spin on full swings, and will either replace the shaft in my 50* wedge, or drop it completely and roll with 3 wedges.

 

Don't. Play what's comfortable. I have played everything from +.5 to +2 due to back issue. As the clubs get longer it gets harder to knock them down just due to the extra length. With long clubs it takes even more delofting of the face to get the same amount as a shorter club due to the extra length (I can explain this if not clear). For example I played with someone else clubs last week who had standard length clubs with softer than my normal shafts and could easily knock everything down. Went out today with my clubs at +1.5 (choked down to +1) and with the exact same swing the ball just shot up in air. People will tell you to work on your swing, but when you get too far away from standard clubs just start acting differently because you can't physically manipulate them like shorter ones.

 

For spin issues learn to hit shots 10-15 yards short of full distance. I very rarely ever hit my wedges full distance. 

[BallerNate]

1 hour ago, Pepperturbo said:

I, too, am a high spin player.  Most of my spin comes from how hard I hit the ball.  The problem many people have is they don't hit the ball hard enough to create a lot of spin.  Even at 70yrs old, I can still make the ball dance and spin back, off some greens.  Further, reason I don't use wedge shafts designed to add spin, maybe have soft tips.  Those are for people that need help creating spin. 

 

If lower spin is desired I adjust my mechanics, and or how hard I hit the ball, maybe use a knock down shot, or chose a different club.  My wedge shafts are designed with stiff tips, so spin is kept within reason.

Yeah, I have a tendency to over swing for sure. That’s my default and it’s something I have to reel in and work at consistently.

 

You’re right, a partial shot with a lower lofted club is usually the better option than trying to full swing out of your socks, which I try and do too often.

[BallerNate]

10 minutes ago, Jc0 said:

 

Don't. Play what's comfortable. I have played everything from +.5 to +2 due to back issue. As the clubs get longer it gets harder to knock them down just due to the extra length. With long clubs it takes even more delofting of the face to get the same amount as a shorter club due to the extra length (I can explain this if not clear). For example I played with someone else clubs last week who had standard length clubs with softer than my normal shafts and could easily knock everything down. Went out today with my clubs at +1.5 (choked down to +1) and with the exact same swing the ball just shot up in air. People will tell you to work on your swing, but when you get too far away from standard clubs just start acting differently because you can't physically manipulate them like shorter ones.

 

For spin issues learn to hit shots 10-15 yards short of full distance. I very rarely ever hit my wedges full distance. 

Are you saying don’t drop the 50* or don’t adjust my swing?

 

You’re 100% right though, huge difference with standard clubs, +0.50”, +75”, +1”, and +1.5”. I’ve played clubs at all those lengths since I didn’t get a fitting until this year.