Ball that spins more off the irons but not the driver

[meh]

Love everything about the t150 but spin them too low. Like 4500 for a seven iron. This is with the lz 6.0 shaft. What iron shaft will help and what ball change will add spin but not too much to the driver?

[Honman]

2 minutes ago, meh said:

Love everything about the t150 but spin them too low. Like 4500 for a seven iron. This is with the lz 6.0 shaft. What iron shaft will help and what ball change will add spin but not too much to the driver?

What ball are you using at the moment?

[meh]

Prov1x

[Golfinfloridaafter40]

15 minutes ago, meh said:

Love everything about the t150 but spin them too low. Like 4500 for a seven iron. This is with the lz 6.0 shaft. What iron shaft will help and what ball change will add spin but not too much to the driver?

A few months back the Titleist rep came to our club to do ball fittings and give away samples.  I had a long conversation with her after the fitting because she said something that surprised me.  She said that the 2023 ProV1, ProV1x, left-, and AVX all performed so well with greenside spin and were so low with driver spin that they mainly only fit people to iron spin anymore.  She did mention that some players refuse to play the spinnier ball because they are firmer now, where they used to be softer.  The firmer ball also goes farther for most players which makes sense so long as you have the speed to compress it. 

 

If your spin is really that low, you need to install Axiom's to add spin and possibly to weaken the lofts. No ball is going to add 2500 rpm.

[Yuck]

Higher spin irons?

[mizuno player]

Bend the loft weaker will add "some" spin. Did you hit the T100? 

 

How did you determine the spin? Is it accurate? What type of monitor did you use? If you hit off a mat I believe that gives lower numbers against hitting off grass. 

 

I'm not an expert in launch monitors.. spin numbers might not be accurate of the proper balls aren't used or you don't have stickers on the club head.. maybe someone more knowledgeable on the type of monitor you used can chime in. 

[Go_Blue!]

I have the exact same build of irons, and my 7i is around 6000 with pro V1X. What I love about the shaft is the flight produced. Landing angle is awesome, which helps stop the ball more so than spin. 

Edited March 27 by Go_Blue!

[Denny100]

Bridgestone BX is a good all round ball in terms of good iron spin but low spin off driver.

 

I think its possible to achieve what you want given different shots activate different parts of the ball, but because i dont switch balls i cant really advise further

[MongoSmash]

Kirkland ball

[MattM97]

What's your delivery like with the iron? 

[JoeFrigo]

Bridgestone Tour B XS or Mizuno RB Tour X are two of the more spinny balls ive seen on irons

 

Also you may want to weaken your lofts and the head itself produces lower spin. I have the new mizuno pro 243's weakened 1* and the 7i still is about 700 rpm's lower than my cobra cb/mb set.

[grochol17]

1 hour ago, mizuno player said:

Bend the loft weaker will add "some" spin. Did you hit the T100? 

 

How did you determine the spin? Is it accurate? What type of monitor did you use? If you hit off a mat I believe that gives lower numbers against hitting off grass. 

 

I'm not an expert in launch monitors.. spin numbers might not be accurate of the proper balls aren't used or you don't have stickers on the club head.. maybe someone more knowledgeable on the type of monitor you used can chime in. 

 

@meh - before changing balls or adjusting your irons or swing, this is an important thing to consider.  If you're hitting indoors off of a mat, your spin will be lower than off of grass and, depending on the LM you were using, the spin numbers might not be that accurate anyway.

 

If you don't have an outdoor monitor to use, there's an easy way to figure out if your spin is ok for you.  When you're playing on a normal conditions day (that is, greens not too hard or soft), what happens when your 7i lands on the green?  If it is bounding off of the back, then your spin and landing angle combo are too low.  If is it doing what you want it to, then your spin and landing angle combo is just fine.  And, as you can guess, if it is spinning back off the front, then your spin and landing angle combo is too high.  This is a case where chasing numbers could be really bad, so worry about on course performance and adjust from there.

 

As for changing balls, the V1x is on the high end of the iron spin spectrum, so there's not really anywhere to go from there.  If you really do need to increase spin, you're going to need to look at your irons or your swing.

Edited March 27 by grochol17

[Stuart_G]

11 minutes ago, grochol17 said:

 

@meh - before changing balls or adjusting your irons or swing, this is an important thing to consider.  If you're hitting indoors off of a mat, your spin will be lower than off of grass

 

Bingo!

 

4500 for a 7i is either almost always  1) hitting off of mat or 2) really low club head speed 

(assuming face impact location is not so bad that it's obvious to the player)

 

A ball change isn't going to help in either case.

 

Try teeing it up a small amount instead of hitting directly off the mat.

[Jayjay_theweim_guy]

7 minutes ago, Stuart_G said:

Try teeing it up a small amount instead of hitting directly off the mat.

I keep meaning to (after reading posts like yours) and then forgeting to actually do this.

 

Maybe it'll stick this time?  As I recall, it doesn't make much of a tee to make a difference, right?  Maybe 1/8" tall?

 

What sort of tees are people using?

[aramirez24]

7 minutes ago, Jayjay_theweim_guy said:

I keep meaning to (after reading posts like yours) and then forgeting to actually do this.

 

Maybe it'll stick this time?  As I recall, it doesn't make much of a tee to make a difference, right?  Maybe 1/8" tall?

 

What sort of tees are people using?

I'll put the ball on top of a plastic bottle cap (the thin ones, not the big dasani like cap) in my sim if I want to simulate a short tee in my sim. 

[Wardonation]

Loft = Spin... 

[tatertot]

How does the ball know what club it's being hit with?

[Stuart_G]

32 minutes ago, Jayjay_theweim_guy said:

What sort of tees are people using?

 

https://www.sennagolftee.com/

 

But I have to admit, I've never actually tested them with an LM to see how they effect the numbers.   I've used them at the local outdoor range hard mats but not a lot since they usually get hit out onto the range with the ball.   Indoors with my LM, I use a fiberbuilt mat - which doesn't effect the spin as much and isn't actually sturdy enough surface to use that particular tee.

[Stoc]

42 minutes ago, Jayjay_theweim_guy said:

What sort of tees are people using?

another option, currently use and they work how you expect. I like that there are different heights. 

 

https://www.amazon.com/BirTee-Golf-Tees-Durability-Simulator/dp/B078KD7Q8J/ref=sr_1_5?crid=PA0FT3XKPP9Z&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.DpZrnsfJduxbrT_gtFaN8ysijTFCxrAW_uXx0DJ7VPDhbgl4SK8GNPY_pyKHawjVI8jy5eiusp2PARVMWva0LjIJYSVMO3KlMZe_QcLSVzxHmjIR3MZsElCJ_yKSx_tVA1AssZH5FyfHb3QzsG_d3QIGingVPdNOekVyMP-JYVdLY7CZLmXFsc4ge3fY7jEX8CeedDZNdRdKlDTgDFG70HGYEuRbBphXQjiSXGIZMW8z-xlC6O_zM6duaMZbTcZQaCCQmi5RhwRyDuEKO9sfjKa3el7rQOcNVgtwRjhM6HE.LWqRCtSjsaAoAjxwKCmDmF5yYoFVr3sEGOaaVZpk6fA&dib_tag=se&keywords=golf%2Btees%2Bindoor&qid=1711550863&sprefix=golf%2Btees%2Bindoor%2Caps%2C134&sr=8-5&th=1

[ewood39]

4 hours ago, Go_Blue! said:

I have the exact same build of irons, and my 7i is around 6000 with pro V1X. What I love about the shaft is the flight produced. Landing angle is awesome, which helps stop the ball more so than spin. 

Same here, I spin the 7 between 5900-6100 

[meh]

5 hours ago, Go_Blue! said:

I have the exact same build of irons, and my 7i is around 6000 with pro V1X. What I love about the shaft is the flight produced. Landing angle is awesome, which helps stop the ball more so than spin. 

I'd agree with this but it's windy where I play so downwind the lack of spin means the ball doesn't stay in the air. I don't have reason to doubt the sim, the other.players I've seen use it don't have the issues I have. 

[Albatross85]

Bstone Tour B XS spin high with wedges and 2200 for me with driver. I played the T100s a couple years ago and they are very low spin heads - i even had mine bent 2* weak and they still spun pretty low. You might look into a different shaft as i dont think the ball alone will get you into the spin window you want. 6k for a 7 iron is about the lowest you want to go and be playable. Alot of the pros are spinning it the same number as the iron. 7k for 7 iron etc. 

[meh]

4 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Bingo!

 

4500 for a 7i is either almost always  1) hitting off of mat or 2) really low club head speed 

(assuming face impact location is not so bad that it's obvious to the player)

 

A ball change isn't going to help in either case.

 

Try teeing it up a small amount instead of hitting directly off the mat.

Thanks, it isn't really low but it's not high (sadly)

[Stuart_G]

46 minutes ago, meh said:

Thanks, it isn't really low but it's not high (sadly)

 

A VERY rough estimate for spin you should expect for your swing speed for clubs with loft lower than about 45* (doesn't include wedges) is:

 

160 * club head speed (mph) * sin(loft)  - where loft is actually the spin loft - not he static loft.

Edited March 27 by Stuart_G

[phizzy30]

Chrome Tour X.  It's my gamer for the year.  It's low spin off driver but gets plenty of spin with irons. 

[ThunderBuzzworth]

I’ve had multiple reliable sources tell me the Srixon Z Star Diamond fits this description 

[SwooshLT]

2024 TP5 ......

[davbrucas]

On 3/27/2024 at 4:44 AM, Honman said:

What ball are you using at the moment?

It’s the shaft in that head along with a slower swing speed. You’re probably not compressing the ball much either. Use the AVX. Best ball for average/slightly above average swing speeds imo. I’m a sweeper and don’t spin my irons much but my ‘23 p790 7i spins around 6000rpm. I use the AVX. 
 

Changing that LZ shaft to something softer will help as well. 

[Stuart_G]

7 hours ago, davbrucas said:

You’re probably not compressing the ball much either.

 

That's a a bit outdated.   I thought people had learned by now how meaningless that expression really is.

[North Butte]

55 minutes ago, Stuart_G said:

 

That's a a bit outdated.   I thought people had learned by now how meaningless that expression really is.

I think the "you aren't compressing the ball" was one of those magical memes that will never die. It's a confluence of misguided golf swing instruction going back many decades plus a "feeling" (actually sound) that many people experience when they strike a golf ball plus a very cunningly devised marketing campaign capitalizing on those two misconceptions. 

 

When I first started playing golf three decades ago, I can't count how many times I heard described or even saw "instructional" articles with drawings depicting the ball being compressing against the ground by a golf club at impact. Even though as far back and Cochran and Stobbs 30 years earlier high speed photography had shown the actual dynamics of club-ball contact, there were entire swing teaching philosophies built around trying to get golfers to "compress the ball". 

 

Not long after that, companies like Maxfli and Wilson stumbled on the way that millions of golfers have a Pavlovian response to a certain pitch of impact sound. Somehow or another that "soft" sound at impact got mingled with the idea of needing to compress the ball and modern golf-ball marketing was born!

 

Bridgestone then fine tuned that strategy by sending reps around the country preaching "the right ball for every swing speed", using a launch monitor as a selling tool to seal the deal. After 15+ years of that, there's no putting that meme to death. It's a permanent part of our collective golf unconscious.