What is with the Hating on the USGA?

[Ashley Schaeffer]

15th - IF the new regulations come out that call for a rollback of 20-25% of ALL golf balls across the board, would you support that? You keep talking about this mythical ball that wont effect slower swing speeds, but some of us know that's not really feasible. So, if anything is done, it will effect everyone from the recreational senior to the full ranks of elite golfers and everyone in between. Do you support that?

 

Good question. If the USGA rolls it back, at least my buddy, 70-year-old Gene, will be properly "scaled" when he plays Seminole, or Cypress Point, or Pine Valley, or whatever other classic course he will never play.

[gioguy21]

leave the ball alone. as i've said before, par is only reference for a given hole to what someone should shoot*, not what they HAVE to shoot. the fact pros go crazy low is of no consequence to us as amateur golfers, golf courses they don't play on, or anyone else.

 

*the usage of 'someone' in this instance is arbitrary - typically, course design is such that courses have a certain number of par 3s, 4s, and 5s, that depending on rating, will play easier or harder than others. consider par as more of a 'mean' or average and you're thinking the right way.

[Shilgy]

15th - IF the new regulations come out that call for a rollback of 20-25% of ALL golf balls across the board, would you support that? You keep talking about this mythical ball that wont effect slower swing speeds, but some of us know that's not really feasible. So, if anything is done, it will effect everyone from the recreational senior to the full ranks of elite golfers and everyone in between. Do you support that?

There certainly are quite a few recreational players that never hit the ball squarely and never compress the ball that would be affected less than 20%. That said there are many recreational players that do hit the ball solidly and would lose at least 10-15% under a 20% ball roll back I would think. Those that hit the ball solidly at 90-105 mph would possibly lose less than 20%.

 

That said, why? Why should most of believe that it is for the "good of the game" for us to learn a new game? To purchase new clubs to fit our changing gaps? To change how we play around the greens? Why should ALL of the ball manufacturers go to the expense of making a new ball? 15 claims Titleist has so much to lose because they are currently the most successful. Even if the rollback is enacted andTitleist maintains their position as #1 they still would have incurred unnecessary expenses in making a new ball. Will the USGA pay for this? And for all of this to what end? "Protecting" the integrity and relevance and ego of a handful of century old courses?

[Sean2]

Another gem is you are no longer allowed to post a score if you are a soloist.

 

I would hazard a guess here that those folks you are playing with have absolutely no idea what you shot for 18 holes. It's not like they are keeping track of every shot, every drop, every whatever.

[BlackDiamondPar5]

Another gem is you are no longer allowed to post a score if you are a soloist.

 

I would hazard a guess here that those folks you are playing with have absolutely no idea what you shot for 18 holes. It's not like they are keeping track of every shot, every drop, every whatever.

Well Sean, that was in preparation for the world handicap system that they said 76% of us wanted. That's 76% of 0.5% that responded to their email survey that went out once... And no one kid yourself, that's exactly the way they wanted it.

[buckeyefl]

The number of holes USGA chooses from year to year for its playoff format has nothing to do with the Rules of Golf. The Rules of golf would let them make it 18 holes or 72 holes or one-hole or two-hole sudden death or three-hole aggregate or determine the winner with a scorecard countback.

 

So if a player is unfamiliar with the playoff format (which I guess is separate from any rules), and plays his way into a Monday 18 hole playoff, but can't be present because of prior engagements (a stretch, I know), is that the USGA's fault as well? Is asking these "professionals" to be well informed in their field really asking too much of them?

Are you worried they will make unbreakable dinner plans and miss the playoff? Spieth stated he thought it was the traditional 18 hole Monday playoff. So it is not the rules he does not understand as you state it is the as yet never used US Open playoff format. I really doubt that come Sunday any player in contention would not be aware of the format.

I guess I was out of line expecting these professionals to understand all of the details of their profession. My apologies. Tier 1 professionals know every detail of their job, I guess all these guys need to do is hit the ball better than the next guy. I bet they know when/where the after party is though.

 

You should have taken the free advice.

Actually, that is all they need to know and do.

[Sean2]

Another gem is you are no longer allowed to post a score if you are a soloist.

 

I would hazard a guess here that those folks you are playing with have absolutely no idea what you shot for 18 holes. It's not like they are keeping track of every shot, every drop, every whatever.

Well Sean, that was in preparation for the world handicap system that they said 76% of us wanted. That's 76% of 0.5% that responded to their email survey that went out once... And no one kid yourself, that's exactly the way they wanted it.

 

I agree! The USGA solicited responses on rolling the ball back...and I sent in my opinion, but I was also thinking that what I have to say will make absolutely no difference as they will do what they want to do regardless. They solicit feedback as a sop to the hoi polloi, but I doubt if any of that feedback will have any bearing on their decision.

[rangersgoalie]

Just saw this, linked at Geoff Shackelford's website; from his Golfweek article from pre-Open press conferences comes the news that before Tuesday, neither Jordan Spieth* nor Justin Thomas** knew about the new USGA playoff format. Which was not only announced to considerable fanfare and discussion in February, but also was actually used, in the US Women's Open just two weeks ago at Shoal Creek.

 

Honestly, it's no big deal if the two young players didn't know about it. What could they do, to change it or specially prepare for their competition this week? Nothing, really.

 

But in the context of commenters suggesting that we really need to ask current Tour players about things like a ball rollback, or course setups, it is a noteworthy bit of cluelessness about their sport. They are both great players, and fun to watch. And often, fun to listen to. But being a great player doesn't make you wise about the administration of the game of golf.

 

 

*Titleist brand ambassador; not that there's anything wrong with that.

**Titleist brand ambassador; not that there's anything wrong with that.

 

May surprise you, but tour players worry more than about the US Open. And the amount of crap that is sent to players in emails etc could easily miss this change. As mentioned by you, the playoff format has little effect on tournament preparation other than travel, and travel is a non issue for top players these days. I understand more of your Shackelford fan stuff now, he hates Titleist and has a grudge against tour pros. I always assumed it was because he was never good enough to play at a high enough level, but after watching this thread, it is likely far different

 

But as has been mentioned by others, your obsession with Titleist throughout the thread. I am not a Titleist fan due to personal issues, but I think it's comical that you're this upset that a company that has done the work they have done, researched and marketed their products, and even the leader in golf ball sales is your focus, when they have developed all of this within the rules of the USGA. Now some want them punished due to succeeding within those parameters, but that seems more the way many things are going these days.

 

I guess the USGA is inept in equipment rules then? Yes, it's sarcasm.

[DFS PFD]

What does everyone actually want from USGA? What kind of progress do you want to see? Clearly not any changes, so just sit back idly and let manufactures and players run rampant?

[Darth Putter]

Just saw this, linked at Geoff Shackelford's website; from his Golfweek article from pre-Open press conferences comes the news that before Tuesday, neither Jordan Spieth* nor Justin Thomas** knew about the new USGA playoff format. Which was not only announced to considerable fanfare and discussion in February, but also was actually used, in the US Women's Open just two weeks ago at Shoal Creek.

 

Honestly, it's no big deal if the two young players didn't know about it. What could they do, to change it or specially prepare for their competition this week? Nothing, really.

 

But in the context of commenters suggesting that we really need to ask current Tour players about things like a ball rollback, or course setups, it is a noteworthy bit of cluelessness about their sport. They are both great players, and fun to watch. And often, fun to listen to. But being a great player doesn't make you wise about the administration of the game of golf.

 

 

*Titleist brand ambassador; not that there's anything wrong with that.

**Titleist brand ambassador; not that there's anything wrong with that.

 

They are also both members of the PGA Tour Player Advisory Council. Jordan was elected the chairman this past February.

 

The full board and directors

 

2018 Player Advisory Council

Daniel Berger

Paul Casey

Stewart Cink

Chesson Hadley

James Hahn

Billy Hurley III

Zach Johnson

Matt Kuchar

Anirban Lahiri

Geoff Ogilvy

Sam Saunders

Jordan Spieth

Chris Stroud

Justin Thomas (fancy seeing you here Justin)

Kyle Thompson

Cameron Tringale

 

2018 Player Directors

Charley Hoffman (2017-19)

Davis Love III (2016-2018) Jordan will be replacing Davis Love III in this spot with a position on the PGA Tour policy board for the next three years

Kevin Streelman (2017-19)

Johnson Wagner (2018-2020)

 

 

If the USGA wants to tall ball rollback, they WILL be speaking to Mr. Spieth.

[15th Club]

Jack Nicklaus v. Jordan Speith and Justin Thomas on wisdom in the administration of golf?

 

!?

 

big red, I've seen a lot of dumb and combative posts from you in these threads, but none moreso than your trashtalking Jack Nicklaus.

 

Nicklaus won more than Spieth or Thomas have at their current ages. He won more than I dare say either one ever will. He's operated what is perhaps the most prestigious Tour event short of a major, for more than 40 years. Designed more golf courses than anyone of his era. More Tour-used courses than anyone I can think of. Sports Illustrated Athlete of the Century. Congressional Gold Medal. World Golf Hall of Fame. 18 Majors. 73 tour wins. 2 US Amateurs. NCAA individual champion. The career grand slam, times three. Transformed the city of Dublin, Ohio, and much of Columbus. The most decorated golfer in the history of the game. 8 senior major championships. Owner of a golf equipment company, and many other golf-related enterprises. The developer of one of the premier players' clubs in the country (the Bear's Club) in addition to Muirfield Village Golf Club.

 

You know, I wish that we were sitting all together at a table with Spieth and Thomas, going through this litany, to better appreciate their embarrassment, to be compared to Nicklaus.

[Sean2]

What does everyone actually want from USGA? What kind of progress do you want to see? Clearly not any changes, so just sit back idly and let manufactures and players run rampant?

 

Some common sense applied to the rules of golf...they are making a step in that direction, and I hope they continue to do so. I don't think rolling back the ball can be construed as "progress". They have limited COR so no need to worry about OEMs "running rampant".

[Shilgy]

The number of holes USGA chooses from year to year for its playoff format has nothing to do with the Rules of Golf. The Rules of golf would let them make it 18 holes or 72 holes or one-hole or two-hole sudden death or three-hole aggregate or determine the winner with a scorecard countback.

 

So if a player is unfamiliar with the playoff format (which I guess is separate from any rules), and plays his way into a Monday 18 hole playoff, but can't be present because of prior engagements (a stretch, I know), is that the USGA's fault as well? Is asking these "professionals" to be well informed in their field really asking too much of them?

Are you worried they will make unbreakable dinner plans and miss the playoff? Spieth stated he thought it was the traditional 18 hole Monday playoff. So it is not the rules he does not understand as you state it is the as yet never used US Open playoff format. I really doubt that come Sunday any player in contention would not be aware of the format.

I guess I was out of line expecting these professionals to understand all of the details of their profession. My apologies. Tier 1 professionals know every detail of their job, I guess all these guys need to do is hit the ball better than the next guy. I bet they know when/where the after party is though.

I would agree with you about "they should know the rules better" and that includes the local rules-for instance DJ and Whistling Straits- but would give them a pass on needing to know on Tuesday what the new playoff format is.

[15th Club]

rangersgoalie: Who in the heck ever said one damned thing, about wanting to "punish" Titleist? It sure wasn't me!

[bscinstnct]

Just saw this, linked at Geoff Shackelford's website; from his Golfweek article from pre-Open press conferences comes the news that before Tuesday, neither Jordan Spieth* nor Justin Thomas** knew about the new USGA playoff format. Which was not only announced to considerable fanfare and discussion in February, but also was actually used, in the US Women's Open just two weeks ago at Shoal Creek.

 

Honestly, it's no big deal if the two young players didn't know about it. What could they do, to change it or specially prepare for their competition this week? Nothing, really.

 

But in the context of commenters suggesting that we really need to ask current Tour players about things like a ball rollback, or course setups, it is a noteworthy bit of cluelessness about their sport. They are both great players, and fun to watch. And often, fun to listen to. But being a great player doesn't make you wise about the administration of the game of golf.

 

 

*Titleist brand ambassador; not that there's anything wrong with that.

**Titleist brand ambassador; not that there's anything wrong with that.

 

They are also both members of the PGA Tour Player Advisory Council. Jordan was elected the chairman this past February.

 

The full board and directors

 

2018 Player Advisory Council

Daniel Berger

Paul Casey

Stewart Cink

Chesson Hadley

James Hahn

Billy Hurley III

Zach Johnson

Matt Kuchar

Anirban Lahiri

Geoff Ogilvy

Sam Saunders

Jordan Spieth

Chris Stroud

Justin Thomas (fancy seeing you here Justin)

Kyle Thompson

Cameron Tringale

 

2018 Player Directors

Charley Hoffman (2017-19)

Davis Love III (2016-2018) Jordan will be replacing Davis Love III in this spot with a position on the PGA Tour policy board for the next three years

Kevin Streelman (2017-19)

Johnson Wagner (2018-2020)

 

 

If the USGA wants to tall ball rollback, they WILL be speaking to Mr. Spieth.

 

Rofl!

[Shilgy]

Jack Nicklaus v. Jordan Speith and Justin Thomas on wisdom in the administration of golf?

 

!?

 

big red, I've seen a lot of dumb and combative posts from you in these threads, but none moreso than your trashtalking Jack Nicklaus.

 

Nicklaus won more than Spieth or Thomas have at their current ages. He won more than I dare say either one ever will. He's operated what is perhaps the most prestigious Tour event short of a major, for more than 40 years. Designed more golf courses than anyone of his era. More Tour-used courses than anyone I can think of. Sports Illustrated Athlete of the Century. Congressional Gold Medal. World Golf Hall of Fame. 18 Majors. 73 tour wins. 2 US Amateurs. NCAA individual champion. The career grand slam, times three. Transformed the city of Dublin, Ohio, and much of Columbus. The most decorated golfer in the history of the game. 8 senior major championships. Owner of a golf equipment company, and many other golf-related enterprises. The developer of one of the premier players' clubs in the country (the Bear's Club) in addition to Muirfield Village Golf Club.

 

You know, I wish that we were sitting all together at a table with Spieth and Thomas, going through this litany, to better appreciate their embarrassment, to be compared to Nicklaus.

Certainly not any you would wish to play? They are much too long to be playable under your short and fast desires. Too bad he was not born a century earlier.

[Sean2]

rangersgoalie: Who in the heck ever said one damned thing, about wanting to "punish" Titleist? It sure wasn't me!

 

Hmmm...must be the "neverTitleist" crowd. lol

[BIG STU]

The USGA is far out of touch with the average golfer........the PGA of America is trying to help grow the game.

Well said my sentiments exactly--- First off was the groove rule of course everyone with the sense of a house fly knows they were in cahoots with all the major club manufacturers so folks would have to buy new wedges. Then the anchored putter ban they screwed up the whole ball of wax on that deal period--- their last little fiasco making folks that want to post handicap rounds play with someone so their round can be verified--- As I have said many times The only thing they are interested in growing is their own bank accounts. Far as set ups for the US Open I have no problem at all with after all everyone in the tournament is playing the same course and conditions. What my main problem with the USGA is in a nutshell is that they have lost touch with the game as it pertains to the everyday Joe or Jane golfer

[Ashley Schaeffer]

Jack Nicklaus v. Jordan Speith and Justin Thomas on wisdom in the administration of golf?

 

!?

 

big red, I've seen a lot of dumb and combative posts from you in these threads, but none moreso than your trashtalking Jack Nicklaus.

 

Nicklaus won more than Spieth or Thomas have at their current ages. He won more than I dare say either one ever will. He's operated what is perhaps the most prestigious Tour event short of a major, for more than 40 years. Designed more golf courses than anyone of his era. More Tour-used courses than anyone I can think of. Sports Illustrated Athlete of the Century. Congressional Gold Medal. World Golf Hall of Fame. 18 Majors. 73 tour wins. 2 US Amateurs. NCAA individual champion. The career grand slam, times three. Transformed the city of Dublin, Ohio, and much of Columbus. The most decorated golfer in the history of the game. 8 senior major championships. Owner of a golf equipment company, and many other golf-related enterprises. The developer of one of the premier players' clubs in the country (the Bear's Club) in addition to Muirfield Village Golf Club.

 

You know, I wish that we were sitting all together at a table with Spieth and Thomas, going through this litany, to better appreciate their embarrassment, to be compared to Nicklaus.

 

How many starts does Nicklaus have on tour since the ProV1 was released? Mainly ceremonial majors way past his prime? That's right.

One could rightly assert that he's never played the modern game at a high level. Why listen to him?

[rangersgoalie]

Jack Nicklaus v. Jordan Speith and Justin Thomas on wisdom in the administration of golf?

 

!?

 

big red, I've seen a lot of dumb and combative posts from you in these threads, but none moreso than your trashtalking Jack Nicklaus.

 

Nicklaus won more than Spieth or Thomas have at their current ages. He won more than I dare say either one ever will. He's operated what is perhaps the most prestigious Tour event short of a major, for more than 40 years. Designed more golf courses than anyone of his era. More Tour-used courses than anyone I can think of. Sports Illustrated Athlete of the Century. Congressional Gold Medal. World Golf Hall of Fame. 18 Majors. 73 tour wins. 2 US Amateurs. NCAA individual champion. The career grand slam, times three. Transformed the city of Dublin, Ohio, and much of Columbus. The most decorated golfer in the history of the game. 8 senior major championships. Owner of a golf equipment company, and many other golf-related enterprises. The developer of one of the premier players' clubs in the country (the Bear's Club) in addition to Muirfield Village Golf Club.

 

You know, I wish that we were sitting all together at a table with Spieth and Thomas, going through this litany, to better appreciate their embarrassment, to be compared to Nicklaus.

 

 

Jacks nickname by many of his peers was Carnac, some in fun, some in being a know it all.

 

His architecture IS one of the driving forces of the aerial game, and bomb and gouge. His pace of play was a role model for many too...

 

See, we can always come up with info for our biases

 

EDIT early architecture

[Darth Putter]

Jack Nicklaus v. Jordan Speith and Justin Thomas on wisdom in the administration of golf?

 

!?

 

big red, I've seen a lot of dumb and combative posts from you in these threads, but none moreso than your trashtalking Jack Nicklaus.

 

Nicklaus won more than Spieth or Thomas have at their current ages. He won more than I dare say either one ever will. He's operated what is perhaps the most prestigious Tour event short of a major, for more than 40 years. Designed more golf courses than anyone of his era. More Tour-used courses than anyone I can think of. Sports Illustrated Athlete of the Century. Congressional Gold Medal. World Golf Hall of Fame. 18 Majors. 73 tour wins. 2 US Amateurs. NCAA individual champion. The career grand slam, times three. Transformed the city of Dublin, Ohio, and much of Columbus. The most decorated golfer in the history of the game. 8 senior major championships. Owner of a golf equipment company, and many other golf-related enterprises. The developer of one of the premier players' clubs in the country (the Bear's Club) in addition to Muirfield Village Golf Club.

 

You know, I wish that we were sitting all together at a table with Spieth and Thomas, going through this litany, to better appreciate their embarrassment, to be compared to Nicklaus.

 

I don't think Jack's position as the most important voice in golf among players is under dispute, but he has been wrong before. He opposed the fully exempt tour and he opposed Deane Beman's plans in the 1980s that have made the pros incredibly rich in the last three decades. One more thing, Jack won't be living with this decision, Jordan and Justin will.

[rangersgoalie]

rangersgoalie: Who in the heck ever said one damned thing, about wanting to "punish" Titleist? It sure wasn't me!

 

You mention Titleist constantly

Do you believe a roll back will not force Titleist, or any company to not have to retool, redeveloped and change their entire

Business?

Titleist is a ball company that also sell equipment. That equipment, is also tied to what the ball does in testing.

 

Forcing any company to change their processes, and potentially (yes potentially) lose market share is punishment.

Those costs and potential revenue I,pacts are precisely why they SHOULD use any means to fight a solution to perceived problems

[Darth Putter]

rangersgoalie: Who in the heck ever said one damned thing, about wanting to "punish" Titleist? It sure wasn't me!

 

Hmmm...must be the "neverTitleist" crowd. lol

 

Where do I sign up?

 

Stupid balatas getting cut in half all the time....

[BIG STU]

15th - IF the new regulations come out that call for a rollback of 20-25% of ALL golf balls across the board, would you support that? You keep talking about this mythical ball that wont effect slower swing speeds, but some of us know that's not really feasible. So, if anything is done, it will effect everyone from the recreational senior to the full ranks of elite golfers and everyone in between. Do you support that?

There certainly are quite a few recreational players that never hit the ball squarely and never compress the ball that would be affected less than 20%. That said there are many recreational players that do hit the ball solidly and would lose at least 10-15% under a 20% ball roll back I would think. Those that hit the ball solidly at 90-105 mph would possibly lose less than 20%.

 

That said, why? Why should most of believe that it is for the "good of the game" for us to learn a new game? To purchase new clubs to fit our changing gaps? To change how we play around the greens? Why should ALL of the ball manufacturers go to the expense of making a new ball? 15 claims Titleist has so much to lose because they are currently the most successful. Even if the rollback is enacted andTitleist maintains their position as #1 they still would have incurred unnecessary expenses in making a new ball. Will the USGA pay for this? And for all of this to what end? "Protecting" the integrity and relevance and ego of a handful of century old courses?

I will give you some food for thought on this. What if they roll back the ball? How many people do you think will buy and play it? Man alive they are billions and billions of balls out there that conform to today's standards. Good Lord some WRxers I have seen on here have enough current balls hoarded to play if they live to be 90. The way I see it is the only folks purchasing those castrated distance balls would be serious amateurs that play USGA comps and those trying to make one of the tours. I can see the marketing now "Try the new lower distance ball mandated by the USGA" Yeah I can see the Titleist advertisements Bubba-- Well this ball goes about 20 yards less than my old Titleist but it hits good and besides the USGA mandated it. I see this being good for 1000 laughs. Besides most average golfers do what they want to do and could care less about the USGA, The R&A or the PGA for that matter they play to have FUN and that is mostly the name of the game

[Ashley Schaeffer]

rangersgoalie: Who in the heck ever said one damned thing, about wanting to "punish" Titleist? It sure wasn't me!

 

Hmmm...must be the "neverTitleist" crowd. lol

 

Where do I sign up?

 

Stupid balatas getting cut in half all the time....

 

I'm on board. Hit a great shot with a new wedge on #2 today. $4 lost. By #7, I was putting a hardboiled egg.

Baller on a budget.

[Darth Putter]

rangersgoalie: Who in the heck ever said one damned thing, about wanting to "punish" Titleist? It sure wasn't me!

 

Hmmm...must be the "neverTitleist" crowd. lol

 

Where do I sign up?

 

Stupid balatas getting cut in half all the time....

 

I'm on board. Hit a great shot with a new wedge on #2 today. $4 lost. By #7, I was putting a hardboiled egg.

Baller on a budget.

 

I haven't used a Titleist ball since the Berlin Wall was still up.

[disco111]

no need to worry about OEMs "running rampant".

 

 

I think that ship sailed long ago.......... :cheesy:

[davep043]

I agree! The USGA solicited responses on rolling the ball back...and I sent in my opinion, but I was also thinking that what I have to say will make absolutely no difference as they will do what they want to do regardless. They solicit feedback as a sop to the hoi polloi, but I doubt if any of that feedback will have any bearing on their decision.

The USGA solicited criticisms after publishing tentative changes to the rules for 2019. I responded, along with at least a few of my friends. The final rules different in a number of ways from the original version. Apparently the USGA listened then, there's no reason to think they'll NOT listen to feedback on the ball issue. Of course, there will be voices on all sides of the issue, so if they choose a specific path, that doesn't mean they didn't consider differing view, just that they made a different choice.

 

Well said my sentiments exactly--- First off was the groove rule of course everyone with the sense of a house fly knows they were in cahoots with all the major club manufacturers so folks would have to buy new wedges. Then the anchored putter ban they screwed up the whole ball of wax on that deal period--- their last little fiasco making folks that want to post handicap rounds play with someone so their round can be verified-

But the USGA structured the groove change so that nobody really had to buy new wedges, the old ones are still legal until 2024 for all except very elite competitions.

As for the anchored putter, anchoring a stroke against your body differs from my image of an acceptable golf stroke. I think the USGA tried their best to walk a fine line, allowing those clubs to remain legal, allowing players with back issues and other physical problems to stand straight up while putting, yet outlaw the anchoring part.

Handicapping, and solo rounds? Handicaps are intended to allow fair competition between players of differing abilities. Competition means playing WITH someone. Makes sense to me that the rounds that should determine a handicap are those where you actually do play with someone else.

 

Other than the groove thing, these are without doubt my opinions, they're not facts. But we're allowed to have differing opinions. Yours don't make you and idiot or a slob (trying for a little humor there), neither do mine make me an idiot or a snob. And I'll ask yet again, what would anyone propose as an alternative? I've read a suggestion for the PGA of America, any others? Or is anarchy a better choice?

[Ashley Schaeffer]

rangersgoalie: Who in the heck ever said one damned thing, about wanting to "punish" Titleist? It sure wasn't me!

 

Hmmm...must be the "neverTitleist" crowd. lol

 

Where do I sign up?

 

Stupid balatas getting cut in half all the time....

 

I'm on board. Hit a great shot with a new wedge on #2 today. $4 lost. By #7, I was putting a hardboiled egg.

Baller on a budget.

 

I haven't used a Titleist ball since the Berlin Wall was still up.

 

#HARDO

[15th Club]

rangersgoalie:

"You mention Titleist constantly." I don't know about "constantly." I want to mention them often enough so as to make a few points; 1) that they are an activist anti-rollback organization; 2) they appear to have an enormous financial stake in ball regulations, although I don't see how they'd be damaged; 3) even if Titleist faced some costs, the USGA still has the right to revise its own set of Rules that it has been overseeing for the last 100 years; 4) Titleist-contracted Tour players have deep conflicts of interest on the issue of ball regulations.

 

"Do you believe a roll back will not force Titleist, or any company to not have to retool, redeveloped and change their entire Business?" Maybe. But the Rules are made by the USGA and the R&A, for the good of the game as they judge it.

 

"Titleist is a ball company that also sell equipment. That equipment, is also tied to what the ball does in testing." Okay. I have nine Titleist cubs in my bag right now. What is your point?

 

"Forcing any company to change their processes, and potentially (yes potentially) lose market share is punishment." Absurd. That is like saying that a change in tax laws or environmental rules or fuel economy standards is "punishment." An absurdist definition of "punishment". In any event, I never wrote, suggested or implied that Titleist should be "punished."

 

Those costs and potential revenue I,pacts are precisely why they SHOULD use any means to fight a solution to perceived problems "Any means..." That's sort of extreme. I expect that a big part of what the USGA will be doing in advance of a ball rollback will be to make sure that they can defend it in litigation. If Titleist does threaten a lawsuit, I hope that they are exposed for it.