Why is the PGA Championship still a Major?

[tiderider]

the PGA used to be the equivalent of the Players ... it was run by the PGA, which also ran the tour ... the tour split in the late 60s, or thereabouts ... it was considered a major as far back as the 40s/50s, and more so than the masters ... iirc, jack once listed it as the 2nd major he most wanted to win since it was for professional golfers (this was early in his career), after the us open ... the players will never be a major ... everyone is aware of how the term "major" has been applied to various other tournaments, but that was in the infancy of golf tours and the golf profession ... the 4 majors are firmly established now and have been for 50 years ... no one's going to change the definition of "major" simply because a larger field or bigger purse is offered, and because it becomes even more difficult to determine who has how many ... jack won 3 players, but never at sawgrass ...

[smashdn]

IMO the PGA needs a solid identity. It can have it if it would:

1) Be held in August in the hottest part of the year most places. Be a true grit-fest. Survive the course and the heat.

2) Be played in the middle of the US with a defined rotation of courses - Crooked Stick, Southern Hills, Bellerive, Valhala, Hazeltine, Oakland Hills, Medinah, Inverness, etc. Traditional parkland type layouts.

3) Be set up harder than your average tour event but without stupid narrow fairways and rough (not a US Open set up) just hard hole locations and tight and fast fairways.

 

To go along with number one, you have to have it in August to give the PGA Professionals a fighting chance. Some of these guys their clubs haven't been open a whole month in April. There needs to be more of them in the field too. Could that bring the overall SOF down? Maybe, probably. But do you want the 150th ranked guy on tour in or would you rather give a guy a chance to be a story in the tournament? I would think TV wants the story.

 

Last thing, put that gap between The Masters and the US Open back in there. The Players can slide right in there and we can still have a hearty discussion about a fifth major (though I don't think it is).

 

Flow is good. Rhythm is good. This season has had neither. Felt like a sprint. Like we were rushing golf through instead of taking the time to build anticipation and enjoy the tournaments along the way.

I like the defined "swings." The West Coast/Early Season swing, the Florida Swing, the Texas Swing, the East Coast Swing. I think this makes it easier for the players to play more events because the travel is less demanding and it really makes it seem like a Tour of tournaments, not just random tournaments sprinkled about.

[Shilgy]

Based on the op's stated desire for historical majors-"the Western was a major"- why not dump the Masters and PGA and reinstate the US and British Amateurs as majors? Gee, that makes more sense and makes the Bobby Jones fans happy.

What the heck is going on with WRX lately with all of these weird threads?

[disco111]

> @Roadking2003 said:

> > @disco111 said:The PGA is a closed tournament also and so is the Players, so all of them should lose the ability to hold a major title.

>

> How did you decide that? Maybe "Open" tournaments "should lose the ability to hold a major title."

 

Both are for pro's only, so yeah, they are closed. Unlike opens, which anybody with game can try to get in. Really not that difficult to comprehend.....

[Roadking2003]

> @disco111 said:

> > @Roadking2003 said:

> > > @disco111 said:The PGA is a closed tournament also and so is the Players, so all of them should lose the ability to hold a major title.

> >

> > How did you decide that? Maybe "Open" tournaments "should lose the ability to hold a major title."

>

> Both are for pro's only, so yeah, they are closed. Unlike opens, which anybody with game can try to get in. Really not that difficult to comprehend.....

 

Wrong answer. My question is "how did you decide majors should be open events rather than closed events?"

[Chief Illiniwek]

 

[Man_O_War]

don't give yourself an ulcer. It's not changing

[LICC]

The PGA has 4th rung status among general golf fans. And while generally all PGA Tour events are held at well-conditioned good courses, the other majors usually are held at outstanding, best-in-the-world at the highest level courses (the USGA had a few missed but usually has incredible venues). The PGA? It's gotten better courses in its rotation but does Quail Hollow, Trump Bedminster, Valhalla, Bellerive, Hazeltine, Atlanta Athletic Club, etc. really make you think of the best courses in the world?

 

[disco111]

> @Roadking2003 said:

> > @disco111 said:

> > > @Roadking2003 said:

> > > > @disco111 said:The PGA is a closed tournament also and so is the Players, so all of them should lose the ability to hold a major title.

> > >

> > > How did you decide that? Maybe "Open" tournaments "should lose the ability to hold a major title."

> >

> > Both are for pro's only, so yeah, they are closed. Unlike opens, which anybody with game can try to get in. Really not that difficult to comprehend.....

>

> Wrong answer. My question is "how did you decide majors should be open events rather than closed events?"

 

Sorry, not the wrong answer, but perhaps re-reading my initial post, were it was stated "my opinion", just may be helpful for better understanding...........

[farmer]

Going back to match play would give the PGA a distinct personality. Match play is generally not the best for tv, but it would be different. It's been around since 1916, and there are perks associated with winning.

[Darth Putter]

The the two Opens are the championships of golf's two ruling bodies. Their place as a major is secure.

The Masters is the most popular golf tournament in the galaxy. Public acclaim will keep its major status as long as the club wants to conduct it.

 

The US PGA is in a more precarious position. I don't think the US PGA Tour can quite get there and make the TPC the fifth major or replace the PGA as #4. If the US Tour were to combine with the others to form a global "super tour" like the ATP in men's tennis, then the coup d'etat is at hand. A global TPC that can be moved outside the US and UK to places like China will be worth way too much money and would most likely replace the PGA as golf's fourth major.

[Bye]

> @Cincy_Ken said:

> > @Bye said:

> > It would be nice to have another non US based major. Demoting the PGA to a regular event would be a bad idea. There is a nice space now later on in the year, something in October could work.

>

> I know the women and seniors do it but no to a 5th major. Major statistics are far too recognized in golf to add a 5th professional major. I like October for the PGA.

 

It’s probably a statistical advantage for some to have 3 of the 4 in the same country.

 

July to April is a long wait for the next major.

 

 

 

 

[bermuda]

The question should be what is the Tour Championship the championship of? It has a 30-man field. The winner of it is not necessarily the FedEx champion or the player of the year. If the Tour Championship is the championship of the PGA Tour, what is The Players the championship of?

 

Here's how the modern four majors got designated:

After winning the 1960 Masters with a fantastic finish, Palmer spoke about wanting to win the U.S. Open and PGA Championship. He didn't mention it at Augusta, but because the British Open was going to be played at St. Andrews, he had that tournament on his schedule from the start of the year. Two days after Palmer won the Masters, Mercer Bailey of the Associated Press wrote that Palmer "has charted a course which could carry him to the biggest grand slam in golf since Bobby Jones' feat in 1930."

[https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields](https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields "https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields")

 

It wasn't people or organizations saying we want this tournament to be a major or we don't want that tournament to be a major. You could say majors are the tournaments people care who wins. I've been a golf fan for more than 40 years. I don't give a flip who wins The Players, the Tour Championship or the FedEx Cup. Those are paychecks. The majors are history.

 

[cdnglf]

> @LICC said:

> The PGA has 4th rung status among general golf fans. And while generally all PGA Tour events are held at well-conditioned good courses, the other majors usually are held at outstanding, best-in-the-world at the highest level courses (the USGA had a few missed but usually has incredible venues). The PGA? It's gotten better courses in its rotation but does Quail Hollow, Trump Bedminster, Valhalla, Bellerive, Hazeltine, Atlanta Athletic Club, etc. really make you think of the best courses in the world?

>

 

What alternative are you proposing?

That there should only be 3 majors?

That the Players (which is played on the same course every year) should somehow replace the PGA?

That some other tournament should somehow replace the PGA?

[LICC]

> @bermuda said:

> The question should be what is the Tour Championship the championship of? It has a 30-man field. The winner of it is not necessarily the FedEx champion or the player of the year. If the Tour Championship is the championship of the PGA Tour, what is The Players the championship of?

>

> Here's how the modern four majors got designated:

> After winning the 1960 Masters with a fantastic finish, Palmer spoke about wanting to win the U.S. Open and PGA Championship. He didn't mention it at Augusta, but because the British Open was going to be played at St. Andrews, he had that tournament on his schedule from the start of the year. Two days after Palmer won the Masters, Mercer Bailey of the Associated Press wrote that Palmer "has charted a course which could carry him to the biggest grand slam in golf since Bobby Jones' feat in 1930."

> [https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields](https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields "https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields")

>

> It wasn't people or organizations saying we want this tournament to be a major or we don't want that tournament to be a major. You could say majors are the tournaments people care who wins. I've been a golf fan for more than 40 years. I don't give a flip who wins The Players, the Tour Championship or the FedEx Cup. Those are paychecks. The majors are history.

>

 

Actually that Arnold Palmer story is how the modern term "Grand Slam" came about. Not the four majors. They had already been considered majors by then.

The term Major really came about through golf writers and the press. But none of this answers why you place more importance on the PGA Championship than the Players, other than the media has told you that the PGA is a "Major".

[smashdn]

> @"Darth Putter" said:

> The the two Opens are the championships of golf's two ruling bodies. Their place as a major is secure.

> The Masters is the most popular golf tournament in the galaxy. Public acclaim will keep its major status as long as the club wants to conduct it.

>

> The US PGA is in a more precarious position. I don't think the US PGA Tour can quite get there and make the TPC the fifth major or replace the PGA as #4. If the US Tour were to combine with the others to form a global "super tour" like the ATP in men's tennis, then the coup d'etat is at hand. A global TPC that can be moved outside the US and UK to places like China will be worth way too much money and would most likely replace the PGA as golf's fourth major.

 

You mean the WGC mess?

 

 

Tennis has "majors" does it not? Wimbledon, US Open, Australian and French Opens?

[bermuda]

> @LICC said:

> > @bermuda said:

> > The question should be what is the Tour Championship the championship of? It has a 30-man field. The winner of it is not necessarily the FedEx champion or the player of the year. If the Tour Championship is the championship of the PGA Tour, what is The Players the championship of?

> >

> > Here's how the modern four majors got designated:

> > After winning the 1960 Masters with a fantastic finish, Palmer spoke about wanting to win the U.S. Open and PGA Championship. He didn't mention it at Augusta, but because the British Open was going to be played at St. Andrews, he had that tournament on his schedule from the start of the year. Two days after Palmer won the Masters, Mercer Bailey of the Associated Press wrote that Palmer "has charted a course which could carry him to the biggest grand slam in golf since Bobby Jones' feat in 1930."

> > [https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields](https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields "https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf_bob_drum_bill_fields")

> >

> > It wasn't people or organizations saying we want this tournament to be a major or we don't want that tournament to be a major. You could say majors are the tournaments people care who wins. I've been a golf fan for more than 40 years. I don't give a flip who wins The Players, the Tour Championship or the FedEx Cup. Those are paychecks. The majors are history.

> >

>

> Actually that Arnold Palmer story is how the modern term "Grand Slam" came about. Not the four majors. They had already been considered majors by then.

> The term Major really came about through golf writers and the press. But none of this answers why you place more importance on the PGA Championship than the Players, other than the media has told you that the PGA is a "Major".

 

It defined the four modern majors. Nicklaus, Palmer and others considered the US and British Ams to be majors, as did a lot of others from the days before the best players turned pro, while at the same time a lot of people did not consider the British Open to be a major. Palmer made it a major. Remember Snead basically saying after he won in 1946 that he wasn't impressed and wasn't coming back (although he did in '62 after Palmer helped define it as a major and the purse increased)? Hogan after he won the British in '53 saying he had an old lawn mower he would send over to Carnoustie once he got home? And in 1960, the Masters was still a fairly recent tournament then, younger than the Players is now, and we don't consider the Players to have enough history to be a major.

[BlackDiamondPar5]

> @LICC said:

> Some of the discussions on other threads about the compressed Majors schedule shows that a majority of fans seem to like the new schedule, but some are complaining that having the Majors held from April to July is too compressed. These people seem to care almost entirely about the four majors and dismiss the Players Championship and the FedEx playoff tournaments. But why are people so caught up on if a tournament is called a "Major" or not? I love the Open and the US Open because they are national championships with outstanding fields played on usually great courses that you don't often see with different setups and challenges than regular Tour events. I love the Masters for all the reasons that people love the Masters. None if it is because they are called "Majors". And while the PGA at Bethpage was excellent this year, in prior years it really hasn't been anything any more special than any other good Tour event. In most years, I've enjoyed watching the Players Championship more than the PGA and the Tour Championship probably just as much.

> So the question- why is the PGA Championship still a "Major"? Historically (prior to 1968), the PGA Championship effectively WAS the Tour Championship, as the Tour was part of the PGA. I think its status as a Major tournament comes directly from the fact that it was the championship tournament of the association that had the greatest golfers in the world. Once the Tour broke off, the PGA Championship no longer is that. The PGA Tour has its own championship tournaments now. The PGA Championship for many years has had 4th rung status among the "Majors".

> So then- Why is the PGA Championship still a "Major"?

 

It might be number 4 but the PGA is the fourth major not 5 and still stands way above these other desperately contrived events. These August events are nothing no matter how the media wants to hype it. Why the need to talk up demoting the PGA? Why are you liking and trying to promote the new schedule so much when it was fine the way it was?

[Titleist99]

> @JaNelson38 said:

> > @LICC said:

> > Some of the discussions on other threads about the compressed Majors schedule shows that a majority of fans seem to like the new schedule, but some are complaining that having the Majors held from April to July is too compressed. These people seem to care almost entirely about the four majors and dismiss the Players Championship and the FedEx playoff tournaments. But why are people so caught up on if a tournament is called a "Major" or not? I love the Open and the US Open because they are national championships with outstanding fields played on usually great courses that you don't often see with different setups and challenges than regular Tour events. I love the Masters for all the reasons that people love the Masters. None if it is because they are called "Majors". And while the PGA at Bethpage was excellent this year, in prior years it really hasn't been anything any more special than any other good Tour event. In most years, I've enjoyed watching the Players Championship more than the PGA and the Tour Championship probably just as much.

> > So the question- why is the PGA Championship still a "Major"? Historically (prior to 1968), the PGA Championship effectively WAS the Tour Championship, as the Tour was part of the PGA. I think its status as a Major tournament comes directly from the fact that it was the championship tournament of the association that had the greatest golfers in the world. Once the Tour broke off, the PGA Championship no longer is that. The PGA Tour has its own championship tournaments now. The PGA Championship for many years has had 4th rung status among the "Majors".

> > So then- Why is the PGA Championship still a "Major"?

>

> The PGA Championship doesnt have "4th rung status" amongst the players, I can tell you that. Its actually the one major every year that rewards year-round performance for all players, not just the top 50 in the world. The PGA is always held at wonderful courses that are always perfectly maintained. And the purse and winners share at just under $2 million is right there with the other majors, The Players, and the WGC events.

>

> Guys who win PGA Tour events arent guaranteed to even be in the Masters, US Open, or the Open Championship. They are guaranteed to be exempt into the PGA.

 

The PGA tournament shows the rank and file along with the club pros some love...

[DFS PFD]

Why can't we just leave the majors alone? The PGA is fine, The Player's is not a major, the end.

[LICC]

> @cdnglf said:

> > @LICC said:

> > The PGA has 4th rung status among general golf fans. And while generally all PGA Tour events are held at well-conditioned good courses, the other majors usually are held at outstanding, best-in-the-world at the highest level courses (the USGA had a few missed but usually has incredible venues). The PGA? It's gotten better courses in its rotation but does Quail Hollow, Trump Bedminster, Valhalla, Bellerive, Hazeltine, Atlanta Athletic Club, etc. really make you think of the best courses in the world?

> >

>

> What alternative are you proposing?

> That there should only be 3 majors?

> That the Players (which is played on the same course every year) should somehow replace the PGA?

> That some other tournament should somehow replace the PGA?

 

I am proposing that those who say the new schedule is bad because with the Open as the last major the season is over, are misguided. There are top tournaments that really are as good or better than the PGA both before and after the majors that provide great events for fans to watch.

As to your other questions, I hadn't proposed anything. I think if the PGA Tour changed the format of the Tour Championship (bigger field, rotating world class venues, no handicapping) that it could replace the PGA as a major, but I don't see that happening.

[braincramp52]

Why is the PGA still considered a Major? It's like I used to tell my kids, because we said so!

[Loki]

All I know is that I am probably done watching golf for the year.

[braincramp52]

> @Loki said:

> All I know is that I am probably done watching golf for the year.

 

Really!!?? I've gotten to like the Fedex playoffs. Much more than Fedex itself.

[Roadking2003]

> @cdnglf said:

> > @LICC said:

> > The PGA has 4th rung status among general golf fans. And while generally all PGA Tour events are held at well-conditioned good courses, the other majors usually are held at outstanding, best-in-the-world at the highest level courses (the USGA had a few missed but usually has incredible venues). The PGA? It's gotten better courses in its rotation but does Quail Hollow, Trump Bedminster, Valhalla, Bellerive, Hazeltine, Atlanta Athletic Club, etc. really make you think of the best courses in the world?

> >

>

> What alternative are you proposing?

> That there should only be 3 majors?

> That the Players (which is played on the same course every year) should somehow replace the PGA?

> That some other tournament should somehow replace the PGA?

 

Maybe the Players should replace the British..... The PGA is way too valuable to replace.

[LICC]

> @cdnglf said:

> > @LICC said:

> > The PGA has 4th rung status among general golf fans. And while generally all PGA Tour events are held at well-conditioned good courses, the other majors usually are held at outstanding, best-in-the-world at the highest level courses (the USGA had a few missed but usually has incredible venues). The PGA? It's gotten better courses in its rotation but does Quail Hollow, Trump Bedminster, Valhalla, Bellerive, Hazeltine, Atlanta Athletic Club, etc. really make you think of the best courses in the world?

> >

>

> What alternative are you proposing?

> That there should only be 3 majors?

> That the Players (which is played on the same course every year) should somehow replace the PGA?

> That some other tournament should somehow replace the PGA?

 

I am proposing that those who say the new schedule is bad because with the Open as the last major the season is over, are misguided. There are top tournaments that really are as good or better than the PGA both before and after the majors that provide great events for fans to watch.

As to your other questions, I hadn't proposed anything. I think if the PGA Tour changed the format of the Tour Championship (bigger fields, rotating world class venues, no handicapping) that it could replace the PGA as a major, but I don't see that happening.

[Roadking2003]

> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > @LICC said:

> It might be number 4 but the PGA is the fourth major not 5 and still stands way above these other desperately contrived events.

 

Actually, it's the 2nd Major after the Masters.

[Roadking2003]

> @lawsonman said:

> Why is the PGA still considered a Major? It's like I used to tell my kids, because we said so!

 

This is true. Designating majors doesn't need a defense. They are majors because the golf world says they are. And now that we all agree, the players also consider them majors.

[Roadking2003]

> @"Darth Putter" said:

> The the two Opens are the championships of golf's two ruling bodies. Their place as a major is secure.

> The Masters is the most popular golf tournament in the galaxy. Public acclaim will keep its major status as long as the club wants to conduct it.

>

> The US PGA is in a more precarious position. I don't think the US PGA Tour can quite get there and make the TPC the fifth major or replace the PGA as #4. \\

 

Except that the PGA is the 2nd most important major after the Masters.

 

[LICC]

> @Roadking2003 said:

> > @lawsonman said:

> > Why is the PGA still considered a Major? It's like I used to tell my kids, because we said so!

>

> This is true. Designating majors doesn't need a defense. They are majors because the golf world says they are. And now that we all agree, the players also consider them majors.

 

It was a major because it was the championship of the top Tour players. It no longer is the championship of the top Tour layers. Hasn’t been for 50 years. So other than It’s a major because people say it is, what is the rationale? Strength of field? Ok, but other fields are as strong or stronger. History? Not the best reason but ok. What else?