What are the chances that another player reaches the Tiger 2000 level in our lifetimes?

[spk7]

I believe there’s too much talent now to see another person dominate like tiger used to

[BlackDiamondPar5]

Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

Talent level close but a tough call.

Consistency, no one yet.

Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

[aenemated]

> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

 

Brooks maybe COULD but he's made it pretty clear he doesn't give a shit to.

 

"When you see me on TV, that's when I play golf."

[LICC]

> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> Talent level close but a tough call.

> Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

 

None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

[lowheel]

> @spk7 said:

> I believe there’s too much talent now to see another person dominate like tiger used to

 

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1990-01-17-sp-182-story.html

 

thats been said every decade since the 70s...

[spk7]

> @lowheel said:

> > @spk7 said:

> > I believe there’s too much talent now to see another person dominate like tiger used to

>

> https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1990-01-17-sp-182-story.html

>

> thats been said every decade since the 70s...

 

Yeah I guess that’s true, even if there was someone who could be as dominant as he was i dont think anyone will because of the way the new schedule is and top players on playing a limited number of events

[dlygrisse]

Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

 

> @LICC said:

> > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

>

> None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

 

 

[LICC]

> @dlygrisse said:

> Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

>

> > @LICC said:

> > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> >

> > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

>

>

Not even close. You either didn’t watch Tiger in his prime or suffer recency bias. Tiger’s prime years hand eye coordination, transition speed of his hips, hand speed, and touch and feel, all combined, are beyond anyone today. Goodness, a 43-year old back fused Tiger won the Masters, was 2nd at two other majors, and won the Tour championship, and was top-10 in how many other tournaments. He is 60% of what he was in his prime. A 24-year old Tiger would dominate today.

 

[Shilgy]

Same guy that says Tiger 2000 will never be done again- because it hasn't happened before- also says this.

 

[straightshot7]

> @dlygrisse said:

> Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

>

> > @LICC said:

> > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> >

> > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

>

>

 

What about around the greens and with the putter? Prime Tiger is like today's Rory McIlroy if Rory had better iron play, better wedge play, and the best short game and putting on tour.

 

It's not even close. Tiger had no weaknesses in his game.

[cdnglf]

> @straightshot7 said:

> > @dlygrisse said:

> > Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

> >

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> > >

> > > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

> >

> >

>

> What about around the greens and with the putter? Prime Tiger is like today's Rory McIlroy if Rory had better iron play, better wedge play, and the best short game and putting on tour.

>

> It's not even close. Tiger had no weaknesses in his game.

 

Tiger was the best ever but there is no need to exaggerate. He wasn't as good as Rory is with the driver.

[straightshot7]

> @cdnglf said:

> > @straightshot7 said:

> > > @dlygrisse said:

> > > Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

> > >

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> > > >

> > > > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > What about around the greens and with the putter? Prime Tiger is like today's Rory McIlroy if Rory had better iron play, better wedge play, and the best short game and putting on tour.

> >

> > It's not even close. Tiger had no weaknesses in his game.

>

> Tiger was the best ever but there is no need to exaggerate. He was never as good as Rory is with the driver.

 

Yeah I was expecting that comment. Tiger was as good with the driver at times, just not as consistently.

 

Tiger was 1st in total driving in 2000!

 

But okay, subtract from the driver. He was still considerably better at every other aspect.

 

[cdnglf]

> @straightshot7 said:

> > @cdnglf said:

> > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > @dlygrisse said:

> > > > Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

> > > >

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > > > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > > > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> > > > >

> > > > > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > What about around the greens and with the putter? Prime Tiger is like today's Rory McIlroy if Rory had better iron play, better wedge play, and the best short game and putting on tour.

> > >

> > > It's not even close. Tiger had no weaknesses in his game.

> >

> > Tiger was the best ever but there is no need to exaggerate. He was never as good as Rory is with the driver.

>

> Yeah I was expecting that comment. Tiger was as good with the driver at times, just not as consistently.

>

> But okay, subtract from the driver. He was still considerably better at every other aspect.

>

 

Obviously a much better putter and IMO the greatest iron player ever. Quickly scanning through SG around the green (admittedly only tracked since 2004), I don't see much evidence that he had a significant edge in that category - makes me wonder if his short game was overrated.

 

Rory has a notable advantage with the driver (and off the tee in general). Tiger never led SG off the tee and his best season is .896. Rory is near the top nearly every year. In his good years, he's just way better than everyone else - this year he's #1 at 1.215 and DJ is #2 at .8.

[straightshot7]

> @cdnglf said:

> > @straightshot7 said:

> > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > @dlygrisse said:

> > > > > Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

> > > > >

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > > > > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > > > > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > What about around the greens and with the putter? Prime Tiger is like today's Rory McIlroy if Rory had better iron play, better wedge play, and the best short game and putting on tour.

> > > >

> > > > It's not even close. Tiger had no weaknesses in his game.

> > >

> > > Tiger was the best ever but there is no need to exaggerate. He was never as good as Rory is with the driver.

> >

> > Yeah I was expecting that comment. Tiger was as good with the driver at times, just not as consistently.

> >

> > But okay, subtract from the driver. He was still considerably better at every other aspect.

> >

>

> Obviously a much better putter and IMO the greatest iron player ever. Quickly scanning through SG around the green (admittedly only tracked since 2004), I don't see much evidence that he had a significant edge in that category - makes me wonder if his short game was overrated.

>

> Rory has a notable advantage with the driver (and off the tee in general). Tiger never led SG off the tee and his best season is .896. Rory is near the top nearly every year. In his good years, he's just way better than everyone else - this year he's #1 at 1.215 and DJ is #2 at .8.

 

Doesn't make any sense to look at SG with Tiger. That stat wasn't available until 2004. Though Tiger was top 10 multiple years as you can see 2005-2010.

 

Tiger was 1st in total driving in 2000. If SG stat existed it would be comparable to Rory's.

 

2000 Tiger: 2nd in distance, 71.22% of fairways

 

2019 Rory: 2nd in distance, 60.66% of fairways....

 

"Never as good as Rory with the driver"? In 2000, Tiger certainly was. Even if you compare him to every year of Rory.

[cdnglf]

> @straightshot7 said:

> > @cdnglf said:

> > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > > @dlygrisse said:

> > > > > > Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > > > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > > > > > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > > > > > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > What about around the greens and with the putter? Prime Tiger is like today's Rory McIlroy if Rory had better iron play, better wedge play, and the best short game and putting on tour.

> > > > >

> > > > > It's not even close. Tiger had no weaknesses in his game.

> > > >

> > > > Tiger was the best ever but there is no need to exaggerate. He was never as good as Rory is with the driver.

> > >

> > > Yeah I was expecting that comment. Tiger was as good with the driver at times, just not as consistently.

> > >

> > > But okay, subtract from the driver. He was still considerably better at every other aspect.

> > >

> >

> > Obviously a much better putter and IMO the greatest iron player ever. Quickly scanning through SG around the green (admittedly only tracked since 2004), I don't see much evidence that he had a significant edge in that category - makes me wonder if his short game was overrated.

> >

> > Rory has a notable advantage with the driver (and off the tee in general). Tiger never led SG off the tee and his best season is .896. Rory is near the top nearly every year. In his good years, he's just way better than everyone else - this year he's #1 at 1.215 and DJ is #2 at .8.

>

> Doesn't make any sense to look at SG with Tiger. That stat wasn't available until 2004. Though Tiger was top 10 multiple years as you can see 2005-2010.

>

> Tiger was 1st in total driving in 2000. If SG stat existed it would be comparable to Rory's.

>

> 2000 Tiger: 2nd in distance, 71.22% of fairways

>

> 2019 Rory: 2nd in distance, 60.66% of fairways....

>

> "Never as good as Rory with the driver"? In 2000, Tiger certainly was. Even if you compare him to every year of Rory.

 

Comparing fairway %s without distances isn't that useful. Rory hits it 15 yards further than Tiger did then.

Total driving doesn't correlate very strongly with SG Off the Tee . This year, Brendan Steele leads the former and is 18th in the latter.

 

You're guessing that Tiger was 50%+ better off the tee in 2000 than he was in any year from 2004 onward, including his 8 win season in 2006, and his 7 win season in 2007. He was almost as good overall in 06/07 as he was in 2000 (his adjusted scoring average was the same in 2000 and 2007). Was his putting and iron play really that much weaker in 2000?

 

 

 

 

[Golfjack]

Seriously you're not pretending the equipment is less than 15 yards difference between 2000 and 2019?

[LICC]

> @cdnglf said:

> > @straightshot7 said:

> > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > > > @dlygrisse said:

> > > > > > > Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > > > > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > > > > > > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > > > > > > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > What about around the greens and with the putter? Prime Tiger is like today's Rory McIlroy if Rory had better iron play, better wedge play, and the best short game and putting on tour.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It's not even close. Tiger had no weaknesses in his game.

> > > > >

> > > > > Tiger was the best ever but there is no need to exaggerate. He was never as good as Rory is with the driver.

> > > >

> > > > Yeah I was expecting that comment. Tiger was as good with the driver at times, just not as consistently.

> > > >

> > > > But okay, subtract from the driver. He was still considerably better at every other aspect.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Obviously a much better putter and IMO the greatest iron player ever. Quickly scanning through SG around the green (admittedly only tracked since 2004), I don't see much evidence that he had a significant edge in that category - makes me wonder if his short game was overrated.

> > >

> > > Rory has a notable advantage with the driver (and off the tee in general). Tiger never led SG off the tee and his best season is .896. Rory is near the top nearly every year. In his good years, he's just way better than everyone else - this year he's #1 at 1.215 and DJ is #2 at .8.

> >

> > Doesn't make any sense to look at SG with Tiger. That stat wasn't available until 2004. Though Tiger was top 10 multiple years as you can see 2005-2010.

> >

> > Tiger was 1st in total driving in 2000. If SG stat existed it would be comparable to Rory's.

> >

> > 2000 Tiger: 2nd in distance, 71.22% of fairways

> >

> > 2019 Rory: 2nd in distance, 60.66% of fairways....

> >

> > "Never as good as Rory with the driver"? In 2000, Tiger certainly was. Even if you compare him to every year of Rory.

>

> Comparing fairway %s without distances isn't that useful. Rory hits it 15 yards further than Tiger did then.

> Total driving doesn't correlate very strongly with SG Off the Tee . This year, Brendan Steele leads the former and is 18th in the latter.

>

> You're guessing that Tiger was 50%+ better off the tee in 2000 than he was in any year from 2004 onward, including his 8 win season in 2006, and his 7 win season in 2007. He was almost as good overall in 06/07 as he was in 2000 (his adjusted scoring average was the same in 2000 and 2007). Was his putting and iron play really that much weaker in 2000?

>

>

>

>

 

There was a big difference in Tiger’s driver from 1999-2002 compared to after. He was much more consistent then. It sounds like you didn’t see him in his prime years. Same with the game around the greens. Stats are limiting when evaluating that. Tiger would hit ok chips in normal situations, but then make absolutely amazing shots in highly challenging situations or when pressure was on the most. And his putting was always outstanding.

[LICC]

> @Shilgy said:

> Same guy that says Tiger 2000 will never be done again- because it hasn't happened before- also says this. !

>

 

There is nothing inconsistent with those statements. You don’t seem to read comments too closely.

 

[LICC]

2000 Tiger: 2nd in distance, 71.22% of fairways

2019 Rory: 2nd in distance, 60.66% of fairways...

 

Great info @straightshot7 Boom goes the dynamite ...

[Davethegolfer]

Just look at scoring average to understand how exceptional Tiger is.

[dlygrisse]

I would be surprised if we see this level of domination again....but you never know. What really happened in the 1990's was guys were soft, they were starting to make good money, although nothing like they did after Tiger arrived, and no one really seemed to dominate. Jack was done, Watson was done winning. Norman had his chance but was a choke artist, Seve was too inconsistent, Faldo was a machine but didn't really have the game to dominate. Feddie, was Freddie, Els had his moments, and Phil hadn't really got rolling yet. Tiger woke them all up. Oh $h!t we are getting steam rolled! If the modern players get complacent again then someone like Tiger could come along, but I don't see it happening anytime soon. I don't see it happening with the current crop. Brooks could win a few more, and have a Tom Watson sort of career, 8 or so majors.....but I just don't see that overall dominance happening.

 

The tour during the 90's was considered very deep...lot's of guys with a few majors....that was the explanation as to why no one dominated....sound familiar?

[dlygrisse]

> @LICC said:

> 2000 Tiger: 2nd in distance, 71.22% of fairways

> 2019 Rory: 2nd in distance, 60.66% of fairways...

>

> Great info @straightshot7 Boom goes the dynamite ...

 

 

There for a couple of seasons Tiger had it all. As soon as he went to Haney he lost his accuracy with the driver. The equipment was different though, give Rory a Titleist 975D with a DGX100 hard stepped and I bet he hits it straighter. Plus it's not all about fairways hit, it's also where your misses go.

[Ferguson]

Tiger had the "unique" ability to string wins and seasons together. Looking at the 1999 and 2001 seasons his ability should be tagged as unique.

 

1999 - 8 wins

2000 - 9 wins

2001 - 5 wins

 

So, that being said, the chances of someone else being as "unique" as Tiger, given the same time frame, is doubtful.

[LICC]

> @dlygrisse said:

> > @LICC said:

> > 2000 Tiger: 2nd in distance, 71.22% of fairways

> > 2019 Rory: 2nd in distance, 60.66% of fairways...

> >

> > Great info @straightshot7 Boom goes the dynamite ...

>

>

> There for a couple of seasons Tiger had it all. As soon as he went to Haney he lost his accuracy with the driver. The equipment was different though, give Rory a Titleist 975D with a DGX100 hard stepped and I bet he hits it straighter. Plus it's not all about fairways hit, it's also where your misses go.

 

Tiger was losing accuracy before he went to Haney. Around 2003 it started. His iron play actually got even more accurate with Haney.

[Brandons68]

The tour is just too competitive these days. I think nobody will get there for a very long time. Brooks has a good chance if he starts playing better in non majors.

[disco111]

> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

 

> Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close.

 

That one word......."DRIVE", is the main reason why it won't happen again. Tiger had a goal which was driven into him from early childhood and his indoctrination into determination and work ethic was molded by a man who himself had those qualities. Today's players are basking in a tour that is very talented and more money then ever and apparently still going up. When players are not hungry and have a lifestyle that most can only dream about, it not that hard to see "lazy" come into the equation.

 

 

[bscinstnct]

>

> There for a couple of seasons Tiger had it all. As soon as he went to Haney he lost his accuracy with the driver. The equipment was different though, give Rory a Titleist 975D with a DGX100 hard stepped and I bet he hits it straighter. Plus it's not all about fairways hit, it's also where your misses go.

 

One of the **biggest "what ifs" for Tiger is....

 

What IF he grew up playing 460 CC and graphite in his driver?

 

TW played a small head, 43.5 steel shaft during his early years and was Top 5 in distance and 70% in accuracy.

 

Then, the tidal wave of graphite and modern driver heads came and he was suddenly no longer the longest. At first he took to long to switch. Then, he had to switch and never really made the switch as seamlessly as he should have. He was still Tiger, still long, but the accuracy went way down.

 

Also, it was how he handled the loss in distance relative to the field that may have prompted him to leave Butch and totally change his swing.

 

So, what IF TW grew up playing the modern driver and maintained his lead in distance as well as being very accurate?

 

Scary to think about the results.

 

Here is a great piece with Butch on how this impacted TW game so much,

 

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/gd0608_harmontiger

 

"One of the reasons I believe Tiger felt he needed to change his swing was to increase his driving distance. When he first turned pro, Tiger drove it past everybody by a healthy margin. Davis Love III and John Daly were close, but no one consistently hit it as far and in as many fairways as did Tiger. When he needed to blast it past an opponent, he had that ability. Then, in about 2001, players started catching up with him. Ernie Els, Phil Mickelson and Vijay Singh all started hitting the ball close to, if not as long as, Tiger, and occasionally those players and others hit it by him. He never admitted it, but I believe that bothered him. He knew he generated more clubhead speed than anyone else out there, and he had gotten even faster since he'd started working out in his mid-20s, so being challenged off the tee was not something that was supposed to happen. When it did, I think he decided he needed to make some changes.

 

I believe that Tiger's perceived loss of distance (or the fact that the rest of the tour started catching up to him in the distance category) had more to do with his equipment than his golf swing. He insisted on staying with a 43 3/4-inch steel-shafted driver with a smaller head, while his fellow-competitors were playing 45-inch graphite shafts and jumbo titanium heads.

 

It's hard to question Tiger's reluctance to make a dramatic equipment change. He was the best player in the world. Tossing your driver when you're playing great is a tough thing to do. There were plenty of graphite shafts Tiger could have hit, but he took a cautious approach to change. No one can fault him for that decision. But I think overhauling his golf swing was a mistake when putting a new driver in the bag would have done the trick."

[redfirebird08]

> @spk7 said:

> I believe there’s too much talent now to see another person dominate like tiger used to

 

This exact same statement was made in the early to mid 1990's before Tiger destroyed the rest of the tour. Guess we'll see how it plays out over time. I think the next Tiger will most likely come from China. They have a much larger population to find someone very unique.

[the bishop]

> @LICC said:

> 2000 Tiger: 2nd in distance, 71.22% of fairways

> 2019 Rory: 2nd in distance, 60.66% of fairways...

>

> Great info @straightshot7 Boom goes the dynamite ...

 

You don't say...

[redfirebird08]

> @cdnglf said:

> > @straightshot7 said:

> > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > > > @dlygrisse said:

> > > > > > > Define talent then, because if you are talking about physical talent then there are plenty of guys who have been as good or better and there are plenty today. Mental focus and drive (I will add a huge sense of self belief) is the key differentiator. Jack had it, Tiger had it, Bobby Jones had it, Hogan had it for a short period of time. Not many others had it for more than a month or so. On the driving range the tour is full of Tiger Woods’s.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > > > > > Physically these guys are there and surpassed TW.

> > > > > > > > > Talent level close but a tough call.

> > > > > > > > > Mental focus and DRIVE, no one even close, though BK shows potential.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > None of these guys today are even close in talent to Tiger in his prime.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > What about around the greens and with the putter? Prime Tiger is like today's Rory McIlroy if Rory had better iron play, better wedge play, and the best short game and putting on tour.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It's not even close. Tiger had no weaknesses in his game.

> > > > >

> > > > > Tiger was the best ever but there is no need to exaggerate. He was never as good as Rory is with the driver.

> > > >

> > > > Yeah I was expecting that comment. Tiger was as good with the driver at times, just not as consistently.

> > > >

> > > > But okay, subtract from the driver. He was still considerably better at every other aspect.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Obviously a much better putter and IMO the greatest iron player ever. Quickly scanning through SG around the green (admittedly only tracked since 2004), I don't see much evidence that he had a significant edge in that category - makes me wonder if his short game was overrated.

> > >

> > > Rory has a notable advantage with the driver (and off the tee in general). Tiger never led SG off the tee and his best season is .896. Rory is near the top nearly every year. In his good years, he's just way better than everyone else - this year he's #1 at 1.215 and DJ is #2 at .8.

> >

> > Doesn't make any sense to look at SG with Tiger. That stat wasn't available until 2004. Though Tiger was top 10 multiple years as you can see 2005-2010.

> >

> > Tiger was 1st in total driving in 2000. If SG stat existed it would be comparable to Rory's.

> >

> > 2000 Tiger: 2nd in distance, 71.22% of fairways

> >

> > 2019 Rory: 2nd in distance, 60.66% of fairways....

> >

> > "Never as good as Rory with the driver"? In 2000, Tiger certainly was. Even if you compare him to every year of Rory.

>

> Comparing fairway %s without distances isn't that useful. Rory hits it 15 yards further than Tiger did then.

> Total driving doesn't correlate very strongly with SG Off the Tee . This year, Brendan Steele leads the former and is 18th in the latter.

>

> You're guessing that Tiger was 50%+ better off the tee in 2000 than he was in any year from 2004 onward, including his 8 win season in 2006, and his 7 win season in 2007. He was almost as good overall in 06/07 as he was in 2000 (his adjusted scoring average was the same in 2000 and 2007). Was his putting and iron play really that much weaker in 2000?

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It wasn't that much weaker in 2000. He was winning majors by 8 to 15 shots that year. This was not happening in 2006 or 2007, when he would win a ton of tournaments (very high win percentage), but was not blowing fields out of the water. Driving accuracy was a problem for him during the Haney years, but he still won a heck of a lot because of his mind, his iron play, and his short game/putting.