Over/Under: PXG will still be in business in 5 years?

[GoGoErky]

Pxg is targeting the customer that doesn’t care about price and wants the best. It’s why they talk about the process used to make their clubs and that they don’t worry about r&d cost or when a product comes out which is why you see gen 3 a year after Gen2 despite gen2 coming out several years after gen1.

Titleist and those other brands are targeting the every day golfer. these brands have a set budget for marketing, r&d, etc. they have shareholder to answer to and sales numbers are important. These brands thanks to pxg realize there is a high end golf product market in the US thanks to pxg. So titleist did the no limit thing with the concept line, Callaway with the epic forged and Tm with the p790 ti. The have these high end options and typically smaller production numbers while still catering to the general public who doesn’t want to pay high end prices regardless if they are better or not.

[Man_O_War]

there's a market for PXG...same reason people were Rolex watches instead of casio straps..they do both tell the time

[MaineMariner]

I come from a thoroughly middle class, Subaru-driving background. I've always felt like something of an outsider when it comes to golf, a sport that I genuinely love. I really dislike PXG and everything it stands for. I mean, that goes for basically every vapid (IMO) "luxury" brand, so this isn't so much a dig at Bob Parsons or the company in particular. They just rub me the wrong way.

Having said all that, the company will still exist in 5 years. There is a market for luxury golf whatevers.

[bluedot]

"Price and perceived exclusivity" is exactly the difference between Timex and Rolex, too, isn't it? I can get a Timex that does MORE things than any watch Rolex makes, just as I can get a Ping club that does everything that a PXG club does.

I would agree that Timex and Rolex is perhaps the most extreme example of the difference between normal vs luxury goods that one can think of; literally NOBODY is trying to decide between those two options. But I think the general analogy holds for PXG vs. the other major OEM's that you mention; PXG is marketing itself completely differently than the others, and I'm not sure that lots of golfers are sitting there right now trying to decide between a new set of Pings vs PXG's.

Setting aside the "PXG for Heroes" program, the only guys I know that are using PXG's are not using them because they've been proven superior in terms of hitting long, accurate golf shots. I do NOT mean for this to sound dismissive or judgemental, but they are "money is no object" guys who just don't care what stuff costs. PXG, like Rolex, is trying to sell a few clubs at a HUGE price point to make their money; Ping and the others are trying to sell a LOT of clubs at a completely different price point (and I would assume profit margin per club).

I'll agree that there is more overlap in the target market for PXG and Ping than for Timex and Rolex, which zero. But the point is still the same; whether or not PXG is viable going forward has a lot more to do with the way the company is run than it does how many sets of PXG's you see on the range vs the other OEM's.

[the bishop]

PXG in a good position on the PHX Open leaderboard right now with Horschel and Wyndham Clark tied at the top. That kind of exposure helps anybody. Like I said earlier they are not for me and whatever you think of Parsons, I think he's taking the long view.

[Mattwillgo]

I’m in the over camp. They were written off by many with Gen 1, purely on price, and their products seem to be getting better with each generation. People like having aspirational products and I think that is especially true in the golf market. Look how many boutique putter companies command high prices but sell out whenever products become available. They seem to have great engineering which leads to innovation that people appreciate. I’m not gonna lie though, a big reason I have them in my bag is because of the PXG for Heroes program.

[ShallowbutDeadly]

Ping clubs are not in the same feel,, they feel terrible and they stlll aren't value priced. If you actually put good shafts in a Blue Print, they are $3k

[braincramp52]

That's your opinion which is obviously not shared by millions of golfers over the last 40 years.

[ShallowbutDeadly]

 

Of course it's my opinion.

PXG has only been around 6 years. So what happened the 34 years prior is meaningless.

Pings aren't inexpensive by any stretch and they are low quality cheap castings that can't even be lie and loft adjusted. If they were $500, fine, but they aren't, new Pings push $1500-2000

[braincramp52]

What in the world are you talking about? You have always been able to adjust the lofts and lies going all the way back to the Eye2's. Somebody that had a set of Ping clubs kick your dog? If you don't like Pings that's fine , but know your facts before you bash them. Cheap castings my ass.

[ShallowbutDeadly]

You do realize why they have the dot system, right?

Talk to any real fitter about bending Pings, you can bend them at your own risk.

I've had Pings and they were a huge disappointment.

[braincramp52]

They have the dot system because Ping practically invented custom fitting. I've personally adjusted the lofts and lies of 100's of sets of Ping irons over the years. I did REAL fitting for 15 years. You have no idea what your talking about. You had Pings and you were disappointed, why not just say that instead of a bunch of crap that everybody else knows isn't true.

[LeoLeo99]

My psychology professor touched on this in a lecture. The study he discussed had to do with plain white vinegar. People rated the more expensive brand name better than the no name brand even though there were the same exact vinegar.

[ShallowbutDeadly]

Ping clearly states on the website if you adjust the clubs you void the warranty. I went to numerous fitters to adjust them and got turned away because they didn't want to risk snapping them; all of them recommended sending them in to Ping which is a big inconvenience. Even Ping recommends sending them in for adjustment. I know people that have bent them themselves and they didn't stay in the adjusted position. I'm sure you can bend them with effort but they aren't made to be bent by local builders. Google it if you think I'm full of it.

 

[rjp322]

He isn’t the only way to feel this way about bending Pings. Most good club techs also feel the same way. There is a reason Ping recommends customers to send their irons to Ping to have bent. I’ve also thought Pings never have felt near as good as most other irons but they do perform pretty well.

[braincramp52]

I don't have to Google it. My 410's I played last season were bent 2 degrees flat last May and were still 2 degrees flat when I got rid of them in December. I know what ping recommends. It's called protecting your butt.

[braincramp52]

So I assume you know what kind of a builder and fitter I was since most GOOD fitters all feel the same way.

[ShallowbutDeadly]

The difference between an average fitter/builder and a great one is they won't comprise clubs you paid $1500 for. If you want to risk ruining your own gear, so be it.

Covering your butt comment was a cop out. Ping clearly states you are voiding the warranty by adjusting them.

All that aside, Ping don't feel anywhere near as far as a PXG. There is a reason why two of their best club designers risked leaving very comfortable careers to join a risky upstart.

[Jimv]

Trying to compare a $10 bottle of wine to a $50 bottle of wine is nonsense! Forget personal tastes which vary greatly and none are wrong. If the $10 guy could sell his bottle for $50 he would, but he cant, and that's a fact.

[Tac]

I’ll go with over.

I’m going to guess that Parsons takes great pride in getting clubs to vets at a reasonable price (whether it’s keeping them in golf or introducing them to golf) and that’s one of his main goals.

[braincramp52]

Wow! You're like arguing with Paddy2iron. This is the last post I'll make here because this thread is about PXG not Ping. Feel is subjective so if you think PXG feels better than a S55 or Blueprint or Iblade then I'm happy for you. Men and women buy used Ping irons everyday that they take and get adjusted for loft and lie. That's a fact, not opinion. I'm not sure where you live that you're paying $1500 for a set of Pings unless you're talking Blueprints. You saying Schweigert and Nicolette left Ping because PXG has a better feel is priceless. They hadn't been designed by them yet. Have a great day.

[tannyhoban]

Ping clubs obviously work very well on tours and for amateurs around the globe. Feel is certainly subjective, but I think you'll find that many if not most would disagree with you.

As for the fitting I believe you are incorrect on all counts.

Early on in PXG threads there were posters making redonkulous claims about what wonder clubs PXG were. Nobody needs to shill.

PXG will likely be around in 5 years - but I thought Nike would stick it out so take it fwiw.

[ShallowbutDeadly]

Those two gents left Ping for PXG because they felt there was a lot of improvement to be had and Ping was doing the same old thing for a while. They were right!

If you want to ruin people's Ping irons,, have fun with that. My guidance comes from the horse's mouth... PING!

Have you seen the price of G710s or Blue Prints?

[braincramp52]

I have. 710's are $1137, If you read my post I mentioned the Blueprints. I've never ruined a set of Pings in my life. Now I'm done. You and Paddy_2_iron must be neighbors.

[ShallowbutDeadly]

With a decent shaft that is included in a pxg, like a steelfiber, they are $1400-1500. About $400 more than an 0211 and no where near the feel and forgiveness.

If you've adjusted pings yourself, you have comprised the integrity of the casting, whether you think so or not. I would hate to have you as a builder.

[ckay]

Parsons is a business man. I think PXG will grow and become profitable enough to be sold to a group of investors assuming he hasn’t sold off shares for funding already.

[MtlJeff]

Why would he do this though? Isn't this a passion project for him? If he was just looking for an investment to cash out of there's much easier ways to do it than golf clubs right?

[ckay]

Every passion project just turns into work. The passion got him to build the company, maintaining it will be work. That’s just my take on it. Doesn’t mean it’s an accurate assessment. ?

[tannyhoban]

Again, that is incorrect. We have Ping certified fitters locally who will adjust loft and lie.

I know this to be true. Stick to what you know for sure and drop it.

[braincramp52]

Thank you! The guy just doesn't get or has been fed a bunch of BS.