golf's three most overrated currently common beliefs ?

[The Pearl]

Thanks Richard, beautiful answer.

 

Stay well. 

[RoyalMustang]

On 7/1/2021 at 12:33 PM, Fairway14 said:

1) distance is highly significant to scoring

2) getting fit for clubs is essential

3) large club heads are more forgiving than small club heads

 

The above are three common perceptions I often hear and, or, read, but find to be misleading and, or, false.

For example, if a player can consistently strike 235 yard straight tee shots he is long enough to shoot under par golf on a 6,800 yard championship course. I understand it is trendy to think that having a 9-iron shot from the rough is better than a 6-iron shot from the middle of the fairway , but on the golf courses I rarely see amateurs playing from the rough or trees all day shoot low scores. I see lots of guys playing from the middle of the fairway shoot low scores.

Regarding "fitting" I believe it's a marketing strategy designed to sell clubs and services more so than anything which will significantly impact a player's shots or scores. Give a player who consistently breaks 75 a club and within a swing or two he will make technique adjustments to produce respectable shots from that club. Higher handicap players have swing technique issues which no club will solve, so if they want to strike better shots the solution is improved swing technique. 

Large club heads, be it driver, fairway woods, irons, or putter are designed to produce better shots from mishits. This is backwards thinking. A good club design is one which promotes consistently solid strikes, and most players will hit more pure-solid strikes with a relatively small club head than they will swinging an over sized head.

 

Please post to this thread thread three common beliefs about golf that you find to be overrated and, or, false.

 

I will bite on the 1st 2:

 

1) this is personal experience, but I agree.  I was somewhat inadvertently chasing distance but was wild; I don't need a 320 yard drive sprayed around; I need 285 in the fairway.  My scores have come down considerably since I dialed down my driver and stopped swinging so damn hard.  Sure, I love to hit those 320 yard bombs, but it raised my scores.  

 

To another poster who said "yeah, you can't drive 235 and play well on a 6900 yard course"; I would respond that anyone driving 235 should not be playing those tees. A good player with a decent amount of athleticism these days can drive 265-275. If you are already a very good ball striker and only driving 235, you are probably in the senior category or have some other physical ailment keeping your distance down (like a friend who has early stage MS), which won't be corrected by chasing more distance.  If you are in that category; you should be moving a tee forward.  I am 43 and 5 foot 8; by no means a big guy or super athletic, but if I can make 75% effort, consistent swings with a non-fitted driver and roll out 285, so can you.  As soon as I move to 90% effort, I gain some yards but I also am in danger of putting the ball into bad spots. 

 

If you are only driving 235 and are young and fit, you aren't likely yet a good ball striker.  Develop your swing naturally and the distance will come. Most good players who hit the ball 300+ yards aren't specifically chasing distance: they just hit the ball well and the distance is the result of a good swing. 

 

Everyone has a different game; know your strengths and weaknesses: polish those strengths to make them elite and minimize the weaknesses so that they don't overly hurt you.  Look at how Ichiro played: he possessed incredible raw power, as anyone who saw him him BP can attest to, but on the field, he used his generational talent of putting the bat on the ball and getting on base.  His power was impressive but so are a lot of guys' power: nobody else possessed his combination of hand-eye coordination and speed however, which is what made him a 1st-round HOF lock.  

 

I would say chase good swing mechanics, not distance. Distance will come, but more importantly, so will accuracy.  And I would trade 235 in the fairway every time vs 320 with hazard penalties on a regular basis. I can still reach in 2 on virtually any par4 from 235 (if I hit the ball well, of course!)

 

2) club fitting: probably not as big of a deal as we make it out to be.  There is a large industry out there that makes big $$$ fitting and selling clubs. I get a complimentary subscription to Golf Magazine and 30 pages each issue seem like a paid advertisement for True Spec golf.  Sure, it helps, but what is a well fit club vs a suitable "off the shelf" club worth?  Maybe a stroke or 2 a round?  How much is a consistent, repeatable swing worth?  15 strokes, based on my progression over the past year.  Equipment is always the "easy" upgrade but never the one you need.  I autocross with a bunch of Porsche folks locally and am about average in skill: my car, however, was upgraded by the previous owner and is about as dialed from an AutoX perspective as it could be.  It has 30k worth of track upgrades and is barely street legal at this point.  Well, guess what? I am still beaten on a regular basis by a guy in a Macan S and barely beat a guy in a Cayenne GTS.  We are talking highly tuned, 3000 lb mid-engined sportscar vs 4000 and 5100 lb SUVs (but still Porsche, which means the best driving SUV you can buy, but still).  Those guys are VERY skilled AutoX drivers though and can make their cars do things that I can't.  My car is worth perhaps 1.5 seconds but their skills are worth 4 to 5.  And we are talking about cars here, which is so much more important than a set of clubs in terms of equipment importance.  Or to put it another way, would you rather be you, racing up the Alps on a state of the art, $15,000 bike, or Lance Armstrong (doping notwithstanding) on a entry-level, $1,200 road bike?  We all focus too much on equipment, and it shouldn't be ignored, but neither should it be prioritized. 

 

 

Edited July 13, 2021 by RoyalMustang

[Bad9]

42 minutes ago, RoyalMustang said:

To another poster who said "yeah, you can't drive 235 and play well on a 6900 yard course"; I would respond that anyone driving 235 should not be playing those tees.

 

The OP says this as his second full sentence in his thread opening post. Its literally the basis of the next 12 pages of this thread to which most disagree with him on.

 

"For example, if a player can consistently strike 235 yard straight tee shots he is long enough to shoot under par golf on a 6,800 yard championship course."

Edited July 13, 2021 by Bad9

[trilerian]

1 hour ago, RoyalMustang said:

 

I will bite on the 1st 2:

 

1) this is personal experience, but I agree.  I was somewhat inadvertently chasing distance but was wild; I don't need a 320 yard drive sprayed around; I need 285 in the fairway.  My scores have come down considerably since I dialed down my driver and stopped swinging so damn hard.  Sure, I love to hit those 320 yard bombs, but it raised my scores.  

 

 

 

 

 

But you are already hitting it 285 with less effort.  Also, I completely disagree with your notion that any young healthy persons can hit it as far as you do just by changing their mechanics.  Some people, and I would actually say most based on the fact that most people don't have a good swing, can't make a good swing or learn how to.  

 

I've had quite a few lessons over the years and one thing has been consistent over those lessons.  I hit the ball farther with my crappy swing than I do trying to make a swing doing what instructors want me to do.  And I don't hit the ball as far as you do, even when I was young, limber, and not overweight. 

[RoyalMustang]

24 minutes ago, Bad9 said:

 

The OP says this as his second full sentence in his thread opening post. Its literally the basis of the next 12 pages of this thread to which most disagree with him on.

 

"For example, if a player can consistently strike 235 yard straight tee shots he is long enough to shoot under par golf on a 6,800 yard championship course."

 

Sure, if he has elite up-and-down skills and elite ball-striking, he/she could get close to par.  But if someone is facing a 450 yard par 4, I would argue that being close to the pin from 215 on the approach is a tall order if he can only drive 235.  So that means up and down, and par at best.

 

My argument is that length matters but that 235 is not an adequate benchmark. If you can hit the green from 215 on an approach shot, you can drive further than 235, and if you can't hit greens in regulation due to tee distance, you can't shoot par.  Chasing length means getting past what you should be in terms of distance, not teeing off to a point where players of similar ability are hitting a 3-iron.  That is how I read it (nevermind the 235).  A player is a 2 handicap and drives 265 but wants to chase distance-will driving 300 get him to scratch? Sure, IF he doesn't lose accuracy. That is where I read the argument as going.

[RoyalMustang]

13 minutes ago, trilerian said:

 

But you are already hitting it 285 with less effort.  Also, I completely disagree with your notion that any young healthy persons can hit it as far as you do just by changing their mechanics.  Some people, and I would actually say most based on the fact that most people don't have a good swing, can't make a good swing or learn how to.  

 

I've had quite a few lessons over the years and one thing has been consistent over those lessons.  I hit the ball farther with my crappy swing than I do trying to make a swing doing what instructors want me to do.  And I don't hit the ball as far as you do, even when I was young, limber, and not overweight. 

 
I didn't mean changing mechanics per-se; it was more about hitting the ball well (which has to do with mechanics but it needs to be a good swing).  What is 260 in terms of distance?  105 Swing speed? that should be attainable by a relatively fit, healthy person, right?  Or maybe I am way off here.  My exposure is seeing kids on the high school team, every single one of them, even the scrawny, playing for 2 years JV kids, hitting it 260. The varsity kids all carry 285 or more-they aren't big guys but they make good contact.  

 

I see a lot of older people at the range who probably picked up golf later in life that hit it low 200's; perhaps they get lessons, perhaps they don't, but either way, I don't know a ton about swings but I can say they don't have a good one. Even if they could drive the ball 300+, they wouldn't be part of this focus group as they would be lucky to break 90. 

 

If you can swing 100-105mph and hit the ball in the center of the driver, it pretty much has to go 250-270 unless I am missing something.  

 

This is hard to quantify, as you can't just give a really good player a 4-iron as his longest club and say "go shoot par".  He will still have length that a much shorter hitter won't have.  You would basically have to pull out of the bag the driver, fairway wood, hybrid, keep a 4-iron, then ditch the 5/6 again to make it equivalent of a person who drives 235.  Maybe that is the experiment to run. What does a very good player shoot when he only has a 3 or 4 iron as a driver, then a 7-PW and normal wedge assortment?  How many strokes does that give up? Again, assuming that player and the sample 235 yard player are equivalent ball strikers. 

Edited July 13, 2021 by RoyalMustang

[Krt22]

58 minutes ago, Bad9 said:

 

The OP says this as his second full sentence in his thread opening post. Its literally the basis of the next 12 pages of this thread to which most disagree with him on.

 

"For example, if a player can consistently strike 235 yard straight tee shots he is long enough to shoot under par golf on a 6,800 yard championship course."

 

 

Let's assume this mythical club golfer exists and give them LPGA tour level SG from the fairway on every 2nd/3rd shot with this 235 yard drive. I don't have SG data past 250, so for Par 5s I assumed a 200 yard perfect layup (in the fairway as well). So if this 235 and straight golfer hits 14/14 fairways, essentially 18/18 with par 5s all being 3 shot holes, and he had LPGA tour level ball striking, he would shoot 73.26 on average. This actually all vibes out, since we all know a golfwrx 4 can beat an LPGA tour player.

 

Edit:Assumption above is actually from 6700 yards, 6800 would be a hair less than a stroke higher most likely

 

 

Edited July 13, 2021 by Krt22

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

Average handicap is 14.7

 

Balls are allowing everyone to hit too far.

 

Take your time when playing.

 

It’s only what you write on the scorecard that counts.

 

Everyone should be capable of professional level putting.

[trilerian]

3 minutes ago, RoyalMustang said:

 
I didn't mean changing mechanics per-se; it was more about hitting the ball well (which has to do with mechanics but it needs to be a good swing).  What is 260 in terms of distance?  105 Swing speed? that should be attainable by a relatively fit, healthy person, right?  Or maybe I am way off here.  My exposure is seeing kids on the high school team, every single one of them, even the scrawny, playing for 2 years JV kids, hitting it 260. The varsity kids all carry 285 or more-they aren't big guys but they make good contact.  

 

I see a lot of older people at the range who probably picked up golf later in life that hit it low 200's; perhaps they get lessons, perhaps they don't, but either way, I don't know a ton about swings but I can say they don't have a good one. Even if they could drive the ball 300+, they wouldn't be part of this focus group as they would be lucky to break 90. 

 

If you can swing 100-105mph and hit the ball in the center of the driver, it pretty much has to go 250-270 unless I am missing something.  

 

There is a pretty big advantage for swing speed with golfers who learn as kids and have to find different leverage points to swing a big heavy stick vs golfers who learned by overpowering the club.  

 

As to what swing speed should be attainable?  No idea, it's all about leverage and moving your body in a way to get the most out of it.  If you are good at doing that, then the sky is the limit, but if you're not, you will have a lower ceiling.  My point though is that most amateurs are not good at doing that.  The average male golfer drives it 225 (or somewhere really close to that), that is about 90 mph clubhead speed with the driver.  And I play with those guys all the time, and see them on the range all the time.  

 

I've been playing about 100 rounds a year for the last 6 years.  I get paired up with random people, and watch a lot of other people playing.  I don't often see people who can hit their driver over 250.  Yes they are out there, but they are in the minority.  

[betarhoalphadelta]

30 minutes ago, trilerian said:

 

But you are already hitting it 285 with less effort.  Also, I completely disagree with your notion that any young healthy persons can hit it as far as you do just by changing their mechanics.  Some people, and I would actually say most based on the fact that most people don't have a good swing, can't make a good swing or learn how to.  

 

I've had quite a few lessons over the years and one thing has been consistent over those lessons.  I hit the ball farther with my crappy swing than I do trying to make a swing doing what instructors want me to do.  And I don't hit the ball as far as you do, even when I was young, limber, and not overweight. 

 

I would agree that most in the mid-high handicap range don't have good swings. I don't agree that they can't learn how to. Most just won't ever put in the effort to actually do it.

 

285 might be a stretch, but I believe that any able-bodied male adult between 20 and 50 years old without significant physical disabilities or limitations should be able to pop their driver out there >250 (total, not carry) without swinging out of their shoes. Any one in that category with top quartile athleticism and strength is physically able to get to that 285 number. Not "elite" by any stretch; we're talking the top 25% of people.

 

Now, most won't actually do that. But most won't also put in the effort for their iron ballstriking and short game that @Fairway14's unicorn 235-driving scratch golfers have put in. Those 235-driving unicorns aren't your typical mid-high handicapper with an ugly subpar swing either, I'm sure. 

[StudentGolfer4]

285 is a lot longer than some people in this thread seem to think. Doing it 4-5 times a round is also much different than hitting 285 as your average drive. 
 

For reference. 2021 pga tour average is 295.5. They have another stat that is average of all drives and that number is lower at 289.5 

 

(full disclosure, I’m not familiar with the difference between those two numbers but I bet someone around here is)

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

4 minutes ago, StudentGolfer4 said:

285 is a lot longer than some people in this thread seem to think. Doing it 4-5 times a round is also much different than hitting 285 as your average drive. 
 

For reference. 2021 pga tour average is 295.5. They have another stat that is average of all drives and that number is lower at 289.5 

 

(full disclosure, I’m not familiar with the difference between those two numbers but I bet someone around here is)

 

This is quite true.

[PappyVanWinkle53]

Golf's most overrated belief:   We must grow the game

 

[jlvgolf]

34 minutes ago, StudentGolfer4 said:

285 is a lot longer than some people in this thread seem to think. Doing it 4-5 times a round is also much different than hitting 285 as your average drive. 
 

For reference. 2021 pga tour average is 295.5. They have another stat that is average of all drives and that number is lower at 289.5 

 

(full disclosure, I’m not familiar with the difference between those two numbers but I bet someone around here is)

 

Arccos has a lot of data on this, their average scratch handicap drives the ball 259 on average - that is average drive length on par 4 and par 5 holes. I would assume most people probably are just thinking about their typical good drive when they say "I hit it 285."

 

To put it in perspective, a 9 handicap has an average drive of 235.

 

But to talk about the scratch golfer with an average drive of 235 - 

A 9 handicap loses about 10.2 strokes to a scratch golfer in an average round

According to Arccos this is:

Off the tee: -2.7 strokes (-1.7 distance/-1 accuracy)

Approach: -3.4

Short game: -1.8

Putting: -2.3

 

If every part of a 235 yard driver's game was on par with the typical scratch golfer, they'd still be about a 2 handicap just due to to the lack of distance off the tee. Finding that extra 1.7 strokes wouldn't be impossible for a great golfer, but at scratch there isn't much low hanging fruit.

 

 

Edited July 13, 2021 by jlvgolf

[virtuoso]

1 hour ago, Lincoln_Arcadia said:

Average handicap is 14.7

 

Balls are allowing everyone to hit too far.

 

Take your time when playing.

 

It’s only what you write on the scorecard that counts.

 

Everyone should be capable of professional level putting.

I feel like a mosquito at a nudist colony: I wouldn't even know where to begin....but you nailed the 14.7 part.

 

Edited July 13, 2021 by virtuoso

[Forged4ever]

49 minutes ago, StudentGolfer4 said:

285 is a lot longer than some people in this thread seem to think. Doing it 4-5 times a round is also much different than  hitting 285 as your average drive.

Superb point SG👊
 

Fairways Greens & Fair Skies 4ever My Friend⛳️
RP

[Fairway14]

56 minutes ago, StudentGolfer4 said:

285 is a lot longer than some people in this thread seem to think. Doing it 4-5 times a round is also much different than hitting 285 as your average drive. 
 

For reference. 2021 pga tour average is 295.5. They have another stat that is average of all drives and that number is lower at 289.5 

 

(full disclosure, I’m not familiar with the difference between those two numbers but I bet someone around here is)

 

285 yards on flat terrain at sea level is a very long drive. At Tour events such as Pebble Beach, Riviera , Torey Pines half the field hits their driver shots less than 285. On the internet hitting it 285 is as easy as typing some keys, much different from playing a golf course.

Actually, to go 235 a ball need be struck mostly solid - square.  Not too many significantly mishit shots travel 235. At last year's PGA guys were hitting 5-wood from the 215 tee bocks at Harding's 8th hole.

Also, again, architects typically make "450 yard par 4's" have elevated tee blocks and, or, wide fairways, wide openings at the front of the greens etc...  so that players may approach the green with long clubs.

[Krt22]

5 minutes ago, Fairway14 said:

 

285 yards on flat terrain at sea level is a very long drive. At Tour events such as Pebble Beach, Riviera , Torey Pines half the field hits their driver shots less than 285. On the internet hitting it 285 is as easy as typing some keys, much different from playing a golf course.

Actually, to go 235 a ball need be struck mostly solid - square.  Not too many significantly mishit shots travel 235. At last year's PGA guys were hitting 5-wood from the 215 tee bocks at Harding's 8th hole.

Also, again, architects typically make "450 yard par 4's" have elevated tee blocks and, or, wide fairways, wide openings at the front of the greens etc...  so that players may approach the green with long clubs.

And the guy driving it 235 while playing the wrong tees is still hitting wedge into those easy 450 yard par 4s.

[ChipStrokes]

6 minutes ago, Krt22 said:

And the guy driving it 235 while playing the wrong tees is still hitting wedge into those easy 450 yard par 4s.

what? you’ve never heard of a driver, driver, two-putt par?

[Krt22]

17 minutes ago, ChipStrokes said:

what? you’ve never heard of a driver, driver, two-putt par?

You are right, if it works in Wii golf, it will work on those easy long par 4s with runways leading to the green

[virtuoso]

Every time someone posts about driving distance, usually within a few minutes they are scolded for overestimating the correlation between greater distance and lower score. The scolders are right, but what they miss is that many amateurs would trade score for more distance...because out-driving your buddies is one of the great joys of the game. If I offered a deal to mid level handicappers that allowed them to add 10 yards to their tee shot for every 1 stroke they added to their index....the amount of guys asking for 40 yards to give up 4 strokes would be staggering.

[Marty86]

57 minutes ago, ChipStrokes said:

what? you’ve never heard of a driver, driver, two-putt par?

 

I got paired up with someone who said he was a 3 HCP here at one of the Bethpage courses and on a par 5 he actually hit a driver off the deck on his 2nd shot and actually 2 putted for a birdie after. So yes the mythical does exist!!

[RoyalMustang]

2 hours ago, StudentGolfer4 said:

285 is a lot longer than some people in this thread seem to think. Doing it 4-5 times a round is also much different than hitting 285 as your average drive. 
 

For reference. 2021 pga tour average is 295.5. They have another stat that is average of all drives and that number is lower at 289.5 

 

(full disclosure, I’m not familiar with the difference between those two numbers but I bet someone around here is)

 

I know from my time on the range that the D1 players out there are always out-carrying me by 20-45 yards.  That is probably a better measure of what elite-type of players can do when they are swinging without restriction. 

 

I played a round the other day: my long drive was about 305, short was 245 (hit it on the heel and low but it rolled a ways), but those were all open fairways/no hazards.  I don't typically walk off my numbers, but if a par 4 is 440 and I am hitting a 9-iron from 150 into the pin, it is a good bet that I am about 290 out.   I wouldn't count any hole where I didn't hit driver or purposely choked down to keep the ball out of trouble. On the tour, given where they play,  I bet a lot of guys aren't swinging past 65% to keep the ball in play, so that pulls the average down.  There is no way my SS is even within 15% of what the typical pro is capable of: they have so many more swings and so much better golf-specific conditioning available to them. 

 

 

[RoyalMustang]

3 hours ago, trilerian said:

 

There is a pretty big advantage for swing speed with golfers who learn as kids and have to find different leverage points to swing a big heavy stick vs golfers who learned by overpowering the club.  

 

As to what swing speed should be attainable?  No idea, it's all about leverage and moving your body in a way to get the most out of it.  If you are good at doing that, then the sky is the limit, but if you're not, you will have a lower ceiling.  My point though is that most amateurs are not good at doing that.  The average male golfer drives it 225 (or somewhere really close to that), that is about 90 mph clubhead speed with the driver.  And I play with those guys all the time, and see them on the range all the time.  

 

I've been playing about 100 rounds a year for the last 6 years.  I get paired up with random people, and watch a lot of other people playing.  I don't often see people who can hit their driver over 250.  Yes they are out there, but they are in the minority.  

 

Same here with random pairings, but I also play regularly with 3 grad school buddies who took up the game in the last year.  All got serious and all got lessons: they all can drive the ball 300+.  One guy ran D1 track but the other 2 are just moderately fit late 20 year olds.  The thing they all have in common is lessons and learning a solid, repeatable swing.  It is a lot easier to pick up golf at 12 years old than 28, but much easier at 28 than 55, especially if you don't build good habits on Day 1.  

 

The bulk of the population isn't taking lessons and isn't actively working on their game.  Sure, they beat balls at the range, but are they improving or reinforcing bad habits in doing so?  Lets face it: being a decent, let alone good, golfer, takes commitment and time management.  People with jobs can't waste time on imperfect practice.  4 hours a week to practice is actually quite a lot if the right things are being practiced; but 4 hours a week reinforcing bad habits isn't getting people anywhere.  

 

My assumption is that anyone that we are referring to is actively getting better or already really good: after all, the premise was a scratch golfer, right? 

[RoyalMustang]

3 hours ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

I would agree that most in the mid-high handicap range don't have good swings. I don't agree that they can't learn how to. Most just won't ever put in the effort to actually do it.

 

285 might be a stretch, but I believe that any able-bodied male adult between 20 and 50 years old without significant physical disabilities or limitations should be able to pop their driver out there >250 (total, not carry) without swinging out of their shoes. Any one in that category with top quartile athleticism and strength is physically able to get to that 285 number. Not "elite" by any stretch; we're talking the top 25% of people.

 

Now, most won't actually do that. But most won't also put in the effort for their iron ballstriking and short game that @Fairway14's unicorn 235-driving scratch golfers have put in. Those 235-driving unicorns aren't your typical mid-high handicapper with an ugly subpar swing either, I'm sure. 

 

Well said.  My post above referenced 3 friends, all late 20's/early 30's, who took up golf during COVID and all drive over 300 yards without any special physical gifts. In fact one of them is pretty darn soft and out of shape: he only recently got fit enough to walk 18 holes.  They all took lessons and got started the right way though, and all are down in the 12-16 HDCP range.  

 

There is a big distinction between people who simply like to play; those who practice but practice poorly, and those who are practicing efficiently and constantly improving.  That last group is less than 5% I bet.  Take those golfers and you will see most of them hitting at least 250.  

[nsxguy]

2 hours ago, Fairway14 said:

 

285 yards on flat terrain at sea level is a very long drive. At Tour events such as Pebble Beach, Riviera , Torey Pines half the field hits their driver shots less than 285. On the internet hitting it 285 is as easy as typing some keys, much different from playing a golf course.

Actually, to go 235 a ball need be struck mostly solid - square.  Not too many significantly mishit shots travel 235. At last year's PGA guys were hitting 5-wood from the 215 tee bocks at Harding's 8th hole.

Also, again, architects typically make "450 yard par 4's" have elevated tee blocks and, or, wide fairways, wide openings at the front of the greens etc...  so that players may approach the green with long clubs.

 

 

Now you've got me trying to figure out which side of your distance argument you're on.

 

 

 

Yours ?

 

 

 

 

 

Or yours ?

 

 

[Fairway14]

1 minute ago, nsxguy said:

 

 

Now you've got me trying to figure out which side of your distance argument you're on.

 

 

 

 

That last post was about 285 actually being 235. Hope this helps.

[Soloman1]

I discovered that you can put someone on ignore and you won't see their posts at all. It's great on the blood pressure. You don't even have to see their nonsense. Yeah!

 

Then I discovered that you will still see their posts if someone quotes them. Sigh.

 

I'm going to put myself on ignore. That's probably the best thing anyway.

 

I wonder why every graph of average driving distance vs. handicap always shows farther is lower? It's a conspiracy of misinformation. Interesting to see virtuoso posting again. For those of you who don't know, he's got a great swing and knows what he's talking about.

[Ghost of Snead]

37 minutes ago, Soloman1 said:

I discovered that you can put someone on ignore and you won't see their posts at all. It's great on the blood pressure. You don't even have to see their nonsense. Yeah!

 

Then I discovered that you will still see their posts if someone quotes them. Sigh.

 

I'm going to put myself on ignore. That's probably the best thing anyway.

 

I wonder why every graph of average driving distance vs. handicap always shows farther is lower? It's a conspiracy of misinformation. Interesting to see virtuoso posting again. For those of you who don't know, he's got a great swing and knows what he's talking about.

 

Since farther is lower and higher swing speeds are farther, can we make the leap that higher swing speeds are lower ?  Just trying to learn here ...

[Soloman1]