Switching out to a different ball when putting

[Mr. Bean]

3 hours ago, Golferpaul said:

This is another rule that has no reason to exist.   As others have said, if the ball is damaged you replace it.  If it's not damaged, who cares?  It's the SAME TYPE OF BALL!  Why should I care if you change from a PROV1 #4 to a cleaner PROV1 #3?  What advantage is gained?

 

Why would you want to change your ball on the putting green, just to save the trouble of cleaning your ball?

[sui generis]

5 hours ago, Golferpaul said:

What advantage is gained?

 

 Imagine the chaos. Bryson DeChambeau would have at least six balls for putting one for long putts, one for short putts, one for left to righters, another for downhiil putts, et al. Now, Golferpaul, that would be stupid and you'd be to blame.  🙄

[Mr. Bean]

35 minutes ago, sui generis said:

 

 Imagine the chaos. Bryson DeChambeau would have at least six balls for putting one for long putts, one for short putts, one for left to righters, another for downhiil putts, et al. Now, Golferpaul, that would be stupid and you'd be to blame.  🙄

 

If those six balls were identical, why would Bryson have six balls? Not that I support Golferpaul's idea but just curious.

 

Edited December 11, 2021 by Mr. Bean

[Greenie]

9 hours ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

Why would you want to change your ball on the putting green, just to save the trouble of cleaning your ball?

Very easy answer. It saves time. "Ready golf"

There are so many simple things a person can do to speed up play.

 

I myself carry a Ballzee ball cleaner to save time cleaning my ball. The only time it doesn't save time to use is on the green if it is my time to putt and my ball is dirty. It is much easier to swap out my ball "the same model" putt with it and clean my dirty ball while waiting on my next putt, walking to the cart, walking to the next tee box etc. 

 

I've waited plenty of times on people on the green polishing their ball like they need some high gloss shine on it before they can putt with it. I've waited on people that left their towel on their bag and went to their bag to clean their ball. I don't play with anyone that has their own caddy to wipe their ball off while they read their putts. So anything to speed up play I'm all for. 

 

When playing as a single I always drop a clean ball on the green to putt with it and clean the other ball as I walk to the next tee box.

 

 

 

[Mr. Bean]

1 hour ago, Greenie said:

Very easy answer. It saves time. "Ready golf"

There are so many simple things a person can do to speed up play.

 

I myself carry a Ballzee ball cleaner to save time cleaning my ball. The only time it doesn't save time to use is on the green if it is my time to putt and my ball is dirty. It is much easier to swap out my ball "the same model" putt with it and clean my dirty ball while waiting on my next putt, walking to the cart, walking to the next tee box etc. 

 

I've waited plenty of times on people on the green polishing their ball like they need some high gloss shine on it before they can putt with it. I've waited on people that left their towel on their bag and went to their bag to clean their ball. I don't play with anyone that has their own caddy to wipe their ball off while they read their putts. So anything to speed up play I'm all for. 

 

When playing as a single I always drop a clean ball on the green to putt with it and clean the other ball as I walk to the next tee box.

 

 

 

 

I hear your reasoning. However, if cleaning a ball is slowing you and your group down there must be many many other issues regarding pace of play for you to tackle before changing the Rule.

 

From a practical point of view, allowing people to change their ball on the putting green would inevitably result in numerous errors and penalties when people accidentally changed the brand and/or model as well.

[Greenie]

5 hours ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

I hear your reasoning. However, if cleaning a ball is slowing you and your group down there must be many many other issues regarding pace of play for you to tackle before changing the Rule.

 

From a practical point of view, allowing people to change their ball on the putting green would inevitably result in numerous errors and penalties when people accidentally changed the brand and/or model as well.

In my foursome we have no problem playing in 3:15 if not held up on the course. Some may say that is rushing around be we certainly don't rush. 

 

I can't say we have many issues with slow play in our group.. We have been playing as a group a long time and over the yrs we have eliminated many things that we consider slowing us down. We look for ways to be more efficient and if someone brings up something someone is doing that is slowing us down we discuss it or joke about it. 

 

As far as changing our ball on the putting green. Everyone knows the official rule and our group rule. You are expected to replace a dirty ball with same ball or you are considered cheating. Everyone carries an extra ball with them. It saves time. 

 

It's funny how many little things can add up to wasted time on the course. Eliminating a bunch of little things can add up to a lot of saved time on the course without rushing one bit.

[Mr. Bean]

1 hour ago, Greenie said:

As far as changing our ball on the putting green. Everyone knows the official rule and our group rule. You are expected to replace a dirty ball with same ball or you are considered cheating. Everyone carries an extra ball with them. It saves time. 

 

 

Sure, maybe even 10 seconds per hole for the 1st player to putt, total of 3 minutes per group per round. Are you absolutely sure it is worth changing the Rule..?

 

Seriously, I clean my ball while checking the line of putt so your talk about saving time is a complete moot. If cleaning a ball slows your group down you are doing something seriously wrong.

 

Edited December 11, 2021 by Mr. Bean

[Golferpaul]

21 hours ago, davep043 said:

Which rule are you on about?  The Rule that says you play the same ball all the way from the tee into the hole, except in one of the many specific situations when you are allowed to substitute a different ball?  That doesn't seem particularly onerous to me

I didn't say it was onerous.  I said it has no reason to exist.

 

It's about as useless as having a rule that says you have to use the same tee until it breaks.

[Golferpaul]

21 hours ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

Why would you want to change your ball on the putting green, just to save the trouble of cleaning your ball?

Yes, or for no reason at all.  Maybe I don't want to walk back to my cart to retrieve a cleaning rag.  Or may I prefer to putt with a number 3 ball.  

[Golferpaul]

19 hours ago, sui generis said:

 

 Imagine the chaos. Bryson DeChambeau would have at least six balls for putting one for long putts, one for short putts, one for left to righters, another for downhiil putts, et al. Now, Golferpaul, that would be stupid and you'd be to blame.  🙄

So, what's the problem with six balls?  Yes, it would be stupid but so is the one ball rule.

[rogolf]

7 minutes ago, Golferpaul said:

It's about as useless as having a rule that says you have to use the same tee until it breaks.

Of course you're aware of Interpretation 4.3a(7)/1 which prohibits using a broken tee found on the tee box or elsewhere; it's using another player's equipment.

[sui generis]

1 minute ago, Golferpaul said:

So, what's the problem with six balls?  Yes, it would be stupid but so is the one ball rule.

 

Hmmm. doesn't seem the Rules folder is your happy place. The "rules am stupid" crowd doesn't last long here. 😒

 

Maybe head over to Tour Talk and expound on Rickie Fowler's white belts or something else of earth-shattering significance.

[sui generis]

Just now, rogolf said:

Of course you're aware of Interpretation 4.3a(7)/1 which prohibits using a broken tee found on the tee box or elsewhere; it's using another player's equipment.

 

Oh, he'll know all about that one that one alright. 😉

[Newby]

9 hours ago, sui generis said:

 

Oh, he'll know all about that one that one alright. 😉

It was in the original draft that I saw issued by the RNLGA

[jobin]

Rules FAQs

Starting the Hole (Teeing Area)

Using Borrowed, Abandoned or Broken Tee

Q.May I use a borrowed, abandoned or broken tee?

A.Yes. The Rules only require that you use a conforming tee. It doesn’t matter where you get the tee from as long as it is conforming (see Definition of Tee).

[Mr. Bean]

3 hours ago, Newby said:

It was in the original draft that I saw issued by the RNLGA

 

Rules No Longer in Golf Association ?

[Mr. Bean]

13 hours ago, rogolf said:

Of course you're aware of Interpretation 4.3a(7)/1 which prohibits using a broken tee found on the tee box or elsewhere; it's using another player's equipment.

 

Is that the one that was drafted due to enormous pressure from one of the largest tee manufacturers Tee & Coffey Corporation?

[Greenie]

13 hours ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

Sure, maybe even 10 seconds per hole for the 1st player to putt, total of 3 minutes per group per round. Are you absolutely sure it is worth changing the Rule..?

 

Seriously, I clean my ball while checking the line of putt so your talk about saving time is a complete moot. If cleaning a ball slows your group down you are doing something seriously wrong.

 

Well Mr. Bean by your own statement you say it adds up to three minutes per round in your group. Not a big deal for sure but when you are saving three minutes here on this issue and three minutes here on this issue the total time saved on the little stuff adds up to a fair of amount of time save IMO.

 

Yes in my group we were doing something seriously wrong with this issue. We have the guy that won't carry a wet towel with him to the green. He will go back to his bag and wipe his ball with his wet towel hanging on his bag. One other guy polishes his ball like he needs some kind of shine on it. The other guy wants to borrow my ballzee when his ball has a fair amount of dirt on it. So what takes your group 10 seconds for cleaning your balls you can imagine took us a little longer. So a solution that works for us is replace your ball with a like clean ball and waste your time cleaning your ball somewhere else.

[Mr. Bean]

2 minutes ago, Greenie said:

Well Mr. Bean by your own statement you say it adds up to three minutes per round in your group.

 

No, I said it adds 3 minutes to YOUR group. Like I said, I clean my ball while checking the lines so no additional time is wasted.

 

By your description your group seems to have memory problems. 😁 If someone cannot remember to take a small towel with him (which I have on my belt, btw) he just might forget the 2nd ball as well...

 

All in all, I find the risks far far greater than the benefits, not to mention that cleaning the ball is not necessary at all more often than it is.

[TwistedSister]

No need for a towel I have the all purpose cleaner...SPIT  and the ever present cloth...trousers.  sheesh!

[denkea]

16 hours ago, Greenie said:

You are expected to replace a dirty ball with same ball or you are considered cheating.

WOW!   I'll bet you have a list of numerous things that are contrary to the rules of golf for your group.

[DaveLeeNC]

This is a rules group so discussions such as this are certainly well within 'the reasonable bounds of discourse'. But wouldn't it be nice if issues such as this one were typical of the problems that you see in the 'quality' of scores posted for handicap in the US. 

 

dave

Edited December 12, 2021 by DaveLeeNC

[antip]

22 hours ago, rogolf said:

Of course you're aware of Interpretation 4.3a(7)/1 which prohibits using a broken tee found on the tee box or elsewhere; it's using another player's equipment.

You sure, I thought it was 4.3a(7)/2; /1 was about not being able to borrow any else's spliff.

[Newby]

14 minutes ago, antip said:

You sure, I thought it was 4.3a(7)/2; /1 was about not being able to borrow any else's spliff.

No. He knows all the rules re borrowing spiffs. He doesn't lend them out.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Newby

[Righty to Lefty]

On 12/7/2021 at 10:53 PM, dubbelbogey said:

For casual rounds, I have a separate ball for putting, but it's identical in make/model/year to my tee ball. The only reason I do this is for speed and expediency so I always have a clean ball to putt with and it's one less thing to do before putting. I've just never been a fan of dragging a wet towel onto the green. My buddies all know about this, a lot of them do the same, and none of them have an issue with it. Yeah, technically not within the rules, but hey, I still sleep well at night.

 

Of course, if I'm in any real sanctioned competition, doing this is not allowed, so I don't do this in that situation.

 

I've never even thought to do that but I like it....I hate dragging a wet towel around for some reason that I can't fully explain so I'm going to have to try this method out.  

[Colin L]

I just don't get how cleaning  balls on the green takes up any appreciable amount of time.  Mindful of this conversation during my game this morning, I wasn't aware at any time of anyone delaying their putt because they were cleaning their ball.  I confess that unless it's particularly mucky, I usually use dhacker's technique and give it a dicht on my breeks* but a couple of times today there was too much mud on it and I had to go to my trolley to clean it on a cloth.  That took only a few seconds as my trolley was, as usual, close to the green which made me wonder if the time factor is only there, if at all, if you are riding a  kart  and it's a distance away form the green?  We were all, as usual, walking.

 

3hrs 25 for a septuagenarian foursome.  Not bad going.

 

* = "a wipe on my trousers" for those untutored in the language of the home of golf. 

Edited December 13, 2021 by Colin L

[Mr. Bean]

What is all this talk about carrying a wet towel?? I have a dry towel, I spit on the ball and wipe it clean. No big deal.

 

I sometimes have a separate wet towel on my trolley for cleaning clubs but I have never even thought of taking one onto the green.

[Golferpaul]

On 12/11/2021 at 5:29 PM, sui generis said:

 

Hmmm. doesn't seem the Rules folder is your happy place. The "rules am stupid" crowd doesn't last long here. 😒

 

Maybe head over to Tour Talk and expound on Rickie Fowler's white belts or something else of earth-shattering significance.

I mistakenly thought this board was for discussing the rules.  Now I understand that this board is for DEFENDING the rules and only defending the rules produces material that is of "earth-shattering significance". 

 

I'll keep that in mind.

[Golferpaul]

17 hours ago, antip said:

You sure, I thought it was 4.3a(7)/2; /1 was about not being able to borrow any else's spliff.

Sharing a spliff is highly encouraged.  Spliffs are not equipment.

[davep043]

1 minute ago, Golferpaul said:

I mistakenly thought this board was for discussing the rules.  Now I understand that this board is for DEFENDING the rules and only defending the rules produces material that is of "earth-shattering significance". 

 

I'll keep that in mind.

You've provided no real reason for saying the rule "has no real reason to exist".  One of the primary principles of golf is that you play the ball from tee to the hole.  Not "a" ball, not "any" ball, "THE ball.  Over the centuries a large number of exceptions have evolved, but that same general principle applies to this day.  There's no reason to scrap it simply because you find it inconvenient, which seems to be your primary concern.