Tiger Woods vs Tom Brady > Dominance

[2bGood]

1 hour ago, deadsolid...shank said:

 I don’t believe if anyone were starting a team and could pick any QB in history, in their prime, TB would be the leading vote getter. 

You are living up to your name with that post. 😉

 

Poor Brady, no respect out of school - drafted 199, 6th QB taken. Dude played his way into the super bowl 10 out of 18 years, wins 7 rings and put up monster numbers and he still not going in the first round in the fantasy draft? 

 

Imagine going into that draft knowing you get 18 years out of a player at top level?

 

Funny thing is I am not a big fan of Tom Brady - but I am a fan of excellence and Tom has that in spades. 

[shoot4par]

On 2/8/2021 at 9:30 AM, xxio said:

Harder to be GOAT in team sports. Too many variables. 

 

Imagine if Pippen didnt get traded for Olden Polynice.....

 

This. Comparing team sports to individual sports is comparing apples to oranges. Brady is the GOAT at his respective position in his game. At times he had a phenomenal defense and in Tampa he filled a position of deficiency. Add in Gronk, Fournette, AB and that rookie O lineman and you've got a perfect storm. Not to mention that defense is fast at LB and mature upfront 

Edited February 10, 2021 by shoot4par

[BlackDiamondPar5]

Staying healthy is part of the success.  Brady gets my vote because physically he's about 32 years old, whereas Tiger is approaching 65 😂

Heck Langer at 63 makes TW look like an old man 🙂

[deadsolid...shank]

8 hours ago, 2bGood said:

You are living up to your name with that post. 😉

 

Poor Brady, no respect out of school - drafted 199, 6th QB taken. Dude played his way into the super bowl 10 out of 18 years, wins 7 rings and put up monster numbers and he still not going in the first round in the fantasy draft? 

 

Imagine going into that draft knowing you get 18 years out of a player at top level?

 

Funny thing is I am not a big fan of Tom Brady - but I am a fan of excellence and Tom has that in spades. 

Doesn’t change the fact that there were several more talented QB’s through the years. There was a reason he lasted til the 6th round. Do you think if Cleveland had drafted him he would have six rings?

I won’t diminish what he has accomplished (how could you), but the simple fact is he was in the perfect situation for him to have that kind of success. 

[Hawkeye77]

I've never heard Tom Brady yell "Omaha" - you just can't be the greatest ever without yelling "Omaha". 

 

I see that as a Linus Van Pelt quote in a Peanuts cartoon on NFL GOATS. 😉

 

Marino was awesome but Don Strock put on one of the most memorable Dolphins passing exhibitions I ever saw, even though they lost to the Chargers.  Tarkenton was incredible, Staubach historically underrated, Bradshaw, darn him, has the record and the rings, Daryle Lamonica (!), on and on.  Hard to plug and play QBs onto other teams but fun to do. Just don't ever tell me that Jim (Chrissie) Everett would ever have won a ring with any Super Bowl group, lol, because it's not plug and play!

[Hawkeye77]

1 hour ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

Staying healthy is part of the success.  Brady gets my vote because physically he's about 32 years old, whereas Tiger is approaching 65 😂

Heck Langer at 63 makes TW look like an old man 🙂

Langer is an athletic marvel! What I wouldn't give for his profile, lol, one solid as a rock chin!

Edited February 9, 2021 by Hawkeye77

[2bGood]

1 hour ago, deadsolid...shank said:

Doesn’t change the fact that there were several more talented QB’s through the years. There was a reason he lasted til the 6th round. Do you think if Cleveland had drafted him he would have six rings?

I won’t diminish what he has accomplished (how could you), but the simple fact is he was in the perfect situation for him to have that kind of success. 

 

This conversation reminds of that scene in Moneyball  with the scouts are talking about all the same old garbage and ignoring the hard irrefutable numbers. 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2021 by 2bGood

[bscinstnct]

1 hour ago, deadsolid...shank said:

Doesn’t change the fact that there were several more talented QB’s through the years. There was a reason he lasted til the 6th round. Do you think if Cleveland had drafted him he would have six rings?

I won’t diminish what he has accomplished (how could you), but the simple fact is he was in the perfect situation for him to have that kind of success. 

 

Ya, and you gotta feel for Bledsoe! He is a primary factor in the Pats going from perennial losers to a highly competitive team. Then he gets hurt. Brady gets the starting job.

 

Then Belichick takes over in 2000. 

 

And then come the Super Bowls starting in 2001!

 

But, gotta give full credit to Brady for being a huge key to all the success. 
 

 

Edited February 9, 2021 by bscinstnct

[forrester_fire]

Hard to compare a team sport to an individual sport.  Brady is only on the field for roughly 50% of the game, isn't responsible for running, blocking, kicking, tackling, etc.

 

As far as individual sports are concerned, I'm more impressed with guys like Dan Gable and John Smith from the amateur wrestling world than either Tiger or Brady.

Edited February 9, 2021 by forrester_fire

[2bGood]

On 2/8/2021 at 9:34 AM, bscinstnct said:

 

I agree and add that he is a true field general. His commitment and work ethic are as strong as TWs. 
 

But he had weaknesses. Specifically, mobility/dealing with pressure “up the gut”. 
We saw this in his 2 losses to the Giants. 
 

TW had no weaknesses. Nobody could touch his game. 

 

I’m just pointing out that Bradys success has depended a *lot on his protection, system, weapons. And let’s not forget...Defense!
 

Without them, he’d be Dan Marino. 

Tiger had no weaknesses? Yes there were moments when that was true, but over his career his health and his driving have been overarching weaknesses. Even his mental game went south for a period of time. 

[curt_jr]

On 2/8/2021 at 9:02 AM, 2bGood said:

Brady hands down. Brady has won nearly twice as many 'majors' as the next QB and 2 more than any player. Brady has 7/18 majors since he was a starter - 39% of seasons he  started he won the Super Bowl  - this is insane.

 

Tiger - not even the best golfer with 3 less majors than Jack

Tiger - won 15 of 82 majors - 18%

 

Tiger was great but Brady has achieved way more in his sport. 

 

 

 

 

I feel like to use that stat to compare the two, you have to account for the amount of potential winners in each major... there aren't just two golfers who can win each major like there are only two teams who can win the super bowl (when it's played, obviously more during the season).

[FakeClubPro]

15 hours ago, 2bGood said:

You are living up to your name with that post. 😉

 

Poor Brady, no respect out of school - drafted 199, 6th QB taken. Dude played his way into the super bowl 10 out of 18 years, wins 7 rings and put up monster numbers and he still not going in the first round in the fantasy draft? 

 

Imagine going into that draft knowing you get 18 years out of a player at top level?

 

Funny thing is I am not a big fan of Tom Brady - but I am a fan of excellence and Tom has that in spades. 

 

Tom works very hard and he is smart.  He surrounds himself with smart people plus his wife is an over achiever.  Tom worked for it.   He knows more about the opposing team before game day than most of the coaches due to hard work.

 

The guy who had kind of had Tom's number?  Eli Manning.   I liked Eli because he was the quiet younger brother that would never supposedly match up even close to Peyton.  He also seems to be a nicer person than Peyton too.   Eli stared down GOAT once or more than once. 

[2bGood]

4 minutes ago, curt_jr said:

I feel like to use that stat to compare the two, you have to account for the amount of potential winners in each major... there aren't just two golfers who can win each major like there are only two teams who can win the super bowl (when it's played, obviously more during the season).

Of course there are not just two teams that can win the super bowl. There are 32 teams that can win it every year - getting to the Super Bowl is part of the accomplishment of winning it. 

 

The question to drive at is getting into a major easier than getting into a Super Bowl? There is no answer, but we are here for fun.

[Aviador Naval]

Perhaps an appropriate metric is who could be eclipsed.

 

Tiger - had the long game and putting of Jack with an incredible short game.  It produced run of golf artistry and dominance for a few years that is likely to never be duplicated.  But, some questionable lifestyle/fitness choices impacted his longevity and his record in majors is reachable - not to mention second...

 

Brady - his record is more untouchable than Wilt’s 100 points in a game.  Moreover, those stressing (appropriately) that it is a team game make it sound like he’s played on the 70s Steelers, 80s Forty-Niners, or 90s Cowboys.  In 21 seasons, he’s played 3 with a HOF receiver and 10 with a HOF tight end (no overlap between the two) and ZERO with HOF lineman and running backs.

Edited February 9, 2021 by Aviador Naval

[dropkicked]

Dam, you guys must all be living in a cold place too!

6 more weeks until golf guys.. 6 more weeks. 😅🖖🏼

[curt_jr]

33 minutes ago, 2bGood said:

Of course there are not just two teams that can win the super bowl. There are 32 teams that can win it every year - getting to the Super Bowl is part of the accomplishment of winning it. 

 

The question to drive at is getting into a major easier than getting into a Super Bowl? There is no answer, but we are here for fun.

Nah, I'm not saying there are just two that can win the Super Bowl in general. But if you're considering that 'The Major' of the NFL, the amount of winners is severely limited compared to PGA majors. On that point though, could winning your conference be a mini-major, so Brady's number is even higher?

 

Exactly, it's a fun line of thought.

 

Would be interested to look at it from a perspective of how many people / competitors each GOAT beat out to get their win. 

[2bGood]

30 minutes ago, curt_jr said:

Nah, I'm not saying there are just two that can win the Super Bowl in general. But if you're considering that 'The Major' of the NFL, the amount of winners is severely limited compared to PGA majors. On that point though, could winning your conference be a mini-major, so Brady's number is even higher?

 

Exactly, it's a fun line of thought.

 

Would be interested to look at it from a perspective of how many people / competitors each GOAT beat out to get their win. 

Around about 1/22 NFL players get to the Super Bowl every year and 1/11 win it. (with about 2000 NFL players each year)

 

The numbers for golfers are likely about 1/3 'pro' golfers play in a major each year. (I am guess that there are 600 pros amongst the PGA, Euro tour and others with about 200 different ones getting into one of the majors each year) then about 1/50 win a major each year not accounting for multiple winners. 

 

Then the longevity thing... way easier to get into the NFL, but way harder to stay there.

 

When you add in average career length etc etc etc etc.A mathematician could have allot of fun running all these numbers. 

[bscinstnct]

1 hour ago, Aviador Naval said:

Perhaps an appropriate metric is who could be eclipsed.

 

Tiger - had the long game and putting of Jack with an incredible short game.  It produced run of golf artistry and dominance for a few years that is likely to never be duplicated.  But, some questionable lifestyle/fitness choices impacted his longevity and his record in majors is reachable - not to mention second...

 

Brady - his record is more untouchable than Wilt’s 100 points in a game.  Moreover, those stressing (appropriately) that it is a team game make it sound like he’s played on the 70s Steelers, 80s Forty-Niners, or 90s Cowboys.  In 21 seasons, he’s played 3 with a HOF receiver and 10 with a HOF tight end (no overlap between the two) and ZERO with HOF lineman and running backs.

 

You make a good point mentioning the “supporting cast”. 

 

Tiger gets all the credit for his championships

 

Brady gets part credit for his. 
 

How much?

 

Well, Defense is half the game, so obviously he gets less than half. 
 

Then you have to give credit to the offensive line, backs and receivers. 
 

Gotta be fair to give them at least 70% of the remaining 50%.

 

So. There’s a total of 15% credit left.

 

Then the coaches gotta get at least 10% off the top for putting the whole strategy and plans and personnel together.

 

So, Brady gets 5%

 

Thats very fair, I don’t think he would dispute that.  
 

Tiger gets 100% credit for all his own wins. 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2021 by bscinstnct

[2bGood]

1 hour ago, bscinstnct said:

 

You make a good point mentioning the “supporting cast”. 

 

Tiger gets all the credit for his championships

 

Brady gets part credit for his. 
 

How much?

 

Well, Defense is half the game, so obviously he gets less than half. 
 

Then you have to give credit to the offensive line, backs and receivers. 
 

Gotta be fair to give them at least 70% of the remaining 50%.

 

So. There’s a total of 15% credit left.

 

Then the coaches gotta get at least 10% off the top for putting the whole strategy and plans and personnel together.

 

So, Brady gets 5%

 

Thats very fair, I don’t think he would dispute that.  
 

Tiger gets 100% credit for all his own wins. 

 

 

Tiger has/had coaches and a caddie. 

Edited February 9, 2021 by 2bGood

[bscinstnct]

1 hour ago, 2bGood said:

Tiger has/had coaches and a caddie. 

Hey, you’re right. And Stevie/Joe get 10% of the cash so it’s fair to give them that much credit. 

 

Coaches? Yeah, I guess 5%-10% too. 
 

Actually, gotta up Stevies credit to 15% for being a bodyguard and barking at the photographers 😂

 

 

 

[cardoustie]

a QB is way more than 5% ... c’mon

[bscinstnct]

34 minutes ago, cardoustie said:

a QB is way more than 5% ... c’mon

 

Of the whole operation?

 

To give perspective on how important the entire organization is.

 

Just look at the lowly Jets in my own hometown. 
 

And tell me if TB12 was on the Jets, they would have even one much less 7 Super Bowls! 😂

 

I’m not saying a great QB doesn’t make an enormous difference. 
 

But just look at how Mahomes performed to see how important the rest of the team is. 
 

Now, we are actually all forgetting the most dominant athlete of all time.

 

 

Carl Lewis!

 

 

[2bGood]

3 minutes ago, bscinstnct said:

 

Now, we are actually all forgetting the most dominant athlete of all time.

 

 

Carl Lewis!

 

 

Didn't he have the same dealer as :

 

 

 

Edited February 10, 2021 by 2bGood

[FakeClubPro]

2 hours ago, 2bGood said:

Tiger has/had coaches and a caddie. 

He had the best caddie who ever played the game in Steve Williams.  Brady did not have a Steve Williams.

[FakeClubPro]

9 minutes ago, bscinstnct said:

 

Of the whole operation?

 

To give perspective on how important the entire organization is.

 

Just look at the lowly Jets in my own hometown. 
 

And tell me if TB12 was on the Jets, they would have even one much less 7 Super Bowls! 😂

 

I’m not saying a great QB doesn’t make an enormous difference. 
 

But just look at how Mahomes performed to see how important the rest of the team is. 
 

Now, we are actually all forgetting the most dominant athlete of all time.

 

 

Carl Lewis!

 

 

That is a young Eddie Murphy

[bscinstnct]

1 minute ago, FakeClubPro said:

That is a young Eddie Murphy

 

Ha! Before your time FCP

 

 

“I race horses, Mann!”

 

 

[FakeClubPro]

12 hours ago, bscinstnct said:

 

Ha! Before your time FCP

 

 

“I race horses, Mann!”

 

 

Ha ha. He was funny when he was young then he got a big head and was just kind of boring.  Steve Martin kind of lost it too. 

 

[shoot4par]

On 2/9/2021 at 1:59 PM, forrester_fire said:

Hard to compare a team sport to an individual sport.  Brady is only on the field for roughly 50% of the game, isn't responsible for running, blocking, kicking, tackling, etc.

 

As far as individual sports are concerned, I'm more impressed with guys like Dan Gable and John Smith from the amateur wrestling world than either Tiger or Brady.

 

Tiger is in complete control of his performance minus the draw which can be equated to a schedule. I think the argument that Rodgers is the most talented QB; I've seen so far minus Mahomes. Talent doesn't necessarily reflect in numbers, championships and records in team sports. I've been singing Brady's praises since 2001 so definitely not diminishing the accomplishments;  just think that talent typically reflects more accurately in individual sports.

Edited February 11, 2021 by shoot4par

[FakeClubPro]

22 hours ago, 2bGood said:

Didn't he have the same dealer as :

 

 

 

Wow - this clown makes Patrick Reed look like a saint.   The cheating was bad enough and kind of normal in bike racing.  The threatening other people like a Mafia Don by this creep Armstrong did should have landed him in jail. 

[Fairways_and_Greens]

Hands down, Tiger. He dominated on his own. 

 

If Brady was DOMINANT, he would have won the Super Bowl with the capped out Patriots, not jumping to a team with a killer O-line and defense.

 

Both are GOATs, but Tiger was more dominant.