2021 Irons/Wedges for Sweepers

[babyfade]

Hi guys. I haven't found a helpful thread to this topic that isn't 3 or more years old, so I try to open a new one.

 

I (6 hcp) am in the process of buying new Irons and Wedges. My swing is short, compact and I am sweeping from the inside, which results to a straight draw and a shallow to non-existent divot.

 

At the moment I own a mixed set of MP18 and MP18SC, which I played for 3 years. I am ok with them, I normaly strike them, but I am short.

 

Thats why I am searching new Irons and got interested with the Srixon ZX5/ZX7. I'd like more forgivness and more lenght and I search a iron that is good for my sweeper swing. Do you think the ZX5/ZX7 are a good choice? or are there better Irons for sweepers?

 

One important question concerning irons: I am 176cm (= 5.78 feet) and normally i feel that a flatter Lie Angle would be better for me. When I was fitted for my MP18s, the guy said that it's Standard. Most distance clubs are longer and steeper than my MP18s. Do you think a flatter Lie Angle would help my sweeping action from the inside? Or would it cause even more draw/hook. The hook is my bad shot.

 

Regarding Wedges I got stuck with the new Vokeys. I a thread that is 3 years old, some people prefere the S Grind over the M Grind as a sweeper. What would you say? Or are there better Wedges for sweepers? I only need a 50 and 54, as I already ordered a Hitoe Bigfoot for sandplay... maybe no the best option for a sweeper but I wanted to try it out. 🙂

 

Thank you for your help.

Edited March 16, 2021 by babyfade

[babyfade]

Can somoene help me?

 

- ZX5/7 as a sweeper?

- flatter lie angle as a sweeper?

- best wedges for sweepers?

 

thx

[craz-e]

I would say there are better options than the Srixon's for a sweeper. In theory the V-Sole should work best for a digger or someone slightly steeper. Worth looking at irons with a narrower sole and if possible go try them off grass and turf conditions you normally play in.

[steventoo]

I have similar characteristics and couldn't be happier with my Titleist T100 irons. I'm 2cm taller but can't remember the length/lie specs.

 

I know they're not a 2021 model, but they're fantastic irons and very much worth trying out. They aren't as scary to hit as their shape might imply.

 

I can't help much with wedges, sorry!

[BogeyParBogey]

Usually flatter promotes more of a fade ball flight.  Most fitting carts have flat clubs available.  Maybe pick up one that is 1 or 2 degrees flat and try it?  Mizuno standard specs are also more flat than other manufacturers.

 

ZX5/ZX7 are going to look much different than MP18/MP18 SC.  I also would think the V-sole is not that well suited to a sweeper swing.

 

Dave

[spring70]

Srixon did not work for me as a sweeper.

[Lobber]

I am a sweeper and do better with thinner soled irons.  Currently gaming Apex 21 Pro and loving them.  Also gaming a Srixon X5/7 combo set and the trf interaction is ok but not quite as clean as the Apex 21 Pros for me

[toddmanley]

I'm a sweeper too and have a set of Apex 21 Pro's being built right now.  Coming from playing Mizuno blades for the past ~18 years (33's, 18's) I really like the look and turf interaction of the Callaway irons.

[rxk9fan]

I am a huge Srixon fan, but I think the v-sole might suit us diggers better.  

I honestly don't know what would be best for a sweeper, and those sweepers that have answered you have recommended a thin sole.  My un-educated answer would have probably been the opposite, thinking a wider sole with some bounce would be the answer?  Live and learn for sure.

 

[Lobber]

1 hour ago, toddmanley said:

I'm a sweeper too and have a set of Apex 21 Pro's being built right now.  Coming from playing Mizuno blades for the past ~18 years (33's, 18's) I really like the look and turf interaction of the Callaway irons.

I think you will be very happy with your purchase. I certainly am

[Lobber]

1 hour ago, rxk9fan said:

I am a huge Srixon fan, but I think the v-sole might suit us diggers better.  

I honestly don't know what would be best for a sweeper, and those sweepers that have answered you have recommended a thin sole.  My un-educated answer would have probably been the opposite, thinking a wider sole with some bounce would be the answer?  Live and learn for sure.

 

I have tried wider sole game improvement type irons as a sweeper and just don’t get along with the soles. Not knocking game

improvement irons in anyway and I could use a bit

more forgiveness with a thin sole

 

[babyfade]

thanks for your answers. the apex pro's where my first choice but then I switched to the Srixons. So maybe I should try the apex pros's and the t100s instead. I am happy how I am hitting my MP18, I'm just too short imo. but maybe changing to the chunkier side of the spectrum isn't the solution.

 

concerning lie angle: I will definitely need to try out. I read a few times now that a flatter angle normally causes a fade. but I don't get the theory behind it: wouldn't I swing even more around the body / from the inside with a flatter angle?

 

any thoughts of good wedges for sweepers? also thinner soles / lower bounce options? what do you think of the m and the s grind of vokeys?

 

thanks.

Edited March 17, 2021 by babyfade

[steventoo]

Following on to my post above, I have a 52/12 Callaway X Forged wedge and a 58/10 and 64/10 Callaway PM Grind. I'm not sure if they suit me because of my swing or if they suit me because I'm so used to them by now.

 

I am looking at replacing the 52 with a 52/08 SM8, and the PM Grinds with whatever their replacement is.

[jomatty]

I’m a sweeper in apex pro’s (19), and really like them.  I imagine the soles on the apex21’s would be equally as good.  Ping i210’s are another club that work well for sweepers but the offset may not be ideal for someone who’s miss is a hook.  Also kind of at the end of its product cycle.  Personally I’d either wait for whatever ping puts out or do an apex/apex pro combo.  I’m a 6 handicap also and 7 iron is as long as I’m comforatable going with the apex19 pros.

as far as wedges I would definitely look at the glide 3.0’s.  Some people can’t stand to see any cavity but they have been good for me.

Edited March 17, 2021 by jomatty

[babyfade]

Thanks guys. Can someone please explain me the theory behind flatter lie angle equals more fade? In my head I would swing more around the body with a flatter lie angle and this equals more draw?

[tatertot]

On 3/17/2021 at 3:43 AM, jomatty said:

I’m a sweeper in apex pro’s (19), and really like them.  I imagine the soles on the apex21’s would be equally as good.  Ping i210’s are another club that work well for sweepers but the offset may not be ideal for someone who’s miss is a hook.  Also kind of at the end of its product cycle.  Personally I’d either wait for whatever ping puts out or do an apex/apex pro combo.  I’m a 6 handicap also and 7 iron is as long as I’m comforatable going with the apex19 pros.

as far as wedges I would definitely look at the glide 3.0’s.  Some people can’t stand to see any cavity but they have been good for me.

As a sweeper with a similar HCP (3.X usually), I would second the Ping recs ... I played the i200s and really liked them, and currently play Glide wedges. 

[Smitty1961]

I'm a scratch hdcp sweeper.  I had the MP18's and the MP20's, I liked the Apex Pro's better and they were definitely longer.  I believe you are on the right track.

[Pepperturbo]

I play to a 4 and sweep the ball with 2i to 8i, inside out.  I hit the ball straight with a low-mid trajectory, and work it left or right as needed.  I can adjust if I need a high trajectory but seldom do that because I play in a fair amount of wind.  From 9i-LW I scrap the turf to the roots, course that depends on the composition of the turf.  My scraps are noticeably shallow not like deep divots - diggers enjoy. 😛

 

Anyway, back in 2002 while having custom MacGregor blades made for me by MacGregor, their questioning made certain aspects of my game clear to me.  The resulting irons helped improve my ball striking and were for a sweeper.  Ever since my irons have been set up similarly.

 

Low bounce, sharp leading edge, minimal camber and narrow soles, short blade heads heel to toe.  My 620MBs & CB long irons 2-4i have 0-1' of bounce, the rest of my blades are considered low traditional specs.  Had some leading edges shaved to make them a tad sharper.

 

The divot of my 52/8' F and 58/8' M is about the same as PW.   Both work really well for me, as I learned my wedge game with 2'-5' progressive bounce wedges which required me to open the face various degrees to more bounce...old school.

 

Too much of a flat lie angle means the heel is higher than the toe.  

[Radeon962]

Sweeper here and played Pings for a long time.  Favorites were G25 and i210.

 

Moved to PXG 0211 and they are like a better feeling i210.  Very similar specs but long irons are easier to hit.  Heads looks very similar at address.

[rlb4]

The thinner sole and less bounce makes a lot of sense. I am a higher handicapper(20ish) and use older Callaway Big Bertha irons. Very SGI with a wide, deep sole and bounce. I am terrible with my irons, hitting a lot of thin and fat shots. I almost never leave a divot. The only counter to this is that I hit my 3 hybrid pretty well. The problem is that most of the thinner sole, less bounce irons are for better players. So what GI/SGI irons would be good for a higher handicapper like me? I was looking at the usual GI/SGI irons but now am second guessing that decision.

[Ripken08]

5 minutes ago, rlb4 said:

The thinner sole and less bounce makes a lot of sense. I am a higher handicapper(20ish) and use older Callaway Big Bertha irons. Very SGI with a wide, deep sole and bounce. I am terrible with my irons, hitting a lot of thin and fat shots. I almost never leave a divot. The only counter to this is that I hit my 3 hybrid pretty well. The problem is that most of the thinner sole, less bounce irons are for better players. So what GI/SGI irons would be good for a higher handicapper like me? I was looking at the usual GI/SGI irons but now am second guessing that decision.

Mizuno Hot Metal / Hot Metal Pro.  Low bounce Mizuno GI clubs

[rlb4]

39 minutes ago, Ripken08 said:

Mizuno Hot Metal / Hot Metal Pro.  Low bounce Mizuno GI clubs

I'll keep those in mind. The Pro's have a smaller head and less offset. Do they have the same width sole and amount of bounce? Is there a big difference in forgiveness between them?

[Ripken08]

1 hour ago, rlb4 said:

I'll keep those in mind. The Pro's have a smaller head and less offset. Do they have the same width sole and amount of bounce? Is there a big difference in forgiveness between them?

Exactly the same clubs with less offset

[iNeedMoreGolf]

Im a sweeper pretty much and i play the mizuno mp 20 mmc. The distace is there. The forgiveness is the right amount. The profile is what i like and the bounce is low but enough to do the job and doesnt dig when the ground is wet or i do take a small divot. Pickers do better with smaller irons im told and i can see from expiernce. I havent seen the srixons in person but im guessing they should be just fine.

[jomatty]

4 hours ago, rlb4 said:

The thinner sole and less bounce makes a lot of sense. I am a higher handicapper(20ish) and use older Callaway Big Bertha irons. Very SGI with a wide, deep sole and bounce. I am terrible with my irons, hitting a lot of thin and fat shots. I almost never leave a divot. The only counter to this is that I hit my 3 hybrid pretty well. The problem is that most of the thinner sole, less bounce irons are for better players. So what GI/SGI irons would be good for a higher handicapper like me? I was looking at the usual GI/SGI irons but now am second guessing that decision.

Apex are not super game improvement and can be intimidating because the heel to toe length is relatively short, but they would be something to try.  

[goheels11]

I am a sweeper, and about the same height as you OP. I play 2.5° flat irons. Just picked up a set of ZX5’s, only two rounds in but have had zero issues with turf interaction.  Coming out of i210’s.  

[RacineBoxer]

14 hours ago, rlb4 said:

I'll keep those in mind. The Pro's have a smaller head and less offset. Do they have the same width sole and amount of bounce? Is there a big difference in forgiveness between them?

 

I think the size of the heads on the pro's are the same as the regular hot metal, just less offset and a thinner sole.

 

Also, for a 20+ handicap who hits his hybrid well, you might want to put the ego to the side a bit and get multiple hybrids, maybe 3-4-5, maybe even a 6. I play to a 4 handicap and sometimes people look at me a little weird because I play Ping G400 irons. Well, I like the big chunky soles and I'm really just trying to hit the ball high and straight. If I have 150 or 190 yards I'm not trying to flight it down, or work it right to left, or work it back to a back right pin... no... I'm trying to hit my standard stock shot high and straight towards the middle of the green, every time. And the G400's are great for high and straight. You know what else goes high and straight? Hybrids.

 

P.S. new golf clubs almost certainly won't help your scores. I'd figure out a way to add 3-4 more hours of practice to your weekly routine if you want to shoot lower scores. Remember- high and straight, all you need 🙂 

[tsmith1362]

17 hours ago, babyfade said:

Thanks guys. Can someone please explain me the theory behind flatter lie angle equals more fade? In my head I would swing more around the body with a flatter lie angle and this equals more draw?

 

I have a similar left miss and sweep the ball as well. I am working hard to become a bit steeper in my attack angle, but have found thin soles and a sharper leading edge have helped me. To answer your question with flatter lie angles, there is a tool you can get from Mitchell or Golfworks that is basically a magnet with a stick attached to it. As you put the club at address it gives you immediate feedback on your projected ball flight based on the current lie angle. 

 

If a club is too flat for your setup then the toe will dig into the ground more than a club that is perfectly soled or too upright. Regardless of your swing type you are more likely to interact with the turf "toe first" which can force you to leave the club face more open at impact and change the amount of sidespin you put on the ball. With an inside out swing, if you strike the ball in the center but dig the toe in the ground it can either straighten your shot up or provide a fade or "right miss" with no curve. 

 

Just because the club face is forced open doesn't always mean the ball will fade. With your swing type, like me, it is likely that if the club is too flat, the toe digs, and can force the clubface open causing more of a straight push rather than a fade. It ultimately affects your dispersion pattern if you are a solid ball striker. 

[rlb4]

1 hour ago, RacineBoxer said:

 

I think the size of the heads on the pro's are the same as the regular hot metal, just less offset and a thinner sole.

 

Also, for a 20+ handicap who hits his hybrid well, you might want to put the ego to the side a bit and get multiple hybrids, maybe 3-4-5, maybe even a 6. I play to a 4 handicap and sometimes people look at me a little weird because I play Ping G400 irons. Well, I like the big chunky soles and I'm really just trying to hit the ball high and straight. If I have 150 or 190 yards I'm not trying to flight it down, or work it right to left, or work it back to a back right pin... no... I'm trying to hit my standard stock shot high and straight towards the middle of the green, every time. And the G400's are great for high and straight. You know what else goes high and straight? Hybrids.

 

P.S. new golf clubs almost certainly won't help your scores. I'd figure out a way to add 3-4 more hours of practice to your weekly routine if you want to shoot lower scores. Remember- high and straight, all you need 🙂 

Definitely all I want is high and straight. No desire to "work" the ball. Before this thread the main clubs I have been looking at were the Ping G710/425 and Cleveland Launcher HB Turbo(yes I would absolutely play them 🙂). The Pings have high offset, wide soles and high bounce. The HB Turbos are very low offset and bounce but have very wide soles. I know that I have to hit them to see what actually works best for me. Am just trying to narrow the list a little. And I am definitely going to get some lessons to improve any major swing flaws before I actually get fitted.

[babyfade]

2 hours ago, tsmith1362 said:

 

I have a similar left miss and sweep the ball as well. I am working hard to become a bit steeper in my attack angle, but have found thin soles and a sharper leading edge have helped me. To answer your question with flatter lie angles, there is a tool you can get from Mitchell or Golfworks that is basically a magnet with a stick attached to it. As you put the club at address it gives you immediate feedback on your projected ball flight based on the current lie angle. 

 

If a club is too flat for your setup then the toe will dig into the ground more than a club that is perfectly soled or too upright. Regardless of your swing type you are more likely to interact with the turf "toe first" which can force you to leave the club face more open at impact and change the amount of sidespin you put on the ball. With an inside out swing, if you strike the ball in the center but dig the toe in the ground it can either straighten your shot up or provide a fade or "right miss" with no curve. 

 

Just because the club face is forced open doesn't always mean the ball will fade. With your swing type, like me, it is likely that if the club is too flat, the toe digs, and can force the clubface open causing more of a straight push rather than a fade. It ultimately affects your dispersion pattern if you are a solid ball striker. 

 

This is so interesting thanks.

 

Maybe I'm just thinking wrong, but in my head when I flatten the lie angle: the toe of the club gets lower and also my hands will be lower at adress. So that would be good for a short man like me (5.77 feet)? I thought that with the flatter lie angle and lower hands, this would help my swing-style. But on the other hand I would have to worry to not hook it to much, as I would swing even flatter?

 

The hook is my miss, but the shank is what really scares me on the course. And I read a lot that with higher/steeper hands you will shank it less. So a flatter lie angle would maybe even cause more problems? 

 

Concering your last point: yes I normally hit a open clubface draw with my swing. On a good day I love my ballflight. On a bad day shanks come in play.

 

Edited March 19, 2021 by babyfade