LIV with some big money announcements (*** TOPIC MODERATED ***)

[bighitlama]

4 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

No, no no........can't shut it down before the signing of Team54 Exhibition golf savior Cam Smith..... He's the Ausie game changer. He said that he wants to play in the playoffs and the Presidents Cup.....but what we've learned is that we can't believe a word that come out of a golfer's mouth........The Pgatour will continue to make stars.

 

I think LIV is counting on that, just like the PGAT uses the Korn Ferry tour.

[BlackDiamondPar5]

25 minutes ago, Gxgolfer said:

When extreme political views are injected or profanity, or attacking the moderation is included in posts, then it will not be approved.  

 

Your recourse is to use the personal message system vs trying to push an extreme position.  This is a warning since you don't seem to understand why your posts are not getting approved vs others.  This is not a debatable decision.

 

This guidance also applies to all posts in this thread as well.  One may write a lengthy posts but then they fail at the end by inserting profanity or espousing a profane thought or attacking a poster or subject.

I've tried posting links twice about Kokrak being dropped by a sponsor. A law firm representing 9/11 families. Both were rejected by mods. No profanity or attacking other members just a link to Bloomberg law. Maybe the third time is a charm 🙂 

https://news.bloomberglaw.com/business-and-practice/law-firm-with-9-11-history-dumps-golfer-after-move-to-saudi-tour

[bighitlama]

20 minutes ago, bekgolf said:

 

If I have this line of thought correct it would be that the highest paid players (liv for now) get all the spots for the majors.  Skill is not a requirement for pay with liv, their highest paid players haven't been breaking 80.

 

How about a merit based system?  Just like we have now.  Win and you get points.  Not enough points then you can do a Monday qualifier.  Keep money out of who gets to play in a major, make it about skill.

 

I should have been clearer.   Up front money to sign up would not be included, just the money won in "exhibitions", so those who played the best would be ranked higher.   I love the idea of qualifiers for a certain number of spots.   Like I said we would have two flawed systems.   Any system that drops guys we know are top 50 out of the top 100 would be a joke.   Of note however, the majors have always included past champions for a certain period of time even if they have fallen off the map.  They seem to know what they're doing.

[Gxgolfer]

11 minutes ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

I've tried posting links twice about Kokrak being dropped by a sponsor. A law firm representing 9/11 families. Both were rejected by mods. No profanity or attacking other members just a link to Bloomberg law. Maybe the third time is a charm 🙂 

https://news.bloomberglaw.com/business-and-practice/law-firm-with-9-11-history-dumps-golfer-after-move-to-saudi-tour

It was rejected because you posted the same thing an hour ago. Maybe edit your original post instead of repeatedly posting the same thing. 

Also, anything with 911 families has exhaustively been covered and that topic will not be expanded on. 

 

[oikos1]

26 minutes ago, bekgolf said:

 

If I have this line of thought correct it would be that the highest paid players (liv for now) get all the spots for the majors.  Skill is not a requirement for pay with liv, their highest paid players haven't been breaking 80.

 

How about a merit based system?  Just like we have now.  Win and you get points.  Not enough points then you can do a Monday qualifier.  Keep money out of who gets to play in a major, make it about skill.

I would agree with that.  Problem is, the PGA Tour isn't going to go for that with the LIV Tour because as we are finding out, the PGA Tour is the OWGR. (see the OWGR Governing Board below)

 

If the OWGR truly want to have legitimacy and credibility, any Tour that uses the USGA and R&A rules of golf should be able to qualify for OWGR points.  Strength of field and length of tournament need be the only requirements.  Wouldn't that ultimately "grow the game"?

 

Precedent is already established for 54 hole tournaments (currently 11 tours and Tigers event qualify for points) so the LIV qualifying for "OWGR" shouldn't even be an issue.

 

I would encourage those speaking of OWGR points to research their website.  I've been shocked how many in the media who speak of OWGR points are utterly clueless as to how the system works.  Ultimately, if the LIV were to be shut out only because it is Saudi backed, the OWGR rankings become a complete joke. 

 

Directly from the OWGR:

 

"The Governing Board and its Technical Committee have continuously monitored and refined the system over the years taking into account the ever changing structure of world golf and suggestions made from players and Tours alike."

 

http://www.owgr.com/about?tabID={30A8C9C7-0A88-4D29-AF92-E44EF02BB899}

 

http://www.owgr.com/about?tabID={A01A4052-F0DF-4DDE-9BE2-940A54F2CA50}

 

OWGR Governing Board

 

Chairman - Peter Dawson CBE

Augusta National GC - Will Jones, Executive Director

European Tour - Keith Pelley, Chief Executive

PGA of America - Seth Waugh, Chief Executive Officer

PGA Tour - Jay Monahan, Commissioner

The R&A - Martin Slumbers, Chief Executive

USGA - Mike Whan, Chief Executive Officer

International Federation of PGA Tours - Keith Waters

Secretary - Ben Bye

 

 

[tiderider]

2 hours ago, Creedo77 said:

I thought that monihan and the r&a would be replaced in the process of whether to give out owgr points to LIV because of a conflict of interest 

Who should replace two of the original participants of the system - both historically important in fundamental ways to the past and current idea of the professional golfer - that has been agreed upon and used by an international consortium of organizations dedicated to the pursuit of professional golf? … 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

10 minutes ago, Gxgolfer said:

It was rejected because you posted the same thing an hour ago. Maybe edit your original post instead of repeatedly posting the same thing. 

Also, anything with 911 families has exhaustively been covered and that topic will not be expanded on. 

 

I don’t mean to be difficult but you are incorrect about my post. You rejected the two posts with the link from several hours ago. Only now you allowed the link. It's not a rehash of previous 911 posts. Kokrak just joined LIV and was dropped because of it by a firm representing 9-11 families. That's new. 

 

[BottleCap]

2 hours ago, jdl said:

Someone tell CBS, NBC and ESPN because they just forked over a bunch of money.

 

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/pga-tour-announces-nine-year-media-deals-with-cbs-nbc-and-espn

Less and less people are tuning into broadcast tv. I wonder who’s going to be watching those networks 5 years from now.

 

There’s so much golf content on Youtube these days thats going to pull youngsters over there like Good Good and Bryson Dechambeau

 

I have a cable subscription, the only reason why i have it is for formula 1. Everyone else i know that has cable tv is in their 60s. 

[bekgolf]

35 minutes ago, oikos1 said:

I would agree with that.  Problem is, the PGA Tour isn't going to go for that with the LIV Tour because as we are finding out, the PGA Tour is the OWGR. (see the OWGR Governing Board below)

 

If the OWGR truly want to have legitimacy and credibility, any Tour that uses the USGA and R&A rules of golf should be able to qualify for OWGR points.  Strength of field and length of tournament need be the only requirements.  Wouldn't that ultimately "grow the game"?

 

Precedent is already established for 54 hole tournaments (currently 11 tours and Tigers event qualify for points) so the LIV qualifying for "OWGR" shouldn't even be an issue.

 

I would encourage those speaking of OWGR points to research their website.  I've been shocked how many in the media who speak of OWGR points are utterly clueless as to how the system works.  Ultimately, if the LIV were to be shut out only because it is Saudi backed, the OWGR rankings become a complete joke. 

 

Directly from the OWGR:

 

"The Governing Board and its Technical Committee have continuously monitored and refined the system over the years taking into account the ever changing structure of world golf and suggestions made from players and Tours alike."

 

http://www.owgr.com/about?tabID={30A8C9C7-0A88-4D29-AF92-E44EF02BB899}

 

http://www.owgr.com/about?tabID={A01A4052-F0DF-4DDE-9BE2-940A54F2CA50}

 

OWGR Governing Board

 

Chairman - Peter Dawson CBE

Augusta National GC - Will Jones, Executive Director

European Tour - Keith Pelley, Chief Executive

PGA of America - Seth Waugh, Chief Executive Officer

PGA Tour - Jay Monahan, Commissioner

The R&A - Martin Slumbers, Chief Executive

USGA - Mike Whan, Chief Executive Officer

International Federation of PGA Tours - Keith Waters

Secretary - Ben Bye

 

 

 Who would be the qualifiers from liv?  An 80 on a relaxed easy course doesn't translate to a spot on a major.

[Soloman1]

Judge: “I sentence you to one year in prison, or six months community service as a GolfWRX moderator.”

 

Defendant: “Lock me up.”

[Ghost of Snead]

42 minutes ago, oikos1 said:

I would agree with that.  Problem is, the PGA Tour isn't going to go for that with the LIV Tour because as we are finding out, the PGA Tour is the OWGR. (see the OWGR Governing Board below)

 

If the OWGR truly want to have legitimacy and credibility, any Tour that uses the USGA and R&A rules of golf should be able to qualify for OWGR points.  Strength of field and length of tournament need be the only requirements.  Wouldn't that ultimately "grow the game"?

 

Precedent is already established for 54 hole tournaments (currently 11 tours and Tigers event qualify for points) so the LIV qualifying for "OWGR" shouldn't even be an issue.

 

I would encourage those speaking of OWGR points to research their website.  I've been shocked how many in the media who speak of OWGR points are utterly clueless as to how the system works.  Ultimately, if the LIV were to be shut out only because it is Saudi backed, the OWGR rankings become a complete joke. 

 

Directly from the OWGR:

 

"The Governing Board and its Technical Committee have continuously monitored and refined the system over the years taking into account the ever changing structure of world golf and suggestions made from players and Tours alike."

 

http://www.owgr.com/about?tabID={30A8C9C7-0A88-4D29-AF92-E44EF02BB899}

 

http://www.owgr.com/about?tabID={A01A4052-F0DF-4DDE-9BE2-940A54F2CA50}

 

OWGR Governing Board

 

Chairman - Peter Dawson CBE

Augusta National GC - Will Jones, Executive Director

European Tour - Keith Pelley, Chief Executive

PGA of America - Seth Waugh, Chief Executive Officer

PGA Tour - Jay Monahan, Commissioner

The R&A - Martin Slumbers, Chief Executive

USGA - Mike Whan, Chief Executive Officer

International Federation of PGA Tours - Keith Waters

Secretary - Ben Bye

 

 

 

A little more info on the OWGR criteria although not official ...

 

https://golf.com/news/liv-golf-official-world-golf-ranking-essential-question/#:~:text=To be eligible for OWGR,field size of 75 players.

 

Tiger's event is 72 holes BTW.

 

 

[Tbone107]

2 hours ago, bekgolf said:

 

There is that.  However, most pro liv arguments bring up the blood money and whataboutisms.  It's become a talking point with them, I wonder why.

 

It's not an interesting format (liv).  Not taking time out of my day to watch, not spending money on anything advertised in conjunction with liv.  No sponsors means not self sustaining.  I'd rather watch the senior scramble at my course. 

 

Shoot, I'd be more inclined to buy a club one of them was hitting well vs a paid pro.  Butt, that's me.

You’re entitled to that opinion. 
 

Personally I like the shotgun format and broadcast style, I like the seemingly more constant action. 
 

With the potential adds of McCord, Barkley, and Feherty to the broadcast, I will certainly enjoy the broadcast commentary leaps and bounds more that whatever the PGAT is rolling out now, and I’m sure there will be many that feel the same way I do. But, also many that feel like yourself and like things “the way they’ve always been done”. 
 

I don’t want them to change the majors, memorial, or players. Outside of those I’m fine with watching an “alternative form of golf tournament” that showcases the best players in the world.

 

I just don’t get why people want to come and argue all the merits against it… Just choose to not watch it and leave it out of sight out of mind, and quit telling other people that they shouldn’t like it. 
 

 

[Gxgolfer]

37 minutes ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

I don’t mean to be difficult but you are incorrect about my post. You rejected the two posts with the link from several hours ago. Only now you allowed the link. It's not a rehash of previous 911 posts. Kokrak just joined LIV and was dropped because of it by a firm representing 9-11 families. That's new. 

 

I allowed it so I could respond to the post publicly to also warn others. Otherwise, it would have been deleted cause you should have just edited your post from over an hour ago. Which was less than an hour between your attempted reposts. Quoted it for context. 

 

2 hours ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

Kokrak dropped by sponsor. 

 

[tatertot]

4 hours ago, ChipStrokes said:

you actually think LIV is paying people to post on their behalf?

nobody manipulates social medial ... it doesn't happen.

[Ghost of Snead]

45 minutes ago, BottleCap said:

Less and less people are tuning into broadcast tv. I wonder who’s going to be watching those networks 5 years from now.

 

There’s so much golf content on Youtube these days thats going to pull youngsters over there like Good Good and Bryson Dechambeau

 

I have a cable subscription, the only reason why i have it is for formula 1. Everyone else i know that has cable tv is in their 60s. 

 

You've heard of TV streaming services and smart TVs ? Can you tell me the attention span of what you define as a "youngster" ? 

[RobS]

37 minutes ago, oikos1 said:

I would agree with that.  Problem is, the PGA Tour isn't going to go for that with the LIV Tour because as we are finding out, the PGA Tour is the OWGR. (see the OWGR Governing Board below)

 

If the OWGR truly want to have legitimacy and credibility, any Tour that uses the USGA and R&A rules of golf should be able to qualify for OWGR points.  Strength of field and length of tournament need be the only requirements.  Wouldn't that ultimately "grow the game"?

 

Precedent is already established for 54 hole tournaments (currently 11 tours and Tigers event qualify for points) so the LIV qualifying for "OWGR" shouldn't even be an issue.

 

I would encourage those speaking of OWGR points to research their website.  I've been shocked how many in the media who speak of OWGR points are utterly clueless as to how the system works.  Ultimately, if the LIV were to be shut out only because it is Saudi backed, the OWGR rankings become a complete joke. 

 

Directly from the OWGR:

 

"The Governing Board and its Technical Committee have continuously monitored and refined the system over the years taking into account the ever changing structure of world golf and suggestions made from players and Tours alike."

 

http://www.owgr.com/about?tabID={30A8C9C7-0A88-4D29-AF92-E44EF02BB899}

 

http://www.owgr.com/about?tabID={A01A4052-F0DF-4DDE-9BE2-940A54F2CA50}

 

OWGR Governing Board

 

Chairman - Peter Dawson CBE

Augusta National GC - Will Jones, Executive Director

European Tour - Keith Pelley, Chief Executive

PGA of America - Seth Waugh, Chief Executive Officer

PGA Tour - Jay Monahan, Commissioner

The R&A - Martin Slumbers, Chief Executive

USGA - Mike Whan, Chief Executive Officer

International Federation of PGA Tours - Keith Waters

Secretary - Ben Bye

 

 

The PGA Tour isn't the OGWR.  They occupy 1 of 9 seats on the board and 1 of 12 seats on the Technical Committee.  I don't support LIV but I have no issue if they get OGWR points if they meet the criteria.  At present, they fail to meet a number of criteria including field size, no cut, no means of qualifying for the tour, etc.  There are Tours with a 54 hole format that are awarded points and they are the lowest caliber of the qualifying Tours and eligible for the fewest points.  There are one off events that have no cut that are awarded points, Hero World Challenge for example.  Those are approved by the Technical Committee prior to going to Board for final approval.  Hero doesn't get points by virtue of being a PGA Tour event. The Tour doesn't even recognize it as an official event.  It probably helps that 75% on the field is in the top 20 with the balance being in the top 50.  There is certainly an argument that Hero shouldn't get points (I don[t think it should) but I don't think using a one off event to rationalize LIV's qualifications as a Tour is an effective argument.  Speaking of growing the game, the OWGR doesn't consider a closed, invitation only tour as growing the game which is why one of the criteria for a Tour to be included is having a qualifying process. These are all things that LIV can rectify if they choose and strengthen their case but their argument at present isn't exceptionally strong with their current format. 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

15 minutes ago, Gxgolfer said:

I allowed it so I could respond to the post publicly to also warn others. Otherwise, it would have been deleted cause you should have just edited your post from over an hour ago. Which was less than an hour between your attempted reposts. Quoted it for context. 

 

 

Right but the one I posted hours before with the link didn't get approved. It's in the news and I was posting.

 

I know this is tough but LIV and Norman made this a reality. 

[Gxgolfer]

4 minutes ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

Right but the one I posted hours before with the link didn't get approved. It's in the news and I was posting.

 

I know this is tough but LIV and Norman made this a reality. 

Again, you are missing the point. You should have edited your originally approved post with the link instead of repeating the same thing. 

[NoFancyUsername.]

Why don't you all ask your juniors at your golf club what golf do they actually watch.......It's all youtube podcasters. I was pointed in the direction of a couple of young golfers who have 686K subscribers...real good content, and it's not all about 72 holes of golf.....they're all using differing formats to keep it alive...and there are many that have over 100K views....it ain't the old brigade watching youtube..it's a majority of all the young ones. The LIV PR team are just following suit. Even The Open starting using youtube for "live at the range" this year. Who knows, the PGAT may even start promoting that they use youtube. World's changing and so will golf. 

[NoFancyUsername.]

On 7/23/2022 at 9:40 AM, Ghost of Snead said:

 

There's a difference between a ban and a suspension. 

Yeah..."you have been banned for one tournament" and "you have been suspended for one tournament" ... English bruh.....like Queue...The letter Q has all these silent vowels after it waiting their turn.

[MUNIGRIT]

Ultimately what will fix the issue of being banned is like Pat Perez said after he torched Phil and said he wouldn't play for 20 mil an event for 5 years is sponsors saying DJ(other pros) are in the field at this PGA event or we are out.

[dalehead]

1 hour ago, NoFancyUsername. said:

Why don't you all ask your juniors at your golf club what golf do they actually watch.......It's all youtube podcasters. I was pointed in the direction of a couple of young golfers who have 686K subscribers...real good content, and it's not all about 72 holes of golf.....they're all using differing formats to keep it alive...and there are many that have over 100K views....it ain't the old brigade watching youtube..it's a majority of all the young ones. The LIV PR team are just following suit. Even The Open starting using youtube for "live at the range" this year. Who knows, the PGAT may even start promoting that they use youtube. World's changing and so will golf. 

Finally someone who understands the YouTube generation. The segment of them that are into golf are not interested in watching tournaments. They like their golf programs in 20-30 minute bites. Attractions for them are club reviews, personalities, so called influencers, trick shots, instruction, etc. They don’t watch PGAT on TV because they find it boring. When you strip away all the hoopla, LIV offers them the same product as the PGAT. 5 hours of guys hitting golf shots. This is LIV’s biggest problem.

[JRS1939]

On 7/19/2022 at 12:53 PM, JRS1939 said:

I'm not stating that. But what I am stating is that when they put together the whole package from 50% of the top 100 players, on incredible venues, with only 4 hours of TV time needed, with great announcing ( you can say that they don't matter but go look at the open championship complaint thread? And showing 50% more golf shots!   They desire to watch becomes astronomical if you love golf.   A lot of people are forgetting they're only 2 events into this!  🤷‍♂️

 

 

Well.... well... well.....

[iBanesto]

4 hours ago, NoFancyUsername. said:

Why don't you all ask your juniors at your golf club what golf do they actually watch.......It's all youtube podcasters. I was pointed in the direction of a couple of young golfers who have 686K subscribers...real good content, and it's not all about 72 holes of golf.....they're all using differing formats to keep it alive...and there are many that have over 100K views....it ain't the old brigade watching youtube..it's a majority of all the young ones. The LIV PR team are just following suit. Even The Open starting using youtube for "live at the range" this year. Who knows, the PGAT may even start promoting that they use youtube. World's changing and so will golf. 

 

I must be old because I find most of the YouTube golf creator content quite banal as almost every channel is the same.

 

The only interesting thing is if they play against touring professionals.

 

 

Charles Howell III going to LIV Golf is probably no big loss for the PGA Tour because he has never really made any memorable impression but has won $42 million. 😅

 

[lowheel]

22 hours ago, Ghost of Snead said:

 

Prove it - Norman's only goal is to destroy the PGA Tour as revenge from them shutting him down in 1994. You don't think folks talk and Monahan hasn't known Norman's intentions for a long time. You don't think Monahan speaks to Finchem ? Why do you think Tiger won't give Norman the time of day ? If Norman doesn't want to ruin the PGA Tour, why is he paying exorbitant sums of money to play in the SGL ? Why has he scheduled 14 events for next year ? Norman was and is the issue. 

      

Its been reported by the washington post, Axios, Associated press...

 

Also who cares if tiger gives norman the time of day, its irrelevant.

 

When you want to draw talent over to your new league/startup you need to pay top dollar, whats difficult to understand? LIV did what anybody would with  green light to spend. Its free agency, simple as that. Norman or anybody else running  LIV would do the same thing, what their financiers what them to do. Stop pretending this is about norman

Edited July 24, 2022 by lowheel

[BlackDiamondPar5]

13 hours ago, NoFancyUsername. said:

Yeah..."you have been banned for one tournament" and "you have been suspended for one tournament" ... English bruh.....like Queue...The letter Q has all these silent vowels after it waiting their turn.

This is odd coming from the guy that doesn't know that Abu Dhabi is not Saudia Arabia. 

 

Obviously the truth makes those wrong sad. 🤣

Edited July 24, 2022 by BlackDiamondPar5

[mahonie]

8 hours ago, NoFancyUsername. said:

So the PGAT is a monopoly 🤔 

...was a monopoly?

[bscinstnct]

8 hours ago, NoFancyUsername. said:

Why don't you all ask your juniors at your golf club what golf do they actually watch.......It's all youtube podcasters. I was pointed in the direction of a couple of young golfers who have 686K subscribers...real good content, and it's not all about 72 holes of golf.....they're all using differing formats to keep it alive...and there are many that have over 100K views....it ain't the old brigade watching youtube..it's a majority of all the young ones. The LIV PR team are just following suit. Even The Open starting using youtube for "live at the range" this year. Who knows, the PGAT may even start promoting that they use youtube. World's changing and so will golf. 

 

Then it’s a *really bad signs the liv events are only getting 60-100k YouTube live stream views 

[FriedEgg]

Well Scott Piercy is killing it in Minnesota this week

[Ghost of Snead]

Pure unadulterated greed ...

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/golf/2022/07/24/paul-dunkley-billionaire-fixer-ian-poulter-ally-who-key-liv/