Unsolicited, on course advice

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

I was lucky to have partners like you when I started playing. Partly why I survived the onslaught of bogey golf.

But also got lots of advice too, and still get it now and then even when in jest.

The drink at the turn is a great idea! I’ll have to pay for my fair share to future golfers I meet. Cheers!

[Noles]

I totally agree and I also find this same thing in basketball. I am a good shooter and coached in high school for 25 years. I also teach younger kids quite often. The moment I start talking about hand position on the ball, where your elbow should be and how to follow through I start shooting poorly. I usually start leaving every shot short, then overcompensate and start hitting the back of the rim. Now when I work with younger kids, I let them see me shoot before we begin, then once I start breaking down the shooting motion, I don't shoot from more that a few feet away.

[Moo]

I've had a similar experience. Just this past summer someone asked me to show them a shot that I'm pretty good at. I explained it and then completely failed to actually execute it. Quite embarrassing!

We all know the cliches about the muscle memory and unconscious processes, but there is real truth at the core of it. Too much thinking can be a real impediment to performance.

On the course I have an extremely repeatable set-up/preshot process, but the part that can't be seen is the letting go of as many thoughts as possible right before I swing.

[HackDaddy360]

I try not to provide on course suggestions unless someone asks. I carry a zero handicap and usually end up not getting asked many questions - maybe because they either don’t want to bug me or they don’t want to think they sound less than savvy.

Post round, if I hear someone complaining about a given hole/shot/club/etc. at the 19th hole I might give them a tip or two - largely because to me their errors are obvious and if it’s a course management issue that’s easily corrected I could probably help them quickly by teaching them to think better.

My comments in those situations are about helping people and wanting them to play better and get more enjoyment out of the game - particularly when their mistakes are clear to someone with material experience.

I usually stick to suggestions about how to play the game - not how to swing the club. I’ve been fortunate enough to work with sports psychologists who train Olympic athletes and very high level golf instructors over the course of my life. Usually Can help someone who shoots 90 break 85 just by adjusting how they approach the game.

On the flip side, it’s frustrating to hear someone say “good shot” when in the back of my mind I’m thinking “FML that was bad” - but I still smile and say thank you ?

[nsxguy]

Except for the fact that YOU wrote the post above, and you're a much better player than I am, I could have written it; pretty much word-for-word. LOL

I feel particularly bad for higher handicappers and the way they flub chip shots. Almost without exception their main problem is flipping at the bottom. They almost always do it on full swings as well but it's a lot easier giving them and showing them the tip for chipping, than going into the full swing.

[Colin L]

I think I would see my doctor if I was flipping at the bottom. But if it means hingeing the wrists such that the clubhead comes through in advance of the hands resulting in a thinned shot over the green and into the rough beyond, I am a highly accomplished exponent of the art.

[nsxguy]

LOL

Yeah, that's it.

A previous discussion on the Mickelson "Hinge and hold". Seems I managed to help one guy a little - https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/comment/18822758#Comment_18822758

 

[zebra2955]

Well some people will have a big problem !! What if like me they play different manufacturers ? Do they switch balls when I go from driver to irons? Oh wait Cobra doesn't make a ball , now what do I do .

[I_HATE_SNOW]

My problem is when I hinge, I don't get the unhinge done and end up with hands ahead of a club aimed at the equator of the ball. Hinge and hold didn't help me. Thin wedges just kill me, and wound those on the green.

[Lamosteve]

My best golfing buddy has a terrible habit of making comments under his breath after everyone's shots in our scrambles (he's a 20 hdcp at best).

" you lifted your head, keep your eye on the ball, soft hands, don't swing so hard, etc"

When we play vs each other, I have to tell him to keep quiet or else I will just get grumpy.

 

 

 

[nsxguy]

You're not supposed to "unhinge". And your hands are supposed to be ahead of the club.

"Unhinging" is "flipping" at the bottom and THAT is what causes the bladed shot.

[Twism86]

As a new golfer I have little advice to give but I am often given some. I dont mind it 99% of the time. A few times I have put it to use during the round with improved results.

Two rounds ago I did give smidgen of advice after a guy failed to get out of a bunker in 3 shots. I just said "try a full swing through the sand" and left it at that.

[Newby]

Oh dear!

[dubbelbogey]

One of my playing buddies offers unsolicited and ineffective advice all of the time - to himself!

The rest of us just watch and laugh! He's a great guy, but he just tortures himself.

[cval]

I was playing with gentleman once and I was struggling pretty bad that day and he offered some great advice. He said he knew exactly while I was struggling and I insisted he tell me. He told me I had crap on the end of my clubs. After carefully examining my club heads and finding nothing wrong he looked at me with smile and said not that end. :)

Unfortunately, I still have the same problem today.

[3GoodPutts]

Not on course, but at driving range. Guy next to me said my shafts may be too stiff ( I had broken the silence with him a couple of minutes earlier since we both have Ping irons). I told him I was fitted for these irons a month earlier, numbers came back I need stiff shafts. This guy goes on to start lecturing me that swing speed has nothing to do with shaft stiffness and I am wrong to think swing speed determines shaft stiffness. I nodded my head in agreement, turned around and finished hitting my balls as quickly as I could to get away from that whacko. Never heard such a crazy thing in my 40 years of playing golf...

[LeoLeo99]

LOL. Sounds like a LOFT problem.

[C6 Snowboarder]

the advice I have offered is to tell someone to fix their ball mark - I say that as they are leaving the green. I have advised some smokers on proper way to disposed of their butts by picking one up and bring it to him and saying nicely " I think you dropped this" I have also offered advice on turn off the damn phone as it is ringing on the Tee Box. I have also offered advice to another group who has the music playing so loud you hear them 500 yards away. I have also offered advice on where to drop when one crosses into a hazard by saying dropping on your line of flight is not the proper drop spot. Have offered advice on a player in a tournament who has gone OB and he tries to drop a ball in the middle of the fairway when the committee has not approved that local rule.

[nsxguy]

Then you haven't been reading this site very much.

Hardly a "crazy thing" and he's not (totally) wrong.

While "nothing to do with" isn't accurate, SS isn't the only factor in choosing stiffness. Shaft weight and swing tempo/transition are probably at least as important as stiffness.

 

Anyway, back on topic, my swing and speed have been getting somewhere back to normal after a serious operation and the other day, in a competition, I was playing with a 29 handicapper. I was hitting the driver pretty well but smothered 1 or 2 draws into lower bullets than got to ground too quickly and cost me a little distance and the 29 tells me I'm not clearing my hips enough.

OK, fine, he was probably at least a little bit close, but honestly a 29 giving any advice ? To anyone ? I mean really now,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[3GoodPutts]

You are trying to defend his point by saying he is only a little wrong. He said "swing speed has nothing to do with shaft stiffness". That is wrong (and crazy wrong). Swing speed most certainly does dictate where you should be on the shaft stiffness scale. Yes, their are other considering factors players consider to determine their final shaft stiffness, but swing speed is certainly near or at the top for that decision making process. When you get fitted for clubs do you ignore the swing speed numbers?

[nsxguy]

To answer your question, no, I don't ignore the SS numbers. And never said nor inferred any such thing.

And how can I be "defending his point" when I SAID what HE said was wrong ?

I SAID he was wrong to say SS had NOTHING to do with it. But you said he completed his thought with you were "wrong to think swing speed determines shaft stiffness", basically "admitting" there was more to it. That IS correct as you yourself now admit. This indicates there was a discussion/clarification to be had, but you didn't want to bother having it. OK, understood.

So does SS most "certainly dictate where you should be on the stiffness scale" ? Or, as you yourself just qualified, "there ARE others factors to consider to determine the final shaft stiffness", which, put another way means those other factors may dictate a DIFFERENT stiffness,,,,,,,,,,,,,, when all factors are taken into account ?

And that, after all is MY point. SS isn't the only factor.

You got fitted. You got the shafts recommended. No worries.

[3GoodPutts]

Very good. It appears we agree that swing speed is very important (and a leading factor) to determine shaft stiffness. So, I stand by my original statement. The person was wrong saying "swing speed has nothing to do with shaft stiffness". We both agree that statement is wrong.

[Bigsetzee]

I don't offer advice - unless it's a casual round, good mate that I know really well, and something that their frustrated at which is obvious.

I do however try to keep guys upbeat and positive where possible by trying to be friendly when things aren't going their way.

[Fuscinator]

"Sorrry, no Engarrrish. Hef a nize dee."

[ZA206]

I don't have many pet peeves associated with golf (I try to not take it too seriously), but giving/getting advice on someone's SWING is my pet peeve. I NEVER EVER offer advice unless someone specifically asks for it, and even then I'm very hesitant. I WILL give course strategy advice to people unfamiliar with the course we are playing (assuming I know the course).

That said, I will make fun of people if they are hacking or whining... I'm sadistic like that. ;-)

 

-ZA

[C6 Snowboarder]

On a more fun note -- when we - as in our usual group of 5 or 6 - play a casual round... we are always poking fun and correcting something just for fun. specially the one guy -- there is so much material as comedians say. His last action that he still gets advice for is how he got the golf cart stuck in the mud up to the chassis - 10 feet off the cart path. When there were signs everywhere saying - Carts on Path only .

 

 

[charli]

Really depends who I’m playing with. Friend? I offer advice for those that I know struggle with certain things. For example one guy who’s a decent golfer sometimes pushes it right and when he does all the weights on his back foot following through. But a stranger not a chance. I’ll let Them struggle while giving them the... yeah golf is tough.. welcome to golf... this game isn’t easy nonsense

[1mcozik]

If I give any advice, it would be to friends/family I'm golfing with and even then, its stuff like "oh try leaning the shaft forward a little" or "keep your head down a little longer" generic type of advice....unless we're playing for money then I have to give the "special" advice that messes with their mind like "do you blink before or after you swing?"

[llewol007]

I only offer advice to people i know and or if someone wants me to see what or why they are doing something and correct something on the spot. Like some have said, better than watching a player point way right and hoping to cut it across his body to get it left.

[LeoLeo99]

I played with a young man today for a few holes. He was flipping bad. I've never seen anyone flip as bad as he was. Every pitch just went straight up in the air and landed well short of the green. And he looked athletic. After the 6th hole I couldn't help myself and told him about it. It was after I hit a few good shots in a row so I had some sway. He understood what I was telling him. I told him to practice it after the round. But he didn't listen. He was about 30 yards off the green on the 9th hole and decided to stop flipping and hit a beautiful low pitch that took two hops and stopped. It was glorious. I hope he continues to play and get better.