Tyson Lamb Putters

[WVP]

gioguy, I agree with much of what you're saying. But if he's getting his price, what incentive does he have to lower it? He can establish himself as an elite craftsman, then eventually leverage his success into a lower cost/high volume line and proceed that way. I am guessing that could be his long term plan.

 

Also, margins aren't quite clear cut. A car is a car, but there's a lot more mark up on a McLaren than a Mazda.

 

I wonder what the better way to go about it is though, do you think if he establishes himself as a high-end putter craftsman and then uses that to create lower-cost high volume lines he would be considered a sell-out? Or would the other way be better where you manufacture low-end putters first, then use your ability as a craftsman to create lines similar to tour-only putters like Scotty?

 

I am thinking the latter as once you have established yourself with the OTR putters and create a following through those, generally more people would be interested, look you up online and find that you create these high-end putters also.

 

I would imagine that's usually what happens with Scotty, someone really likes an OTR they just picked up - goes online and then realizes there's this whole other world of Cameron collecting and tour only putters.

 

I think establishing yourself with a high volume line right from the start is near impossible though. Who knows of Tyson Lamb outside of GolfWRX and his 7,000 Instagram followers?

 

Odyssey, Ping, Taylormade, Scotty Cameron all dominate the Golf Galaxy/Golfsmith world. Only in the last 2 years has Bettinardi, Edel and Seemore been stocked at my local Golf Galaxy and I would bet they don't sell as much as the first four OEM's I mentioned.

[ZBUCK]

gioguy, I agree with much of what you're saying. But if he's getting his price, what incentive does he have to lower it? He can establish himself as an elite craftsman, then eventually leverage his success into a lower cost/high volume line and proceed that way. I am guessing that could be his long term plan.

 

Also, margins aren't quite clear cut. A car is a car, but there's a lot more mark up on a McLaren than a Mazda.

 

I wonder what the better way to go about it is though, do you think if he establishes himself as a high-end putter craftsman and then uses that to create lower-cost high volume lines he would be considered a sell-out? Or would the other way be better where you manufacture low-end putters first, then use your ability as a craftsman to create lines similar to tour-only putters like Scotty?

 

I am thinking the latter as once you have established yourself with the OTR putters and create a following through those, generally more people would be interested, look you up online and find that you create these high-end putters also.

 

I would imagine that's usually what happens with Scotty, someone really likes an OTR they just picked up - goes online and then realizes there's this whole other world of Cameron collecting and tour only putters.

 

I think establishing yourself with a high volume line right from the start is near impossible though. Who knows of Tyson Lamb outside of GolfWRX and his 7,000 Instagram followers?

 

Odyssey, Ping, Taylormade, Scotty Cameron all dominate the Golf Galaxy/Golfsmith world. Only in the last 2 years has Bettinardi, Edel and Seemore been stocked at my local Golf Galaxy and I would bet they don't sell as much as the first four OEM's I mentioned.

 

Agree 100% - it would definitely be close to impossible. I guess I am thinking hypothetically with no barriers to entry in the market.

[caloge]

Comments about his pricing are silly. What fraction does the cost of materials impact the price of a bespoke suit or a handmade watch? Very little. To suggest his off the rack price is too high is a bogus argument; he doesn't sell off the rack putters so the comparison is apples to oranges. His prices are still well below circle t's. I don't know what he includes at his base price and what attracts an up charge but he doesn't seem to have an issue selling them. The market dictates the price. If they were too expensive he would have to lower prices to stay in business. If you guys are right, then he will have no other choice.

 

Also, the suggestion that nobody knows these artisan putter makers is anecdotal and inaccurate. these guys make between 75-100 putters a month. I think that's pretty good for little boutique shops.

[avgjoe]

the guy is getting lamb basted... ba-dum!

[gioguy21]

Comments about his pricing are silly. What fraction does the cost of materials impact the price of a bespoke suit or a handmade watch? Very little. To suggest his off the rack price is too high is a bogus argument; he doesn't sell off the rack putters so the comparison is apples to oranges. His prices are still well below circle t's. I don't know what he includes at his base price and what attracts an up charge but he doesn't seem to have an issue selling them. The market dictates the price. If they were too expensive he would have to lower prices to stay in business. If you guys are right, then he will have no other choice.

 

Also, the suggestion that nobody knows these artisan putter makers is anecdotal and inaccurate. these guys make between 75-100 putters a month. I think that's pretty good for little boutique shops.

 

it's not anecdotal, nor innacurate. 75-100 putters a month IS a boutique shop, and while it may be good for Byron and others, Tyson sure as h*ll isn't putting out that much -- and while it may be hard for you to get, go to a muni course, or even a country club and ask who Kari Lajosi or Byron Morgan is...to everyone you know. i'd bet you'd get AT MOST 3-4 people in total.

 

 

and watches/suits take time to make; putters for the most part are milled, assembled, stamped. you're not talking 30 hours into a putter as you would for say, a patek phillipe -- (much longer for his timepieces btw), but i get where you're going.

 

and my point about his pricing -- it STARTS at $1,200. starts.

 

circle t's have a reason they're that expensive. they're (for the most part) incredibly limited, made for tour putters. LAMB'S PUTTERS ARE NOT.

 

you're right, not apples to apples -- Tyson's not there yet, despite his pricing.

[smeech8000]

circle t's have a reason they're that expensive. they're (for the most part) incredibly limited, made for tour putters.

 

99% of CT's put out never see Tour play despite their FTUO designation. They're a carbon (er, stainless) copy of the OTR model with different engravings. No additional craftsmanship is required in their production versus their vanilla counterparts other than CNC setup.

 

CT's have a single reason to justify their expense, it's because people will pay the price Cameron asks. Does Cameron have the right to charge a premium? Of course he does. So does Lamb. Is Cameron more deserving (than Lamb) of the markup because he is more well-known, has paid his dues, and his "craftsmanship" is more valuable than Lamb's? Perhaps this is debatable, but is also ultimately subjective.

 

The market dictates what you as a vendor "deserve" to do.

 

 

Tyson's not there yet, despite his pricing.

 

Lamb said himself that he has found an odd niche in the market. Are you villifying him for exploiting it, or upset that his work isn't deserving of the price? The market says otherwise as he apparently is at full capacity at current pricing.

 

Are you chiding/warning him as to the myopic viewpoint of his business model? I'm sure the guy who's filling as many orders as he can handle at$1,200+ each welcomes your opinion but don't be offended if he disregards it with a chuckle.

 

If he cleans up his reputation a bit after this whole deal, he'll have the option of expanding into a larger production or going the JP Harrington route at one of the major OEM's.

[BMP1785]

I've been in the machining trade for 9yrs, I program with Mastercam off of solid models every day for our 4 Haas mill's. I know what it takes to set up a machine & each of the 7 operations needed. It's honestly not as easy as the video he posted.

 

The hourly rate where I work is $90 let's assume that's his as well, he's the only one so he needs to be getting that while machining / blasting /stamping / cutting raw material / programming / assembly / designing / etc

 

Let's say 9 hrs of shop rate

1 = design, updating the putter model with logos & textures the customer has chosen.

3 = machine, I don't machine much stainless but let's assume 3hrs for set-up & run time in the mill.

5 = finish work, welding / blasting / torching / stamping / paint fill / assembly / etc

Total $810

 

Materials

Let's say $100 for a all stainless putter ( no Damascus etc ) + head cover / shaft & grip.

 

+ 20-30% profit & you have your starting point.

 

$1,183 & we haven't included head cover, shaft, grip & shipping & there was a lot of assuming in there.

 

That's the way I looked at it when I decided to order from Tyson as a machinist that is capable of going from print to part.

[BMP1785]

A couple photo's of my 2nd head cover from Tyson.

[LionGolfer]

How do I go about inquiring about options and pricing?

 

Like it buy it. Don;t like it don;t buy it. It's your coin, your choice. What's all the fuss about?

[Big Ben]

For this type of cash David Billings and Machine can create a one of kind masterpiece. Dave is one of the true Gentleman and Artists in the CNC and industrial putter style age. BB

[TMfan54]

How do I go about inquiring about options and pricing?Like it buy it. Don;t like it don;t buy it. It's your coin, your choice. What's all the fuss about?

I sent an email yesterday and was called by Tana a couple hours later. She did say that she had over 3,000 emails in her inbox though so I might have gotten pretty lucky

[Hit-em]

How do I go about inquiring about options and pricing?Like it buy it. Don;t like it don;t buy it. It's your coin, your choice. What's all the fuss about?

I sent an email yesterday and was called by Tana a couple hours later. She did say that she had over 3,000 emails in her inbox though so I might have gotten pretty lucky

 

I guess that's why I never heard back from them on the inquiry I sent ...

[Mikey Town]

Why do so many people on this forum gripe about the price of products?!

 

If you:

 

1. Like the product, and

2. Want to purchase the product, and

3. Are able to afford the price of the product

 

Then, you buy the product.

 

If you:

 

1. Don't like the product, or

2. Don't want to purchase the product, or

3. Are not able to afford the price of the product

 

Then, you do not buy the product.

 

If a business owner:

 

1. Isn't overwhelmed and backlogged, and

2. Has enough orders coming in to keep them busy all day, and

3. Is making enough money to make them happy

 

Then, they are pricing their product EXACTLY where it should be priced... no matter what anyone thinks their product is "worth."

 

 

Between this, the constant Circle T debates and all the PXG crap, I feel like this form has gone full retard lately.

 

And everyone knows you should...

 

[Bruno4]

Some of you could use an economics lesson or two.

[NYCgolfer17]

Don't you guys know being bold and brash works well these days ala "The Donald".

 

Aside from all that, I think the guy makes sick putters. I have been following him in IG for a while now. I contacted him through there and got a response pretty quick. I didn't buy a putter but I may consider buying one in the future. Not sure why there is so much hate, its undeniable that he makes a good product.

[oneaugusta]

No one said hates or denies his talent, just not sure he's a proven commodity for me to buy one of his flatsticks. I like his work and think he is very talented, would consider investing in one of his putters if the price point were better.

[smeech8000]

I like his work and think he is very talented, would consider investing in one of his putters if the price point were better.

 

Gotta speculate to accumulate! :derisive:

[5hort5tuff]

Don't you guys know being bold and brash works well these days ala "The Donald".

 

Aside from all that, I think the guy makes sick putters. I have been following him in IG for a while now. I contacted him through there and got a response pretty quick. I didn't buy a putter but I may consider buying one in the future. Not sure why there is so much hate, its undeniable that he makes a good product.

 

He may make a good product. ..but not 1200 good. There is no way it take 1200 worth of work and materials considering it's a machined putter. Guys like Lump and Lamont can sell a handmade for 4-600$ and literally mill it by hand, no problem.

 

Yes they are nice, but they are not unique at all. He makes a standard anser, mills some grooves, or changes the texture kf survices..that's it...

[NYCgolfer17]

Don't you guys know being bold and brash works well these days ala "The Donald".

 

Aside from all that, I think the guy makes sick putters. I have been following him in IG for a while now. I contacted him through there and got a response pretty quick. I didn't buy a putter but I may consider buying one in the future. Not sure why there is so much hate, its undeniable that he makes a good product.

 

He may make a good product. ..but not 1200 good. There is no way it take 1200 worth of work and materials considering it's a machined putter. Guys like Lump and Lamont can sell a handmade for 4-600$ and literally mill it by hand, no program.

 

Yes they are nice, but they are not unique at all. He makes a standard anser, mills some grooves, or changes the texture kf survices..that's it...

 

So whats your point? If you don't want to pay $1200 for one no one is forcing you. Last time I checked Canada was a free country right?

[Bruno4]

Don't you guys know being bold and brash works well these days ala "The Donald".

 

Aside from all that, I think the guy makes sick putters. I have been following him in IG for a while now. I contacted him through there and got a response pretty quick. I didn't buy a putter but I may consider buying one in the future. Not sure why there is so much hate, its undeniable that he makes a good product.

 

He may make a good product. ..but not 1200 good. There is no way it take 1200 worth of work and materials considering it's a machined putter. Guys like Lump and Lamont can sell a handmade for 4-600$ and literally mill it by hand, no program.

 

Yes they are nice, but they are not unique at all. He makes a standard anser, mills some grooves, or changes the texture kf survices..that's it...

 

I think that's what many of us are saying... The market is clearly saying he can charge $1200. It's all supply and demand.

 

He can charge $50k if people will pay it. Conversely, if the orders slow down or stop, he'll have to rethink his strategy.

[BestGrips]

I've talked quite a bit with him about grips and putters in the last few months. We're both the same age and live in the same state, so maybe that has something to do with it, but he's one of the most honest and genuine guys I've dealt with in the golf biz. It's a refreshing change from the usual "how cheap can I get a grip from you? Oh, you want more than $6? Sorry, I need something I can mark up 500%," I get from the usual manufacturers.

[5hort5tuff]

Don't you guys know being bold and brash works well these days ala "The Donald".

 

Aside from all that, I think the guy makes sick putters. I have been following him in IG for a while now. I contacted him through there and got a response pretty quick. I didn't buy a putter but I may consider buying one in the future. Not sure why there is so much hate, its undeniable that he makes a good product.

 

He may make a good product. ..but not 1200 good. There is no way it take 1200 worth of work and materials considering it's a machined putter. Guys like Lump and Lamont can sell a handmade for 4-600$ and literally mill it by hand, no program.

 

Yes they are nice, but they are not unique at all. He makes a standard anser, mills some grooves, or changes the texture kf survices..that's it...

 

So whats your point? If you don't want to pay $1200 for one no one is forcing you. Last time I checked Canada was a free country right?

 

Who said anything about freedom?

 

But seriously. My point is that I don't believe there's anything close to 1200 in value there. That's it. I'm not saying don't buy his putters...I'm saying why would you?

[PostandGhost]

Some of you could use an economics lesson or two.

 

What lesson is "Market Correction" under?

[UnderPar18]

I love his putters and I think Tyson will surpass Cameron in the years to come. I don't think he will try to get crazy with new ideas until he really makes it big.

 

I'm hoping to order a putter from him in the near future.

[alexdub]

I love his putters and I think Tyson will surpass Cameron in the years to come. I don't think he will try to get crazy with new ideas until he really makes it big.

 

I'm hoping to order a putter from him in the near future.

 

This is cute

[JL529]

there's a great article on Not allowed because of spam about him. I would put the link, or you could just google it.

[Pure745]

there's a great article on Not allowed because of spam about him. I would put the link, or you could just google it.

 

The article makes him sound like a tool.

[UnderPar18]

I love his putters and I think Tyson will surpass Cameron in the years to come. I don't think he will try to get crazy with new ideas until he really makes it big.

 

I'm hoping to order a putter from him in the near future.

 

This is cute

 

Thanks man, I appreciate the kind words. I'm still deciding if I should ask him for an autograph as well with my putter.

[Etiger83]

I love his putters and I think Tyson will surpass Cameron in the years to come. I don't think he will try to get crazy with new ideas until he really makes it big.

 

I'm hoping to order a putter from him in the near future.

 

lolwut

[Mikey Town]

So, if you use the argument that a custom watch or bespoke suit costs a lot of money, lets look at that. I will use Rolex, just for fun. It takes 1 year to make a Rolex, they make 1,000,000 per year, they use a steel that no one else wants to use because it is expensive and it is harder to machine but, it looks a certain way so Rolex uses it. Rolex has been in business since 1905, nearly every watch in their line GAINS value as it ages. Next, I will use Frank Shattuck, a bespoke suit maker that was featured on the Balvenie series Raw Craft on youtube with Anthony Bourdain. He uses Fox wool for his suits, Fox has been in business since 1772. It is some of the most expensive wool flannel in the world, why you may ask? It is some of the very best. It takes 3-4 fittings to complete the process of completing your one-off hand-made suit and it takes Frank 65hrs to make a suit and he can make about 15 a year. Both of those "brands" are well worth their asking price, to me, because they have a history, a heritage, they are worth the cost of entry because of all the work that goes in to them, especially the suits.

 

Now, I am not a machinist but, I am not a dullard. Tyson has two or three putter models so once he got those programmed in, the lions share of that work was done, the added steps of machining the "stamps" in is more work, I get that, is it the difference in a $299 putter and a $1199 putter? Not for me. If we are keeping it in the same realm with putters, take a look at Kyle Sears at Kingston Putters. He is making putters out of "GSS", a material that instantly adds a 0 to any other putter maker. He will make you a one-off GSS putter out of a superior material for $495.

 

We can mentally punch a clown ourselves about this for 4 more pages but, at the end of the day, I don't like the perception of the company.

 

Very well written post, but I just can't take someone serious when they propose inflicting mental harm to clowns.

 

Haven't they been through enough?