Putting in 2019 - Flagstick in or out?

[fairways4life]

Another wrinkle of the flag in scenario -

 

What happens when the shadow of the flagstick perfectly lines your putt up?

 

Or, when the shadow of the flag flapping in the wind is directly over your ball or line?

 

Hurry up and putt before the shadow moves!

[BMC]

Another wrinkle of the flag in scenario -

 

What happens when the shadow of the flagstick perfectly lines your putt up?

 

Or, when the shadow of the flag flapping in the wind is directly over your ball or line?

 

You’d take it out if you feel it’s distracting... you can change IN vs OUT each hole... or each putt

 

I get that...a speeding up play rule is really just adding more decisions to be made.

[PingEye2]

Another wrinkle of the flag in scenario -

 

What happens when the shadow of the flagstick perfectly lines your putt up?

 

Or, when the shadow of the flag flapping in the wind is directly over your ball or line?

You’d take it out if you feel it’s distracting... you can change IN vs OUT each hole... or each putt

 

I get that...a speeding up play rule is really just adding more decisions to be made.

 

Yep, I can’t argue with that.

[The Pearl]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

[davep043]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

What do YOU suggest, should we time each player's every shot? How else to "directly" address the issue of slow play?

[The Pearl]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

What do YOU suggest, should we time each player's every shot? How else to "directly" address the issue of slow play?

 

That is the obvious solution on tour. One simple rule would be to disallow using the logo or alignment aid for a putt. Foolish amounts of time is wasted over the course of a round while 4 players try to line up their alignment mark on the ball at some brown blade of grass on the line. It is mind numbing watching it. For the muni crowd, proper spacing of tee times and the monitoring of the course through technology. The golf industry is woefully behind on using technology to monitor the flow of a golf course.

[bladehunter]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

What do YOU suggest, should we time each player's every shot? How else to "directly" address the issue of slow play?

 

Direct penalties for slow players not slow groups. In everyday play ? . Space out tee times another 4 minutes and make the already there Marshall actually go out and work. Courses pack too many tee times in usually and then don’t police. It’s a compound issue. But easily fixed. Also enforcing max double bogey would help. Marshall sees you chipping up for triple he says something. Have a short speech plus signage at the counter to let folks know it’s coming. And be ok with losing slow players. Trust me getting the reputation as a course where you can play in 4 hours or less is a good thing. Better ( both handicap and etiquette) players will flock your way.

[davep043]

And here I thought we were talking about the actual rules of golf. My apologies.

[GolfTurkey]

Apologies if this has already been mentioned, I haven't read the entire thread. This may allow devious players to cheat more because they can hit a long putt without anyone seeing them if they reach the green first and then mark their ball nice and close to the hole.

 

There is one guy that I have the misfortune of playing with occasionally who cheats his Word not allowed off and I can't imagine him not doing this.

[nostatic]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

What do YOU suggest, should we time each player's every shot? How else to "directly" address the issue of slow play?

 

ban gambling?

 

 

I'll see myself out :D

[sthompson42]

Isn’t there a new “rule” that “recommends” player complete their stroke in 40 seconds? Funny. The “rule” only “recommends”. No teeth and no details about when the clock starts. Why even include the new rule? It would be hilarious to watch players timing each other. To me, 40 seconds seems long on most shots unless there is wind, yardage is difficult to calculate, etc.

 

I agree the real answer is proper use of marshals. I never see Marshals moving groups along. One slow group can hold the whole course up. Don’t get me started on slow fivesomes.

[nsxguy]

What will be funny is to watch people pull the pin 4 times to get the balls out of the hole. Which I’m sure will make the game faster and faster. Lol.

 

Something I just thought of, how many times will you be in the FW waiting and see the flag go into the hole. You then start your practice swings and look up to find that the group is still on the green putting. haha

 

Personally I'm going to putt with the flag in the hole, but I don't like the rule change.

 

I think, if you can reach the green in the first place, you'll be able to tell when they're leaving the green vs. taking turns putting the flag in or out.

 

Once we get the hang of it it'll be just fine. All this hand wringing is

 

[Undonersg]

I will be going flag stick out for anything around 8-10 feet and in.... Keep it in for everything else.

[jasonfish11]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

What do YOU suggest, should we time each player's every shot? How else to "directly" address the issue of slow play?

 

The funny thing is the real issue in golf around slow play isn't how slow/fast the PGA tour is. It's how slow casual play is on public courses, which drives people away. Me not being able to go to the course hit a small bucket, play 18 holes and be back by 11am or noon really handcuffs me on how much I can play golf. A 5 hour round turns into 6+ hours away from the family when you count in travel and warm up.

 

That being said there are a few things courses could try.

 

-Courses could designate all tee times before a certain time (say 10 am) as "faster rounds" where you pay for the round by the hour and you have to check into the clubhouse after you finish.

-Penalize slow play (again before a certain time of day) by adding $x every 15 min someone is past a 4 hour round. Example if it's $5 per 15 min and you finish in 4:25 you would owe an extra $10.

Both of these have draw backs. 1 they are a little difficult to enforce because you are asking people to pay after, so what happens if they just leave? Also it will likely cause more on course conflicts, if the group in front is slower than you and you are on a budget for example.

 

Other options would be:

-re-route many courses so that they are more conducive to fast play. Limit distances between greens and tee boxes, create cart path short cuts if there are common areas people hit balls into.

-reduce rough height to allow balls to be found easier

-remove blind hazards so people know with out a doubt if a ball went into the hazard (no more searching when you see the ripples in the pond)

-slower green speeds (don't need to be shag carpet, but stimping above 11 will slow play on a public course)

-speed up greens a little (I know I putt terribly on shag carpet, so there has to be an "ideal" speed somewhere)

-ban golf carts (or somehow make walking more appealing)

-ban walkers (or make it less appealing)

-spread out tee times

 

As you can see some of these are counter intuitive to others, that is because some of these may work, some may not, and it will be different course to course. But all of them are things that could be done to attempt to speed up casual golf rounds.

 

The first thing you need to do as a course owner (if slow play is a concern of yours) is to see where play slows down. Go out and look at the course, are groups backed up on #13 tee box? If so look at what is slowing people down in the FW or on the green of #13, and do something to fix that first. Is every hole taking 15-20 min? How long are people spending on greens, on approaches, searching for balls, etc.? Ask the golfers where they get bottle necked, or where they feel things slow down.

 

I have never seen any golf course gathering data like this, and with out that kind of data if someone says they are trying to fix slow play on their course they are just playing darts blindfolded.

[I_HATE_SNOW]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

What do YOU suggest, should we time each player's every shot? How else to "directly" address the issue of slow play?

 

The funny thing is the real issue in golf around slow play isn't how slow/fast the PGA tour is. It's how slow casual play is on public courses, which drives people away. Me not being able to go to the course hit a small bucket, play 18 holes and be back by 11am or noon really handcuffs me on how much I can play golf. A 5 hour round turns into 6+ hours away from the family when you count in travel and warm up.

 

That being said there are a few things courses could try.

 

-Courses could designate all tee times before a certain time (say 10 am) as "faster rounds" where you pay for the round by the hour and you have to check into the clubhouse after you finish.

-Penalize slow play (again before a certain time of day) by adding $x every 15 min someone is past a 4 hour round. Example if it's $5 per 15 min and you finish in 4:25 you would owe an extra $10.

Both of these have draw backs. 1 they are a little difficult to enforce because you are asking people to pay after, so what happens if they just leave? Also it will likely cause more on course conflicts, if the group in front is slower than you and you are on a budget for example.

 

Other options would be:

-re-route many courses so that they are more conducive to fast play. Limit distances between greens and tee boxes, create cart path short cuts if there are common areas people hit balls into.

-reduce rough height to allow balls to be found easier

-remove blind hazards so people know with out a doubt if a ball went into the hazard (no more searching when you see the ripples in the pond)

-slower green speeds (don't need to be shag carpet, but stimping above 11 will slow play on a public course)

-speed up greens a little (I know I putt terribly on shag carpet, so there has to be an "ideal" speed somewhere)

-ban golf carts (or somehow make walking more appealing)

-ban walkers (or make it less appealing)

-spread out tee times

 

As you can see some of these are counter intuitive to others, that is because some of these may work, some may not, and it will be different course to course. But all of them are things that could be done to attempt to speed up casual golf rounds.

 

The first thing you need to do as a course owner (if slow play is a concern of yours) is to see where play slows down. Go out and look at the course, are groups backed up on #13 tee box? If so look at what is slowing people down in the FW or on the green of #13, and do something to fix that first. Is every hole taking 15-20 min? How long are people spending on greens, on approaches, searching for balls, etc.? Ask the golfers where they get bottle necked, or where they feel things slow down.

 

I have never seen any golf course gathering data like this, and with out that kind of data if someone says they are trying to fix slow play on their course they are just playing darts blindfolded.

That would guarantee that no one would let anyone play through.

[jasonfish11]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

What do YOU suggest, should we time each player's every shot? How else to "directly" address the issue of slow play?

 

The funny thing is the real issue in golf around slow play isn't how slow/fast the PGA tour is. It's how slow casual play is on public courses, which drives people away. Me not being able to go to the course hit a small bucket, play 18 holes and be back by 11am or noon really handcuffs me on how much I can play golf. A 5 hour round turns into 6+ hours away from the family when you count in travel and warm up.

 

That being said there are a few things courses could try.

 

-Courses could designate all tee times before a certain time (say 10 am) as "faster rounds" where you pay for the round by the hour and you have to check into the clubhouse after you finish.

-Penalize slow play (again before a certain time of day) by adding $x every 15 min someone is past a 4 hour round. Example if it's $5 per 15 min and you finish in 4:25 you would owe an extra $10.

Both of these have draw backs. 1 they are a little difficult to enforce because you are asking people to pay after, so what happens if they just leave? Also it will likely cause more on course conflicts, if the group in front is slower than you and you are on a budget for example.

 

Other options would be:

-re-route many courses so that they are more conducive to fast play. Limit distances between greens and tee boxes, create cart path short cuts if there are common areas people hit balls into.

-reduce rough height to allow balls to be found easier

-remove blind hazards so people know with out a doubt if a ball went into the hazard (no more searching when you see the ripples in the pond)

-slower green speeds (don't need to be shag carpet, but stimping above 11 will slow play on a public course)

-speed up greens a little (I know I putt terribly on shag carpet, so there has to be an "ideal" speed somewhere)

-ban golf carts (or somehow make walking more appealing)

-ban walkers (or make it less appealing)

-spread out tee times

 

As you can see some of these are counter intuitive to others, that is because some of these may work, some may not, and it will be different course to course. But all of them are things that could be done to attempt to speed up casual golf rounds.

 

The first thing you need to do as a course owner (if slow play is a concern of yours) is to see where play slows down. Go out and look at the course, are groups backed up on #13 tee box? If so look at what is slowing people down in the FW or on the green of #13, and do something to fix that first. Is every hole taking 15-20 min? How long are people spending on greens, on approaches, searching for balls, etc.? Ask the golfers where they get bottle necked, or where they feel things slow down.

 

I have never seen any golf course gathering data like this, and with out that kind of data if someone says they are trying to fix slow play on their course they are just playing darts blindfolded.

That would guarantee that no one would let anyone play through.

 

What would? slowing down green speeds?

 

I assume you are referring to the monetary penalties I listed. If so yes I realize this, and I pointed out it does have its drawbacks. Actually every single one of these changes has a potential of some negative side effect. As it's nearly impossible to change something with out having a negative side effect to some thing? It might be a side effect to some minority subset of golfers, it might be a side effect of cost, it might have a negative side effect of temporarily decreased revenue.

 

If the course plans properly and evaluates the risks of any change as well as countermeasures to those risks they can effectively evaluate if they would want to make the changes.

 

This is what I do for a living, I take problems that the company has (or even ones they don't realize they have) and I fix them. Almost all of the fixes I've ever implemented has some negative side effect for someone, but to this day I've never been blind sided by one of those side effects because I require people I'm working with to find out what those side effects will be prior to implementing any type of change. I've had situations where the side effect had more or less impact than we expected, but I've never just seen a random unexpected side effect happen. This is simple project management.

[davep043]

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

What do YOU suggest, should we time each player's every shot? How else to "directly" address the issue of slow play?

 

The funny thing is the real issue in golf around slow play isn't how slow/fast the PGA tour is. It's how slow casual play is on public courses, which drives people away. Me not being able to go to the course hit a small bucket, play 18 holes and be back by 11am or noon really handcuffs me on how much I can play golf. A 5 hour round turns into 6+ hours away from the family when you count in travel and warm up.

 

That being said there are a few things courses could try.

 

-Courses could designate all tee times before a certain time (say 10 am) as "faster rounds" where you pay for the round by the hour and you have to check into the clubhouse after you finish.

-Penalize slow play (again before a certain time of day) by adding $x every 15 min someone is past a 4 hour round. Example if it's $5 per 15 min and you finish in 4:25 you would owe an extra $10.

Both of these have draw backs. 1 they are a little difficult to enforce because you are asking people to pay after, so what happens if they just leave? Also it will likely cause more on course conflicts, if the group in front is slower than you and you are on a budget for example.

 

Other options would be:

-re-route many courses so that they are more conducive to fast play. Limit distances between greens and tee boxes, create cart path short cuts if there are common areas people hit balls into.

-reduce rough height to allow balls to be found easier

-remove blind hazards so people know with out a doubt if a ball went into the hazard (no more searching when you see the ripples in the pond)

-slower green speeds (don't need to be shag carpet, but stimping above 11 will slow play on a public course)

-speed up greens a little (I know I putt terribly on shag carpet, so there has to be an "ideal" speed somewhere)

-ban golf carts (or somehow make walking more appealing)

-ban walkers (or make it less appealing)

-spread out tee times

 

As you can see some of these are counter intuitive to others, that is because some of these may work, some may not, and it will be different course to course. But all of them are things that could be done to attempt to speed up casual golf rounds.

 

The first thing you need to do as a course owner (if slow play is a concern of yours) is to see where play slows down. Go out and look at the course, are groups backed up on #13 tee box? If so look at what is slowing people down in the FW or on the green of #13, and do something to fix that first. Is every hole taking 15-20 min? How long are people spending on greens, on approaches, searching for balls, etc.? Ask the golfers where they get bottle necked, or where they feel things slow down.

 

I have never seen any golf course gathering data like this, and with out that kind of data if someone says they are trying to fix slow play on their course they are just playing darts blindfolded.

That would guarantee that no one would let anyone play through.

 

What would? slowing down green speeds?

 

I assume you are referring to the monetary penalties I listed. If so yes I realize this, and I pointed out it does have its drawbacks. Actually every single one of these changes has a potential of some negative side effect. As it's nearly impossible to change something with out having a negative side effect to some thing? It might be a side effect to some minority subset of golfers, it might be a side effect of cost, it might have a negative side effect of temporarily decreased revenue.

 

If the course plans properly and evaluates the risks of any change as well as countermeasures to those risks they can effectively evaluate if they would want to make the changes.

 

This is what I do for a living, I take problems that the company has (or even ones they don't realize they have) and I fix them. Almost all of the fixes I've ever implemented has some negative side effect for someone, but to this day I've never been blind sided by one of those side effects because I require people I'm working with to find out what those side effects will be prior to implementing any type of change. I've had situations where the side effect had more or less impact than we expected, but I've never just seen a random unexpected side effect happen. This is simple project management.

Again, I go back to the topic, the flagstick. @ThePearl wants to address those issues directly, does that have anything to do with the flagstick, or the rules surrounding it? There are dozens of threads about slow play, these conversations belong in one of them.

[jasonfish11]

@The Pearl was talking about slow play from my understanding. He basically said that the USGA & R&A were trying to fix slow play by allowing people to leave the flag in. Essentially indirectly addressing slow play instead of just directly addressing it.

 

At least that is how I read his comment.

[davep043]

@The Pearl was talking about slow play from my understanding. He basically said that the USGA & R&A were trying to fix slow play by allowing people to leave the flag in. Essentially indirectly addressing slow play instead of just directly addressing it.

 

At least that is how I read his comment.

 

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

You're probably right, in that he dislikes the rule change around the flagstick, and maybe some of the others which are intended to help speed up play. He's down on the USGA for attempting to address the slow play issue using "classic government logic." But the only tool the USGA really has to influence pace of play is the rulebook. They can't change green speeds, or group intervals, or provide more effective marshals, that's up to individual golf establishments. So should they USGA ignore the issue, or take some of the steps available to them to try to improve things?

I'm not claiming that each of the rules changes intended to speed up play will be effective, or will be free of unintended consequences, but at least I can recognize that they're trying.

[jasonfish11]

@The Pearl was talking about slow play from my understanding. He basically said that the USGA & R&A were trying to fix slow play by allowing people to leave the flag in. Essentially indirectly addressing slow play instead of just directly addressing it.

 

At least that is how I read his comment.

 

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

You're probably right, in that he dislikes the rule change around the flagstick, and maybe some of the others which are intended to help speed up play. He's down on the USGA for attempting to address the slow play issue using "classic government logic." But the only tool the USGA really has to influence pace of play is the rulebook. They can't change green speeds, or group intervals, or provide more effective marshals, that's up to individual golf establishments. So should they USGA ignore the issue, or take some of the steps available to them to try to improve things?

I'm not claiming that each of the rules changes intended to speed up play will be effective, or will be free of unintended consequences, but at least I can recognize that they're trying.

 

You are right, the USGA can't mandate certain course requirements. The only way they can twist the arm of courses would be to not allow USGA tournaments held there, or not allow scores to be posted to the handicap systems from those courses.

 

Their only way to enforce slow play directly would be to say pace of play must not exceed X:XX or else you will lose your standing with the USGA and scores from this course won't be accepted for handicap purposes.

 

But monitoring that would be either costly or it would require courses to self report their average pace of play, which is also fraught with ways to avoid. The simplest solution would be to ask players to input "time to complete round" on the GHIN system, and if that average exceeds the time the course loses it's USGA standing. But again that has it's own issues.

[nsxguy]

-ban golf carts (or somehow make walking more appealing)

-ban walkers (or make it less appealing)

 

I suppose you could do that but I don't know how much ca$h these guys have,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

[fairways4life]

@The Pearl was talking about slow play from my understanding. He basically said that the USGA & R&A were trying to fix slow play by allowing people to leave the flag in. Essentially indirectly addressing slow play instead of just directly addressing it.

 

At least that is how I read his comment.

 

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

You're probably right, in that he dislikes the rule change around the flagstick, and maybe some of the others which are intended to help speed up play. He's down on the USGA for attempting to address the slow play issue using "classic government logic." But the only tool the USGA really has to influence pace of play is the rulebook. They can't change green speeds, or group intervals, or provide more effective marshals, that's up to individual golf establishments. So should they USGA ignore the issue, or take some of the steps available to them to try to improve things?

I'm not claiming that each of the rules changes intended to speed up play will be effective, or will be free of unintended consequences, but at least I can recognize that they're trying.

 

You are right, the USGA can't mandate certain course requirements. The only way they can twist the arm of courses would be to not allow USGA tournaments held there, or not allow scores to be posted to the handicap systems from those courses.

 

Their only way to enforce slow play directly would be to say pace of play must not exceed X:XX or else you will lose your standing with the USGA and scores from this course won't be accepted for handicap purposes.

 

But monitoring that would be either costly or it would require courses to self report their average pace of play, which is also fraught with ways to avoid. The simplest solution would be to ask players to input "time to complete round" on the GHIN system, and if that average exceeds the time the course loses it's USGA standing. But again that has it's own issues.

1. 99% of courses will never host a USGA event anyway.
   
2. Not allowing courses to participate in handicap posting goes directly against the USGA's desire to grow the game. It's completely counterintuitive.
   
3. There is very little the USGA can do to improve pace of play for casual rounds. That responsibility is on the golf course management and the players on the course.
   

[jasonfish11]

@The Pearl was talking about slow play from my understanding. He basically said that the USGA & R&A were trying to fix slow play by allowing people to leave the flag in. Essentially indirectly addressing slow play instead of just directly addressing it.

 

At least that is how I read his comment.

 

This is classic governing body/government/etc. logic. Let's solve a problem indirectly rather than directly. We all know the reason for slow play. Let's address those issues directly rather than attempting solve them using methods that are ripe for unintended consequences.

You're probably right, in that he dislikes the rule change around the flagstick, and maybe some of the others which are intended to help speed up play. He's down on the USGA for attempting to address the slow play issue using "classic government logic." But the only tool the USGA really has to influence pace of play is the rulebook. They can't change green speeds, or group intervals, or provide more effective marshals, that's up to individual golf establishments. So should they USGA ignore the issue, or take some of the steps available to them to try to improve things?

I'm not claiming that each of the rules changes intended to speed up play will be effective, or will be free of unintended consequences, but at least I can recognize that they're trying.

 

You are right, the USGA can't mandate certain course requirements. The only way they can twist the arm of courses would be to not allow USGA tournaments held there, or not allow scores to be posted to the handicap systems from those courses.

 

Their only way to enforce slow play directly would be to say pace of play must not exceed X:XX or else you will lose your standing with the USGA and scores from this course won't be accepted for handicap purposes.

 

But monitoring that would be either costly or it would require courses to self report their average pace of play, which is also fraught with ways to avoid. The simplest solution would be to ask players to input "time to complete round" on the GHIN system, and if that average exceeds the time the course loses it's USGA standing. But again that has it's own issues.

1. 99% of courses will never host a USGA event anyway.
   
2. Not allowing courses to participate in handicap posting goes directly against the USGA's desire to grow the game. It's completely counterintuitive.
   
3. There is very little the USGA can do to improve pace of play for casual rounds. That responsibility is on the golf course management and the players on the course.
   

 

I agree with #1 and #3.

 

#2 is just a consequence of them blocking a course from entering scores. If they did research and it showed that the length of time a round takes is more detrimental to the growth of the game than course availability, then it's possible reducing pace of play by black balling some courses for not upholding pace of play would INCREASE the growth of the game. I haven't done any studying to determine if that is true or not, I can only state that as of right now it's possible that is a true statement, until someone collects data to prove otherwise.

 

I'm not recommending that the USGA actually follow through with out proving it though. That would be dumb, but to be fair it would seem fitting given all the other dumb decisions they have made in the recent years.

[PingEye2]

https://lowestscorewins.com/tips/putting-with-the-flagstick-in

[Hawkeye77]

Whether or not it speeds play will probably depend on how many beers have been consumed and how much sh*t we want to give to the guy who's the oddball.

 

Thanks for describing the adversarial situations that I foresee with this. Just as I said. Most assume it's a new rule to keep it in. Not a choice as to in or out.

 

adversarial? it's golf... jesus.

 

You will get crucified for leaving it in.

[Golfjack]

Golfers basically would need to be able to be tracked on course. Either the course can give them a shot tracking device (then some people already have one and wouldn't want to use two). Best I think are GPS trackers golfers would have to assign to their account, and offer incentives for them to drop off each time as in no penalty for long rounds, but 5 dollars off for 30 minutes below the target time what not. It'll take time since it also depends on groups in front, but people will learn.

[sui generis]

Golfers basically would need to be able to be tracked on course. Either the course can give them a shot tracking device (then some people already have one and wouldn't want to use two). Best I think are GPS trackers golfers would have to assign to their account, and offer incentives for them to drop off each time as in no penalty for long rounds, but 5 dollars off for 30 minutes below the target time what not. It'll take time since it also depends on groups in front, but people will learn.

 

I've had this thought that carts could have credit card swipe things. Every hour the cart stops and a new swipe for 10 or 15 or 20 bucks is required. Ha, imagine all those half drunk fat guys lugging their 65 pound staff bags up the 18th fairway so as to not have to pay that fourth fee. :)

[bladehunter]

And here I thought we were talking about the actual rules of golf. My apologies.

 

The rules will never speed up play. Slow wakes up slow and goes to bed slow. They eat slow. They think slow. Prodding is the only way.

[davep043]

Whether or not it speeds play will probably depend on how many beers have been consumed and how much sh*t we want to give to the guy who's the oddball.

 

Thanks for describing the adversarial situations that I foresee with this. Just as I said. Most assume it's a new rule to keep it in. Not a choice as to in or out.

 

adversarial? it's golf... jesus.

 

You will get crucified for leaving it in.

Not with the guys I play with regularly. We're all trying to win a dollar, and will do anything within the rules to gain a small edge. I'm comfortable believing that the flagstick can provide a slight advantage.

[PingEye2]

Whether or not it speeds play will probably depend on how many beers have been consumed and how much sh*t we want to give to the guy who's the oddball.

 

Thanks for describing the adversarial situations that I foresee with this. Just as I said. Most assume it's a new rule to keep it in. Not a choice as to in or out.

 

adversarial? it's golf... jesus.

 

You will get crucified for leaving it in.

Not with the guys I play with regularly. We're all trying to win a dollar, and will do anything within the rules to gain a small edge. I'm comfortable believing that the flagstick can provide a slight advantage.

 

Exactly, the object is to shoot the lowest score. If there is evidence that it helps (and I believe there will be proof of that) you’d be an idiot to not want it in. And an idiot not to put it back in if someone had already removed it.