Schauffele thinks arm-lock putting should be banned, but uses it anyway?

[stingerfade]

6 hours ago, rp4golf said:

 Being someone with a military-grade level of the yips, I can unequivocally  attest to the fact that the armlock technique does not keep the face of the putter from rotating.

Stop moving your lower body when you putt. The “hiplock” per se 🙂

[JohnnyCashForever]

Xander says the arm lock grip should be banned but is contemplating using it anyway.  Presumably to finish better in future tournaments.  Warren Buffett complains that he doesn't pay enough in taxes and says that his taxes should be raised.  Yet, presumably, he doesn't "give" the government any more money than what he is obligated to pay by the exact letter of the tax law.  When principle meets big money, it is the rare great man who chooses the former over the latter. 

[Shilgy]

2 hours ago, stingerfade said:

The armlock is 100% resting or “locked” against the forearm hence the name. Not sure why people can’t grasp a simple concept. Grip the putter with your hands.  That’s it. Have all the reminders you want. The putter grip being flat is kind of a reminder and I didn’t realize people are rotating the grip to lay flat against forearm? That should be illegal too. Just grip it in your hands. Incidental forearm contact lol ok nice reach haha 

 

Stop using a crutch and learn how to putt. Also ban green reading books 

Don’t use it, don’t need it…….but…..

 

the other anchored strokes have one thing in common….the butt end of the putter is in a fixed position ( hence the term “anchored”)….the extended grip up the forearm is not anchored or locked. You could still switch from the lead arm that most guys use to the Kuchar rear arm in a stroke by flipping. 
 

Thus it is not anchored.

[jdl]

On 6/4/2021 at 3:31 PM, JaNelson38 said:

 

Because you start down the slippery slope of regulating someone's grip.  Other than not anchoring the putter to your chest, there is no rule that states how one is supposed to hold any club in the bag.  At least, not that I'm aware of.

 

Likewise, you don't have to putt with a putter.  And you can use the putter in places other than on the green itself.  Heck, you don't even need to carry a putter in your bag....part of the problem is that people look at the putter as some sort of extra-special thing, when in reality its still just one of your 14 clubs.  

 

If we're gonna ban the arm lock, why aren't we going to ban the forward press?  Or the left-hand-low grip?

None of this has anything to do with my post you quoted?

 

Using something other than a putter? Forward press? Left hand low?

 

[stingerfade]

12 hours ago, Shilgy said:

Don’t use it, don’t need it…….but…..

 

the other anchored strokes have one thing in common….the butt end of the putter is in a fixed position ( hence the term “anchored”)….the extended grip up the forearm is not anchored or locked. You could still switch from the lead arm that most guys use to the Kuchar rear arm in a stroke by flipping. 
 

Thus it is not anchored.

It’s completely anchored TO THE ARM. Seriously there’s no debate about that 

[Mathwiz]

After reading this thread, I feel a little dumber.

[iBanesto]

Left hand low arm lock.

 

Horschel who also said arm lock should be banned used this technique with a short length putter.

 

[iBanesto]

5 minutes ago, stingerfade said:

Yea that’s not anchored to his arm....🧐

 

I have no issues with the arm lock. It's within the rules.

 

I've always liked Langer's arm lock grip in 1993.

 

[stingerfade]

Just now, iBanesto said:

 

I have no issues with the arm lock. It's within the rules.

 

I've always liked Langer's arm lock grip in 1993.

 

Great example of someone who can’t putt historically so needs to anchor the club to a part of his body 🙂

[j-rob]

We have beat this dead horse for so long. 
 

If anchoring or arm locking was such a huge benefit, everyone would do it. It’s nonsense. Players who weren’t anchoring would be like a race car driver using older engine or tire technology. This wasn’t the case bc it simply isn’t a cheat code. The ban was silly. 
 

Things that work, like new driver & shaft technology, stick. Everybody takes advantage of it. Whereas I’ve never seen any meaningful percentage of players use a belly or long putter in all of my years following golf. 

[zonadub]

If you have ever tried arm lock putting, you know that it is still possible to yip or flip your wrists, and the shaft can leave contact with your forearm. It is not locked in the way a belly putter is locked to your navel or a broomstick is held against your chest. It might look ‘wrong’ to you, but there are other variables that do not happen if the end of the club is actually anchored to something that doesn’t move.

[Shilgy]

2 hours ago, rp4golf said:

Just because you have an opinion doesn't mean you're right, or that those opinions who do matter (golf's ruling bodies) care what you think.

While I completely disagree with @stingerfade on armlock putting meeting the golf definition of anchored his movement comment most likely has merit. 
 Almost every amateur player has some movement of the body that throws off the putting stroke.  And that movement most definitely can be a prime cause of what some think are yips.

[j-rob]

By the logic of banning arm lock, we should take that thought process to its logical conclusion. Just have a standard set of clubs and balls that everyone must use. No alterations, no changes. Complete uniformity. 
 

But that is of course preposterous. Golf is full of intricacies and personal preferences. Stop trying to legislate things that don’t matter. Get the ball in the hole with the most efficiency while playing by the rules of golf. Equipment doesn’t win championships. Golfers win championships. 

[bogeyk]

The governing bodies will most likely move to get rid of the arm lock when it becomes more and more common in college and younger amateur’s bags.  That, along with major wins, is when the talk of banning the anchored stroke started to heat up. 

[Shilgy]

2 hours ago, bogeyk said:

The governing bodies will most likely move to get rid of the arm lock when it becomes more and more common in college and younger amateur’s bags.  That, along with major wins, is when the talk of banning the anchored stroke started to heat up. 

Nah, the want the whole club moving…. And it is. No worse imo than claw/left hand low/saw etc.

[Mudguard]

13 hours ago, zonadub said:

If you have ever tried arm lock putting, you know that it is still possible to yip or flip your wrists, and the shaft can leave contact with your forearm. It is not locked in the way a belly putter is locked to your navel or a broomstick is held against your chest.

That's what I found with it after using the belly for so long. I putted two rounds like I used to putt pre-psiy, then found the end of the grip floating off my forearm, which was a complete disaster. 

[1t2golf]

Topic cleaned up. Stop the bickering or move on to another topic.  

[King_Slender]

Greens reading books are a far bigger issue in my opinion.  

[zonadub]

On 6/6/2021 at 9:39 PM, Mudguard said:

That's what I found with it after using the belly for so long. I putted two rounds like I used to putt pre-psiy, then found the end of the grip floating off my forearm, which was a complete disaster. 

That is why I went to the claw grip with the arm lock. It seemed to be better at holding the grip against my forearm.

 

full disclosure - am trying to go back to a traditional length putter using a regular grip. it isn’t going too well. might go back to arm locking. 😉

[TLUBulldogGolf]

Do you have to extend your putter to use the wrist lock grip? Played around with some setups and kind of want to try it myself..

[driveandputtmachine]

On 6/6/2021 at 6:14 AM, iBanesto said:

Left hand low arm lock.

 

Horschel who also said arm lock should be banned used this technique with a short length putter.

 

I made the point about Horschel in another one of these threads, but none of the ban it guys seemed to care.  I am not sure if it is the fact that Horschels is a normal length putter or what, but no major cry against him.  

[ThinkingPlus]

5 minutes ago, driveandputtmachine said:

I made the point about Horschel in another one of these threads, but none of the ban it guys seemed to care.  I am not sure if it is the fact that Horschels is a normal length putter or what, but no major cry against him.  

When the issue is really all about the "optics", the probability of having a rational discussion asymptotes to zero quickly.

[Mudguard]

2 hours ago, TLUBulldogGolf said:

Do you have to extend your putter to use the wrist lock grip? Played around with some setups and kind of want to try it myself..

I think the arm lock is more critical to get the correct length than a broomstick or belly. Obviously a belly putter you couldn't use if it was too short but if it was an inch longer it was fine. 

 

With the arm lock that I had (Bettinardi Kuchar I think) I felt like was too short. But it's tricky if you can't try different lengths. I've looked at ordering another but can't decide what length. 

[gunmetal]

On 6/4/2021 at 3:03 PM, stingerfade said:

Both those method have the club in the hands only. It’s not a hard concept to grasp. 

 

Billy Ho has the club in both of his hands left hand low and his right hand fingers braced (aka locked) against his wrist. Same with Noren. That's okay?

 

I found it really strange that Billy would voice his problems with arm lock. The dude is a total wrist lock putter. Break down the net difference for me, please.

[iBanesto]

3 hours ago, gunmetal said:

 

Billy Ho has the club in both of his hands left hand low and his right hand fingers braced (aka locked) against his wrist. Same with Noren. That's okay?

 

I found it really strange that Billy would voice his problems with arm lock. The dude is a total wrist lock putter. Break down the net difference for me, please.

 

I don't think Noren has a grip like Horschel/arm lock style.

 

I think he has more of a split grip (or more gap between his hands) and a significant forward press.

 

[Hankshank]

1. Schauffele doing it while he thinks its wrong - Totally OK. Golf is played by the rules, and a professional player should do most of it.

 

2. Adam Scott/Langer syndrome - Wonderful swingers who lost millions of dollars not being able to get that last part to the hole done. Along comes the broomstick and hey presto Langer dominates the Senior tour and Scott finishest at the top in majors all the time.  Is that right? Do I like it? 
I think that was wrong,  the broomsticking was wrong. Looked ridiculous and still putting is a big part of the game. But I did like it since swing is king. The complexity of the golf swing is what has made golf interesting without a single low since 1981. I have never left a driving range without the feeling of "some balls more". Training putting is a boring must. Great swingers of the golf club should be kings.

3. Should hands only be the name of the game? Made into a rule? I do not think so. I do think that the broomstick anchoring was too far to the other side, I think what we have now is a compromise and a pretty good one too.

Edited June 24, 2021 by Hankshank

[MUNIGRIT]

Xander should want it banned because he has putted so bad from switching it literally cost him any chance at USO when his nall striking was good enough he should have been up there with Rahm.

[caniac6]

I've picked up arm lock putters, and I can't put the putter against my arm without the putter face being wide open. I can't figure out how anyone uses those things. I'd try left handed, or a broomstick before going arm lock. I consider arm lock anchoring, but it is a skill. I can't do it.

[gunmetal]

There are so many players that are putting left hand low and locking the putter against their wrist but they seem to fly under the radar more. It's very easy to spot on TV. I noticed Lexi went to the claw this week. Good for her. Trying something unconventional and thinking outside the box. Cool.

Why people get so up in arms about this is beyond me. Some people can fix or improve their yips with a new unconventional grip like the garsen grips or an oversized superstroke with 50 grams of weight below the left hand and 15 at the butt, or one of the 500 variants on the market today (all which the USGA and R&A signed off on). Some people can move to an unconventional grip like the claw, saw, pencil, left and low, split grip, etc (all which the USGA and R&A signed off on). Some people try unconventional methods such as looking at the hole or closing their eyes. Why people get so upset about unconventional putters that the USGA and R&A signed off on is beside me. Incidentally, I'm pretty sure Xander's experiment will be ending soon given his performance with anchoring vs without. Just like Kisner. And Bubba....

 

This shouldn't be as big of a deal as it is. If you think it's cheating - you're just wrong. You can not like it. You can think they got it wrong. You can 'not like the way the broomstick looks.' You can think it's against whatever the hell 'the spirit of the game' means, but it really doesn't matter because if it's within the rules of golf. Go play and enjoy the game. It's hard enough no matter how conventional or unconventional you view it.

[Juice1121]

Suggesting that an arm lock is the same as belly or a broom is insane. There are still multiple levers above the elbow to create inconsistencies in form. 

 

Technically, it's anchored to your forearm, but your forearm is not a stable platform, it moves with your putting stroke. 

 

If they want to say the grip can only be in contact with your hands then that's fine, but until then I see no issue with it.