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Kuchar in the bunker

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  • farmerfarmer Members Posts: 8,126 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    If the rules official onsite approved of Kuchar's action, then it may look bad, but it was legal.

  • VindogVindog Don't order the schnitzel. They're using schnauzer! Members Posts: 17,742 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Sep 9, 2019 1:46am #33

    Just saying that Tiger has had his share of **** himself, rules wise. So while he got to remove the boulder (under the direction of an RO), and maybe got a nice reference point back at TPC (didn't need an RO for that), he also couldn't get the drop procedure right at the Masters, moved his ball while removing sticks for penalty, messed up the embedded ball ruling during the desert swing, etc...

    Very well may be the greatest player ever, but not as rules savvy as others. That's all.

    I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for that website, though.

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  • Always_roughAlways_rough Members Posts: 483 ✭✭✭✭

    I think the way he went about improving his lie showed his intent. If he felt comfortable with the rule, he woulda just grabbed a wedge and dug out a nice little teeing area for his ball. Used to like the guy, even with his odd swing. Now he just seems like the other Georgia Tech graduates that have to say, "Well, technically" at least once every conversation.

    Got 14 daggum golf clubs, but none of 'em hit the ball straight.

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  • howellhandmadehowellhandmade Members Posts: 823 ✭✭✭✭✭

    As I watched it, I became uncomfortable. Stop, Matt, just . . . stop. I mean, technically, a grain of sand is a really tiny rock, but that went on far too long. If one of the guys in my foursome did that we’d start throwing tees at him.

  • Titleist99Titleist99 Members Posts: 451 ✭✭✭✭

    Here's the bigger question: If Matt Kuchar's act was so egregious …..Who is protecting the field, certainly not the rule official and not his playing partner.

  • OutBackHackOutBackHack Members Posts: 968 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @mrbh said:
    Agree Cink did the same thing at HH that year and that was also highly problematic for the same reason - in both cases a really poor lie got turned into a perfect one. Not saying either one was strictly against the letter of the rules necessarily, but the look and smell is awful IMO.

    There's a common denominator with these 2. Several more with the denominator are questionable on various ways on a golf course.

  • hell_is_chromehell_is_chrome Members Posts: 994 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Sep 9, 2019 8:31am #38

    @Vindog said:

    @Titleist99 said:
    Let me tell you about the rules of golf.....they are there to help you....Period. The top players (except Dustin Johnson) knows how to exploit the rules and they do it all the time especially Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson and Ernie Els just to name a few. They figure that Golf gives you so many bad breaks that they deserve a couple of good breaks....Remember if an official is right there and he says that what you are doing is okay then it is okay by the rules, that why they call for rulings when ever something is in question......end of story.

    Tiger has a losing record against the rule book. Boulder gate might have been the only time he came out on top.

    Well, the boulder and the time at Akron in 2006 when he lost his ball on the roof of the clubhouse but somehow it was ruled not lost.

  • bulls9999bulls9999 Members Posts: 760 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just saw this and thought it was incredible. Matt Kuchar removing small granular sand (surely he's grabbing individual sand particles as well with his forcep-fingers?) as loose impediments until such point he's opened up a nice trench around his ball and it's sitting on a pedestal like a tee. What is up with this guy?
    https://twitter.com/Ladiestees1/status/1170049042665095168?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1170049042665095168&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fgolfweek.com%2F2019%2F09%2F08%2Fmatt-kuchar-latest-act-goes-against-spirit-of-the-rules%2F

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  • VindogVindog Don't order the schnitzel. They're using schnauzer! Members Posts: 17,742 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    Just a few lines down from your topic is this one.

    https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/1790940/kuchar-in-the-bunker#latest

    run of the mill driver with stock shaft
    a couple of outdated hybrids
    shovel-ier shovels
    wedges from same shovel company
    some putter with a dead insert and
    a hideous grip
  • bladehunterbladehunter Today was a good day... south carolinaMembers Posts: 27,888 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    so to all griping about this ...are you also against the new rule allowing loose impediments to be moved in hazards? I recall quite a large majority were all for this when discussed in the rules forumn before it was implemented.... I fail to see how people couldnt see this type thing coming.... when we stop playing it as we find it , the game will be lost

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  • broomstickerbroomsticker Members Posts: 48 ✭✭

    @bladehunter said:
    so to all griping about this ...are you also against the new rule allowing loose impediments to be moved in hazards? I recall quite a large majority were all for this when discussed in the rules forumn before it was implemented.... I fail to see how people couldnt see this type thing coming.... when we stop playing it as we find it , the game will be lost

    Yes, I am 100% opposed to the new "penalty area" rule. There is no difference in hitting from the rough than the penalty area other than the allowable drops. It's silly.
    Bunkers in the US at least are too easy. If we do not get a perfect lie we b**** about a poor rake job or a bad break. Don't hit it there!

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  • bladehunterbladehunter Today was a good day... south carolinaMembers Posts: 27,888 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @broomsticker said:

    @bladehunter said:
    so to all griping about this ...are you also against the new rule allowing loose impediments to be moved in hazards? I recall quite a large majority were all for this when discussed in the rules forumn before it was implemented.... I fail to see how people couldnt see this type thing coming.... when we stop playing it as we find it , the game will be lost

    Yes, I am 100% opposed to the new "penalty area" rule. There is no difference in hitting from the rough than the penalty area other than the allowable drops. It's silly.
    Bunkers in the US at least are too easy. If we do not get a perfect lie we b**** about a poor rake job or a bad break. Don't hit it there!

    Absolutely agree. All the new rules did was to give the cheater a reason to justify doing so.

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    Ping G410 15.5* Graphite Design ADDI 8x
    Ping G410 21* ADDI 105x 
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    Ping Glide Forged  50  54 60 s400
    Spider X Tour Armlock.  42 inch with jumbo max 17 inch  grip.   


  • gvogelgvogel Members Posts: 7,764 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm burning my Skechers.

    Unseen, in the background, Fate was quietly slipping the lead into the boxing-glove.  P.G. Wodehouse
  • mosesgolfmosesgolf Members Posts: 6,896 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    Gray area but wow his lie sure did improve immensely.

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  • LlortamaiseyLlortamaisey Members Posts: 6,060 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    It reminds me of when guys improve their lie on the tee box by using their foot to step and press down behind the ball. The visual of such action looks terrible, and it certainly seems like a penalty, it would be any other place on the course, but the rules allow you to improve your lie in certain situations. Ultimately, it’s much ado about nothing. I’m fine with it.

  • Titleist99Titleist99 Members Posts: 451 ✭✭✭✭

    @JohnnyCashForever said:

    @Titleist99 said:
    Let me tell you about the rules of golf.....they are there to help you....Period. The top players (except Dustin Johnson) knows how to exploit the rules and they do it all the time especially Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson and Ernie Els just to name a few. They figure that Golf gives you so many bad breaks that they deserve a couple of good breaks....Remember if an official is right there and he says that what you are doing is okay then it is okay by the rules, that why they call for rulings when ever something is in question......end of story.

    Well, no, it's not the end of the story. Witness DJ's ruling on the 5th green at Oakmont. There have been plenty of real-time rulings that were reversed after-the-fact.

    "Kuchar" may eventually enter the English (and Spanish) lexicon as a verb.

    1. "Better keep an eye on him. He really tried to kuchar that rules official on the last hole."
    2. "The caddie didn't want to be kuchared, so he hired a contracts lawyer to negotiate his pay for the week."
    3. "I was accused of kucharing the bocce game yesterday at the picnic. Come on! Everyone knows that I was entitled to an extra ball by an obscure codicil to the original bocce rule book."

    Or how 'bout I'm being kuchared by Johnny Cash....he's taking this post right up to the edge of reality.....LOL!

  • Hawkeye77Hawkeye77 Countdown to The Open Championship! IowaClubWRX Posts: 18,402 ClubWRX

    @gvogel said:
    I'm burning my Skechers.

    No way - Kuchar's Skechers buyers are too cheap to waste them.

  • Titleist99Titleist99 Members Posts: 451 ✭✭✭✭

    @hell_is_chrome said:

    @Vindog said:

    @Titleist99 said:
    Let me tell you about the rules of golf.....they are there to help you....Period. The top players (except Dustin Johnson) knows how to exploit the rules and they do it all the time especially Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson and Ernie Els just to name a few. They figure that Golf gives you so many bad breaks that they deserve a couple of good breaks....Remember if an official is right there and he says that what you are doing is okay then it is okay by the rules, that why they call for rulings when ever something is in question......end of story.

    Tiger has a losing record against the rule book. Boulder gate might have been the only time he came out on top.

    Well, the boulder and the time at Akron in 2006 when he lost his ball on the roof of the clubhouse but somehow it was ruled not lost.

    Thanks for pointing out the fact that the mountain of a boulder was not the only time Tiger Woods got a favorable ruling. Well done! The poster almost had me believing that Nonsense!....LOL!

  • FergusonFerguson Members Posts: 5,181 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    just a few things to ponder:

    1. to my knowledge, there has never been a "positive Kuchar" thread
    2. his dad loves free sketchers
    3. you will never find a Christmas card from Justin Leonard in Kuchar's house
  • RangeballzRangeballz Members Posts: 1,775 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    Agree it doesn't pass the smell test. I guess if it is a "waste area" or whatever it is called, he can remove loose impediments, but he seemed to be pretty liberal with that interpretation. Plus he can ground his club and with a low backswing can create a nice path into the ball. Just doesn't look right IMHO, but whatever.

  • smashdnsmashdn Let's cut them trees down. Members Posts: 1,468 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @bladehunter said:
    so to all griping about this ...are you also against the new rule allowing loose impediments to be moved in hazards? I recall quite a large majority were all for this when discussed in the rules forumn before it was implemented.... I fail to see how people couldnt see this type thing coming.... when we stop playing it as we find it , the game will be lost

    I don't play for money or care what my handicap is (or score really for that matter).

    I say play it down everywhere. I won't pick up on the green unless there is a big glob of dirt or my ball is in someone else's line. I'd be game for just doing a little smoothing in the bunkers, no full bore raking. Just smooth out the footprints as best you can and get on with the game.

    There is a certain satisfaction for me in hitting a good shot from a tough lie.

  • RobertBaronRobertBaron Members Posts: 846 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Llortamaisey said:
    It reminds me of when guys improve their lie on the tee box by using their foot to step and press down behind the ball. The visual of such action looks terrible, and it certainly seems like a penalty, it would be any other place on the course, but the rules allow you to improve your lie in certain situations. Ultimately, it’s much ado about nothing. I’m fine with it.

    It’s the tee box. Why does that look any more terrible than building a little mound like players used to do?

  • Ignatius ReillyIgnatius Reilly Members Posts: 456 ✭✭✭✭

    @RobertBaron said:

    @Llortamaisey said:
    It reminds me of when guys improve their lie on the tee box by using their foot to step and press down behind the ball. The visual of such action looks terrible, and it certainly seems like a penalty, it would be any other place on the course, but the rules allow you to improve your lie in certain situations. Ultimately, it’s much ado about nothing. I’m fine with it.

    It’s the tee box. Why does that look any more terrible than building a little mound like players used to do?

    It gets worse than just a mound or a depression behind the ball.

    At my course, some of the guys use a little stick to hold the ball up in the air!

    Outrageous!

    Anyways, what Kuch is doing should be against the rules. Since it's not, then the rules need to change to cover it, because this is not the way any shot was ever intended to be played.

  • 86020818602081 Members Posts: 1,960 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    Legal or not.. it's looks shady to me..
    He's improving his lie as he's acting like he's moving rocks..

  • VindogVindog Don't order the schnitzel. They're using schnauzer! Members Posts: 17,742 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Sep 9, 2019 10:25pm #57

    B> @Titleist99 said:

    @hell_is_chrome said:

    @Vindog said:

    @Titleist99 said:
    Let me tell you about the rules of golf.....they are there to help you....Period. The top players (except Dustin Johnson) knows how to exploit the rules and they do it all the time especially Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson and Ernie Els just to name a few. They figure that Golf gives you so many bad breaks that they deserve a couple of good breaks....Remember if an official is right there and he says that what you are doing is okay then it is okay by the rules, that why they call for rulings when ever something is in question......end of story.

    Tiger has a losing record against the rule book. Boulder gate might have been the only time he came out on top.

    Well, the boulder and the time at Akron in 2006 when he lost his ball on the roof of the clubhouse but somehow it was ruled not lost.

    Thanks for pointing out the fact that the mountain of a boulder was not the only time Tiger Woods got a favorable ruling. Well done! The poster almost had me believing that Nonsense!....LOL!

    Alright so 3-2.

    I have yet to see you back up your claim. So make a list pointing out where he's lobbied the ROs. I'm open minded to being wrong. Are you?

    run of the mill driver with stock shaft
    a couple of outdated hybrids
    shovel-ier shovels
    wedges from same shovel company
    some putter with a dead insert and
    a hideous grip
  • gvogelgvogel Members Posts: 7,764 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    I think that we need to go back to a simpler form of the rules. You play the ball as it lies. You don't get relief, unless there is a local rule (lift clean and place after a torrential rain). No relief from whatever is in a bunker or waste area. If you hit it in there, you deal with the consequences, however bad. Better than hitting it into a water hazard. And I am in favor of deep furrows in bunkers.

    ON the other hand, I am also in favor of ground under repair when you hit it into a fairway divot. I believe that if you hit it into the fairway, you should be rewarded with a decent lie.

    Unseen, in the background, Fate was quietly slipping the lead into the boxing-glove.  P.G. Wodehouse
  • Titleist99Titleist99 Members Posts: 451 ✭✭✭✭

    @Vindog said:
    B> @Titleist99 said:

    @hell_is_chrome said:

    @Vindog said:

    @Titleist99 said:
    Let me tell you about the rules of golf.....they are there to help you....Period. The top players (except Dustin Johnson) knows how to exploit the rules and they do it all the time especially Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson and Ernie Els just to name a few. They figure that Golf gives you so many bad breaks that they deserve a couple of good breaks....Remember if an official is right there and he says that what you are doing is okay then it is okay by the rules, that why they call for rulings when ever something is in question......end of story.

    Tiger has a losing record against the rule book. Boulder gate might have been the only time he came out on top.

    Well, the boulder and the time at Akron in 2006 when he lost his ball on the roof of the clubhouse but somehow it was ruled not lost.

    Thanks for pointing out the fact that the mountain of a boulder was not the only time Tiger Woods got a favorable ruling. Well done! The poster almost had me believing that Nonsense!....LOL!

    Alright so 3-2.

    I have yet to see you back up your claim. So make a list pointing out where he's lobbied the ROs. I'm open minded to being wrong. Are you?

    Okay......What about the double hit under the bush at his own tournament when he said that he didn't feel the double hit, so the rules committee said OK.

  • Vardon GripVardon Grip Members Posts: 532 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It’s all good guys, it’s kuuuuuch, can’t hate the kuuuch, I’m sure it was embedded on its secondary ball mark and didn’t feel it when he was scooping the sand, I mean loose impediments.
    Even if it looks like cheating it isn’t, “i feel like i could go dancing” free sketchers and free the Tucán! (Or is it Tucán loop 4 free?)

  • BaddsBadds Members Posts: 1,664 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    I love that Kuchar has triggered self-righteous windbags once again.

    I'm looking at you Jeff Shackelford.

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