Interesting development - $3000 pay to caddy from a $1.3 million winners check? (MOD EDIT - NO POLIT

[Krt22]

I really do look forward to everyone finally giving Kuchar the credit he deserves for giving David Ortiz (the caddie not the ball player) a 300% + raise over the previous season's rate (leaving aside that bonus too).

If everyone tries to lift up people in the golf industry the way Matt does, everyone would be better off!

 

Yeah...but ya see..if you look at the math....$900 on a 177k is 0.5%...while 5k on 1.29M is 0.38%. So despite getting paid more than 5x for the same amount of work, he actually got "less" if you look at the numbers. It's basically a criminal offense

[bscinstnct]

Interesting thought.

 

What if Kuchar did this to a US caddie in tournament in let's say Florida?

 

Would there be a different reaction?

 

I doubt he would.

 

Would love to see if he tried it at Bethpage....

 

 

@fuhgedabouditgolf

 

You believe this freakin guy? I not only caddie and get him a major, but I bring him sangwiches, tell him the latest Howard Stern jokes (bababooo!). And he gives me 5 dimes? But its ok, I put a hunk of bluecheese in his bag right before he left. Take that ya cheap bald bastid!

[lowheel]

I really do look forward to everyone finally giving Kuchar the credit he deserves for giving David Ortiz (the caddie not the ball player) a 300% + raise over the previous season's rate (leaving aside that bonus too).

If everyone tries to lift up people in the golf industry the way Matt does, everyone would be better off!

 

Yeah...but ya see..if you look at the math....$900 on a 177k is 0.5%...while 5k on 1.29M is 0.38%. So despite getting paid more than 5x for the same amount of work, he actually got "less" if you look at the numbers. It's basically a criminal offense

 

Yup straight to gitmo

[Krt22]

Interesting thought.

 

What if Kuchar did this to a US caddie in tournament in let's say Florida?

 

Would there be a different reaction?

 

No.

 

 

Yep. I bet more floridian resort caddies would be more than happy with 5k for 4 days or work. Hell each PGA tournament has hundreds of volunteers who stand around for hours on end for some free shirts and to get inside the ropes.

[wobgon]

Interesting thought.

 

What if Kuchar did this to a US caddie in tournament in let's say Florida?

 

Would there be a different reaction?

Yes, Without a doubt a racial issue.

[kcsf]

It's MLK Day and I'm feeling like a public service announcement summarizing where this thread currently resides is in order. I'll do my best to keep it as neutral as possible.

 

 

FACTS

--There was a golf tournament in Mexico and Matt "Alligator Arms" Kucher arrived without his caddy.

--The golf course recommended El Tucan

--El Tucan carried Kuch's bag all week

--Matt Kucher won for the first time since 2014

--Kucher stated the amount paid El Tucan was between $3k and 10% of his winnings

--Some ex-PGA pro SJW named Tom Gillis who, without cause, gave his opinion on Twitter calling out Kucher

 

Items that are not quite facts, but sure are close. 80% chance of being factual.

--El Tucan was paid a $3k flat fee for the week

--El Tucan was paid an additional $2k as a tip after Kucher won

--El Tucan was not paid the local caddy standard of 5% of a win

 

Items with a 50/50 shot of being facts

--Kucher stated he and El Tucan HAD an agreement in place prior to the start of the tournament

--El Tucan stated there was NO agreement in place, and was paid a random amount after the tournament

 

 

Positions a reasonable person could take with the above information:

--El Tucan was paid a predetermined amount of money, and received a tip of 68% of the predetermined flat fee. This agreement, made prior, was fulfilled by Kucher and he generously tipped due to his win.

--There was no agreement in place and Kucher took advantage of this and paid El Tucan poorly comparatively to how a normal caddy would be paid. (It's been stated in the thread a 5% amount for a local caddy is the going rate for a win)

 

Items that matter close to 0%

--Gillis spouting off his opinion on Twitter or anywhere else

--$5k is more than someone in Uzbekistan makes in a year

--Under2hours posts

 

 

If I left out any important items, let me know and I'll update.

[wobgon]

https://www.bing.com...selectedIndex=3

 

Is this the Gillis everyone has been talking about?

[augustgolf]

https://www.bing.com...selectedIndex=3

 

Is this the Gillis everyone has been talking about?

 

Nope - that is a "pre-Gilligan" - not to be confused with a mulligan, which I see nowhere in the new 2019 rules of golf.

[duffer987]

I really do look forward to everyone finally giving Kuchar the credit he deserves for giving David Ortiz (the caddie not the ball player) a 300% + raise over the previous season's rate (leaving aside that bonus too).

If everyone tries to lift up people in the golf industry the way Matt does, everyone would be better off!

 

Yeah...but ya see..if you look at the math....$900 on a 177k is 0.5%...while 5k on 1.29M is 0.38%. So despite getting paid more than 5x for the same amount of work, he actually got "less" if you look at the numbers. It's basically a criminal offense

Sure in hindsight. But those are base pay numbers, the 900 to 3k, I didn't even mention that tidy bonus. Unless you are in sales, surely it's all about securing the good base salary and then working on the bonus structure and other benefits.

I bet due to the ad-hoc nature of things they didn't have time to do a personal development plan with incentivized goals that would have enabled him to earn more.

TBF, Kuchar went above and beyond to give him extra when there was nothing in their agreement that stipulated a bonus. I mean surely everyone thinks that right? :)

[duffer987]

Just found Kuchar's next fill-in caddie. He'd not complain one bit and would likely give Gillis a PID just for lookin' funny:

 

https://twentytwowords.com/man-won-1-lottery-wants-winnings-paid-giant-check/

[cdnglf]

Haiku time...

 

Majorless wonder

The Mayakoba cheapskate

Could it be karma?

 

 

[Dpavs]

Why do only those "supporting" Kuch & his $5,000 paid to the caddy feel it is necessary to name call or troll those on "the other side" of this debate.

 

This is an anonymous site, but the lengths some of those here who claim Kuch was perfectly in his right, maybe generous too in how he handled the situation and those claiming it is no ones business as to what was paid, and then the comments/posts made to those who have taken issue or think otherwise have been really nasty & often uncalled for.

 

Real classy people.

Says the one guy on the forum known by everyone as a class act...………...

 

Regardless if this is true or not, he makes a good point. Too many pejorative references and not enough intelligent conversation in all too many threads these days. And honestly trying to trash him response only proves his point right?

 

Yes, "intelligent conversation" like comparing Kuchar to rapists?

 

 

I did not attribute intelligent conversation to anyone or any single post ... it was more of a comment and observation in general. Your reply and attempt at total misdirection, pretty much is what I find to be useless rhetoric and that which is becoming all too frequently seen.

 

Honestly, I get you have a strong opinion here but I think we all have a better chance at keeping the discussions civil and sane if we all choose not join the other darker side, right?

[Krt22]

that depends on your definition of the darker side.

[cdnglf]

The smile is empty

The heart is penurious

The shoes are ugly

 

[MidwestGolfBum]

Wait, it is not anyone's business, right?

 

Gillis has said it repeatedly and it has been echoed in here. Anything around 5% would not have created a storm.

 

I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that Cejka gave him something around $9k plus his $3k base in 2017 when he finished T-9th and took home $177,500. That's speculation although I did tweet Cejka, but I bet he won't throw his hat in the ring against another player.

 

The "standard deal" is 5% on anything other than a win and 10% of a win in addition to the base. Active or retired tour players are the best source for what would have been fair. That's why Gillis's opinion has any validity. Although clearly he typically paid the base when he slammed the trunk shut.

 

"Christ all mighty it's like I'm sittin' round here playing cards with my brothers kids or something, you nerve racking..."

 

FWIW (very little obviously - figuratively and literally):

 

"He also caddied for Alex Cejka the year before and only got paid $900 and he (Cejka) won $177,000."

https://twitter.com/...033799999922176

I await all the retroactive pearl clutching about Cejka.

 

I asked for this exact question a few (probably like 12 at this point) pages back and got no response. Thanks for digging it up!

[bscinstnct]

The smile is empty

The heart is penurious

The shoes are ugly

 

No hair on his head

Velcro wallet is empty

For Toucan at least

[rangersgoalie]

He won the tourney

He paid a local caddie

The rest is BS

[bscinstnct]

He won the tourney

He paid a local caddie

The rest is BS

 

All cheapos beware

Twitter will be dispensing

Social Justice

[jmck]

So many words and yet

 

Such a small pittance from one

 

Smiley McNoTip.

[Krt22]

5/7/5 buddy.

 

Poor El toucan sam

Vitimized by sketcher man

Twitter schlep must help

[BlackDiamondPar5]

He won the tourney

He paid a local caddie

The rest is BS

Agreed. I'm still waiting for a response from SJWs on what they would dictate as the proper dollar amount that should have been paid.

[bscinstnct]

He won the tourney

He paid a local caddie

The rest is BS

Agreed. I'm still waiting for a response from SJWs on what they would dictate as the proper dollar amount that should have been paid.

 

One point three million

And gave his caddie 5k

Gillis on the case!

[Krt22]

Justice must be served

His family needs to eat

How can Kuchar sleep

[bscinstnct]

Justice must be served

His family needs to eat

How can Kuchar sleep

 

Lol, 2* out and waitin for me chinese food, how this...

 

 

Rip off on the links

Social Justice Warriors

Come out to play-ay

 

[nikegal]

Interesting thought.

 

What if Kuchar did this to a US caddie in tournament in let's say Florida?

 

Would there be a different reaction?

 

No.

 

 

Yep. I bet more floridian resort caddies would be more than happy with 5k for 4 days or work. Hell each PGA tournament has hundreds of volunteers who stand around for hours on end for some free shirts and to get inside the ropes.

They used to be free, haha. Now the volunteers have to pay for their gear. At the Web.com event in Pittsburgh, It was $55 for a shirt, visor/hat and a wind slick that wasn’t even water repellant, haha. Take care :) Madison

[Krt22]

The safeway open has free gear. The US open is $185 for the volunteer gear!

[Hawkeye77]

A bargain is struck.

Gillis bleating, "look at me!"

Fifteen minutes up.

[ebrasmus21]

I’m not a poet.

Gillis can kiss my a**

No death to this thread.

[duffer987]

Gillis is a berk

Matt gives local caddie work

Both of these are true

[manku]

The safeway open has free gear. The US open is $185 for the volunteer gear!

 

Before they started charging, people would volunteer, get the free swag (tickets too) and disappear!

 

I volunteer at Riviera (I'm on a good committee), but I also understand the absurdity of volunteering (and actually paying) to work in an event where literally EVERYONE else involved is getting paid. Some people swallow the "volunteers allow us to donate more to charity" garbage, but of course they could also cut the prize pool by 2mm, pay the "volunteers" and give away the same amount!

 

Socialist rant over...