Please Delete, Lock or whatever..... Kind regards Paddy

[WristySwing]

@Paddy_2_Iron I know you don't want to return the irons, but listen to what this person has to say. You got had. Take them back and demand a refund. You were sold JUNK. GARBAGE. TRASH. No matter how you phrase it, the product they sold you is horrific. My eyebrows would have hit the roof at the line about scratch golfers trading in their blades for these things. Most fitters have a performance guarantee because they believe in what they do, you need to go in there guns blazing. Tell them you without a doubt want some sort of refund on these, they are terrible, you can't hit them, the quality is poor, etc. Don't leave until you have an answer.
Do not buy those Hawkeyes or Fusions either. A good deal does not mean good for you. Get your money back and then spend it on some good quality, halfway new used gear. Something like the Taylormade M2, Cobra F7, or Ping G should easily be in your price range and can be found in a lot of used golf stores/used sections of bog box shops or on eBay.

[Stuart_G]

They don't feel heavy because they are bad heads or bad shafts. And as long as they do feel too heavy, there is NO way to know how the quality of the heads or shafts for that matter is effecting the results. The one thing I do agree with is that as long as they feel bad, something needs to be done. Whether to try and fix the current set or simply replace them is the question.

As far as fixing the current set, it's not that complicated. If they feel too heavy, the problem is that either 1) the swing weight is too high or 2) the static /shaft weight is too high or 3) both are too high for the player. The big question is which. And the stock specs don't help us, we need actual specs - actual shaft weights, swing weights, grip weight, and lengthsr. As a knock off set, it's likely custom made and we have no idea to what specs they were actually made. Ideally we also need some comparison specs from a set that doesn't feel too heavy to get a better idea of what is a good fit for the OP.

 

If the static weight is too high, then that would need to be addressed with a shaft change. In which case, if you can't do the work yourself, is usually less expensive to flip the set and find one (likely used) that are a better fit.

If the swing weight is too high, it might be possible to address that with length (as the easiest - e.g. change to 3/8" length progressions) but more radically may need to pull the heads to check for tip weights. And if the OP is one who needs or fits into an over-length set, there may not be many options to get a reasonable swing weight with standard weight heads at the longer lengths. Over length builds generally need lighter heads designed for those longer lengths.

 

[Paddy_2_Iron]

Thanks guys for all the good information I really do appreciate it. FYI I'm not a troll, I'm a 19 handicap golf who is looking to improve and I am getting way better. A lot of thanks to the driver.

I went up there today and spoke with the fitter and decided to bring up a callaway 2019 head I bought off ebay and fit it with a Ozik Program F15. It's pretty nice to be honest I hit a few and it was carrying 180. The fitter hit it over 210 carry.

I'm going to play this a few round and might have to think about saving up some money to get this set.

What do you think about this set? 2019 Callaway Big Bertha with Ozik Program F15's?

[hurley999s]

At least now you’re dealing with a known entity in the Callaway. However the important thing here is exactly what Stuart mentioned - and it gets to the heart of club fitting. It’s much more than just finding a head and pairing it up with a shaft. You’ve gotta find the right length, weight (total/static and swingweight) and balance for your swing.

I’ll say this - if the fitter you’re dealing with doesn’t bring up any of these topics in your fitting and just tries to steer you to throwing a Masterfit shaft into that Callaway, make it the last time you set foot in there.

You should be having a discussion and fitting around all of the parameters outlined above. The same club head on the same shaft can be made to feel and perform very different based on component weights, added weights, trimming, grips, etc. So for you I think you have a lot more to understand or at least inquire about.

[BB28403]

Callaway preowned my friend!

step 1. Dig a 4 feet deep x 4 feet wide hole, bury those irons in dirt.

step 2. Go to Callaway pre owned website

step 3. Order irons that are suggested to you by 3+ members on here.

very serious! ?

[Stuart_G]

@Paddy_2_Iron 'said What do you think about this set? 2019 Callaway Big Bertha with Ozik Program F15's?
It's not what we think about them that matters. The only thing that matters is how they felt to you and how they performed for you?
And performance is about a LOT more than just distance and how far you hit them. Did they feel good - too light, too heavy? Did the shaft feel too soft or too stiff? Was the impact in the center of the face and how consistent was it? (foot powder spray or impact tape should be used for that). How consistent were the results, what type of dispersion? How was the accuracy and shot shape (compared to what might be expected with your normal swing and results).
If they did feel good and seem work reasonably well, it may not necessarily be an ideal fit, but it's at least a step in the right direction.
And an important thing to be aware of is that the Matrix program F15's were made in different weights. If memory serves, there were 80's, 85's, 95's and 120's. it's very important to know which one is the one you got and worked for you. It's also important to know the flex.
Second, depending on the weight, unless you have some medical issues that benefit from the shock absorption of the graphite (e.g. arthritis or tendonitis are the more common ones), you might be better off focusing on steel shafts since prices tend to be a bit less expensive for them if an equivalent steel shaft can be identified.
@BB28403 said Order irons that are suggested to you by 3+ members on here.
The problem with that is that no one here can know what a good fit will be for the OP any more than the individual he's been going to see. The only thing that will help the OP is to go out and demo/test as many different shaft and head combo's as he can - and if he can't find a competent fitter to help him, that means he's going to need to pay attention to the details of what worked and how they felt, etc.. IF he can collect enough data and bring it back here, then someone here might be able to help him with a specific recommendation, but not before.

[Tommyj]

OP, you said a couple of posts up that you were told the lie angle on your wedges was way off. Standard lie angle on the S18 is 63* and yours was at 62.5*, I wouldn't be complaining about that.

I want to see those scratch reps who are working those crap irons both ways.

Check the swing weights on your new irons for fun, I'll bet they're all over the map.

[Paddy_2_Iron]

How do you check the swing weights?
I'm thinking about getting these checked for me again just in case it's as Stuart says, the specs are off. They do feel heavy in the head, especially on the takeaway. I like a lighter club to keep my body loose. For several reason, one is when I swing down I don't have that little over the top head move and I get about 10 yards distance more on a club. When they are heavier you have to use my muscles to hold the club in place etc......
Not to mention the club feels like it bottoms out and takes more energy to swing during rounds can cause some inconsistencies. In regards to fitness I stretch a little and walk a lot, ~1 hour ever other day, but I don't do weights etc.... (Reason I bring that up is I don't want some heavy club where you have to be muscles mcgee to swing it.@Tommyj The head was 62.5 but it was advertised and labeled as a 60. @Stuart_G I'm going to have them check them out again, maybe it's just a defect. I honestly don't mind them not being a name brand if they play and as I stated already I'm a 19 handicap. So straight and advancing is what Im looking for. I wish the 9 was more of a wedge look to be honest, I may end up replacing that one before it's all said and done.....
The iron felt pretty nice. I like the look of the head, it's chunky enough to give me confidence over the ball, the head weight it great and the bottom edge sets right up to the ball. It looks like I'll be able to pick it clean off the fairway. Since it's a 4 iron I dont have a negative attack angle like my 7, 8 iron etc....
Speaking of which do you recommend any irons that has the look and feel of the S18's? I'd love to get one off those as my 9 iron.

[SBH9458]

@Paddy_2_Iron were you able to get the refund for the prior set?

[Viktoryred3]

I take it you haven’t tried to get any of your money back? Don’t feel like you’re doing this so called “fitter” dirty by asking for a refund. He ripped you off, plain and simple. If anyone has been done dirty, it’s you OP. The last thing I would’ve done is bring another club in there to get work done, or in your case reshafted. Everyone has to start somewhere, but not everyone has to get ripped off to learn a lesson....

[dxdgenert]

Thanks told myself I wouldn’t do this but I’ll also pile on: You were duped into buying $1k worth of what would be considered “knockoff” garbage. All of it, driver and shafts included. Regardless of whether you hit that driver well, it cost you as much or more for their component head and cheap shaft (it is, regardless of what you think or were told) as you would have for a name brand “real” manufacturer driver with a premium shaft. And in case these clowns try to tell you that their stuff is made by the same manufacturers, it isn’t. You can try to get your money back but they won’t. Try to chargeback from your credit card company but it won’t stick. Bottom line is that you these guys offered a product and you bought it. No one forced you. Had you done your homework prior, hopefully you wouldn’t have set foot in their “fitting center” in the first place. It doesn’t seem that you even know the difference between lie angle and loft angle. That is referring to the “work” they did on your wedges. You seem to be super passionate, uninformed and impressionable. That is a perfect client for these guys.

So with all that said the damage is done. Where do you go from here? Start over piece by piece. It’ll take time and money. It sounds like you don’t have either at the moment. You already have the clubs so play them as they are and don’t give those people another cent. Not. One. More. Cent.

When you are able, go to fitter that offers OEM (known brands like Callaway, TaylorMade, PING, Callaway, etc). Do. Not. Buy. Components. Again. look for close out previous years models. If that doesn’t work go for used.

Finally, what is the obsession with Ozik shafts? Ozik shafts are old. The company that made them, Matrix, doesn’t even exist in the capacity they once did. I believe that a company called LA Golf Shafts bought their IP and are marketing the Ozik name as a super premium offering but I doubt that is what you are referring to. Get. Fit.

There is a phrase: Don’t throw good money after bad money. Please heed this. Do things right and be happy. I assume from your comments that you think and analyze this stuff. This will bother you until it is fixed so do so as soon as you can.

[bulls9999]

I may not get around much, but I've never heard of a fitter fitting someone into knock-off irons? What the heck?

[dxdgenert]

This used to be very common. 15-20 years ago before clubfitting became mainstream, component (actual term instead of knockoffs) fitters and builders were the norm. I can’t believe any of them are left. I’d put these Masterfit jokers in the same bucket as Warrior. They’re touting custom fitting as some magical wizardry and ignoring the millions of dollars of R&D that the big companies spend to develop their products. Never mind the fact that everyone does fitting now, as well. They prey on uninformed, passionate, older high-handicappers.

[Tommyj]

Any big box golf place will probably also do club work and have a swing weight scale. They're usually pretty good about letting you use it to check your clubs. If your irons are standard length with standard size grips I would expect a swing weight somewhere in the range of C9 to D1, and swing weights should be pretty consistent across the set, no more than +/- 1 point.

I misunderstood your commend regarding the wedge, thought the 62.5 referred to the lie angle, not the loft.

[Paddy_2_Iron]

@dxdgenert
Thanks for the post, appreciate the heads up. Like anything in life it's relative and since picking the game back up from a ~8 year hiatus, this is the best driver I have had in a long time (I was using an R1 TM used and a Cobra Baffler), since my Cleveland Launcher from year ago. I think I'm going to try to play this stuff out until like you mentioned I get some cash and to be honest my game improves. I really need to get my game in order. The wedges are pretty decent, even if you think the masterfit shafts are crap, I seem to hit them fairly well. I'm just going to go with this equipment until I can't stand it or maybe I come around on it.
People laugh at me for going here, but the facility is really set up nice and they are really attentive and seem willing to help you out. I even played a round with a club pro who gave me a hole by hole lesson and it was really cool watching him play. He shot 8 pars in a row and then did 8 more in a row. Best I have ever seen. @Tommyj All good I probably said something incorrectly. It was loft and it was 2.5 off from what it was advertised.
I finally decided to just go with the Masterfit equipment even irons and just play the game and see what happens. It's probably me.......

[Londoner]

Sorry but I'm not having this. I went along earlier but now I call BS.

[Paddy_2_Iron]

@Londoner What are you talking about you never went along with this.....
There is no BS about this. I live in Jacksonville, went to Masterfit to get fitted for custom clubs. You are strange.....

[ChristopherMcDonald]

Everyone gave you the right answer. Return ALL of your clubs (including the component driver and hybrid). You are not getting value for your money.

Go get fit, even at Golftec or similar, and shop yesteryears major OEM brands.

[Paddy_2_Iron]

@ChristopherMcDonald
Why would I return my driver when I belt it 240 carry relatively straight? The shaft holds my miss to the right and mitigates a hook I sometimes bring in when my upper body gets to active?
Mizuno wedges (3 out of the 4) are solid even with the shafts?

[ChristopherMcDonald]

Driver reason for return: It's a component that doesn't cost ANYWHERE NEAR $330 that you paid for it. Shaft is probably a pull from an old driver (not on the manufacturers website anymore). If you hit it well, you'll be able to find something you'll hit JUST AS WELL, for less, much less. They most likely bored out your wedges to accept the (again, super cheap) graphite shaft. I would at very, VERY least find out if they modified the head to accept those shafts. If they did, I would ask them to pay for my new wedges. The equipment you were given are not quality. You were sold trash because you (no fault to you) didn't know any better. I would get every single cent back.

 

Just for fun, you should let them know we're having a riveting conversation regarding the way they operate. Would love for them to come here to defend their position on totally screwing an unknowledgeable customer.

 

Keep in mind, we're all 100% on your side. It's just seeming like you don't want to hear what we're saying.

[Londoner]

Strange? I'm not the one trying to defend paying 1000 bucks for 50's worth if clubs. It's rubbish.

[Viktoryred3]

@Paddy_2_Iron We’re all on your side, we’re only telling you to return the clubs because you paid 10x the amount of what they’re worth. You most definitely could find name brand clubs that are much newer for a fraction of the price compared to what this “fitter” sold you. If you’re ok with getting ripped off that’s fine by me, as it’s not my money being wasted. I just find it unfortunate that you create a post questioning your fitting/club buying experience, everyone here on golfwrx gives you the same answer (that you got ripped off and should at least try to get some type of refund), and you don’t seem to like that advice, so you start trying to justify the “fitter” scamming you. If you’re going to blatantly ignore our advice, what’s the purpose of creating a post in the first place?

[Paddy_2_Iron]

I'm pissed because I don't think they refund me any money. I asked for a refund already on a 3 hybrid and he said wait 3 months then he will see what he can do.... This isn't like the PGA superstore where you bring a club back and they replace it.

I did get talked into a hybrid once and hated it and promptly brought it back for a 2 irons crossover. Which wasn't the right club either but felt bad to keep returning. Actually it went 4 iron crossover, 2 iron hybrid, 2 iron crossover. Probably shouldn't of bought any......

I'm pretty ticked off to be completely honest.

I just need to get out of the buying game and just play the damn game....

[hurley999s]

**This isn't like the PGA superstore where you bring a club back and they replace it.**

That’s the big red flag I talked about earlier. Any competent custom club fitter will have some sort of performance guarantee. It’s basically a good fitter saying “hey I know we’re good at what we do and we want to help you improve, so if the clubs don’t work for you, let’s find something that does”

Their refusal to allow you to return them for a refund basically says “hey this idiot gave us $1000 for crap that cost us $50, no way in he!l we’re losing out on this sale and giving this schmuck his money back”

OP you’ve been given the truth. Up to you to decide whether to accept it.

Oh and by the way, I think your flaw in logic is that a good player = good fitter. You’re trusting what this guy says because he got 8 pars in a row on a simulator. Guess what, I’ll bet you the $20 your clubs are worth that Brooks Koepka couldn’t fit you worth a d@mn.

[dxdgenert]

Whoa, whoa, whoa... The 8 pars, bogey(?), 8 pars we’re on a simulator not a real course?!? Oh hell no.

[mizuno player]

If you used a CC to pay contact them and file a complaint. Maybe they will reverse the charge.

I would not defend him based on the fact th driver seems to be working. Sounds like he got lucky.

Sorry OP. This guy should not be allowed to be in business.

[halliedog]

People laugh at me for going here, but the facility is really set up nice and they are really attentive and seem willing to help you out. I even played a round with a "club pro" who gave me a hole by hole lesson and it was really cool watching him play. He shot 8 pars in a row and then did 8 more in a row. Best I have ever seen.

I've only ever heard of one other club pro guy shooting 8 consecutive pars. This guy you played with wasn't by chance from Kansas City was he? https://clubproguy.com/pages/the-streak

[Tac]

 

I’ve been reading through this thread, was thinking exactly the same thing and eventually get to your post expressing the exact same sentiment.

If this is real, then to me, the guy is just a keener who is extremely excited to be buying and playing again and wants to talk about his new clubs but doesn’t really want any dissenting advice.

I’ve seen this online many times over the years with golf, astronomy and guitar gear — especially just after Xmas.

 

Since the OP says he’s in Jacksonville, I’m going to assume this is the place?

http://www.masterfitgolfltd.com/

[hurley999s]

Actually reading back I’m not sure - I assumed it was but who knows, maybe the fitter wined and dined OP at the local muni with all the profit he saw coming his way :)

[braincramp52]

Paddy, I'd just take this whole thing as a learning experience. But, I don't care how nice the facility was or how nice the fitter was I'd never set foot near the place again because you got screwed and the guys there know it.