LIV Tour Discussion Thread (*** NO POLITICS ***)

[italianstallion]

16 minutes ago, dropkicked said:

Read the quote. Rahm, stated he made his decision based on whats best for his family and setting them up for the future..

What man wouldn't take the money in order to secure generational wealth for his family?

 

I don't know...maybe a man who has the intelligence to realize he's already acquired generational wealth? 

 

I have to hand it to a guy like Rickie Fowler...when LIV started becoming a thing he barely had any status anywhere. He probably made $100-$150M career between tournaments and endorsements by that point, and I'm sure LIV offered him minimum $50M to go over. A guy with what I saw at that time a non-future in pro golf turned down that money. Why? If I had to guess, a combination of morals, desire to play with his friends on the only tour that matters, and an understanding that whatever he had in the bank at that time was more than enough for his life and the life of his children and children's children. Spieth and Adam Scott have recently used language that echoes a similar thought process.

 

Much to your and the PIF's dismay, there are actually people out there who are immune to the "Disease of More." 

 

 

[bladehunter]

31 minutes ago, dropkicked said:

Read the quote. Rahm, stated he made his decision based on whats best for his family and setting them up for the future..

What man wouldn't take the money in order to secure generational wealth for his family?

Thats not usually the best way to set them up.  Quality of person and personal accomplishments in a wealthy family dwindles by a nearly predictable percentage each gen after.  
 

Would be much better to take Shaquille oNeil’s approach “ I’m rich.  You’re not”.   A pay for any  school. House them.  Maybe even let them work for you to buy a cheap car.  Otherwise. Make them make their own.  You can even invest in their ideas later if you deem it a serious goal.  But just to set up trust funds ?  No way .  Rahm had plenty to do it the right way before.  

[MaineMariner]

35 minutes ago, dropkicked said:

Read the quote. Rahm, stated he made his decision based on whats best for his family and setting them up for the future..

What man wouldn't take the money in order to secure generational wealth for his family?

 

Nobody's questioning his decision in the abstract. The question was about Rahm's decision to take the money in the face of his prior statements that an offer of generational wealth would not persuade him as he was already generationally wealthy.

 

Rahm answered, essentially, that his perspective changed when the money was actually in front of him. Not an unreasonable answer, but a bit disheartening nonetheless. Like his true colors came out when the Saudi's opened the briefcase stuffed with cash.

[Noles]

41 minutes ago, dropkicked said:

Read the quote. Rahm, stated he made his decision based on whats best for his family and setting them up for the future..

What man wouldn't take the money in order to secure generational wealth for his family?

There is a list of guys who didn't take the money

[bscinstnct]

14 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

Thats not usually the best way to set them up.  Quality of person and personal accomplishments in a wealthy family dwindles by a nearly predictable percentage each gen after.  
 

Would be much better to take Shaquille oNeil’s approach “ I’m rich.  You’re not”.   A pay for any  school. House them.  Maybe even let them work for you to buy a cheap car.  Otherwise. Make them make their own.  You can even invest in their ideas later if you deem it a serious goal.  But just to set up trust funds ?  No way .  Rahm had plenty to do it the right way before.  

 

Generally 

 

 

More than 2/3 of “generational wealth”

 

poof

 

Disappears in the 2nd generation 

 

Then 90%
 

buh bye

 

Disappears by the 3rd generation!

 

Not hard to figure out why that is lol

 

 

 

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

16 hours ago, pingbling23 said:

Me thinks they are fudging the numbers.  How does a replay of last years tournament get more views then tigers hero event?  Tiger brings the viewers right?

 

15 hours ago, pingbling23 said:

What seems more reasonable?  Tiger returning to competitive golf with several of the worlds best getting less views then a replay of last years final round doesn’t seem right.  With all their contacts and incentive to have high viewership in relation to their 700 million tv contract, it would not surprise me to have some fluff happening.  I mean the cbs/pga tour affiliates were blocking LIV from airing in several high market areas around the country last season and I assume that’s continuing.  On golf channel the hero had less then 500k views the first 2 days average, that’s pickleball numbers.  Ofcourse they were bragging because that was double the viewers from the year before when there was no tiger.  Regardless, we all knew we would not get accurate ratings numbers for liv due the hurtles the pga tour and their tv cronies were putting up.  This a new product and the pga tour is well established.  No one expects LIV to be pulling in the same or even close to the viewership of the pga tour.  LIV is getting enough to cause the pga tour to change course and will increase as time goes on.

 

It did get more than Tiger's event, but make sure you're comparing properly. You can't compare weekend network numbers to Thurs/Fri Golf Channel numbers. The Hero got >1M on Saturday and ~880K on Sunday. 

 

That said, there is a BIG difference. The weekend of the Hero was also the weekend of conference championships in college football and a full slate of Sunday NFL games. The AT&T didn't have to contend with either. Many people are going to watch football over a silly season limited-field golf tournament, even WITH Tiger showing up. 

 

I'm sure I'm not the only one that tunes in to football during football season over golf. That might make me a minority on WRX, but pretty sure there are a lot of people in the general golfing public like me. 

[One Putter]

1 hour ago, dropkicked said:

Read the quote. Rahm, stated he made his decision based on whats best for his family and setting them up for the future..

What man wouldn't take the money in order to secure generational wealth for his family?

Yeah man because we all know Jon Rahm was hurting for money and didnt already have generational wealth. I was beginning to actually feel sorry for the guy but my worries are no more. Yay, more entitled nepo babies!

Edited February 7 by One Putter

[Shilgy]

On 2/5/2024 at 12:39 PM, woahnelly said:

 

https://tugr.org/rankings

 

These are more unbiased 

 

Brian Harman is currently 10 in OWGR. How can it be taken seriously? 

Whether you agree with it or not it is performance based….not someone deciding arbitrarily where they “think” they should be.

 

It’s funny….some think two years is too long….but of course one week is too short.  So how far back do you go? How many more points are awarded in certain events ? Majors?

 

Some that complain about the rankings point at DJ.  The only thing we have to go on for the last two years is majors and he’s been….ok.  A couple missed cuts and a couple top 10’s.  Anything higher than 50th would be, at best, based on performance from a few years back and name recognition.  Which coincidentally what LIV was counting on signing the guys they did early on.

[DrunkCaddy]

2 hours ago, Noles said:

Another streaming service???  $45-$50 per month????  This thing will be a flop.

It's going to contain all college football (SEC, ACC, B1G, Big XII),  the NFL (MNF), the NBA, etc.

 

I would say this might be the thing that puts the final dagger into cable TV's heart.  

[Titleist99]

21 minutes ago, italianstallion said:

 

I don't know...maybe a man who has the intelligence to realize he's already acquired generational wealth? 

 

I have to hand it to a guy like Rickie Fowler...when LIV started becoming a thing he barely had any status anywhere. He probably made $100-$150M career between tournaments and endorsements by that point, and I'm sure LIV offered him minimum $50M to go over. A guy with what I saw at that time a non-future in pro golf turned down that money. Why? If I had to guess, a combination of morals, desire to play with his friends on the only tour that matters, and an understanding that whatever he had in the bank at that time was more than enough for his life and the life of his children and children's children. Spieth and Adam Scott have recently used language that echoes a similar thought process.

 

Much to your and the PIF's dismay, there are actually people out there who are immune to the "Disease of More." 

 

 

Great post by the way (my opinion). Kudos to Rickie, he waited out the storm and gained even more fans for it.

 

My list of PGAT players that continue to shock me for rejecting the irrational cash: 

 

 Rickie Fowler-- For reasons listed above.

Matt Kuchar----Even tho making $64M on the tour, for him enough is not enough. he's at that age.

Justin Rose---At that age, Ryder Cup buddies on LIV, eligible for majors 

Jason Day----At that age, Injury prone, tons of kids, eligible for majors

Tommy Fleetwood---Ryder Cup buddies on LIV, can't win on the PGAT, eligible for majors.

Wyndham Clark----I know he said but his offer wasn't high enough, they lowballed him. he's eligible for the Majors. Top 20 OWGR.

Brian Harman--eligible for the Majors, at that age. Top 20 OWGR.

Tony Finau---Seems a little disenchanted lately. tons of kids, eligible for the majors, a friend of Jon Rahm.

Adam Scott.

 

Shocked that these guys hadn't taken the bag already.😆

 

Doesn't mean that they won't in the near future though.

 

 

[PedronNiall]

5 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

Thats not usually the best way to set them up.  Quality of person and personal accomplishments in a wealthy family dwindles by a nearly predictable percentage each gen after.  
 

Would be much better to take Shaquille oNeil’s approach “ I’m rich.  You’re not”.   A pay for any  school. House them.  Maybe even let them work for you to buy a cheap car.  Otherwise. Make them make their own.  You can even invest in their ideas later if you deem it a serious goal.  But just to set up trust funds ?  No way .  Rahm had plenty to do it the right way before.  

Why not both? The truly wealthy families endow their children or grandchildren with funds as well as doing everything they can to curate a path for them to develop the skills & network to succeed. The families with wealth that lasts don't get on the track of "I got it from the dirt, now you can, too" by leaving their children with nothing. That's one thing that often sees a next generation right back in poor shape, people who think it's hard work alone that makes for success. Intelligent decisions and luck both have their hand in things, so sending your offspring back out there to try and make lightning strike twice is asking for bad times. It's beyond foolish not to give your child every head start you can while also instilling them with the realities of what will keep them well above the waterline. 

 

There's a reason established houses continue on. There's a reason it's not uncommon to see successful families hand their businesses down to the next in line over generations and have those established businesses continue to grow. Tiger put his son on a path that has him signed to lucrative deals before he's even 18 and builds off the family name as a Tour-related example. There's no guarantee he does well in life because of that, but it puts him in a much better spot to do so than someone with wealthy parents who grows up around luxury while being given little of their own and told they need to do it all again from scratch. 

 

The kids whose parents buy them starter homes, etc., tend to do better on average in my experience than those who only get stern advice and "go out there and succeed" as a graduation gift, and that's the finding statistically as well. 

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/is-income-inequality-caused-by-inheritance-generational-wealth-2019-2

 

 

 

Just picking an easy to digest example, but there are plenty more showing the same. Research does tend to show that things like the ability to delay gratification and be resilient are important factors, but the wealthy families I've known didn't make it a habit of just giving their kids every little thing they asked for and they expected them to do their best in school, get through the headaches, etc. All other things being equal I'll bet on the kids from families who point them on the path to continued success while helping them to have stability over kids coming straight out of school and having to pay their own way from scratch.

 

All that said, Rahm didn't need LIV money to ensure it happens for his kids. Greed got him the bed he's in and now he gets to lie in it. I'm really unclear why anyone in this thread is trying to spin that as Monahan's fault. Rahm admitted he didn't think the money mattered to him, then it suddenly did when it was actually in front of his face. That's on him. 

[WorkItBothWays]

5 hours ago, ahenderX said:

So...

 

ESPN: LIV Golf's Jon Rahm hoping for a way to play in PGA Tour events

 

He's emotional having missed recent PGA Tour events.

 

I...just...do...not...know...how...to...reply...

As soon as they sign on that dotted line they all seem to completely lose self-awareness. It's laughable and must be embarrassing for LIV that their players still want to play the PGA Tour events despite what Phil claims.

[jimecherry]

3 hours ago, idrive said:

 

Not if they're looking for exciting, compelling content.  That leaves liv out.

leaves golf out to be honest excluding the majors

[jimecherry]

57 minutes ago, Noles said:

There is a list of guys who didn't take the money

please post that list along with how much each was offered ;}

[dropkicked]

1 hour ago, bladehunter said:

Thats not usually the best way to set them up.  Quality of person and personal accomplishments in a wealthy family dwindles by a nearly predictable percentage each gen after.  
 

Would be much better to take Shaquille oNeil’s approach “ I’m rich.  You’re not”.   A pay for any  school. House them.  Maybe even let them work for you to buy a cheap car.  Otherwise. Make them make their own.  You can even invest in their ideas later if you deem it a serious goal.  But just to set up trust funds ?  No way .  Rahm had plenty to do it the right way before.  

I hear you. But that's also not always the case. Providing children with more opportunities comes with a large price tag (personal experience) and having the financial means to support those efforts is welcoming.  Still ensuring that you raise them to be intelligent, functioning adults who can manage a career of their own without having to be supported financially.

 

WRT finances... having $10 - $20 million earned is a far cry from half a billion... I can see why he would go and I respect the fact he stated that the money was a factor.

Honestly who wouldn't take the money?

 

 

 

Edited February 7 by dropkicked

[Barfolomew]

15 hours ago, grm24 said:

Do you have the local channels tv package on your DirecTv service? CW is available over the air most everywhere. The CW has a website where you could find the channel it's on in your part of SoCal.

https://www.cwtv.com/thecw/stations/

 

Not sure where you are in SoCal but for instance the CW is on KFMB and in LA it's on KTLA. Both are carried by DirecTV Local. Just because you don't have CW on your satellite package doesn't mean it's not available over the air where you reside.

Thanks man but I just use the app on Roku 💪

[jdl]

3 hours ago, bscinstnct said:

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/02/06/espn-fox-and-warner-bros-discovery-to-launch-joint-sports-streaming-platform-this-year.html
 

 

This could be the answer for LIV

 

This thing will be looking for content.

They already have the content, this is just preparing for the eventual demise of cable. By replacing it with a bundled package of content from different....hey...THAT'S CABLE!!!11! 🤣

 

But seriously, the only channel missing that I'd need was Golf Channel. I suppose the new PGA Tour entity could create their own channel now and join in. And yeah, maybe LIV too.

[italianstallion]

13 minutes ago, jimecherry said:

please post that list along with how much each was offered ;}

See @Titleist99’s post. 

[subrew]

The first LIV Lesson was uploaded to their YT channel:

 

 

[jimecherry]

9 minutes ago, italianstallion said:

See @Titleist99’s post. 

his list doesnt have how much each was offered

[woahnelly]

36 minutes ago, Titleist99 said:

Great post by the way (my opinion). Kudos to Rickie, he waited out the storm and gained even more fans for it.

 

My list of PGAT players that continue to shock me for rejecting the irrational cash: 

 

 Rickie Fowler-- For reasons listed above.

Matt Kuchar----Even tho making $64M on the tour, for him enough is not enough. he's at that age.

Justin Rose---At that age, Ryder Cup buddies on LIV, eligible for majors 

Jason Day----At that age, Injury prone, tons of kids, eligible for majors

Tommy Fleetwood---Ryder Cup buddies on LIV, can't win on the PGAT, eligible for majors.

Wyndham Clark----I know he said but his offer wasn't high enough, they lowballed him. he's eligible for the Majors. Top 20 OWGR.

Brian Harman--eligible for the Majors, at that age. Top 20 OWGR.

Tony Finau---Seems a little disenchanted lately. tons of kids, eligible for the majors, a friend of Jon Rahm.

Adam Scott.

 

Shocked that these guys hadn't taken the bag already.😆

 

Doesn't mean that they won't in the near future though.

 

 

 

Rickie still wants to win a major. Was good to see him bounce back last year, and nearly won the US Open 😞

 

Finau is probably the most shocking from that list.

[One Putter]

https://x.com/Jordanfabian/status/1755248670939705712?s=20

 

Threatening employees, id feel great about working for them.....

[ahenderX]

1 hour ago, dropkicked said:

Read the quote. Rahm, stated he made his decision based on whats best for his family and setting them up for the future..

What man wouldn't take the money in order to secure generational wealth for his family?

I can’t understand the mindset of someone being concerned about generational wealth. I guess it’s just another 1st world problem confronting millionaires and billionaires.

[freeze16172002]

32 minutes ago, jimecherry said:

please post that list along with how much each was offered ;}

 are you saying no one has turned down a LIV offer? 

[Titleist99]

27 minutes ago, One Putter said:

https://x.com/Jordanfabian/status/1755248670939705712?s=20

 

Threatening employees, id feel great about working for them.....

I hope that former PGAT players realize that they're now employees of this Saudi Regime.

[italianstallion]

39 minutes ago, jimecherry said:

his list doesnt have how much each was offered

Nobody knows for certain what anyone has been offered. But if rumors and speculation are to be believed, the multiplier seems to be 2-3X career earnings. Does that help or hurt whatever cryptic point you’re trying to make? 

[Louis_Posture]

13 hours ago, pingbling23 said:

If you watched tournaments like you profess, you would see they show every shot and slow limp regardless of what he’s shooting.

That is history.

[jimecherry]

34 minutes ago, italianstallion said:

Nobody knows for certain what anyone has been offered. But if rumors and speculation are to be believed, the multiplier seems to be 2-3X career earnings. Does that help or hurt whatever cryptic point you’re trying to make? 

only point is every one has a number and we dont know if those players that refused to join were offered that number or not yet.

[italianstallion]

6 hours ago, jimecherry said:

only point is every one has a number and we dont know if those players that refused to join were offered that number or not yet.

 

"Some people have a number" is a factual statement, "everyone has a number" is not. While using the word "everyone" might help you and the LIV supporters quiet your moral conscience when your heads hit the pillow at night, using that generalization disingenuously misrepresents the facts. Some people consider their time, freedom, moral compass, and reputation to be priceless. I know I do and I'm barely worth a pocket full of lint.

Edited February 8 by italianstallion

[Short Pete]

Jon Rahm has said that 54 holes with a shotgun start is not serious tournament golf. He and his wife seemed to have decided that they wouldn’t need this much money. Now he plays this format against weak competition and is an overpayed employee of the PIF. And he states that he already misses the PGA Tour. If he has a mediocre Major season he will be the Best Player in the Game that no one cares about, just like DJ. The PIF could have nourished a whole struggling African country for a year with Rahms salary. 
 

I wanted to check the results on Sunday and found out they had the broadcast on YouTube for free. Rahm and Niemann were on 17, with Sergio waiting. 23.000 people watched it, despite Pebble being canceled and big Rahmbo teeing it up for the first time. Outside the inner inner circle of golf nuts no one cares for this. Legion 13, cmon! Has any investor bought one of the teams yet? No. 
 

Guys like Poulter, Westwood, Three Sticks, Uihlein or the mighty Pat Perez did what’s best for them. They have a minimum of 1.3 million bucks guaranteed, no matter how much they suck at playing, not counting team earnings when their mates play well.