Taking Unused Balls Home from Driving Range (MERGED)

[TM_HOYER]

If you get a bucket with 100 balls and use 50, what is your viewpoint taking them home with you to use at the range at a future time.

Ok. There has been a good discussion on this issue. Now let's vote.

[TM_HOYER]

I have setup a poll to see how things split on this issue. So now is the time to get out and vote.

[Dizz]

How is it not stealing?

[nebatty]

Your paying to use the balls and the range, not to KEEP the balla!!

[Walkin36]

Okay. I think I know what you are trying to say, but you really need to be more clear about it.

So, what you mean is that if you pay for a large bucket of balls, let's say 100, and you only use 50 then have to go. You want to know is it is okay to take those balls home with you, not to keep, but to come back and use at a later time? This is kind of like the whole AT&T roll over minutes thing. You pay for 1000 anytime minutes, and if you only use 900, the minutes roll over to next month.

I would say it depends on the range, how often you go there, and how well you know the people who run it. I don't think taking the balls home is the right way to go about it, because odds are that you will never bring them back. If you look at it like getting a rain check from a golf course, it might be okay. I am sure if you had to go and went and turned in the balls, maybe you could get a voucher to get those balls back next time you came.

[randomhero1090]

Ok, after Carogers explained it, I deleted my vote and voted again.

It's probably "wrong" in the sense that the course doesn't want you to do it, but I do it anyway. Usually what happens is I practice where I play. I may go get a bucket or 2 the night before I play. Hit maybe 1 bucket, take the other bucket home, take the bucket back to the course and use it for warm-up.

Saves me time in a weird kind of way. The course opens at 7am. I'll get there at 6:30am and warm-up. But I get the very 1st tee time most Saturdays (7:05) while still getting a warm-up in.

[bscinstnct]

I practice where you get a card, put it in a machine at your stall and the balls pop up.

You just use whatever you want and then you take the card and it still has value for future use.

The ranges where you get a bucket could credit customers for unused balls.

Seem like a rigid thing to have to hit a certain, specific amount of balls.

Not sure about taking the balls home, but the range should come up with some solution for their customers.

[TM_HOYER]

I setup the vote to show general view points on all the discussion on the other post. So if you get a bucket of 100 balls, use 50, what is your viewpoint on taking them home with you to take back to the range to hit at a future time.

[overtona]

Why??? That makes no sense. That's like going to a restaurant and taking the plate home with you and bringing the plate back when you return.

[Skaffa77]

While I understand the reasoning of taking unused balls home (to be hit at the range later), I don't believe it's a good practice.

I guess I think of it this way...If I pay for 18 holes, run out of time after 12 holes, is it okay for me to come back at some random time, jump on the 13th hole and finish my round??

I will say that I do recognize some ranges are not offering an economy size bucket, but still, I don't think it's right to take their property even if the intent is to bring it back. If everyone did this, would we possibly see a shortage of balls available at the range?

[geesecougar2]

[quote name='Pondy' date='14 March 2010 - 01:10 PM' timestamp='1268590258' post='2315169']
Finally, if you're the kind of guy that will walk off with range balls, what does that say about you as a person, when something important is on the line?
[/quote]

I guess one could sensationalize anything and take any tiny breach of etiquette as a final indication of a person's moral fiber. But you know that it's disingenuous. It's like accusing Tiger of using PEDs on the basis that his integrity has been shot due to his cheating on his wife. It's a weak argument and usually made by people who have not actually had to make tough decisions in real life (may or may not be you).

If you determine a person's integrity by whether or not they save a few balls for next time, or whether they take an extra sugar packet from Starbucks, an extra ketchup from McDonald's, a buttermilk sauce from Jack in the Box, I think you need to re-evaluate your value system.

I mean, the entire reason people do this in the first place is because it's not something important that is on the line.

[quote name='larrybud' date='14 March 2010 - 01:42 PM' timestamp='1268592140' post='2315228']
I think in the grand scheme of things, borrowing 20 balls for a week from a range or course that you frequent falls between chewing with your mouth open and not holding the door open for someone on the scale of sins.
[/quote]

Seriously.......I posted once in this thread and am just coming back to it now. It baffles me how this is being made such a big deal.

People are wielding their pitchforks, but taking balls from the driving range for next time is so low on the totem pole that I'm surprised how resourceful some of these posters are being in their posts.....save it for an important topic (like the Tiger one ). I guess people like to take any and all opportunities to make themselves feel like superior human beings.....

Anyway, like I said in my prior post, I do it. I guess it could technically be called stealing, but I don't want to see the cop who has enough time on his hands to arrest you for doing that. It would be a bigger crime to have cops taking tax dollars and having nothing better to do than setting up raids on those dastardly driving range thiefs.

But I do it. And I don't feel bad about it. I know it's not "right", but I know I'm going to come back and use those balls at that same driving range, so no harm no foul. I've been going to the same driving range for a decade now, and I couldn't count the number of balls I've borrowed over that time.

Analogously, I wouldn't like to think about the amount of money I would have thrown away over the past ten years if I just "paid it forward" by leaving those balls around for the next time.

[Asleep]

I take un-used silverware home with me, un-used towels from the gym, and I fill a big box with all the un-used food from the all-you-can-eat restaurant.

[EnglishBob]

Put it another way:-

Your car is going into the shop for 7 days of work, so you rent one. After 4 days the shop tells you they have a part on back order and you can have your car back for a week, then they will need it for another 3 days.

You don't need the rental for the last 3 days you paid for, but will need it next week for 3, do you park it in your garage for a week before using the last 3 days? No, of course not, that would be ridiculous.

Now a ball may not cost the same as a car, but the range has an inventory of them, if every customer takes 50% of teh balls home for a few days, they are soon going to have to pick the range endlessly as they don't have a large enough stocj of balls to proceed.

While you are not stealing the balls per se, you are stealing the businesses use of them.

[Chicago Lefty]

I won't take range balls home, because frankly I think that's crazy. But if I find a quality ball mixed in, I'll take that ;-)

[geesecougar2]

Part of my post from the other thread....

I do it, probably once every fifteen or twenty times I go to the range. And I don't feel bad about it. I know it's not "right", but I know I'm going to come back and use those balls at that same driving range, so no harm no foul. I've been going to the same driving range for a decade now, and I couldn't count the number of balls I've saved for later over that time.

Analogously, I wouldn't like to think about the amount of money I would have thrown away over the past ten years if I just "paid it forward" by leaving those balls around for the next time.

Also, I guess it's not really related, but the fact that they don't have the decency to tell me when they've aerated the greens before I shell out dough to get on the course really pisses me off. I think that's a bigger crime than to save a few balls for later. And their practice of not informing me of the condition of the greens makes me less concerned about the ethics surrounding saving balls for next time.

[Borthwick]

I'm surprised this topic is even debateable. The balls belong to the range. By taking balls off the range, even if you bring them back at some future point, you are increasing the cost of a bucket of balls to everyone who frequents the range. Imagine the $$ impact of a range that had enough balls for 500 patrons/day having 50 of those patrons decide to take unused balls home with them.

[puttingmatt]

You are kidding yourselves. Stealing is stealing. How is it the ranges
issue if you do not finish using a bucket of balls. If you are that cheap
or uncertain about how many balls to use at a session of practice, get
a small bucket. Better yet, talk with the owner of the driving range about
getting a driving range pass, pay for a pass or membership and practice
all year long.

[jmorr81]

I have done this once. I went to the range on a perfectly sunny day. Paid for a large bucket and went to the putting green before heading for the range. All of the sudden a huge storm rolls up before I get the chance to hit a ball. I go to the clubhouse to get a refund on my bucket and they refused so I put the bucket in my trunk and came back the next day and used the bucket. I would never take a bucket under normal circumstances.

[Rockfish]

[quote name='overtona' date='15 March 2010 - 11:46 AM' timestamp='1268667983' post='2316990']
Why??? That makes no sense. That's like going to a restaurant and taking the plate home with you and bringing the plate back when you return.
[/quote]

No, that would be like taking the driving range's CLUBS (plates, utensils) and taking them home with you.

I don't know about you but I OFTEN take home any food I haven't eaten at the restaurant.

[gdb99]

If I can't finish the bucket, I leave it for the next guy. I've also been to the range where someone else left some balls because they couldn't finish it. I don't consider it stealing [b]if[/b] you go back but, it's not right to do.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='TM_HOYER' date='15 March 2010 - 09:02 AM' timestamp='1268665377' post='2316902']
If you get a bucket with 100 balls and use 50, what is your viewpoint taking them home with you to use at the range at a future time.

Ok. There has been a good discussion on this issue. Now let's vote.
[/quote]

Vote... that's ridiculous.  It's "wrong" for a few reasons.  Why wouldn't people know that?  All we buy when paying for a bucket or basket of balls is "usage" of a certain number of balls at that facility; NOT the right to take them home.  We didn't buy those balls, we're momentarily renting them with limitations.  It's only "right" if the organization publicly stipulates it's OK to take them home.

What happens if the purchaser forgets he has them, decides not to return them or dies.  There are a slew of reasons that could have the purchaser not returning "ALL" the balls; none of them right!  As a result, that facility would loose inventory over a year forcing them to buy more, raise the price of range balls or further limit the service.

I didn't vote because it's NOT the users decision whether or not to take balls home!

[farmer]

Of course it's wrong. If you can't hit all of an enormous basket, get a smaller basket. What are you trying to save-three or four dollars?!

[mat562]

It's called theft where I live.

If I'm a range owner and I see someone making a deliberate effort to hide the balls prior to leaving the range, or simply walking out with a load of my balls, I'm supposed to take them at their word when they say that they were simply hanging onto them for the sake of convenience until the next time they visited the place?

Righto.

[TM_HOYER]

[quote name='Pepperturbo' date='15 March 2010 - 12:09 PM' timestamp='1268669388' post='2317049']
[quote name='TM_HOYER' date='15 March 2010 - 09:02 AM' timestamp='1268665377' post='2316902']
If you get a bucket with 100 balls and use 50, what is your viewpoint taking them home with you to use at the range at a future time.

Ok. There has been a good discussion on this issue. Now let's vote.
[/quote]

Vote... that's ridiculous. It's "wrong" for a few reasons. Why wouldn't people know that? All we buy when paying for a bucket or basket of balls is "usage" of a certain number of balls at that facility; NOT the right to take them home. We didn't buy those balls, we're momentarily renting them with limitations. It's only "right" if the organization publicly stipulates it's OK to take them home.

What happens if the purchaser forgets he has them, decides not to return them or dies. There are a slew of reasons that could have the purchaser not returning "ALL" the balls; none of them right! As a result, that facility would loose inventory over a year forcing them to buy more, raise the price of range balls or further limit the service.

I didn't vote because it's NOT the users decision whether or not to take balls home!
[/quote]

I know it's wrong, you know it's, but there are others with different viewpoints. So I set up the poll to see what the breakdown is for the different views that members expressed. I know it will not change any minds, but it will be interesting to see the breakdown.

[Pepperturbo]

 I understand what your hoping to get; still the poll won't be accurate.  Anyone with the slightest bit of conscience won't tell the truth; see the antithesis.  "Different viewpoints"; you can say the words "its wrong".  But I give you credit... 

[Harry Longshanks]

[quote name='Rockfish' date='15 March 2010 - 09:05 AM' timestamp='1268669147' post='2317042']
[quote name='overtona' date='15 March 2010 - 11:46 AM' timestamp='1268667983' post='2316990']
Why??? That makes no sense. That's like going to a restaurant and taking the plate home with you and bringing the plate back when you return.
[/quote]

No, that would be like taking the driving range's CLUBS (plates, utensils) and taking them home with you.

I don't know about you but I OFTEN take home any food I haven't eaten at the restaurant.
[/quote]


C'mon dude, I hope that was a joke because I'm sure you know the difference is that you don't rent the food. The restaurant doesn't expect it back when you leave. Overtona's analogy is dead on.

If everyone did it, there would be no balls for anyone to use. Everyone would buy a large bucket, which is generally a cheaper per ball cost, then take home the ones they didn't use. It's like people who drive in the carpool lane as a solo driver and then rationalize it by saying that they aren't hurting anyone because the lane is wide open. Well duh. That's because everyone else follows the rules. If everyone did it, the carpool lane would be just as jammed up as the regular lanes.

It's stealing, plain and simple.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='Rockfish' date='15 March 2010 - 10:05 AM' timestamp='1268669147' post='2317042']
I don't know about you but I OFTEN take home any food I haven't eaten at the restaurant. 
[/quote]

Do you actually want us to believe you equate renting practice balls at the range with buying food and taking it home?  The only way that would fly is "if" your renting the food.

do you think leasing an item is the same as buying it too?

[bscinstnct]

[quote name='farmer' date='15 March 2010 - 12:10 PM' timestamp='1268669416' post='2317051']
Of course it's wrong. If you can't hit all of an enormous basket, get a smaller basket. What are you trying to save-three or four dollars?!
[/quote]

4 bucks is 4 bucks. Gets a slice and a soda. Man, I remember when I could get a slice and a soda for a buck. Anyway, why should the range get my slice?



I don't think people should take them home, I am just surprised that range owners don't credit for unused balls.

The ones that do, will probably see more customers since they provide better service and the bonus is that no one will be tempted to take them home.

I am glad my range uses ball cards and I don't have the problem.

[forgedforever]

Would you do this with a bowling ball and shoes from your local bowling center?

How about a basketball from the local YMCA?

Ever rented a bicycle?

Granted, range golf balls may not have the same value as the above. However, no matter your intent, having possession of another's property without their explicit consent is stealing.

I wouldn't like your chances in Court of explaining your position to the judge.

Unless he had an incurable slice

[larrybud]

[quote name='Sawgrass' date='15 March 2010 - 10:10 AM' timestamp='1268662227' post='2316812']
People who go 10 MPH over the speed limit know that they're doing something wrong. They do it anyway because it's worth the risk to them. They don't pretend that it is not an infraction.

People who take range balls without permission are pretending they're not doing something wrong. If they'd all just say, "Screw it, I know it's wrong but I'm doing it anyway" as some here have said, it would at least stop the weak justifications.

And by the way, I don't believe anyone here who views this range ball thing as stealing thinks that it's up there with major crimes. So stop that strawman in his tracks, and throw him in the pokey.
[/quote]
I already said that I know it's wrong, but have done it on occasion, just like driving 10 over the limit.

As far as your last point, I urge you reread the threads. Some make it sound like it's right up there with child molestation.