My Experience Gaming Blades as a Mid-High Handicapper

[Nickc]

This is a long thread - and no easy way to go back to start.

I first played golf as a junior - Slazenger Ambassador 1/2 set. No cavities then and looking at the clubs no real muscle back either. I WAS Not great at golf and it all lapsed.

Took it up a few years ago again - with some cheapo cavity backs - & then bought some second hand MP32s - looked nice - & to my surprise just as easy if not easier to strike than the cavities + sounded better +seemed more accurate and repeatable on accuracy.

But I am a short hitter with a medium to slow swing speed. One thing with the Mp32 is lofts are a lot higher than for many other oem clubs & need to remember to take account of this.

The other day got out an old permission 4 wood (in my Slazenger 1/2 set) amazed how easy to hit the tiny head & the sound wow! Shame not a ballata ball.

.... Maybe another discussion but should cavity back / game improvement clubs be banned or be a separate league of golf to using blades? OK could then argue clubs with hickory shafts are the only pure golfing clubs - mhhh

[Nickc]

> @nature_boy_wrx said:

> Its not rocket science that CBs are more forgiving - that's obvious. But the magnitude of forgiveness is very small and not enough to override the other benefits of the blade in some cases. I have yet to see a so called players CB with ALL the best attributes of a blade. Blades are not a panacea but it's really ignorant to not consider them if you haven't tried them for more than a few rounds or range sessions.

 

To add to this - if you want to improve your swing and club face contact do not rely on forgiving clubs to cover up your ineptitude. Maybe even get a secondhand set of blades for practice purposes.

Sorry the above is a bit tongue in cheek I e not serious but worth a thought!

[BiggErn]

> @Nickc said:

> > @nature_boy_wrx said:

> > Its not rocket science that CBs are more forgiving - that's obvious. But the magnitude of forgiveness is very small and not enough to override the other benefits of the blade in some cases. I have yet to see a so called players CB with ALL the best attributes of a blade. Blades are not a panacea but it's really ignorant to not consider them if you haven't tried them for more than a few rounds or range sessions.

>

> To add to this - if you want to improve your swing and club face contact do not rely on forgiving clubs to cover up your ineptitude. Maybe even get a secondhand set of blades for practice purposes.

> Sorry the above is a bit tongue in cheek I e not serious but worth a thought!

 

Yea then you could just quit practicing short game.

[Nickc]

> @BiggErn said:

> > @Nickc said:

> > > @nature_boy_wrx said:

> > > Its not rocket science that CBs are more forgiving - that's obvious. But the magnitude of forgiveness is very small and not enough to override the other benefits of the blade in some cases. I have yet to see a so called players CB with ALL the best attributes of a blade. Blades are not a panacea but it's really ignorant to not consider them if you haven't tried them for more than a few rounds or range sessions.

> >

> > To add to this - if you want to improve your swing and club face contact do not rely on forgiving clubs to cover up your ineptitude. Maybe even get a secondhand set of blades for practice purposes.

> > Sorry the above is a bit tongue in cheek I e not serious but worth a thought!

>

> Yea then you could just quit practicing short game.

 

? Did I miss something in the earlier discussion.

[BiggErn]

> @Nickc said:

> > @BiggErn said:

> > > @Nickc said:

> > > > @nature_boy_wrx said:

> > > > Its not rocket science that CBs are more forgiving - that's obvious. But the magnitude of forgiveness is very small and not enough to override the other benefits of the blade in some cases. I have yet to see a so called players CB with ALL the best attributes of a blade. Blades are not a panacea but it's really ignorant to not consider them if you haven't tried them for more than a few rounds or range sessions.

> > >

> > > To add to this - if you want to improve your swing and club face contact do not rely on forgiving clubs to cover up your ineptitude. Maybe even get a secondhand set of blades for practice purposes.

> > > Sorry the above is a bit tongue in cheek I e not serious but worth a thought!

> >

> > Yea then you could just quit practicing short game.

>

> ? Did I miss something in the earlier discussion.

 

No you just posted the same nonsense someone else has about practicing with a club you don’t play with that’ll somehow miraculously make you better. If that’s the case you shouldn’t be missing greens so why waste time on short game.

[revanant]

> @mahonie said:

> > @revanant said:

> > > @agolf1 said:

> > > > @revanant said:

> > > > > @BiggErn said:

> > > > >

> > > > > Your sources do not back you up. Stats on every tour come from on course conditions with many more variables than hitting straight away into a sim. Pros would probably hit inside a 10 ft circle on an indoor sim, not sure why you can’t grasp how flawed your assessment is.

> > > >

> > > > The sim is basically just a driving range with a mat, rather than grass. The yardages are true for what I see on course, as are the shot shapes.

> > > >

> > > > I can't speak to what a PGA tour pro would do on an indoor sim or on a driving range. The only question we're trying to answer is, in the hands of an amateur, are those shots good? Can an amateur play good golf with those results?

> > > >

> > > > Your answer is probably no. But I have no idea what your expectation is for a good result. If a PGA tour pro would achieve all shots in a 10 foot circle, what should the expectation be for an amateur? What do you usually see when you go to the range? Do you think your results are better or worse than average? If you're better than average, how much worse could a player drop and still play good golf? On a course, are you usually within 10 yards of the hole with an approach shot? Are you closer? Farther away? What range do you think an amateur should aspire to? How much worse are the results in the photo?

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > @agolf1 said:

> > > > > > @revanant said:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks. For what it's worth, I put up that sort of bulk sim data back in April. It's on page 24, and then goes on for a bunch of pages, etc. We don't need to rehash it--suffice it to say there was a lot of back and forth, and @BiggErn and I disagreed about the results and interpretation.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The MP-14 photo from above that we're chatting about now will save you about 20 pages of reading. I think 4 shots within 17 feet of the target is good. I think a 6-iron that carries 140 at 32 degrees is very playable--especially given the numbers for an LPGA 7-iron and the difference in loft.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > @Biggern disagrees. You might disagree as well. But I think the sources I cite back me up--you have to apply fair standards to the data. LPGA pros play great golf. Slamming a 6 or 7 iron because it only goes 140 yards just doesn't make sense, when my swing speed is on point for that distance. Likewise, considering a miss of 30 feet to be awful doesn't make sense, if PGA tour pros live with that sort of miss on a weekly basis.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I'm not saying I'm a magical and amazing golfer, despite my handicap. I'm saying that if I hit an MP-14 6 iron 140 yards at 75 mph of swing speed, and wind up around 30 feet from my target, I should be able to play good golf with the iron. In other words, a mid-high handicap can play with blades and get objectively good results.

> > > > > Here's the thing - no one believes you have roughly tour level proximity on the course from 140 yards hitting about half the GIR that the pros hit and hitting a club that has substantially less loft than the club they hit from that distance. Maybe we are all wrong and you actually do. Or maybe you are selectively remembering data points you want to remember. Who knows. But just ask yourself if it sounds a little odd that it would be true.

> > > > >

> > > > > If you are truly hitting 3 greens per 9 on average, then I will agree that your iron play is relatively better than the rest of your game, and switching clubs isn't what you immediately need to do to cut 5 shots off your scores. In fact, you should stop replying to this thread and go practice your putting.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also, not that it matters for this but those LPGA numbers seem very dated. They are basically the same ones they've been posting for years. A lot of players these days are carrying a 7-iron or 8-iron 150 yards (granted there is no loft figure in the chart either) and the driver carry is probably 230 for the median player.

> > > >

> > > > The basic problem that I think this thread has highlighted is that we can all look at the same data and have wildly different conclusions. As crazy as it sounds, we can't manage to agree on something as basic as what a good shot looks like, or what a reasonable expectation of accuracy is from an iron shot from an amateur is--regardless of the type of iron being used. If we can't even define our terms, then we definitely can't gauge if one iron is performing better than another, or if an amateur's results are good or bad.

> > > >

> > > > Here are the options that have come out in the past few pages, as far as I can tell:

> > > > 1) PGA tour pros hit approach shots between 30 and 40 feet from the pin, whether or not they land on the green. If an amateur can do something in this ballpark with an iron, they should be able to play good golf. This is a good result.

> > > > 2) PGA tour pros hit approach shots within 30 and 40 feet from the pin. Amateurs should not expect to approach tour level accuracy. Mid-high handicaps should expect to hit a shot within 30 yards of the pin. So something in between 30 feet and 30 yards is a good result.

> > > > 3) PGA tour pros hit approach shots within 30 and 40 feet from the pin. But the courses they play have much harder conditions and much more difficult greens. Therefore, amateurs should expect to hit much closer and accurate shots than PGA tour pros do. Therefore, shots that land within 30 to 40 feet from a pin aren't good results. Amateurs should not expect to play good golf with these results. Instead, amateurs should look to have much closer proximity to the pin. The number should be _________ . ( @BiggErn or others can supply a number?)

> > > >

> > > > I think the answer is close to #1. Pros might play less receptive greens and more difficult greens and then have to deal with long putting distances from pins. But they still have to putt on those same difficult greens and post good scores. The number of 3-putts on the tour are incredibly low, so it seems to be a consistent theme that lag putting is a crucial skill for scoring well and pros do an astounding job of keeping long putts from turning into extra strokes, so I should start practicing that skill heavily.

> > > >

> > > > Now, maybe I'm wrong, and the answer for how amateurs make good scores is actually #3. In other words, because our amateur greens are more receptive, I should be able to improve my iron play considerably and reliably land my shots much closer than 30 feet to the pin on average, so that I don't have to deal with longer putts.

> > > >

> > > > If you're a single digit handicapper, are you getting there with really close approach shots on a regular basis? From mid-iron distance and in, do you guys normally hit approach shots closer than 30 feet? 20 feet? 10 feet? What's the number we should strive for, and what is a bad number if we're judging irons?

> > > >

> > > > Or are you closer or worse than the PGA numbers on approach, and something else clicked to bring your scores down (good driving, long hitting, good scrambling, good lag putting, etc.)?

> > > >

> > > > As for the point about LPGA numbers, the numbers they were achieving in 2017 were still reflective of good iron shots, right? : ) In other words, if I call my 6 iron a "seven iron, lengthened .5 inches" and hit a shot with 140 carry and mid-6k spin, I've hit a good shot with the right numbers. If I hit that shot with an MB, then I hit it a good shot with an MB. As an objective standard for this discussion, I think the LPGA numbers fit the bill for my swing speed.

> > > >

> > > > In this discussion, we can use all the objective standards we can get. So far, the only ones I can find are the PGA stats and the Trackman ball/swing data.

> > > Go get a copy of Broadie's book, it has the numbers. And in breaking news to some, it shows that hacks end up farther away from the hole than pros from every distance.

> > >

> > > I'm just saying that the distances haven't been updated in years on that LPGA chart. You can find basically the same numbers from several years before 2017 even though driving distance keeps going up on that tour.

> >

> > Thanks, I’ll check it out—it seems like a book I’ll enjoy.

> >

> > So, basically, Broadie found that amateurs are worse than the pga averages for pros on approach shots?

> >

> > That honestly makes a lot more sense than suggesting that amateurs should hit it closer than pga numbers, since our greens are softer or whatever.

> >

> > On the LPGA stuff, I guess it’s good that the average distance is improving. My point is just that if my numbers look like the LPGA circa 2015, or 2017, or whatever, then I should be able to play good golf from the middle tees at a public course, and can stop worrying about my irons. Which, by and large, is what I’ve done since the spring. I’ve set my bag and I’m having fun playing golf while improving. : )

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

> Be careful looking at Broadie’s stuff when he’s in TaylorMade’s pocket and helping them sell distance...allegedly.

>

>

 

I hear ya--I'll read it and see what I think. It might be the old story of "if I give you a tylenol, don't take the whole bottle." I know he touts distance as a big cutter of strokes on the tour, and that putting importance can be overstated. But offhand, if I'm not going to magically get longer off the tee, I should focus on the things I can control -- like putting. : )

 

The fact that PGA tour pros just refuse to three putt is impressive, and something I really want to work on.

[cliffhanger]

Played blades last year and index came down from a 12 to a 7. Playing players CB's this year and index is heading north again. hmmm.

[Chuck905]

I shoot the same score with mb it cb, but I get more enjoyment and feel from mb.

 

It usually comes down to up and downs or making more putts or lag putting in my case for lower scores.

[Exactice808]

LOL been reading back and forth and PMing @revanant on prior occasions. Cant really see the troll but a very excited/zealous new golfer.

 

@revanant, I see where you are TRYING to correlate yet lack the greater understanding of how the multiple facets apply.

 

Lets try put a couple of items into place. I know for a fact, that at my range I can hit my 100 yard shot likely in a 5yard circle pretty much 10/10 times. AT THE RANGE. Hitting multiple repeatable shots, with that a consistent flight pattern carry distance and roll distance,

 

I have seen mini tour player peg the 100 yard marker all day at the range. Does that mean that all 100 yard shots are going to be in 5 yard circle on the COURSE during a live round? NO That not realistic, but the intent is to practice so the probability is higher. I pretty much guarantee that many high level players on this site can do the same.

 

Move that out to the 150 yard marker they are likely still throwing darts "At the range" but on the course, with just 1 shot the probability is lower.

 

2019 PGA Tour stats -150-175 yards

1 Rank , 121 Attempts - 22' 11"

192 rank - 90 Attempts - 35'5"

 

If we recorded my attempts under the same circumstance, I would assume my proximity would be like 50ft YET if I went to the range to replicate 150-175 yards averages it would likely be half the distances (25ft average) (AT THE RANGE) . At the range its so easy to calculate your average on a repeated shot, NOT during a stipulated round.

 

Looking at your range data from before, @ 150yards, your dispersion is 28.3Y or 85ft in dispersion, That means if we took your potential 150 yard average on the course, its likely, 100ft+ proximity. THERE IS ZERO correlation to your points as I highly DOUBT you are doing better or even equal to 28.3yards or 85ft of dispersion on the course during a live round. More so your case has no relevance as your dispersion is no where near acceptable period. @ 150 yards an average distance of a par 3, your dispersion averages would not hit a green as its too wide/scattered.

 

fact is, @ your Hdcp, Blades or CB dont matter much. You fail to accept your limitations in your dispersion and try to correlate that the MBs have helped.

 

Sorry bud..... its not the club at all... and your actual results are no where near optimal nor acceptable.

 

 

 

[jons1]

There's more to golf than whether you shoot an 87 vs an 85 or 83 or otherwise.... play whatever makes you happy... period.

[revanant]

> @Exactice808 said:

> LOL been reading back and forth and PMing @revanant on prior occasions. Cant really see the troll but a very excited/zealous new golfer.

>

> @revanant, I see where you are TRYING to correlate yet lack the greater understanding of how the multiple facets apply.

>

> Lets try put a couple of items into place. I know for a fact, that at my range I can hit my 100 yard shot likely in a 5yard circle pretty much 10/10 times. AT THE RANGE. Hitting multiple repeatable shots, with that a consistent flight pattern carry distance and roll distance,

>

> I have seen mini tour player peg the 100 yard marker all day at the range. Does that mean that all 100 yard shots are going to be in 5 yard circle on the COURSE during a live round? NO That not realistic, but the intent is to practice so the probability is higher. I pretty much guarantee that many high level players on this site can do the same.

>

> Move that out to the 150 yard marker they are likely still throwing darts "At the range" but on the course, with just 1 shot the probability is lower.

>

> 2019 -

> #1 Rank -150-175 yards, 121 Attempts - 22' 11"

> #192 - 90 Attempts - 35'5"

>

> If we recorded my attempts under the same circumstance, I would assume my proximity would be like 50ft YET if I went to the range to replicate 150-175 yards averages it would likely be half the distances (25ft average) (AT THE RANGE) . At the range its so easy to calculate your average on a repeated shot, NOT during a stipulated round.

>

> Looking at your range data from before, @ 150yards, your dispersion is 28.3Y or 85ft in dispersion, That means if we took your potential 150 yard average on the course, its likely, 100ft+ proximity. THERE IS ZERO correlation to your points as I highly DOUBT you are doing better or even equal to 28.3yards or 85ft of dispersion on the course during a live round. More so your case has no relevance as your dispersion is no where near acceptable period. @ 150 yards an average distance of a par 3, your dispersion averages would not hit a green as its too wide/scattered.

>

> fact is, @ your Hdcp, Blades or CB dont matter much. You fail to accept your limitations in your dispersion and try to correlate that the MBs have helped.

>

> Sorry bud..... its not the club at all... and your actual results are no where near optimal nor acceptable.

>

>

>

Thanks—this was helpful. I especially appreciate the actual numbers.

 

I 100% agree that hitting shots at a sim, without wind, weather, other players, etc. isn’t the same as when you’re standing in the tee box, rough, or fairway. And I also am 100% on board that you can’t overstate the challenge of only having one shot—without warmup—and having to live with whatever hit or miss comes out.

 

I’d like to put a pause on talking about my own game for a moment.

 

If I can ask, taking cb vs mb out of the question for a minute, how often would you say you have a long putt (say, >20 feet) after an approach with a short or mid iron?

 

Likewise, how often do you find yourself needing a good lag putt during a round? At some point, did you have to sink a bunch of time into practicing that part of your game? Or are you finding that your able to put your approach shots close enough that you have a lot of close putts?

 

[Exactice808]

> @revanant said:

> Thanks—this was helpful. I especially appreciate the actual numbers.

>

> I 100% agree that hitting shots at a sim, without wind, weather, other players, etc. isn’t the same as when you’re standing in the tee box, rough, or fairway. And I also am 100% on board that you can’t overstate the challenge of only having one shot—without warmup—and having to live with whatever hit or miss comes out.

>

> I’d like to put a pause on talking about my own game for a moment.

>

> If I can ask, taking cb vs mb out of the question for a minute, how often would you say you have a long putt (say, >20 feet) after an approach with a short or mid iron?

>

> Likewise, how often do you find yourself needing a good lag putt during a round? At some point, did you have to sink a bunch of time into practicing that part of your game? Or are you finding that your able to put your approach shots close enough that you have a lot of close putts?

>

BETTER Question!

 

lets look at my quick stats (last 5 rounds) As my memory is still fresh to try to answer your question, I averaged 2 birdies per round, Considering this, that means I generally 1 putt a critical green in regulation to make a birdie.

I averaged 8 GIR

I Averaged 34 putts per round

I Averaged a score of 82.8

 

This might not easily answer your question as luck and condition are contributing factors, BUT

1) How often would I say I have long putts greater than 20ft after a mid to short iron approach? I would say 50/50. Out of the 8 GIR average I would say 4 of them would be well inside 20 ft and the other 4 would be outside of 20ft. Meaning my average is still like I said 50ft proximity.

 

2) How often do I need to lag, Pretty much on every putt that is NOT a tap in. to me 5ft and in I am "expecting" to make (reality is NOT) but outside of 5ft I am lagging to go into the hole or get damn near close to making it.

 

Sinking in time to practice? Well.... lets ponder that.

 

1) I struggled with putting for a while till I realized Jordan Speith was 80% from 10ft and in. I am not 80% from 3 ft and in, let alone 5ft and in. So I worked on building confidence. I built a truth board and hit 1000's of 1000's putts on the truth board, (3ft board with a slope that acts like a 8ft putt) the hole is no bigger than a ball. to build experience and confidence.

If I want to putt like JS, or TW, gotta catch up to how many putts they have practiced over time. (experience and confidence in X distance)

 

2) Short game was INVALUABLE can't put a price on this. learned how to scramble, hit a multitude of shots from around the green, low, high, rolling, stopping, etc develop a back up to a terrible iron play and that was the short game.

 

I lean MORE on Both the Short game and the putting to mask my inabilities. YET if my Iron play is solid. I can throw a 77 in there with 15 pars..... 15 pars....no birdies and choked on a single hole. Look at the stats 10 GIR, 31 putts. no birdies, you can see lots of scrambles and lots of solid 2 putts for par.

 

 

So NO I cannot say with any factual evidence that I am stoning flags with any type of consistency and regularity. period, NOR do pros. But they develop their accuracy as best as possible to GIVE them opportunities.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[revanant]

@Exactice808 Great answer! Thanks for taking the time on that and putting so much thought into it.

 

I’m definitely going to keep in mind the point about lagging it outside of five feet.

[Exactice808]

> @revanant said:

> @Exactice808 Great answer! Thanks for taking the time on that and putting so much thought into it.

>

> I’m definitely going to keep in mind the point about lagging it outside of five feet.

 

After all I type you got lag at 5ft, that is the last piece of advice I would give to anyone. That is purely for me and a choice that I make due to my tendencies of putting You should not do it unless you have a tendency, You need to develop a putting technique the produces results. What is your putts per round if its @ 36 or better you are on track as that 2 putts per hole, If its more than that, throw out the lag for putts greater than 5ft. You have way more issues as in fairness your GIR and Proximity means that you are lagging your second put or even 3rd putt that makes ZERO sense.

[dpb5031]

You guys have pretty high expectations if you're considering any putt outside of 20' as "long." My guess is you're not truly assessing proximity. 20' is a shorter distance than most people imagine. In my experience most golfers assess putts to be shorter than they actually are. I'm a low HC player, and if I hit a mid iron (6,7,8) onto the green to about 25'' I consider it a pretty good result. I hope to hit my wedges inside of 20', but regularly achieving that proximity, even with a wedge, is no guarantee even for a scratch level am.

[Tree Levino]

> @mahonie said:

> > @BiggErn said:

> > > @chisag said:

> > >

> > > > @BiggErn said:

> > > > Your sources do not back you up. Stats on every tour come from on course conditions with many more variables than hitting straight away into a sim. Pros would probably hit inside a 10 ft circle on an indoor sim, not sure why you can’t grasp how flawed your assessment is.

> > >

> > >

> > > ... Time to give credit where credit is due. Revanant should be in the Troll Hall Of Fame. Members have been trading arguments with a self admitted 25 that claims MB's has reduced his index to 23. If he switched to a persimmon driver there is a very good chance he could get that 23 down to a 22. :D

> >

> > Lol. It’s hard to tell since there are so many delusional arguments presented by the double digit MB crowd.

>

> @BiggErn @balls_deep @chisag...does anything more need to be said?

 

This argument reminds me very much of surfing. It was usually the beginner/intermediate surfer that got overconfident and wanted to ride a super low volume high performance shortboard in marginal wages (which if you don’t know surfing takes a lot of skill) and the advanced who was accepting of the benefits of “help” and would ride something “easier”. The sh*t surfer would be flailing around while the good surfer was ripping.

 

Shot 76 yesterday mainly due to putting. Went back to arm lock - 12 putts on the front. Irons wouldn’t have mattered for the most part aside from a couple of circumstances when I think the CB helped. Tough lies with the ball way above or below my feet I got the distance I needed off the toe or heel of the club. Would’ve been a different story with the blades.

 

I will say regardless of CB vs MB, having loft on your clubs is so important. I had a few shots out of flier lies yesterday that would’ve been way gone without the amount of spin I get. Instead the ball is stopping out of the rough, even downwind due to loft and a narrow sole.

[bodhi555]

One thing I do love about my current MB's is the consistency when playing from a flier lie - I've had enough now that I can tell straight away what sort of lie is going to behave and what will come out with some extra juice, enabling me to plan taking one less club, or if I'm going to have to hack it out (another situation I prefer MBs). Whether this judgement is something a 15 handicapper will be making is a different conversation, but I do love the predictability of my VR Pros. Given I get very little distance drop off on mishits, I'm still unsure what I would gain by moving to a cavity. But then I hover between a 7 and 9 index (CONGU), so am probably not who this thread is aimed at.

[Glaze88]

I play blades and I know I'm not good enough to justify using them but I just love the look and feel of blades. To me, that's more important in my game right now!

[Blarkins111]

Not playing true blades, but I switched from Ping G400 irons to Mizuno 919 forged this year and definitely got a wake up call. Started this season as 22 and am currently down to a 17 and looking to get it under 15 before winter sets in.

 

I was taking lessons through the spring and was definitely seeing some better results on the course. Between that and some good fortune in my career I wanted to step up a notch with my irons and get something that appealed to my eye a little better.

 

I LOVE the Mizunos but they definitely let me know I had a long way to go ball striking wise. The Pings were almost too forgiving as the feedback wasn't strong enough to tell me how far off I was, and I don't feel like they punished a poor strike that much. They were great clubs, but I think they were masking some swing flaws for me. The Mizunos don't punish me too severely for an off center strike, but they also tell me I missed the sweet spot. I've been putting in a lot more work and it's paying off, and I don't know that I would have done that had I stuck with the Pings.

 

Long story short, I guess play what you want, but be prepared to work hard to get the results you want.

 

 

[chippa13]

These kind of posts make me laugh.

"I took some lessons and am now practicing more and my index is getting better.......because I moved to blades."

[Blarkins111]

 

> @chippa13 said:

> These kind of posts make me laugh.

> "I took some lessons and am now practicing more and my index is getting better.......because I moved to blades."

 

That is a bit of a misrepresentation of what I said.

 

I didn't switch clubs until after my lesson package was over. I had this idea in my head I had a really sound repeatable swing and while I had improved, I definitely had some delusions of grandeur.

 

I am getting better because I am practicing a lot more and working really hard on my fundamentals. The new irons did not make me any better (my scores were worse for a while), they highlighted that my swing still wasn't great and let me know I had a lot more work to put in.

 

 

[mukster]

I have read this thread and these are the points I take from it:

1) I will never read this again

2) I will care even less now about what other people play and what other people think I should play

3) Clubs are simply tools, but so are some people.

[Tree Levino]

> @mukster said:

> I have read this thread and these are the points I take from it:

> 1) I will never read this again

> 2) I will care even less now about what other people play and what other people think I should play

> 3) Clubs are simply tools, but so are some people.

 

Accurate.

[Tree Levino]

JR likes to make the point that blades aren't too bad as a mid cap.

My take aways:

1. Decent swings produce decent results with blades (though smash factor leaves a lot to be desired)

2. Bad strikes with the MB lose massive amounts of height - 35-50 feet high vs 120 feet high

3. His own clubs retained height and distance much better

4. Mid caps can play blades but not much point

 

You can hit a knock down with any iron. High, straight shots are _generally_ how to score. "Workability" is available in any design provided you have the ability. Based on those test results, Mark would be shooting better scores with the i210 vs MB.

 

[Lumberjack627]

I don’t know if I would even try them as a mid handicap. I wish I could play them tho.

[Hack Daddy]

If you have the swing speed, the fact is, blades won't be as punishing as they would be if you're an average or slower swinger. We're always discussing blade playability, but the fact of the mater is, most people can't even get a 3/4/5 iron to the apex it's supposed to be. And we have all these people chiming in about forgiveness. OP has the swing speed to get away with mishits with blades...

 

Enjoy OP, I still like to drop my bag at the 19th and everyone think I'm a +.

 

Lol

[LowAndLeft32]

So what would be the ideal swing speed for blades? Thanks.

 

> @"Hack Daddy" said:

> If you have the swing speed, the fact is, blades won't be as punishing as they would be if you're an average or slower swinger. We're always discussing blade playability, but the fact of the mater is, most people can't even get a 3/4/5 iron to the apex it's supposed to be. And we have all these people chiming in about forgiveness. OP has the swing speed to get away with mishits with blades...

>

> Enjoy OP, I still like to drop my bag at the 19th and everyone think I'm a +.

>

> Lol

 

 

[BiggErn]

> @chippa13 said:

> These kind of posts make me laugh.

> "I took some lessons and am now practicing more and my index is getting better.......because I moved to blades."

 

Yep lol. Also “the CB was almost too forgiving masking my flaws and the feedback wouldn’t tell me where my misses were”. Lol ??

[revanant]

> @dpb5031 said:

> You guys have pretty high expectations if you're considering any putt outside of 20' as "long." My guess is you're not truly assessing proximity. 20' is a shorter distance than most people imagine. In my experience most golfers assess putts to be shorter than they actually are. I'm a low HC player, and if I hit a mid iron (6,7,8) onto the green to about 25'' I consider it a pretty good result. I hope to hit my wedges inside of 20', but regularly achieving that proximity, even with a wedge, is no guarantee even for a scratch level am.

@Exactice808 @dpb5031 — Thanks, guys!

 

Now that I’ve had a little bit of time to digest exactice’s post and given the numbers above, I think it’s really helpful for understanding how much I should expect out of my irons vs how much other parts of my game need to show up to improve my scoring.

 

I definitely haven’t put anywhere near the type of time that Exactice has into putting, and I think I should. The closest I have to that sort of setup is a putt-out and my bumpy carpet. : )

 

I can now also confirm that my putting is flat-out awful, and that the solution isn’t to necessarily try to hit the ball closer. A lot of it is being driven by 3 putts that, based on what I’ve looked at over the past few days, should be avoidable with better lag putting. It’s not uncommon for me to leave myself way short from distances that should apparently be well within an average amateur’s ability to two-putt, and then wind up with a 3-putt.

 

To @dpb5031 ‘s point, if I shouldn’t expect to put my irons closer than 20 feet from the pin, but find 20 feet a challenging distance to putt from, I have a big problem, and its not related to my irons.

 

As for course management, I thought this photo was interesting. I’m definitely aiming at pins too aggressively, and not factoring in enough my tendency to draw.

 

 

[Blarkins111]

> @BiggErn said:

> > @chippa13 said:

> > These kind of posts make me laugh.

> > "I took some lessons and am now practicing more and my index is getting better.......because I moved to blades."

>

> Yep lol. Also “the CB was almost too forgiving masking my flaws and the feedback wouldn’t tell me where my misses were”. Lol ??

 

I wonder if you're as big of a jerk in real life as you are here?

 

 

I don't think I'm off base by saying G400 irons are more forgiving than the 919s. I could hit a shot that turned out pretty well on the course and not realize how far off the center I might have been because I wasn't paying super close attention to where the impact was. I just had an assumption that the strike may not have been on the sweet spot, but I wasn't that far off because I still either hit the green or was just off of it. I wasn't checking the face after every shot I hit.

 

 

 

I'm not saying my new clubs made me better and that you should play blades (not that I play true blades anyway) to improve ball striking.

 

 

I am saying that I got a lesson in how lazy I was being with my game when I switched.