Where are you playing tomorrow - Chicago (Round 3)

[VNutz]

> @MountainKing said:

> > @ldchristopher said:

> > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > >

> > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > >

> > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> >

> > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

>

> A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

 

The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

 

The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

 

 

[Argonne69]

Does the Cal Sag actually flood? I don't think I've ever seen the water level close to the top of the canal.

[mci711]

> @VNutz said:

> > @MountainKing said:

> > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > >

> > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > >

> > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > >

> > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> >

> > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

>

> The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

>

> The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

>

>

 

Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

[TBone0576]

Played Shepherds Crook in Zion yesterday for the first time this season. Course is in really nice shape and probably the fastest greens I have played in a few years. $49 with a cart during the week is not a bad price to pay out there in my opinion.

[VNutz]

> @Argonne69 said:

> Does the Cal Sag actually flood? I don't think I've ever seen the water level close to the top of the canal.

 

To be honest I have no idea, I’ve never seen it when flooding, just the after effects. I just assume it flooded somewhere to account for all the water I’ve seen on the course, but it does sound unlikely now that I think about it. Hard to believe flooding comes strictly from accumulation and lack of drainage.

[DavePelz4]

As someone who traverses> @VNutz said:

> > @Argonne69 said:

> > Does the Cal Sag actually flood? I don't think I've ever seen the water level close to the top of the canal.

>

> To be honest I have no idea, I’ve never seen it when flooding, just the after effects. I just assume it flooded somewhere to account for all the water I’ve seen on the course, but it does sound unlikely now that I think about it. Hard to believe flooding comes strictly from accumulation and lack of drainage.

 

As someone who traverses Harlem Ave, it does flood on occasion like with some of the massive storms we've had this year.

[TheBear95]

> @mci711 said:

> > @VNutz said:

> > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > > >

> > > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > > >

> > > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> > >

> > > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

> >

> > The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

> >

> > The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

> >

> >

>

> Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

 

While a 90s Camry is hardily exciting, it is/was an extremely reliable, well-built vehicle. Still see a few of them on the road today. A better comparison would be the Ford Tempo, which was a complete shit-box. That's a more accurate description of Billy Casper Golf and the facilities they "manage".

[DavePelz4]

> @TheBear95 said:

> > @mci711 said:

> > > @VNutz said:

> > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > > > >

> > > > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> > > >

> > > > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

> > >

> > > The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

> > >

> > > The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

>

> While a 90s Camry is hardily exciting, it is/was an extremely reliable, well-built vehicle. Still see a few of them on the road today. A better comparison would be the Ford Tempo, which was a complete ****-box. That's a more accurate description of Billy Casper Golf and the facilities they "manage".

 

You guys are SOOOOO young! Better than the Tempo is the Ford Pinto. Hit the car in the back end and the gas tank would explode into flames. It was basically a rolling bomb.

[TheBear95]

> @DavePelz4 said:

> > @TheBear95 said:

> > > @mci711 said:

> > > > @VNutz said:

> > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> > > > >

> > > > > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

> > > >

> > > > The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

> > > >

> > > > The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

> >

> > While a 90s Camry is hardily exciting, it is/was an extremely reliable, well-built vehicle. Still see a few of them on the road today. A better comparison would be the Ford Tempo, which was a complete ****-box. That's a more accurate description of Billy Casper Golf and the facilities they "manage".

>

> You guys are SOOOOO young! Better than the Tempo is the Ford Pinto. Hit the car in the back end and the gas tank would explode into flames. It was basically a rolling bomb.

 

Haha. Yes, a little young for the Ford Pinto. I do remember that my dad had an early 80s Ford LTD when I was a kid. He spent most of his time swearing at in the garage.

[greenj20]

Grew up in the western suburbs and will be back this weekend. Saturday we are playing Arrowhead in Wheaton. I always remember needing my bug spray growing up as it wound through the woods. Still true?

[mci711]

> @TheBear95 said:

> > @mci711 said:

> > > @VNutz said:

> > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > > > >

> > > > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> > > >

> > > > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

> > >

> > > The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

> > >

> > > The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

>

> While a 90s Camry is hardily exciting, it is/was an extremely reliable, well-built vehicle. Still see a few of them on the road today. A better comparison would be the Ford Tempo, which was a complete ****-box. That's a more accurate description of Billy Casper Golf and the facilities they "manage".

 

Good point! I used 90s camry because a 92 camry was my first car in 05. Now that I think of it being 13 years old, I never had any real problems.

[Argonne69]

> @DavePelz4 said:

> > @TheBear95 said:

> > > @mci711 said:

> > > > @VNutz said:

> > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> > > > >

> > > > > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

> > > >

> > > > The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

> > > >

> > > > The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

> >

> > While a 90s Camry is hardily exciting, it is/was an extremely reliable, well-built vehicle. Still see a few of them on the road today. A better comparison would be the Ford Tempo, which was a complete ****-box. That's a more accurate description of Billy Casper Golf and the facilities they "manage".

>

> You guys are SOOOOO young! Better than the Tempo is the Ford Pinto. Hit the car in the back end and the gas tank would explode into flames. It was basically a rolling bomb.

 

Ford Fairmont, Chevy Vega, Chevy Nova, AMC Pacer. Ah, classic American autos.

 

[Argonne69]

> @TheBear95 said:

> > @DavePelz4 said:

> > > @TheBear95 said:

> > > > @mci711 said:

> > > > > @VNutz said:

> > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

> > > > >

> > > > > The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

> > > > >

> > > > > The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

> > >

> > > While a 90s Camry is hardily exciting, it is/was an extremely reliable, well-built vehicle. Still see a few of them on the road today. A better comparison would be the Ford Tempo, which was a complete ****-box. That's a more accurate description of Billy Casper Golf and the facilities they "manage".

> >

> > You guys are SOOOOO young! Better than the Tempo is the Ford Pinto. Hit the car in the back end and the gas tank would explode into flames. It was basically a rolling bomb.

>

> Haha. Yes, a little young for the Ford Pinto. I do remember that my dad had an early 80s Ford LTD when I was a kid. He spent most of his time swearing at in the garage.

 

My brother retired from Ford Motor Company, having worked at the Torrence Avenue Assembly plant on Chicago's south side for over 30 years. His first job on the line was using a rubber hammer to tap in the 'F' and 'O' on the front of the hood, along with checking the air pressure in the right front tire. His partner installed the 'R' and 'D', and checked the left front tire. If your dad's car had a crooked 'FO', blame my brother.

 

[TheBear95]

> @Argonne69 said:

> > @TheBear95 said:

> > > @DavePelz4 said:

> > > > @TheBear95 said:

> > > > > @mci711 said:

> > > > > > @VNutz said:

> > > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

> > > >

> > > > While a 90s Camry is hardily exciting, it is/was an extremely reliable, well-built vehicle. Still see a few of them on the road today. A better comparison would be the Ford Tempo, which was a complete ****-box. That's a more accurate description of Billy Casper Golf and the facilities they "manage".

> > >

> > > You guys are SOOOOO young! Better than the Tempo is the Ford Pinto. Hit the car in the back end and the gas tank would explode into flames. It was basically a rolling bomb.

> >

> > Haha. Yes, a little young for the Ford Pinto. I do remember that my dad had an early 80s Ford LTD when I was a kid. He spent most of his time swearing at in the garage.

>

> My brother retired from Ford Motor Company, having worked at the Torrence Avenue Assembly plant on Chicago's south side for over 30 years. His first job on the line was using a rubber hammer to tap in the 'F' and 'O' on the front of the hood, along with checking the air pressure in the right front tire. His partner installed the 'R' and 'D', and checked the left front tire. If your dad's car had a crooked 'FO', blame my brother.

>

I think the script was the only thing that was right on that LTD. My dad will be 67 this month and he's been a LOYAL Ford man his entire life. Don't understand it at all. Nothing but 50 years of shitboxes, headaches and problems. He was legitimately upset when Ford announced that they will be no longer making cars after 2020. He's not a truck or SUV guy. I told him that this was a blessing and that God finally wanted him to have a few years of trouble free driving as he entered his golden years.

[MountainKing]

> @greenj20 said:

> Grew up in the western suburbs and will be back this weekend. Saturday we are playing Arrowhead in Wheaton. I always remember needing my bug spray growing up as it wound through the woods. Still true?

 

Yes, except these days you probably need double what you used to.

[tmw1582]

> @MountainKing said:

> > @Argonne69 said:

> > > @ME27 said:

> > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> >

> > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

>

> Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

 

Agreed. As I mentioned a few pages back Water's Edge is a waste of a pretty nice layout. The conditions are garbage.

 

Playing Joliet Golf Club on Sunday morning. We were looking for a place to play and based on a few comments on here I thought I'd give it a shot. At $65 I think it's worth the risk. Here's to hoping it's sill in decent shape.

[DavePelz4]

> @greenj20 said:

> Grew up in the western suburbs and will be back this weekend. Saturday we are playing Arrowhead in Wheaton. I always remember needing my bug spray growing up as it wound through the woods. Still true?

 

Played there last weekend and no bug spray needed. If you haven't played it in a while you will be pleasantly surprised.

[DavePelz4]

> @tmw1582 said:

> > @MountainKing said:

> > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > >

> > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> >

> > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

>

> Agreed. As I mentioned a few pages back Water's Edge is a waste of a pretty nice layout. The conditions are garbage.

>

> Playing Joliet Golf Club on Sunday morning. We were looking for a place to play and based on a few comments on here I thought I'd give it a shot. At $65 I think it's worth the risk. Here's to hoping it's sill in decent shape.

 

The conditions at JGC are pretty good but it will be interesting to hear what you think of the routing.

[ldchristopher]

>

> You guys are SOOOOO young! Better than the Tempo is the Ford Pinto. Hit the car in the back end and the gas tank would explode into flames. It was basically a rolling bomb.

 

 

[Argonne69]

New toy for tomorrow. 'Hope it's a fairway finder.

 


 

[mci711]

> @Argonne69 said:

> New toy for tomorrow. 'Hope it's a fairway finder.

>

> 

>

 

I had the taylormade mini driver that came out 5-6 years ago. I really liked it, and looked into buying another one this past winter when I was struggling with my driver. Hope it works well for you!

[@_the_crook]

Sportsman's tomorrow and Shepherd's on Sunday.

Arg - nice stick you got there. hope you bomb 'em.

[psygolf]

Interesting dig against Casper Group...there’s no comparison to the quality of the Chicago Park Disrict courses now to when Kemper had control.

All I hear is good things from those playing George Dunne/Orchard Valley also.

 

[stasek]

Last minute Links at Carillon this afternoon. It was nice playing in 4 hours (nobody in front or behind). Meh off the tee, great irons, mediocre chipping and serviceable putting - 75. Should have been under par (or possibly in the 60s, but 2 hole momentary lapse of concentration (2 doubles on easy holes) and countless lipouts resulted in a “oh, what could have been” round. Course is in good condition, greens were average, but it was Late in the afternoon, so the bumpiness was understandable.

[B-Man]

> @mci711 said:

> > @TheBear95 said:

> > > @mci711 said:

> > > > @VNutz said:

> > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > @ldchristopher said:

> > > > > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > > > > @Argonne69 said:

> > > > > > > > > @ME27 said:

> > > > > > > > > Played waters edge today. This place has really gone downhill. Used to be a pretty decent track not too long ago. Course has a nice setup but conditions were no bueno. Decent round 79.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When was it decent? I always thought it had a good collection of holes, but the drainage was always poor, and conditioning was spotty at best for many years.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Been a good 5 years since it's been in decent shape. They even used to have some cool flower beds out there way before that but yeah, it's a waste of a great layout in current years.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The Cal-Sag Channel literally runs right through the course. My guess is it flooded then baked out (side note: Cal-Sag, Salt Creek and the North Shore Channel have gotta be the three worst smelling rivers in the area). With a flood plain course like that there isn’t a lot that can be done without spending money to re-sod and, given the weather patterns we’ve been having year in and year out, that seems like a fruitless endeavor, especially for a course “professionally” managed by Billy Casper. It saddens me that a two-time major winner and genuinely good guy is now more known as the name attached to suspect golf course management. But I digress. Water’s Edge is serving it’s primary purpose of retaining flood water but I wouldn’t expect much more than that.

> > > > >

> > > > > A guy in our group lives right by there and indicated their hurting for money, part of why they haven't taken care of it. If that's been the trend, this season didn't do them any more favors. You are right on Billy Casper, it rarely seems like a course gets better when they take them over. They're a disgrace to his name.

> > > >

> > > > The town on Worth is the root of the problem. They expected the course to be a cash cow but in reality it’s the opposite. They were always trying to squeeze money out of it, so 10 years ago they changed management from Kemper Sports to Casper. That’s when the change began. Casper is cheaper but runs a skeleton crew and their courses suffer, but Worth probably sees more money coming in so they don’t care. They’d prefer to turn it into a strip mall if they could. There are a myriad of other sketchy things they’ve done, but that’s likely not for public consumption.

> > > >

> > > > The flooding is an issue because it’s built over and old dump and lacks the sandy sub soil that courses need. Thus it doesn’t drain well, and when the CalSag floods it’s nearly impossible to recover quickly.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Yikes, going from Kemper to Casper hurts. Like driving a BMW for years then buying 90s Camry.

> >

> > While a 90s Camry is hardily exciting, it is/was an extremely reliable, well-built vehicle. Still see a few of them on the road today. A better comparison would be the Ford Tempo, which was a complete ****-box. That's a more accurate description of Billy Casper Golf and the facilities they "manage".

>

> Good point! I used 90s camry because a 92 camry was my first car in 05. Now that I think of it being 13 years old, I never had any real problems.

 

I drive a 92 Camry. Only has 112k on it. I drive it only to golf courses, so about 1,000 miles a year maybe.

[jimwgt26]

Water’s Edge was nice when it first opened in the 90’s. I would only play there if I lived within 20 minutes and nothing else is available. I played earlier this summer for the first time in years. It’s a dump.

 

I’ve been playing Sunset Valley a lot recently. It’s convenient for me on a weekday afternoon. They did a great job with the renovation. IMO, SV is a great neighborhood course, it’s not Stonewall, The Preserve, Blackstone, Cantigny or Thunderhawk.

[Shriner]

Well, for pure golf, I may have a new favorite course in Illinois. Stonewall has been my #1 for awhile, but my goodness is Pine Meadow perfect. No two holes are the same and not a house on the course. If a course is going to be difficult, I want it to be because of the course, not because they designed a 20 yard wide fairway with water on both sides. Anyone can make a difficult course that way. This is the most fair, difficult course I can remember playing. If you miss by a little, you can recover. If you miss by alot, you are taking a penalty. That is the definition of how a course should be laid out. The clubhouse is a shack and the 19th hole basically does not exist but who cares when you have a golf course that is perfect; can't wait to go back!

[Argonne69]

Couldn't ask for a nicer day, no? Fun round at Pheasant Run. It's certainly not going to win any awards, but it's not a bad (short) parkland course. Most of the par 4's are short, but it has a few long ones. The par 3s are fairly long. Two of the par 5's are fairly long and very tight within corridors of tall trees, but the others are very gettable. Conditions were decent. The tee boxes were rough, and it was hard to get a tee in the ground on many. The fairways were in nice shape, with only a handful of brown patches. The greens were in great shape. Speed was on the slow side. 'No surprise for a resort course. Early morning pace was very good at 4:05.

 

OMG. Anybody want to by a slightly used mini driver? 'Probably the worst club I've put in my bag in recent years. The shaft is too light and whippy, and I was hitting low hooking knuckleballs. 'Don't think I hit one over 200 yds, and certainly didn't find a single fairway. 'Not quite the driver alternative I was looking for. I guess the three year old Aeroburner Mini Driver stays in the bag. Miserable day off the tee, but luckily the course was short enough that I was able to hit hybrids and fairway woods into or around the greens. I managed 5 fairways with my driver, but still had 12 greens. My putter was hot, and really bailed me out. Two birdies and three bogies on the day.

[Apindara]

> @Shriner said:

> Well, for pure golf, I may have a new favorite course in Illinois. Stonewall has been my #1 for awhile, but my goodness is Pine Meadow perfect. No two holes are the same and not a house on the course. If a course is going to be difficult, I want it to be because of the course, not because they designed a 20 yard wide fairway with water on both sides. Anyone can make a difficult course that way. This is the most fair, difficult course I can remember playing. If you miss by a little, you can recover. If you miss by alot, you are taking a penalty. That is the definition of how a course should be laid out. The clubhouse is a shack and the 19th hole basically does not exist but who cares when you have a golf course that is perfect; can't wait to go back!

How were the greens running? Last time I heard they were super slow.

 

 

[Argonne69]

> @Apindara said:

> > @Shriner said:

> > Well, for pure golf, I may have a new favorite course in Illinois. Stonewall has been my #1 for awhile, but my goodness is Pine Meadow perfect. No two holes are the same and not a house on the course. If a course is going to be difficult, I want it to be because of the course, not because they designed a 20 yard wide fairway with water on both sides. Anyone can make a difficult course that way. This is the most fair, difficult course I can remember playing. If you miss by a little, you can recover. If you miss by alot, you are taking a penalty. That is the definition of how a course should be laid out. The clubhouse is a shack and the 19th hole basically does not exist but who cares when you have a golf course that is perfect; can't wait to go back!

> How were the greens running? Last time I heard they were super slow.

>

>

 

The first few holes were very slow due to the morning dew. I was kicking up rooster tails. By the middle of the front nine they had dried off, and were rolling with moderate speed. 'Probably 7 or 8.