PGA Tour Playoffs fix

[BURKMI19]

What about the following scenario for a fix to the current FedEx playoffs system (yes it is actually broken.....seriously who gets strokes spotted to them in a pro event)

 

Top 125 still get in for the first playoff event, only instead of the entire field playing against each other we break it down into 5 Brackets of 25 players each.  The brackets would be seeded in a numerical pattern to allow for the most equitable positioning in the brackets.

 

So I would have brackets something like this:

B1: 1,10,14,18,22,26,35,39,43,47,51,60,64,68,72,76,85,89,93,97,101,110,114,118,122

B2: 2,6,15,19,23,27,31,40,44,48,52,56,65,69,73,77,81,90,94,98,102,106,115,119,123

B3: 3,7,11,20,24,28,32,36,45,49,53,57,61,70,74,78,82,86,95,99,103,107,111,120,124

B4: 4,8,12,16,25,29,33,37,41,50,54,58,62,66,75,79,83,87,91,100,104,108,112,116,125

B5: 5,9,13,17,21,30,34,38,42,46,55,59,63,67,71,80,84,88,92,96,105,109,113,117,121

 

Event 1 (The Northern Trust)

Players will compete against the other 24 in their bracket for being able to move on, so after 36-holes if two players were tied there would be a sudden-death playoff to determine who got to move on to the weekend.  The 36-hole cut for the first event would be exactly 70 players, 14 from each bracket.

Event 2 (BMW Championship)

Players in from each bracket compete against each other for 72-holes no cut.  The six best scores from each bracket move to Tour Championship, if there are ties at the end then we'd have sudden death playoff for who moves on.

Event 3 (Tour Championship)

The remaining 30 players tee it up but we don't any strokes offset, this is straight up.  Winner takes all.

 

* We eliminate guys "getting a pass" on not performing well during a week and still getting to move on

* We eliminate spotting guys strokes in the tour championship

* You gotta earn it for three straight weeks

* And just like in the major team sports, what you did in the regular season doesn't grant you any playoff perks.  So the whole cumulative point thing can get thrown out, none of that mid-tournament player ranking calculation stuff.

 

 

 

[johnseg]

I am not sure anything needs fixed. I just don't think it can ever be what the Tour wants it to be. Just be happy there are three tournaments after all of the important ones are over that draws a good field.

[CasualLie]

1 hour ago, BURKMI19 said:

What about the following scenario for a fix to the current FedEx playoffs system (yes it is actually broken.....seriously who gets strokes spotted to them in a pro event)

 

Top 125 still get in for the first playoff event, only instead of the entire field playing against each other we break it down into 5 Brackets of 25 players each.  The brackets would be seeded in a numerical pattern to allow for the most equitable positioning in the brackets.

 

So I would have brackets something like this:

B1: 1,10,14,18,22,26,35,39,43,47,51,60,64,68,72,76,85,89,93,97,101,110,114,118,122

B2: 2,6,15,19,23,27,31,40,44,48,52,56,65,69,73,77,81,90,94,98,102,106,115,119,123

B3: 3,7,11,20,24,28,32,36,45,49,53,57,61,70,74,78,82,86,95,99,103,107,111,120,124

B4: 4,8,12,16,25,29,33,37,41,50,54,58,62,66,75,79,83,87,91,100,104,108,112,116,125

B5: 5,9,13,17,21,30,34,38,42,46,55,59,63,67,71,80,84,88,92,96,105,109,113,117,121

 

Event 1 (The Northern Trust)

Players will compete against the other 24 in their bracket for being able to move on, so after 36-holes if two players were tied there would be a sudden-death playoff to determine who got to move on to the weekend.  The 36-hole cut for the first event would be exactly 70 players, 14 from each bracket.

Event 2 (BMW Championship)

Players in from each bracket compete against each other for 72-holes no cut.  The six best scores from each bracket move to Tour Championship, if there are ties at the end then we'd have sudden death playoff for who moves on.

Event 3 (Tour Championship)

The remaining 30 players tee it up but we don't any strokes offset, this is straight up.  Winner takes all.

 

* We eliminate guys "getting a pass" on not performing well during a week and still getting to move on

* We eliminate spotting guys strokes in the tour championship

* You gotta earn it for three straight weeks

* And just like in the major team sports, what you did in the regular season doesn't grant you any playoff perks.  So the whole cumulative point thing can get thrown out, none of that mid-tournament player ranking calculation stuff.

 

 

 

 

If everyone is cool with 30 players making it to Tour Championship for winner takes all, and equal start, then why do you need the brackets?

[golfortennis]

In order best solution, these would be my proposed fixes:

 

1)Eliminate them.

.

.

.

6)Match play.  If they are playoffs, go head to head.  Maybe you do 2 out of 3s or something, but get match play involved.

 

Eliminate them.  NASCAR-inspired ideas should end up like a number of their cars each race: crashed and burned.

[the bishop]

Yeah that simplifies things for sure 

Edited August 31, 2021 by the bishop

[Titleist84]

1) The regular season points only get you into the playoffs. After that the playoff events should have no cuts and the top x players move on to the next week.

 

2) Change the field sizes to 70, 50, 30.  No other sport let's everyone into the playoffs.

 

3) Use courses that have held majors.

 

4) Everyone starts at even par and whoever wins the Tour Championship wins the FedEx Cup.  

 

 

 

 

[dalehead]

9 minutes ago, Titleist84 said:

1) The regular season points only get you into the playoffs. After that the playoff events should have no cuts and the top x players move on to the next week.

 

2) Change the field sizes to 70, 50, 30.  No other sport let's everyone into the playoffs.

 

3) Use courses that have held majors.

 

4) Everyone starts at even par and whoever wins the Tour Championship wins the FedEx Cup.  
 

I can agree with all except the winner of the Tour Championship winning the Fed Ex Cup.

The whole premise of the Fed Ex Cup is identifying the best player for the season. We can debate how Fed Ex points are awarded but a season long point system is a valid way of determining the most consistent player of the year.

Part of the problem with the Tour Championship is the name. The implication is the winner is the champion of the Tour that year.  But a season long competition shouldn’t be determined by one tournament. If the winner of the TC is the champion of the year what is the Fed Ex Cup winner the champion of.

Change the name of the TC, maybe to the Coca Cola Classic and make it just the final playoff event with the points added to the player’s season total. The player with the most points is the Tour Champion, AKA as the Fed Ex Cup champion.

 

9 minutes ago, Titleist84 said:

 

 

 

 

 

[NJBigFish22]

Take the top 90, after first event top 60 move on, after second event top 30 move on.  Scores are cumulative. So let’s take an example of top 2 finishers in tour championship. 

 

So player A shoots 13 under, 3 under and 5 under, total is 21 under.

Player B shoots 6 under, 16 under and even, total is 22 under and he wins.

[stinger_gc]

I've said this before and I'll say it again majors should have a higher point value. It's completely ridiculous that Tony Finau is ranked ahead Jon Rahm even though he's won a major and has 6 more top 10s.  Stupid format and stupid concept all around.

[golfortennis]

4 minutes ago, PHILsThemannnn said:

I've said this before and I'll say it again majors should have a higher point value. It's completely ridiculous that Tony Finau is ranked ahead Jon Rahm even though he's won a major and has 6 more top 10s.  Stupid format and stupid concept all around.

 

This is the same tour that gave Peter Kostis crap for daring to ask a winner of a tournament what it felt like knowing he would be in the Masters, rather than the "excitement" of the 500 FedEx Cup points he had just earned.

 

Your last sentence is an understatement. 

[stinger_gc]

35 minutes ago, golfortennis said:

 

This is the same tour that gave Peter Kostis crap for daring to ask a winner of a tournament what it felt like knowing he would be in the Masters, rather than the "excitement" of the 500 FedEx Cup points he had just earned.

 

Your last sentence is an understatement. 

I actually found the Kostis interview where he said that, and IMO that's a bunch of BS. I think for a guy like Garrick Higgo (won the Palmetto Championship the week before the US Open) it's a much bigger deal to play the Masters then it is to get into the Fedex Cup Playoffs.

[golfortennis]

14 hours ago, PHILsThemannnn said:

I actually found the Kostis interview where he said that, and IMO that's a bunch of BS. I think for a guy like Garrick Higgo (won the Palmetto Championship the week before the US Open) it's a much bigger deal to play the Masters then it is to get into the Fedex Cup Playoffs.

 

This is what happens when you "partner" with an organization as a broadcaster.  

[stinger_gc]

1 minute ago, golfortennis said:

 

This is what happens when you "partner" with an organization as a broadcaster.  

Exactly! The PGA Tour is cramming the fedex cup down everyone's throats. 

[Abh159]

I'm not saying the FedEx Cup Playoff format is perfect by any means, but why do people keep using the argument that "the regular season doesn't matter in other sports"???

 

Ever heard of home field/court advantage? Or first round buys? Or getting to play the lowest seed (aka worst team) in the opening round? It's almost like no one on golfwrx watches other sports...

Edited September 1, 2021 by Abh159

[stinger_gc]

14 minutes ago, Abh159 said:

I'm not saying the FedEx Cup Playoff format is perfect by any means, but why do people keep using the argument that "the regular season doesn't matter in other sports"???

 

Ever heard of home field/court advantage? Or first round buys? Or getting to play the lowest seed (aka worst team) in the opening round? It's almost like no one on golfwrx watches other sports...

Only complaint I have is the majors are undervalued. No way Tony Finau should be ranked higher then Collin Morikawa.

[golfortennis]

46 minutes ago, Abh159 said:

I'm not saying the FedEx Cup Playoff format is perfect by any means, but why do people keep using the argument that "the regular season doesn't matter in other sports"???

 

Ever heard of home field/court advantage? Or first round buys? Or getting to play the lowest seed (aka worst team) in the opening round? It's almost like no one on golfwrx watches other sports...

 

When baseball started with the wild card, someone made a very astute point.  "The question that needs to be asked is, do you consider the regular season to be a qualification process for the playoffs, or do you consider the playoffs a reward for the champions of the regular season?"  One's view on that question tends to inform one's view on whether the regular season matters.

 

Now, the ship has long sailed since playoffs = $$$, but seeding is a very small reward in most of the sports.  The number of 8 seeds that have made the finals in hockey is absurd.  Basketball is the only exception, only because the nature of the game allows for dominance.  And baseball, the difference between winning 3 out of 7 and 4 out of 7, extrapolated over 162 is 69 wins vs 93.  It's a crapshoot come playoff time.  

 

Dress it up however you want, but the more teams that get in, the less the regular season matters.    

[golfortennis]

39 minutes ago, PHILsThemannnn said:

Only complaint I have is the majors are undervalued. No way Tony Finau should be ranked higher then Collin Morikawa.

 

The PGA Tour doesn't cash in, I mean, run, the majors.  But I'm sure your point and that are purely coincidental.

[Abh159]

50 minutes ago, golfortennis said:

Dress it up however you want, but the more teams that get in, the less the regular season matters.    

 

I don't disagree, but you could make the argument that the PGA actually lets less players (or teams) into the playoffs than any other sport thus making it the hardest sport to make the playoffs.

 

The official/unofficial money list for 2021 has 377 players listed (FYI in 2019 there were 434 players on that list). There is no data I could find regarding people who played in a tour event but didn't make the cut (aka win money) in the 2021 season, but I would say a conservative guess is at least 100 more. 

 

Lets say 477 PGA Tour Players total for the 2021 season and only 125 made the playoffs. That equals 26%. If you just take the guys that won money then it's 377 for 125 which equals 33%.

 

MLB - 30 teams for 10 playoff spots = 33%

NFL - 32 teams for 12 (14 this year) spots = 37.5% (43%)

NHL - 32 teams for 16 spots = 50%

MLS (if anyone cares) - 27 teams for 14 spots = 52%

NBA - 30 teams for 16 spots = 53%

 

So at the end of the day why shouldn't those who do well in the regular season be rewarded when it could be argued that golf is the toughest sport to make the playoffs in?

Edited September 1, 2021 by Abh159

[golfortennis]

2 hours ago, Abh159 said:

 

I don't disagree, but you could make the argument that the PGA actually lets less players (or teams) into the playoffs than any other sport thus making it the hardest sport to make the playoffs.

 

The official/unofficial money list for 2021 has 377 players listed (FYI in 2019 there were 434 players on that list). There is no data I could find regarding people who played in a tour event but didn't make the cut (aka win money) in the 2021 season, but I would say a conservative guess is at least 100 more. 

 

Lets say 477 PGA Tour Players total for the 2021 season and only 125 made the playoffs. That equals 26%. If you just take the guys that won money then it's 377 for 125 which equals 33%.

 

MLB - 30 teams for 10 playoff spots = 33%

NFL - 32 teams for 12 (14 this year) spots = 37.5% (43%)

NHL - 32 teams for 16 spots = 50%

MLS (if anyone cares) - 27 teams for 14 spots = 52%

NBA - 30 teams for 16 spots = 53%

 

So at the end of the day why shouldn't those who do well in the regular season be rewarded when it could be argued that golf is the toughest sport to make the playoffs in?

 

Team sports vs individual sport.  How many of those 477 are senior tour players with some remaining status, sponsor's exemptions, and otherwise guys to fill out fields.  How many events are opposite field events because there is a bigger tournament going on somewhere else?  As long as two teams are there, you can play a game.  A third team isn't there waiting to be an alternate.

 

Not a valid comparison, IMO.  Not to mention, all they did was convert the money list that was the criteria for a card for the next season, and said this points list now is the list.  

 

[BURKMI19]

4 hours ago, Abh159 said:

I'm not saying the FedEx Cup Playoff format is perfect by any means, but why do people keep using the argument that "the regular season doesn't matter in other sports"???

 

Ever heard of home field/court advantage? Or first round buys? Or getting to play the lowest seed (aka worst team) in the opening round? It's almost like no one on golfwrx watches other sports...

What I meant by stating that the regular season doesn't matter, is that what you did doesn't and shouldn't help you, but the FedEx Cup allows for that which is frustrating.  Guys who can skip the first/second event or get cut from the first but still move on is laughable.

[me05501]

On 8/31/2021 at 9:11 PM, PHILsThemannnn said:

I've said this before and I'll say it again majors should have a higher point value. It's completely ridiculous that Tony Finau is ranked ahead Jon Rahm even though he's won a major and has 6 more top 10s.  Stupid format and stupid concept all around.

Whether you like the playoff format or not, it should be pretty obvious that winning one of the playoff events will always be very meaningful points-wise. 

[stinger_gc]

2 minutes ago, me05501 said:

Whether you like the playoff format or not, it should be pretty obvious that winning one of the playoff events will always be very meaningful points-wise. 

It's stupid. You could technically win all 4 majors and still not be the number 1 seed going into the Tour Championship just because the playoff events carry so much weight. 600 for a major win, 2000 for winning a playoff event

[ArtMBgolf]

Fed Ex is putting up a lot of $, so as long as they do there will be a Fed Ex Cup.  
I believe the Tour made the rules, so the tour can change them.  
 
Giving strokes on Tour is and looks childish stupid. 
 
Some guys play a lot of tournaments or peak when the points are high. 
Some miss too many tournaments and get hurt in the Fed Ex Cup.  
 
I feel the 100, 70, 30 is fine, but start even in the Tour Champ.  
Other sports award home field, but golf doesn't have that.  
The Super Bowl rarely has the home team in it.  They don't award any 
points to the team with a better record.   

[drn92]

I think one of the golf magazine writers had an idea for a true playoff … maybe something like invite the top 144 players. Bottom 12 each round are cut. Cumulative score over the 12 rounds of the 3 tournaments. By the time you get to East Lake the Saturday round has 24 players and the Sunday round has 12. 
 

every round would count. 
 

drn92

[tw_focus]

No, the real fix is to make the finals match play. It's a joke to have a tourney with players starting off with free strokes. Make it match play, and give the top players byes into the later rounds. 30th place has to win 6-7 matches for the title, but 1st place has to win only 3-4.

[Dave230]

Change the final 30 to a final 10, and then just do a straight tournament starting on level par for the big prize. I think making it that exclusive would retain the importance of needing to play well to make it and then you wouldn’t have contrived system to make it interesting.

[FootWedge16]

All I know is that handicapped scoring at a pga event is still the absolute worst idea ever implemented on tour.

[me05501]

3 hours ago, FootWedge16 said:

All I know is that handicapped scoring at a pga event is still the absolute worst idea ever implemented on tour.

 

The worst idea ever implemented on tour was the prior system where a guy could win the Tour Championship and still lose the points race. 

This is the SECOND worst idea ever implemented on tour. 

[Tpfol]

I think the comparison to other sports is funny.

How many teams make the playoffs? Is regular season important?

Well, what other sport plays the Superbowl in 1 month, then in consecutive months the World Series, Stanley cup and Championship? 

The Tour championship doesnt need fixing, its just a fun money grab for these guys. 

Ask Rory McIlroy which he'd prefer, 5 straight Fedex Cup Championships or 1 Masters win?

 

[Titleist99]

23 hours ago, Abh159 said:

I'm not saying the FedEx Cup Playoff format is perfect by any means, but why do people keep using the argument that "the regular season doesn't matter in other sports"???

 

Ever heard of home field/court advantage? Or first round buys? Or getting to play the lowest seed (aka worst team) in the opening round? It's almost like no one on golfwrx watches other sports...

Agreed 100%.....Let's not even mention Tennis where in the first round the #1 seed plays someone that their family is rooting for the top player......LOL!