Is the PGA Tour at a loss or at a crossroad?

[bekgolf]

Just now, miami1023 said:

I should mention that the abysmal live coverage of the PGA tour is not helping at all. Watching on Thursdays and Fridays requires about 2 streaming subscriptions and a lot of patience that ends up with you not even seeing the groups you want to see. Once you get to Saturday and Sunday you have the big networks covering barely half day of which the coverage itself barely shows any of the real golf until the last few holes. 

 

I'm not a fan of the format used by networks.  Don't like the human interest stories, don't like the sports updates (I'm watching golf, if I was interested in other sports I'd be watching them),  I don't like the sponsor interviews or commercials but they are a necessary evil to pay for the broadcast.

 

I especially don't like the current trend of massively amplifying background noise.  I'm not sure of the reason but I don't like hearing a motorcycle 1/2 a mile away accelerating or the background hiss so loud that I can't make out anything else.

[subrew]

The background noise at the LPGA Thailand event was so awesome.  Birds and Monkeys turned up to 11.  My cat was losing his mind, kept trying to attack the surround sound speakers behind the couch.  

Edited February 26 by subrew

[jimecherry]

44 minutes ago, bekgolf said:

 

 

Do you think YT and other steaming content is taking away from PGA Tour viewership?  IMO those of us who watch PGA golf do so for the competition and to see shots that would be once a season for most of us. 

 

I've watched a few of the Rick Shiels series and they are entertaining but they aren't taking the place of tournament golf.

imho the problem isnt youtube/tiktok taking away from pga tour its time & mortality. and youtube/tiktok are growing.

[tacklingdummy]

1 hour ago, grm24 said:

Hard to have commercials when literally no advertisers want to be part of the product. The PGA Tour is on NBC, CBS and Golf Channel. The same 3 television networks they have been on for years. 

 

It is also funny when many of those same advertisers are doing lots of business in Saudi Arabia. Funny how that works. 

 

 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

6 minutes ago, tacklingdummy said:

 

It is also funny when many of those same advertisers are doing lots of business in Saudi Arabia. Funny how that works. 

 

 

They don't want to advertise because no one watches it despite it being easily accessible to anyone with an internet connection. The product stinks. 

[jimecherry]

8 minutes ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

They don't want to advertise because no one watches it despite it being easily accessible to anyone with an internet connection. The product stinks. 

i'm glad that your atleast not calling them evil ;}

[tacklingdummy]

23 minutes ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

They don't want to advertise because no one watches it despite it being easily accessible to anyone with an internet connection. The product stinks. 

 

John Rahm, DJ, Cam Smith, Bryson, Koepka, etc, etc. competing. Yeah, those guys are washed up has-beens hacking it up. Nobody wants to watch that. 😂 

 

 

[Maine Golfer]

Its the stupid team stuff nobody cares about. I don't know who "The crushers" or "Ironheads" are, nor do I care about the point totals they have. 

 

and yeah they have great stars, playing the same stars every week isn't magic. This overlaps with the PGA / world tour idea, do you really think you can do major golf every week? No... Also sometimes majors aren't super fun to watch on Sunday, with nobody surging. This idea golf can magically grow on TV, with format changes is crazy talk!

 

 

[grm24]

26 minutes ago, tacklingdummy said:

John Rahm, DJ, Cam Smith, Bryson, Koepka, etc, etc. competing. Yeah, those guys are washed up has-beens hacking it up. Nobody wants to watch that.

Based on the extremely low measured tv ratings, miniscule streaming numbers and general apathy towards the product it does strongly appear nobody wants to watch. 

[LeoLeo99]

I watched a little of the Mexico open yesterday.  Snooze fest.  The announcers spent more time extolling Mexico and the golf course which looked pretty easy although they insisted it wasn't than the golf.  

[wedgegame]

2 minutes ago, LeoLeo99 said:

I watched a little of the Mexico open yesterday.  Snooze fest.  The announcers spent more time extolling Mexico and the golf course which looked pretty easy although they insisted it wasn't than the golf.  

 I guess Greg Norman can't design a compelling golf course or golf tour. 🤷‍♂️

[Maine Golfer]

The Shark on a bad day can't hit in straight, so he setup a course you can miss fairways 😛 

[Zitlow]

The PGAT should hire Kim Kardashian as their brand ambassador. 

[Maine Golfer]

Fire most golf channel hosts and hire the best posters from this website. 

 

b00m problem solved 

[bekgolf]

7 minutes ago, Zitlow said:

The PGAT should hire Kim Kardashian as their brand ambassador. 

 

You might be on to something.  I'd vote for Paige Spiranac.

[Maine Golfer]

Guns and Roses on the 18th hole @ The Players  

[tacklingdummy]

2 hours ago, grm24 said:

Based on the extremely low measured tv ratings, miniscule streaming numbers and general apathy towards the product it does strongly appear nobody wants to watch. 

 

But they are only counting the views from the CW and YouTube to get the rating numbers. They are not counting the ratings directly from the LIV Golf website. I'd bet most are watching directly from LIV website because there are no commercials like the CW and YouTube. 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 27 by tacklingdummy

[pgapromex]

2 hours ago, Maine Golfer said:

The Shark on a bad day can't hit in straight, so he setup a course you can miss fairways 😛 

Uh huh....

 

Gregory John Norman AO is an Australian entrepreneur and retired professional golfer who spent 331 weeks as world number one in the 1980s and 1990s. He won 88 professional tournaments, including 20 PGA Tour tournaments and two majors: The Open Championship in 1986 and 1993.

 

That 331 weeks as number 1 only bested by one guy.  Yeah Greg's a loser lol

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world_number_one_male_golfers0

Edited February 27 by pgapromex

[grm24]

5 minutes ago, tacklingdummy said:

 

But they are only counting the views from the CW and YouTube to get the rating numbers. They are not counting the ratings directly from the LIV Golf website. I'd bet most are watching directly from LIV website because there are no commercials like the CW and YouTube. 

They aren't drawing any type of respectable numbers from their own website stream or they would be heavily promoting that. Whether it's 100, 1,000 or 10,000 more viewers is irrelevant. 

 

The fact that can't be argued is regardless of where they're viewed (The CW, YouTube or their stream) there simply isn't a large audience for them. If there were they would announce it everywhere.

 

Think it's a coincidence the 432k number they drew during Sunday of The AT&T was somehow leaked when they thought it was big? It seemed like a reasonable number until it was noted they drew less than a third of the viewers than a repeat of the Saturday round of the AT&T did (1.3 million). It was then excoriated when placed in the proper context. Same as the 168k number they had on Saturday when the AT&T had 1.95 million. 

[MaineMariner]

Whatever you think of the Mexico event, it was way better than the LIV event this weekend.

 

More golf is better, right?

[pingbling23]

45 minutes ago, tacklingdummy said:

 

But they are only counting the views from the CW and YouTube to get the rating numbers. They are not counting the ratings directly from the LIV Golf website. I'd bet most are watching directly from LIV website because there are no commercials like the CW and YouTube. 

 

 

 

 

U.S. numbers only too.  

[pgapromex]

10 minutes ago, MaineMariner said:

Whatever you think of the Mexico event, it was way better than the LIV event this weekend.

 

More golf is better, right?

Hmmm let's see...

 

DJ, Rambo, Deshampoo, Koepka vs Knapptime and the 8 nobodies on a boring flat resort course.

 

It's a tough one 😳

[MaineMariner]

16 minutes ago, pgapromex said:

Hmmm let's see...

 

DJ, Rambo, Deshampoo, Koepka vs Knapptime and the 8 nobodies on a boring flat resort course.

 

It's a tough one 😳

Did they play an event this weekend and nobody noticed?

 

I guess it would have been clearer if I put “this last weekend.” My point being that LIV guys disappearing for huge swaths of the year is worse than the occasional low-stakes PGA Tour event.

Edited February 27 by MaineMariner

[tacklingdummy]

17 minutes ago, grm24 said:

They aren't drawing any type of respectable numbers from their own website stream or they would be heavily promoting that. Whether it's 100, 1,000 or 10,000 more viewers is irrelevant. 

 

The fact that can't be argued is regardless of where they're viewed (The CW, YouTube or their stream) there simply isn't a large audience for them. If there were they would announce it everywhere.

 

Think it's a coincidence the 432k number they drew during Sunday of The AT&T was somehow leaked when they thought it was big? It seemed like a reasonable number until it was noted they drew less than a third of the viewers than a repeat of the Saturday round of the AT&T did (1.3 million). It was then excoriated when placed in the proper context. Same as the 168k number they had on Saturday when the AT&T had 1.95 million. 

 

 

I still think there are higher ratings on the website. I have watch it on the CW and YouTube and it is far better on their website with no commercials. The CW and YouTube both have a lot of commercials. 

 

But, I think their ratings are lower because a few reasons. LIV is not on a major TV network. That is the biggest. It is just easier to watch on the major networks. PGA tour tournaments are always on the major networks at the same times on Sat, Sun, so it is easy to watch on a TV.  

 

LIV needs to do a better job on marketing how to watch it on a regular TV,  when the schedules are. There is quite a few more steps on watching it on a TV because you have to get the CW app or YouTube app on the TV.  Scheduling is not always the same like the PGA tour tournaments. When you are at home on Sat and Sun, you know you can turn on the tv at 12pm-3pm PST on most weeks and a PGA tournament is on. 

 

Also, a lot may have to do with the demographic watching PGA tour events vs LIV. PGA tour events have a much older demographic watching the tournaments which they are more to watch on the TV and not like streaming or know about how to stream. LIV has a younger demographic watching, so streaming is more standard. I'd bet if you just compared the streaming numbers for PGA vs LIV, LIV streaming numbers would be higher than PGA.  Of course, if LIV was on a major network on TV, they would get much better ratings. 

[jimecherry]

Just now, MaineMariner said:

Did they play an event this weekend and nobody noticed?

oddly enough Alvaro Ortiz brother won an event in Oman and nobody at WRX noticed ;}

[grm24]

23 minutes ago, tacklingdummy said:

 

 

I still think there are higher ratings on the website. I have watch it on the CW and YouTube and it is far better on their website with no commercials. The CW and YouTube both have a lot of commercials. 

 

But, I think their ratings are lower because a few reasons. LIV is not on a major TV network. That is the biggest. It is just easier to watch on the major networks. PGA tour tournaments are always on the major networks at the same times on Sat, Sun, so it is easy to watch on a TV.  

 

LIV needs to do a better job on marketing how to watch it on a regular TV,  when the schedules are. There is quite a few more steps on watching it on a TV because you have to get the CW app or YouTube app on the TV.  Scheduling is not always the same like the PGA tour tournaments. When you are at home on Sat and Sun, you know you can turn on the tv at 12pm-3pm PST on most weeks and a PGA tournament is on. 

 

Also, a lot may have to do with the demographic watching PGA tour events vs LIV. PGA tour events have a much older demographic watching the tournaments which they are more to watch on the TV and not like streaming or know about how to stream. LIV has a younger demographic watching, so streaming is more standard. I'd bet if you just compared the streaming numbers for PGA vs LIV, LIV streaming numbers would be higher than PGA.  Of course, if LIV was on a major network on TV, they would get much better ratings. 

Regardless of the source watched, the ratings for the that tour simply don't amount to anything regardless of the metrics used. Even when all the sources numbers are combined. The CW has a reach of 100% of the population in the USA. It's not difficult for anybody to find out when they are on the CW. Takes a few seconds at most. 

 

BTW you don't need any sort app to watch the CW on your tv. It's available OTA for literally the entire US population via satellite, cable, etc. Thought that they were on in the same time frame on The CW whether tape delayed or live when they have an event. Is that not the case?

 

As for the streaming audience again I'll repeat what you continunally want to over emphasize. If the streaming numbers were great Norman and his followers would loudly sing their praises from the mountain tops about them. The reason they aren't is that there are not good ratings to be promote. Streaming, OTA or anything else. Regardless of demographics. There is a reason they don't distribute their audience numbers anymore.

 

It also doesn't matter who they sign off the PGA Tour it's not improving ratings or getting big name big money sponsors flocking to them. They keep throwing good money after bad looking for some sort of miracle. The only thing keeping them going is ill advised hubris of it's management team and deep a pocketed benefactor in PIF. 

[TiScape]

1 hour ago, pgapromex said:

Hmmm let's see...

 

DJ, Rambo, Deshampoo, Koepka vs Knapptime and the 8 nobodies on a boring flat resort course.

 

It's a tough one 😳

Someone needs a screen name change! May I suggest, hmmmm, hold on, IDK….

livpromex??? JAT 🤷🏼‍♂️

 

🤣

[Golfnuck]

The PGA tour (or any other private entity) cannot compete with an oil rich county that is willing to spend their own citizen's money without a care in the world.

 

Frankly the PGA tour and golf itself is only a minor sport.  Imagine if the Saudi's tried to buy the NFL.  Now you would see the US government step in quickly.

Edited February 27 by Golfnuck

[hunterdog]

8 hours ago, tacklingdummy said:

 

 

I still think there are higher ratings on the website. I have watch it on the CW and YouTube and it is far better on their website with no commercials. The CW and YouTube both have a lot of commercials. 

 

But, I think their ratings are lower because a few reasons. LIV is not on a major TV network. That is the biggest. It is just easier to watch on the major networks. PGA tour tournaments are always on the major networks at the same times on Sat, Sun, so it is easy to watch on a TV.  

 

LIV needs to do a better job on marketing how to watch it on a regular TV,  when the schedules are. There is quite a few more steps on watching it on a TV because you have to get the CW app or YouTube app on the TV.  Scheduling is not always the same like the PGA tour tournaments. When you are at home on Sat and Sun, you know you can turn on the tv at 12pm-3pm PST on most weeks and a PGA tournament is on. 

 

Also, a lot may have to do with the demographic watching PGA tour events vs LIV. PGA tour events have a much older demographic watching the tournaments which they are more to watch on the TV and not like streaming or know about how to stream. LIV has a younger demographic watching, so streaming is more standard. I'd bet if you just compared the streaming numbers for PGA vs LIV, LIV streaming numbers would be higher than PGA.  Of course, if LIV was on a major network on TV, they would get much better ratings. 

I’m curious how you determined the demographics of viewers of the tours. Is there a published study and by whom? Thanks

[bcjim]

32 minutes ago, hunterdog said:

I’m curious how you determined the demographics of viewers of the tours. Is there a published study and by whom? Thanks

It's called "making s*** up"