Anyone think playing too fast is actually in poor etiquette?

[ThinkingPlus]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > Yes.

>

> Absolutely yes.

>

> Had a match last year with a guy like that. Both of us walking. I outdrove him by a good bit. So I always was hitting into greens last. He would power walk ahead and be near the green by the time my ball stopped. If On the green he’d mark my ball for me and be putting as I walked up. 4 holes of this and I’d had enough. I told him on 5 tee that “ I’d appreciate you not picking my ball up again , If you don’t have time to play this match Concede it and we will walk in “. He turned bright red. And I proceeded to close him down on 12. He was using gamesmanship in my opinion , and I just refuse to take it any longer.

>

> Also know another guy I refuse to ride in a cart with. He literally gripes every shot if I don’t just hop in the cart while the ball is in flight. Then speeds to the next ball and repeats. Last straw was when I stepped out of the cart 6 feet away and shot a distance with my finder. He says “ I’m sick of watching you go to the ball with no club in hand “. I shot back hard “ how do I know which club until I know how far I need to hit it “? And then told him to be glad I wasn’t holding a club. I may have thrown it in his direction. People are slow. Sure. But people who don’t have time to play the game properly should stay home.

 

The key is what you said about playing properly. In order to really play and score to the best of your abilities you need to know distances to penalty areas, bunkers, pins, etc... . You need to read the wind. You need to read putts for longer than a couple of seconds. You really need to putt out everything outside of 1'. All these actions and considerations take some amount of time. If you aren't doing these things, you aren't going to shoot your best score which is kind of the game's intent. In fact, one could theoretically be accused of sandbagging with excessively fast play. I would never condone taking excessive time to play. Taking between 4 and 4.5 hours for a foursome to play (depending upon how busy the course is) is reasonable and in line with what associations and courses typically recommend. If you play faster than that and it doesn't impact others then that is fine, but you don't get a cookie, or gold star, or a trophy. The best way to play faster is swing less often. Donning Nomex suit.

[North Butte]

Didn't Wesley Bryan shoot around par in a final round of a Tour event in like 2 hours, playing solo? I'm pretty sure he was reading the wind and lining up his putts. I say that because when you watch him in a normal Tour round he spends a huge proportion of his time literally standing around waiting on the other players to do their thing. His normal Tour rounds are basically two hours of him playing his best possible golf, interspersed with two-plus hours of doing nothing.

 

So no, the people playing golf in a foursome in three hours are not pissing away strokes by not bothering to hit the appropriate shots for the conditions and they're not picking up all their short putts. They doing all the stuff it takes to play their best golf. It simply doesn't take very long to do that, even if you're shooting in the 90's.

[bladehunter]

> @ThinkingPlus said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > Yes.

> >

> > Absolutely yes.

> >

> > Had a match last year with a guy like that. Both of us walking. I outdrove him by a good bit. So I always was hitting into greens last. He would power walk ahead and be near the green by the time my ball stopped. If On the green he’d mark my ball for me and be putting as I walked up. 4 holes of this and I’d had enough. I told him on 5 tee that “ I’d appreciate you not picking my ball up again , If you don’t have time to play this match Concede it and we will walk in “. He turned bright red. And I proceeded to close him down on 12. He was using gamesmanship in my opinion , and I just refuse to take it any longer.

> >

> > Also know another guy I refuse to ride in a cart with. He literally gripes every shot if I don’t just hop in the cart while the ball is in flight. Then speeds to the next ball and repeats. Last straw was when I stepped out of the cart 6 feet away and shot a distance with my finder. He says “ I’m sick of watching you go to the ball with no club in hand “. I shot back hard “ how do I know which club until I know how far I need to hit it “? And then told him to be glad I wasn’t holding a club. I may have thrown it in his direction. People are slow. Sure. But people who don’t have time to play the game properly should stay home.

>

> The key is what you said about playing properly. In order to really play and score to the best of your abilities you need to know distances to penalty areas, bunkers, pins, etc... . You need to read the wind. You need to read putts for longer than a couple of seconds. You really need to putt out everything outside of 1'. All these actions and considerations take some amount of time. If you aren't doing these things, you aren't going to shoot your best score which is kind of the game's intent. In fact, one could theoretically be accused of sandbagging with excessively fast play. I would never condone taking excessive time to play. Taking between 4 and 4.5 hours for a foursome to play (depending upon how busy the course is) is reasonable and in line with what associations and courses typically recommend. If you play faster than that and it doesn't impact others then that is fine, but you don't get a cookie, or gold star, or a trophy. The best way to play faster is swing less often. Donning Nomex suit.

 

1000.% this-^. If you’re not out to shoot a score , you won’t likely be in my group long. And I just do not understand folks that play this game for any other reason. Plenty of cheap outdoor exercise in this world to be had.

[cvhookem63]

As plenty of other have said here: YES - you can definitely play TOO fast. I think playing too fast is almost more annoying to me than playing too slow. If you are hitting your tee shot and driving (or walking) off before others have hit, walking off the green and driving (or walking) to the next tee box before everyone has putted out, etc - then you are playing too fast and nobody is going to enjoy playing with you. A single joined my group doing this exact thing recently, and it was pretty frustrating. We typically play at a 3 hours pace (if the course isn't backed up) - so not slow at all IMO - and this guy was just playing at a blazing pace. It was not an enjoyable experience.

[bladehunter]

3 hours ? How long is this course ? Butte , I’m not even going to argue with you. But will say , to me 3 hours with a 4 some is smoking fast.

 

My normal Saturday time is 812. We usually are finished at or around noon. ... so under 4 plenty of times. But. That’s 4 guys shooting around par. And assuming nobody in front of us to wait on. I just don’t know where we’d gain 50 or so minutes at.

[SkiSchoolPro]

Yes, https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/1720252/speed-obsessed#latest

But more people play slower than necessary.

[tatertot]

If everybody played at the exact pace I do, I don't think there would be a problem.

[North Butte]

I can't describe where your 4-hour round differed from a 3-hour one. On an old-fashioned course designed for walking (i.e. no quarter mile hikes between holes) for a walking foursome to play in 3 hours is pretty quick. It means not doing much if any time searching in the woods or rough for lost balls and yeah, it means all four of them probably need to keep it in the 70's and 80's. Threesomes in 3:00 is no problem at all, though.

 

But even in a foursome with the odd ball search or one guy struggling and shooting 95 (most likely me, alas) something like 3:05, 3:10 or 3:15 is not rushed at all. To get to 4 hours or more somebody's wasting some time somewhere.

 

Now if you're talking some ridiculous modern monstrosity of a modern course that plays to 7,200 yards but covers more like 10,000 because the holes are so spread out...well, take as long as you want. I don't play that kind of course.

 

P.S. Here's a test of where the time is going. Any time you look around and everyone is already at or near their ball but nobody is actually making a swing or stepping up to address the ball, count to 30 and see if a ball has been hit yet. It only takes a couple of 30-second nobody-does-nothing pauses per hole to add nearly 20 minutes to a round. And some groups, there's a 30+ second pause per player on almost every hole. That's where the 4+ hours rounds come from in my experience.

[bladehunter]

> @"North Butte" said:

> I can't describe where your 4-hour round differed from a 3-hour one. On an old-fashioned course designed for walking (i.e. no quarter mile hikes between holes) for a walking foursome to play in 3 hours is pretty quick. It means not doing much if any time searching in the woods or rough for lost balls and yeah, it means all four of them probably need to keep it in the 70's and 80's. Threesomes in 3:00 is no problem at all, though.

>

> But even in a foursome with the odd ball search or one guy struggling and shooting 95 (most likely me, alas) something like 3:05, 3:10 or 3:15 is not rushed at all. To get to 4 hours or more somebody's wasting some time somewhere.

>

> Now if you're talking some ridiculous modern monstrosity of a modern course that plays to 7,200 yards but covers more like 10,000 because the holes are so spread out...well, take as long as you want. I don't play that kind of course.

>

> P.S. Here's a test of where the time is going. Any time you look around and everyone is already at or near their ball but nobody is actually making a swing or stepping up to address the ball, count to 30 and see if a ball has been hit yet. It only takes a couple of 30-second nobody-does-nothing pauses per hole to add nearly 20 minutes to a round. And some groups, there's a 30+ second pause per player on almost every hole. That's where the 4+ hours rounds come from in my experience.

 

I missed the 3 some part. So yes. I guess we could play around 3 ish with a 3 some. My course is very walkable. Tees beside greens etc. so it’s not that at all.

 

I still hate the idea of going out with a time in my head though. One thing I refuse to do is play when I feel rushed. I’ll just slow down. Call me any name you like. But I’m not going to run from ball to ball. It’s rare that I play with someone that makes me feel that way. But that’s how to combat it if you run into it.

[North Butte]

> @bladehunter said:>

> I still hate the idea of going out with a time in my head though. One thing I refuse to do is play when I feel rushed. I’ll just slow down. Call me any name you like. But I’m not going to run from ball to ball. It’s rare that I play with someone that makes me feel that way. But that’s how to combat it if you run into it.

 

I never wear a watch or look at the time when I'm playing golf. But there seems to be a little alarm that goes off in my head any time I've been out there 3-1/2 hours or so and we still have a couple of holes left to play. Slow feels slow, no watch needed.

 

What I do know is I don't like (repeatedly) standing there while people indulge in time-wasting superstitious quirks and "routines". Which in my experience is where a lot of the difference between a 3:10 and a 3:50 round comes from. It only takes one guy in each foursome trying to imitate Jordan Spieth to slow the whole course down.

 

That's the thing in all these slow play discussions. When I describe playing in 3 hours or a bit more in a threesome or in a little under 3 hours solo, that's *descriptive*, not *prescriptive*. I'm not arguing the "3 hour round" as a first principle. I'm arguing for a group of three or four normal 70's and 80's shooters to be able to hit the ball, find the ball and hit it again without stopping on every single hole to wait.

 

When that happens, when there's mostly golf with very little waiting, I look back at the end of the round and voila, turns out we went around in 3:05 or whatever it was. The number isn't the thing, the experience of play is the thing.

[Pepperturbo]

In answer to the OP's question "yes," there's a point when excessively fast POP is too fast for the field in front. In general, the field copes with excessively fast and slow golfers and neither deserves preferential treatment, as each is a sliver segment of all golfers.

[Under2hours]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > Yes.

> > >

> > > Absolutely yes.

> > >

> > > Had a match last year with a guy like that. Both of us walking. I outdrove him by a good bit. So I always was hitting into greens last. He would power walk ahead and be near the green by the time my ball stopped. If On the green he’d mark my ball for me and be putting as I walked up. 4 holes of this and I’d had enough. I told him on 5 tee that “ I’d appreciate you not picking my ball up again , If you don’t have time to play this match Concede it and we will walk in “. He turned bright red. And I proceeded to close him down on 12. He was using gamesmanship in my opinion , and I just refuse to take it any longer.

> > >

> > > Also know another guy I refuse to ride in a cart with. He literally gripes every shot if I don’t just hop in the cart while the ball is in flight. Then speeds to the next ball and repeats. Last straw was when I stepped out of the cart 6 feet away and shot a distance with my finder. He says “ I’m sick of watching you go to the ball with no club in hand “. I shot back hard “ how do I know which club until I know how far I need to hit it “? And then told him to be glad I wasn’t holding a club. I may have thrown it in his direction. People are slow. Sure. But people who don’t have time to play the game properly should stay home.

> >

> > The key is what you said about playing properly. In order to really play and score to the best of your abilities you need to know distances to penalty areas, bunkers, pins, etc... . You need to read the wind. You need to read putts for longer than a couple of seconds. You really need to putt out everything outside of 1'. All these actions and considerations take some amount of time. If you aren't doing these things, you aren't going to shoot your best score which is kind of the game's intent. In fact, one could theoretically be accused of sandbagging with excessively fast play. I would never condone taking excessive time to play. Taking between 4 and 4.5 hours for a foursome to play (depending upon how busy the course is) is reasonable and in line with what associations and courses typically recommend. If you play faster than that and it doesn't impact others then that is fine, but you don't get a cookie, or gold star, or a trophy. The best way to play faster is swing less often. Donning Nomex suit.

>

> 1000.% this-^. If you’re not out to shoot a score , you won’t likely be in my group long. And I just do not understand folks that play this game for any other reason. Plenty of cheap outdoor exercise in this world to be had.

 

Here we go again, people not understanding or with the attitude that they are playing Sunday at the Open. Our course is 6900 (Par 71) and well laid out. Some walks, but none excessive. It is however very very hilly.

 

Yesterday's threesome was 2:45. We played well (I had a PB & regular partner hit a lot of GIR's). The third shoots in the 90's. I could however shoot 100 and would still play in the same time as I am admittedly unusually fast.

 

Read the wind, know your yardage to the yard, where pins and bunkers are, please don't tell me you're that good. We have great pin sheets, but it comes down to puring a ball or not.

 

And no we don't all obsess over that 2'er.....

[North Butte]

> @Under2hours said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > > Yes.

> > > >

> > > > Absolutely yes.

> > > >

> > > > Had a match last year with a guy like that. Both of us walking. I outdrove him by a good bit. So I always was hitting into greens last. He would power walk ahead and be near the green by the time my ball stopped. If On the green he’d mark my ball for me and be putting as I walked up. 4 holes of this and I’d had enough. I told him on 5 tee that “ I’d appreciate you not picking my ball up again , If you don’t have time to play this match Concede it and we will walk in “. He turned bright red. And I proceeded to close him down on 12. He was using gamesmanship in my opinion , and I just refuse to take it any longer.

> > > >

> > > > Also know another guy I refuse to ride in a cart with. He literally gripes every shot if I don’t just hop in the cart while the ball is in flight. Then speeds to the next ball and repeats. Last straw was when I stepped out of the cart 6 feet away and shot a distance with my finder. He says “ I’m sick of watching you go to the ball with no club in hand “. I shot back hard “ how do I know which club until I know how far I need to hit it “? And then told him to be glad I wasn’t holding a club. I may have thrown it in his direction. People are slow. Sure. But people who don’t have time to play the game properly should stay home.

> > >

> > > The key is what you said about playing properly. In order to really play and score to the best of your abilities you need to know distances to penalty areas, bunkers, pins, etc... . You need to read the wind. You need to read putts for longer than a couple of seconds. You really need to putt out everything outside of 1'. All these actions and considerations take some amount of time. If you aren't doing these things, you aren't going to shoot your best score which is kind of the game's intent. In fact, one could theoretically be accused of sandbagging with excessively fast play. I would never condone taking excessive time to play. Taking between 4 and 4.5 hours for a foursome to play (depending upon how busy the course is) is reasonable and in line with what associations and courses typically recommend. If you play faster than that and it doesn't impact others then that is fine, but you don't get a cookie, or gold star, or a trophy. The best way to play faster is swing less often. Donning Nomex suit.

> >

> > 1000.% this-^. If you’re not out to shoot a score , you won’t likely be in my group long. And I just do not understand folks that play this game for any other reason. Plenty of cheap outdoor exercise in this world to be had.

>

> Here we go again, people not understanding or with the attitude that they are playing Sunday at the Open. Our course is 6900 (Par 71) and well laid out. Some walks, but none excessive. It is however very very hilly.

>

> Yesterday's threesome was 2:45. We played well (I had a PB & regular partner hit a lot of GIR's). The third shoots in the 90's. I could however shoot 100 and would still play in the same time as I am admittedly unusually fast.

>

> Read the wind, know your yardage to the yard, where pins and bunkers are, please don't tell me you're that good. We have great pin sheets, but it comes down to puring a ball or not.

>

> And no we don't all obsess over that 2'er.....

 

When it comes to "playing my best" I am 100% certain that it does NOT involve reading short putts from all sides, practice swings. tossing grass up in the air to check the wind or anything beyond getting my yardage, figuring out the day's hole location then stepping up and hitting the ball. Or on the green, doing most of my reading while walking to the ball and only checking up by the hole if I have some doubt about the correct read.

 

The more I try to "get serious" and dot every i and cross every t the more more tense and out of sync I get.

[Roadking2003]

I've never understood speed players. What's your hurry? What happened to enjoying the round and the company of other golfers? Do you have to get home to mow the grass? or run home to jump on GOLFWRX.COM?

 

Do any of you have a beer after the round of golf? If so, what's your hurry?

 

I set aside six hours when I play golf including a leisurely warm-up and having a beer after the round.

 

[farmer]

> @"North Butte" said:

> Didn't Wesley Bryan shoot around par in a final round of a Tour event in like 2 hours, playing solo? I'm pretty sure he was reading the wind and lining up his putts. I say that because when you watch him in a normal Tour round he spends a huge proportion of his time literally standing around waiting on the other players to do their thing. His normal Tour rounds are basically two hours of him playing his best possible golf, interspersed with two-plus hours of doing nothing.

>

> So no, the people playing golf in a foursome in three hours are not pissing away strokes by not bothering to hit the appropriate shots for the conditions and they're not picking up all their short putts. They doing all the stuff it takes to play their best golf. It simply doesn't take very long to do that, even if you're shooting in the 90's.

 

This is interesting, and maybe you can give an answer. If player A in the group needs a ruling, does player B hit his approach? Or do the other players stand around until the issue has been resolved?

[North Butte]

On the tournaments I've seen on TV, looks like they stand around for a couple minutes after the green clears ahead of them and if the ruling isn't going to come quickly the player awaiting the official just waves the others to go ahead and hit.

[MountainKing]

> @bladehunter said:

> 3 hours ? How long is this course ? Butte , I’m not even going to argue with you. But will say , to me 3 hours with a 4 some is smoking fast.

>

> My normal Saturday time is 812. We usually are finished at or around noon. ... so under 4 plenty of times. But. That’s 4 guys shooting around par. And assuming nobody in front of us to wait on. I just don’t know where we’d gain 50 or so minutes at.

 

3 hours is unreasonable for sure, and I'm a huge proponent of fast rounds, but for most 4somes a 3 hour round is too much. With that, my group I normally play with are all low hcp and if we have an empty course we can easily play in 3 hours. It's just ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire. In some instances if we're on opposite sides of the fairway and there's no risk of an errant shot hitting somebody then two guys might just go ahead and play at the same time. If there's a lost ball, all guys play their shots then go join the hunt, ect. If you know the course well it should be even easier. 3:30 to 4 hours should not be unreasonable for a 4some of any level.

 

[MountainKing]

> @farmer said:

> > @"North Butte" said:

> > Didn't Wesley Bryan shoot around par in a final round of a Tour event in like 2 hours, playing solo? I'm pretty sure he was reading the wind and lining up his putts. I say that because when you watch him in a normal Tour round he spends a huge proportion of his time literally standing around waiting on the other players to do their thing. His normal Tour rounds are basically two hours of him playing his best possible golf, interspersed with two-plus hours of doing nothing.

> >

> > So no, the people playing golf in a foursome in three hours are not pissing away strokes by not bothering to hit the appropriate shots for the conditions and they're not picking up all their short putts. They doing all the stuff it takes to play their best golf. It simply doesn't take very long to do that, even if you're shooting in the 90's.

>

> This is interesting, and maybe you can give an answer. If player A in the group needs a ruling, does player B hit his approach? Or do the other players stand around until the issue has been resolved?

 

In the years I've played, tournaments and for fun we always run by the everybody takes care of their own business first then goes and helps out with the ruling or ball search. On the lost ball thing, with the 3 minute rule, the 3 minutes if often close to up by the time the other 3 players have played their shots.

[North Butte]

> @MountainKing said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > 3 hours ? How long is this course ? Butte , I’m not even going to argue with you. But will say , to me 3 hours with a 4 some is smoking fast.

> >

> > My normal Saturday time is 812. We usually are finished at or around noon. ... so under 4 plenty of times. But. That’s 4 guys shooting around par. And assuming nobody in front of us to wait on. I just don’t know where we’d gain 50 or so minutes at.

>

> 3 hours is unreasonable for sure, and I'm a huge proponent of fast rounds, but for most 4somes a 3 hour round is too much. With that, my group I normally play with are all low hcp and if we have an empty course we can easily play in 3 hours. It's just ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire. In some instances if we're on opposite sides of the fairway and there's no risk of an errant shot hitting somebody then two guys might just go ahead and play at the same time. If there's a lost ball, all guys play their shots then go join the hunt, ect. If you know the course well it should be even easier. 3:30 to 4 hours should not be unreasonable for a 4some of any level.

>

 

I can't quite parse your comments...

 

Is 3 hours "unreasonable"?

 

Or do you and your group easily play in 3 hours?

 

But I completely agree that "...ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire..." makes up about 90% of what it takes to play 3 hours or a bit longer on a nicely laid out course.

[Under2hours]

> @Roadking2003 said:

> I've never understood speed players. What's your hurry? What happened to enjoying the round and the company of other golfers? Do you have to get home to mow the grass? or run home to jump on GOLFWRX.COM?

>

> Do any of you have a beer after the round of golf? If so, what's your hurry?

>

> I set aside six hours when I play golf including a leisurely warm-up and having a beer after the round.

>

 

I explained that I do stay around after...... 4 hours on the course though to me is long.

 

Butte forgot to mention reading the Humidity & Dew Point too prior to playing your shot.

 

Ughh slow play exasperates me to no end.

[North Butte]

> @Under2hours said:

> > @Roadking2003 said:

> > I've never understood speed players. What's your hurry? What happened to enjoying the round and the company of other golfers? Do you have to get home to mow the grass? or run home to jump on GOLFWRX.COM?

> >

> > Do any of you have a beer after the round of golf? If so, what's your hurry?

> >

> > I set aside six hours when I play golf including a leisurely warm-up and having a beer after the round.

> >

>

> I explained that I do stay around after...... 4 hours on the course though to me is long.

>

> Butte forgot to mention reading the Humidity & Dew Point too prior to playing your shot.

>

> Ughh slow play exasperates me to no end.

 

I don't know why so many people (at least in these discussions) think that a certain numerical amount of time like "3 hours" or "4 hours" is the crux of the matter.

 

It's having the flow of my round interrupted repeatedly that ruins the experience. If I'm not walking, hitting my ball or watching someone else hit their ball then I'm not playing golf. I'm waiting until I can play golf again.

 

I'd imagine almost every here, if they had a tee time for 9:00am and were told after walking up on the first tee that it will actually be around 10:00am before you can hit your first shot, would find that tedious and annoying. To me, it's no less annoying if that extra sixty minutes is split into increments of two or three minutes apiece two dozen times during the round.

[MountainKing]

> @"North Butte" said:

> > @MountainKing said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > 3 hours ? How long is this course ? Butte , I’m not even going to argue with you. But will say , to me 3 hours with a 4 some is smoking fast.

> > >

> > > My normal Saturday time is 812. We usually are finished at or around noon. ... so under 4 plenty of times. But. That’s 4 guys shooting around par. And assuming nobody in front of us to wait on. I just don’t know where we’d gain 50 or so minutes at.

> >

> > 3 hours is unreasonable for sure, and I'm a huge proponent of fast rounds, but for most 4somes a 3 hour round is too much. With that, my group I normally play with are all low hcp and if we have an empty course we can easily play in 3 hours. It's just ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire. In some instances if we're on opposite sides of the fairway and there's no risk of an errant shot hitting somebody then two guys might just go ahead and play at the same time. If there's a lost ball, all guys play their shots then go join the hunt, ect. If you know the course well it should be even easier. 3:30 to 4 hours should not be unreasonable for a 4some of any level.

> >

>

> I can't quite parse your comments...

>

> Is 3 hours "unreasonable"?

>

> Or do you and your group easily play in 3 hours?

>

> But I completely agree that "...ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire..." makes up about 90% of what it takes to play 3 hours or a bit longer on a nicely laid out course.

 

Sorry, 3 hours is doable by any group if it's a wide open course, but it's an unreasonable expectation to hold anybody to that, especially a course with a full tee sheet. Does that make sense?

[North Butte]

> @MountainKing said:

> > @"North Butte" said:

> > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > 3 hours ? How long is this course ? Butte , I’m not even going to argue with you. But will say , to me 3 hours with a 4 some is smoking fast.

> > > >

> > > > My normal Saturday time is 812. We usually are finished at or around noon. ... so under 4 plenty of times. But. That’s 4 guys shooting around par. And assuming nobody in front of us to wait on. I just don’t know where we’d gain 50 or so minutes at.

> > >

> > > 3 hours is unreasonable for sure, and I'm a huge proponent of fast rounds, but for most 4somes a 3 hour round is too much. With that, my group I normally play with are all low hcp and if we have an empty course we can easily play in 3 hours. It's just ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire. In some instances if we're on opposite sides of the fairway and there's no risk of an errant shot hitting somebody then two guys might just go ahead and play at the same time. If there's a lost ball, all guys play their shots then go join the hunt, ect. If you know the course well it should be even easier. 3:30 to 4 hours should not be unreasonable for a 4some of any level.

> > >

> >

> > I can't quite parse your comments...

> >

> > Is 3 hours "unreasonable"?

> >

> > Or do you and your group easily play in 3 hours?

> >

> > But I completely agree that "...ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire..." makes up about 90% of what it takes to play 3 hours or a bit longer on a nicely laid out course.

>

> Sorry, 3 hours is doable by any group if it's a wide open course, but it's an unreasonable expectation to hold anybody to that, especially a course with a full tee sheet. Does that make sense?

 

Yes, I agree. It's not hard to do but there aren't many places left where you can actually expect to find it.

 

 

[MountainKing]

> @"North Butte" said:

> > @MountainKing said:

> > > @"North Butte" said:

> > > > @MountainKing said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > 3 hours ? How long is this course ? Butte , I’m not even going to argue with you. But will say , to me 3 hours with a 4 some is smoking fast.

> > > > >

> > > > > My normal Saturday time is 812. We usually are finished at or around noon. ... so under 4 plenty of times. But. That’s 4 guys shooting around par. And assuming nobody in front of us to wait on. I just don’t know where we’d gain 50 or so minutes at.

> > > >

> > > > 3 hours is unreasonable for sure, and I'm a huge proponent of fast rounds, but for most 4somes a 3 hour round is too much. With that, my group I normally play with are all low hcp and if we have an empty course we can easily play in 3 hours. It's just ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire. In some instances if we're on opposite sides of the fairway and there's no risk of an errant shot hitting somebody then two guys might just go ahead and play at the same time. If there's a lost ball, all guys play their shots then go join the hunt, ect. If you know the course well it should be even easier. 3:30 to 4 hours should not be unreasonable for a 4some of any level.

> > > >

> > >

> > > I can't quite parse your comments...

> > >

> > > Is 3 hours "unreasonable"?

> > >

> > > Or do you and your group easily play in 3 hours?

> > >

> > > But I completely agree that "...ready golf and taking care of your business while others are hitting so when it's your turn you're ready to fire..." makes up about 90% of what it takes to play 3 hours or a bit longer on a nicely laid out course.

> >

> > Sorry, 3 hours is doable by any group if it's a wide open course, but it's an unreasonable expectation to hold anybody to that, especially a course with a full tee sheet. Does that make sense?

>

> Yes, I agree. It's not hard to do but there aren't many places left where you can actually expect to find it.

>

>

 

Chicago this golf season, the horrible weather up until recently has left courses empty even on weekends. We had to play a lot in the rain but I will say it was a glorious run of weekend rounds not having to wait on slow people.

[bladehunter]

> @Under2hours said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > > Yes.

> > > >

> > > > Absolutely yes.

> > > >

> > > > Had a match last year with a guy like that. Both of us walking. I outdrove him by a good bit. So I always was hitting into greens last. He would power walk ahead and be near the green by the time my ball stopped. If On the green he’d mark my ball for me and be putting as I walked up. 4 holes of this and I’d had enough. I told him on 5 tee that “ I’d appreciate you not picking my ball up again , If you don’t have time to play this match Concede it and we will walk in “. He turned bright red. And I proceeded to close him down on 12. He was using gamesmanship in my opinion , and I just refuse to take it any longer.

> > > >

> > > > Also know another guy I refuse to ride in a cart with. He literally gripes every shot if I don’t just hop in the cart while the ball is in flight. Then speeds to the next ball and repeats. Last straw was when I stepped out of the cart 6 feet away and shot a distance with my finder. He says “ I’m sick of watching you go to the ball with no club in hand “. I shot back hard “ how do I know which club until I know how far I need to hit it “? And then told him to be glad I wasn’t holding a club. I may have thrown it in his direction. People are slow. Sure. But people who don’t have time to play the game properly should stay home.

> > >

> > > The key is what you said about playing properly. In order to really play and score to the best of your abilities you need to know distances to penalty areas, bunkers, pins, etc... . You need to read the wind. You need to read putts for longer than a couple of seconds. You really need to putt out everything outside of 1'. All these actions and considerations take some amount of time. If you aren't doing these things, you aren't going to shoot your best score which is kind of the game's intent. In fact, one could theoretically be accused of sandbagging with excessively fast play. I would never condone taking excessive time to play. Taking between 4 and 4.5 hours for a foursome to play (depending upon how busy the course is) is reasonable and in line with what associations and courses typically recommend. If you play faster than that and it doesn't impact others then that is fine, but you don't get a cookie, or gold star, or a trophy. The best way to play faster is swing less often. Donning Nomex suit.

> >

> > 1000.% this-^. If you’re not out to shoot a score , you won’t likely be in my group long. And I just do not understand folks that play this game for any other reason. Plenty of cheap outdoor exercise in this world to be had.

>

> Here we go again, people not understanding or with the attitude that they are playing Sunday at the Open. Our course is 6900 (Par 71) and well laid out. Some walks, but none excessive. It is however very very hilly.

>

> Yesterday's threesome was 2:45. We played well (I had a PB & regular partner hit a lot of GIR's). The third shoots in the 90's. I could however shoot 100 and would still play in the same time as I am admittedly unusually fast.

>

> Read the wind, know your yardage to the yard, where pins and bunkers are, please don't tell me you're that good. We have great pin sheets, but it comes down to puring a ball or not.

>

> And no we don't all obsess over that 2'er.....

 

I don’t know what to say to this. I guess I could shoot 95 or so in a cart in 245. Maybe just hit it from the cart ? But no time for pee breaks or even water at that speed.

[North Butte]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Under2hours said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > > > Yes.

> > > > >

> > > > > Absolutely yes.

> > > > >

> > > > > Had a match last year with a guy like that. Both of us walking. I outdrove him by a good bit. So I always was hitting into greens last. He would power walk ahead and be near the green by the time my ball stopped. If On the green he’d mark my ball for me and be putting as I walked up. 4 holes of this and I’d had enough. I told him on 5 tee that “ I’d appreciate you not picking my ball up again , If you don’t have time to play this match Concede it and we will walk in “. He turned bright red. And I proceeded to close him down on 12. He was using gamesmanship in my opinion , and I just refuse to take it any longer.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also know another guy I refuse to ride in a cart with. He literally gripes every shot if I don’t just hop in the cart while the ball is in flight. Then speeds to the next ball and repeats. Last straw was when I stepped out of the cart 6 feet away and shot a distance with my finder. He says “ I’m sick of watching you go to the ball with no club in hand “. I shot back hard “ how do I know which club until I know how far I need to hit it “? And then told him to be glad I wasn’t holding a club. I may have thrown it in his direction. People are slow. Sure. But people who don’t have time to play the game properly should stay home.

> > > >

> > > > The key is what you said about playing properly. In order to really play and score to the best of your abilities you need to know distances to penalty areas, bunkers, pins, etc... . You need to read the wind. You need to read putts for longer than a couple of seconds. You really need to putt out everything outside of 1'. All these actions and considerations take some amount of time. If you aren't doing these things, you aren't going to shoot your best score which is kind of the game's intent. In fact, one could theoretically be accused of sandbagging with excessively fast play. I would never condone taking excessive time to play. Taking between 4 and 4.5 hours for a foursome to play (depending upon how busy the course is) is reasonable and in line with what associations and courses typically recommend. If you play faster than that and it doesn't impact others then that is fine, but you don't get a cookie, or gold star, or a trophy. The best way to play faster is swing less often. Donning Nomex suit.

> > >

> > > 1000.% this-^. If you’re not out to shoot a score , you won’t likely be in my group long. And I just do not understand folks that play this game for any other reason. Plenty of cheap outdoor exercise in this world to be had.

> >

> > Here we go again, people not understanding or with the attitude that they are playing Sunday at the Open. Our course is 6900 (Par 71) and well laid out. Some walks, but none excessive. It is however very very hilly.

> >

> > Yesterday's threesome was 2:45. We played well (I had a PB & regular partner hit a lot of GIR's). The third shoots in the 90's. I could however shoot 100 and would still play in the same time as I am admittedly unusually fast.

> >

> > Read the wind, know your yardage to the yard, where pins and bunkers are, please don't tell me you're that good. We have great pin sheets, but it comes down to puring a ball or not.

> >

> > And no we don't all obsess over that 2'er.....

>

> I don’t know what to say to this. I guess I could shoot 95 or so in a cart in 245. Maybe just hit it from the cart ? But no time for pee breaks or even water at that speed.

 

So what exactly would you be doing during the half-hour or so you were neither hitting shots or driving between shots? It just doesn't take that long to even take a practice swing and laser a distance before every one of those 95 shots. No way it takes even a full minute to shoot a distance, pull a club, take a practice swing and hit the ball. Even less for putts. So that's 95 minutes. You can drive a cart around a 7,000 yard course in 30 minutes *easily*. So that leaves 40 minutes for taking a pee or eating a snack or stopping and smelling the roses.

 

But I know there are millions of golfers like you who think anything under 3-1/2 or 4 hours to play golf means doing something crazy. It's just a collective delusion, I guess.

[farmer]

> @"North Butte" said:

> On the tournaments I've seen on TV, looks like they stand around for a couple minutes after the green clears ahead of them and if the ruling isn't going to come quickly the player awaiting the official just waves the others to go ahead and hit.

 

I've tried to watch in ruling situations, but have never seen the other players do anything.

[Krt22]

> @farmer said:

> > @"North Butte" said:

> > On the tournaments I've seen on TV, looks like they stand around for a couple minutes after the green clears ahead of them and if the ruling isn't going to come quickly the player awaiting the official just waves the others to go ahead and hit.

>

> I've tried to watch in ruling situations, but have never seen the other players do anything.

 

Hard to tell by TV alone, they will record everything but what they show isnt always live/in order

[bladehunter]

> @"North Butte" said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Under2hours said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @ThinkingPlus said:

> > > > > > > Yes.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Absolutely yes.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Had a match last year with a guy like that. Both of us walking. I outdrove him by a good bit. So I always was hitting into greens last. He would power walk ahead and be near the green by the time my ball stopped. If On the green he’d mark my ball for me and be putting as I walked up. 4 holes of this and I’d had enough. I told him on 5 tee that “ I’d appreciate you not picking my ball up again , If you don’t have time to play this match Concede it and we will walk in “. He turned bright red. And I proceeded to close him down on 12. He was using gamesmanship in my opinion , and I just refuse to take it any longer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also know another guy I refuse to ride in a cart with. He literally gripes every shot if I don’t just hop in the cart while the ball is in flight. Then speeds to the next ball and repeats. Last straw was when I stepped out of the cart 6 feet away and shot a distance with my finder. He says “ I’m sick of watching you go to the ball with no club in hand “. I shot back hard “ how do I know which club until I know how far I need to hit it “? And then told him to be glad I wasn’t holding a club. I may have thrown it in his direction. People are slow. Sure. But people who don’t have time to play the game properly should stay home.

> > > > >

> > > > > The key is what you said about playing properly. In order to really play and score to the best of your abilities you need to know distances to penalty areas, bunkers, pins, etc... . You need to read the wind. You need to read putts for longer than a couple of seconds. You really need to putt out everything outside of 1'. All these actions and considerations take some amount of time. If you aren't doing these things, you aren't going to shoot your best score which is kind of the game's intent. In fact, one could theoretically be accused of sandbagging with excessively fast play. I would never condone taking excessive time to play. Taking between 4 and 4.5 hours for a foursome to play (depending upon how busy the course is) is reasonable and in line with what associations and courses typically recommend. If you play faster than that and it doesn't impact others then that is fine, but you don't get a cookie, or gold star, or a trophy. The best way to play faster is swing less often. Donning Nomex suit.

> > > >

> > > > 1000.% this-^. If you’re not out to shoot a score , you won’t likely be in my group long. And I just do not understand folks that play this game for any other reason. Plenty of cheap outdoor exercise in this world to be had.

> > >

> > > Here we go again, people not understanding or with the attitude that they are playing Sunday at the Open. Our course is 6900 (Par 71) and well laid out. Some walks, but none excessive. It is however very very hilly.

> > >

> > > Yesterday's threesome was 2:45. We played well (I had a PB & regular partner hit a lot of GIR's). The third shoots in the 90's. I could however shoot 100 and would still play in the same time as I am admittedly unusually fast.

> > >

> > > Read the wind, know your yardage to the yard, where pins and bunkers are, please don't tell me you're that good. We have great pin sheets, but it comes down to puring a ball or not.

> > >

> > > And no we don't all obsess over that 2'er.....

> >

> > I don’t know what to say to this. I guess I could shoot 95 or so in a cart in 245. Maybe just hit it from the cart ? But no time for pee breaks or even water at that speed.

>

> So what exactly would you be doing during the half-hour or so you were neither hitting shots or driving between shots? It just doesn't take that long to even take a practice swing and laser a distance before every one of those 95 shots. No way it takes even a full minute to shoot a distance, pull a club, take a practice swing and hit the ball. Even less for putts. So that's 95 minutes. You can drive a cart around a 7,000 yard course in 30 minutes *easily*. So that leaves 40 minutes for taking a pee or eating a snack or stopping and smelling the roses.

>

> But I know there are millions of golfers like you who think anything under 3-1/2 or 4 hours to play golf means doing something crazy. It's just a collective delusion, I guess.

 

Buddy. I’m not wanting to argue.

 

But if we keep going we’re going to be done in 20 min ....

 

Honest to goodness. I rarely if ever take a practice swing .... maybe if I’m trying to draw a driver and need to feel that shot shape. I don’t even take practice strokes with a putter. Waste of energy. I have no clue how youd play in 235. Has to be lack of putts. As in whack the 30 footer and rake back the 6 footer that’s left ? If that’s true. That’s half the game not played. I know. I’ve chronicled my ridiculous amount of greens hit and no putts made in tournament play this year ... was told that I was playing half the game well and that I suck. Lol. Then accused of being full of poop and/or lying about it. .... if I were going to make up a lie about this game , it sure as hell would have a happy ending .... anyway.

 

I’m not saying that’s what you are doing. But the guy above I quoted certainly isn’t putting out and he isn’t just raking back 2 footers either.

[Carl Spackler3]

Tons of fast players here, I tell ya, I’d love to play behind a few of you