What up with Jordan?

[gvogel]

> @Socrates said:

> The more I see what he is doing, he might be the 2nd coming of Ian Baker-Finch or David Duval.

 

Or Lydia Ko.

[caniac6]

It may be unlikely, or it may be possible we've see the best of JS. He wouldn't be the first athlete to come out like a world beater, and end up with a short career. If I were him, I might put the clubs away until October, and start fresh with a new coach and a new attitude. He knows himself better than any of us, but what he is doing now is clearly not working, and he seems very frustrated.

[Shilgy]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @gvogel said:

> > > @Dave230 said:

> > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> >

> > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> >

> > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> >

> > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> >

> > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

>

> Has to be said. That first part is not true.

>

> He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

 

Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

[bladehunter]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @gvogel said:

> > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > >

> > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > >

> > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > >

> > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > >

> > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> >

> > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> >

> > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

>

> Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

 

Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

 

Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

[Shilgy]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Shilgy said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > >

> > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > >

> > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > >

> > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > >

> > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > >

> > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > >

> > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> >

> > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

>

> Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

>

> Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

 

But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

[farmer]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > >

> > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > >

> > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > >

> > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > >

> > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > >

> > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > >

> > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> >

> > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> >

> > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

>

> But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

 

Remember that pass Jackie Smith dropped in the '78 SB? If he caught that, the score is tied, momentum shifts to the Cowboys and we win. Whatever might have happened did not happen.

[bladehunter]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > >

> > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > >

> > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > >

> > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > >

> > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > >

> > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > >

> > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> >

> > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> >

> > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

>

> But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

 

I don’t think a double is a given. He could advance the ball. He just chose the easier smart sure play. His wedges at that point were all scaring the hole. If he gets it inside 120 yards he’s going to likely have a look at par with bogey a given.

[gvogel]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Shilgy said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > > >

> > > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > > >

> > > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > > >

> > > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> > >

> > > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> > >

> > > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

> >

> > But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> > The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> > We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

>

> I don’t think a double is a given. He could advance the ball. He just chose the easier smart sure play. His wedges at that point were all scaring the hole. If he gets it inside 120 yards he’s going to likely have a look at par with bogey a given.

 

From where he was, he might have advanced the ball 10 feet into another horrendous lie. That's the way that I remember it.

[Shilgy]

> @gvogel said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> > > >

> > > > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> > > >

> > > > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

> > >

> > > But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> > > The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> > > We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

> >

> > I don’t think a double is a given. He could advance the ball. He just chose the easier smart sure play. His wedges at that point were all scaring the hole. If he gets it inside 120 yards he’s going to likely have a look at par with bogey a given.

>

> From where he was, he might have advanced the ball 10 feet into another horrendous lie. That's the way that I remember it.

 

That makes more sense. If Blade was correct and he could have advanced it back into the fairway then he certainly would not have taken an unplayable.

[Titleist_PT23]

I wish the guy much success. But I also think it would be hilarious if his next and only future win is the PGA Championship. Bum/worst golfer ever to complete the Career Grand Slam.

[KRAMER1997]

Maybe he's just having a rough patch due to an injury/swing issue. I mean Tiger went from barely walking in early 2017 to winning the Tour Championship in 2018 and the Masters in 2019. I can honestly see his game falling off the face of the golf world in 2020 or winning another Major if he just happens to play hot golf for 72 holes.

[North Texas]

> @agolf1 said:

> I wish the guy much success. But I also think it would be hilarious if his next and only future win is the PGA Championship. Bum/worst golfer ever to complete the Career Grand Slam.

 

So if he did join that list, making him the bum/worst golfer on the list, where would that put all of the other golfers that are not on that list? After all, it's a pretty damn exclusive list.

[Titleist_PT23]

> @"North Texas" said:

> > @agolf1 said:

> > I wish the guy much success. But I also think it would be hilarious if his next and only future win is the PGA Championship. Bum/worst golfer ever to complete the Career Grand Slam.

>

> So if he did join that list, making him the bum/worst golfer on the list, where would that put all of the other golfers that are not on that list? After all, it's a pretty **** exclusive list.

I don't know. It's mostly a joke. I can just imagine the comments saying "he's the luckiest player to win all four majors."

[bladehunter]

> @gvogel said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> > > >

> > > > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> > > >

> > > > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

> > >

> > > But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> > > The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> > > We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

> >

> > I don’t think a double is a given. He could advance the ball. He just chose the easier smart sure play. His wedges at that point were all scaring the hole. If he gets it inside 120 yards he’s going to likely have a look at par with bogey a given.

>

> From where he was, he might have advanced the ball 10 feet into another horrendous lie. That's the way that I remember it.

 

Lol. Yea. 10 ft. Go back and watch it. There aren’t any huge bushes etc on that hill. More walking paths than plants. He chose to drop it because it was a near guaranteed bogey. Then he mishit the 3rd shot and had to make bogey the hard way.

 

Reverse engineer it. He hit 3 iron for the 3rd shot off the range. He flubbed it and came up 15 yards short of the pin. We know he hits 3 iron around 220. So he hit the 3rd shot around 205 ish. He had dropped back around 30 yards from where the unplayable was. After al the ruling. So we can conclude that he was roughly 190 out for his second shot. Give or take. I’m saying he could have moved it 50-75 yards without much doubt. 100 mile an hour 6 iron in the deepest junk will move a ball 50 yards with any sort of strike. Let’s be real people. He took the calculated play. And it was smart. He could have very well hit That 3 iron on and made par. It wouldnt have been the greatest par ever made if he had.

 

I know all the Spieth haters cheered when he hit it there and knew he was done. Then they cried cheater when the ruling took forever. Which wasn’t any doing of his. A whole lot of sour grapes is what that all is.

[North Texas]

Good gosh, all this rehashing what happened in the Open and asking what if this and what if that. You know what they say. If my aunt had balls, she would be my uncle.

[bladehunter]

Just went back and rewatched it. Yes the lie was bad. So I’ll concede that it may have been harder than I recalled to get it back to the fairway. But 10 ft ? This isn’t the Wednesday senior shotgun.

 

Another thing. The main reason for the decision or thinking of not hitting the shot seemed to be the sky cam and cable overhead. He asked for and did not get relief from that.

 

And lastly there was around 10 ft of flat bare ground before the driving range fence. He could have easily dropped there and for an unplayable. Even if the range is OB. He chose to go on back for a better lie and line of sight ( farther form the mounds). So no range OB would not have made for automatic double. Go watch for yourself if you don’t believe me. He had a place to hit either way.

[Shilgy]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @gvogel said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> > > > >

> > > > > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> > > > >

> > > > > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

> > > >

> > > > But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> > > > The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> > > > We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

> > >

> > > I don’t think a double is a given. He could advance the ball. He just chose the easier smart sure play. His wedges at that point were all scaring the hole. If he gets it inside 120 yards he’s going to likely have a look at par with bogey a given.

> >

> > From where he was, he might have advanced the ball 10 feet into another horrendous lie. That's the way that I remember it.

>

> Lol. Yea. 10 ft. Go back and watch it. There aren’t any huge bushes etc on that hill. More walking paths than plants. He chose to drop it because it was a near guaranteed bogey. Then he mishit the 3rd shot and had to make bogey the hard way.

>

> Reverse engineer it. He hit 3 iron for the 3rd shot off the range. He flubbed it and came up 15 yards short of the pin. We know he hits 3 iron around 220. So he hit the 3rd shot around 205 ish. He had dropped back around 30 yards from where the unplayable was. After al the ruling. So we can conclude that he was roughly 190 out for his second shot. Give or take. I’m saying he could have moved it 50-75 yards without much doubt. 100 mile an hour 6 iron in the deepest junk will move a ball 50 yards with any sort of strike. Let’s be real people. He took the calculated play. And it was smart. He could have very well hit That 3 iron on and made par. It wouldnt have been the greatest par ever made if he had.

>

> I know all the Spieth haters cheered when he hit it there and knew he was done. Then they cried cheater when the ruling took forever. Which wasn’t any doing of his. A whole lot of sour grapes is what that all is.

 

Again, if he was positive he could move it 50 yards, which would reach the fairway by the way, why oh why would he take an unplayable and bring double in to play?

 

PS no sour grapes on my part. But your logic is not logical on the reason for the drop. But he did go on the hit streak after this and won.

[bladehunter]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @gvogel said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

> > > > >

> > > > > But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> > > > > The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> > > > > We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

> > > >

> > > > I don’t think a double is a given. He could advance the ball. He just chose the easier smart sure play. His wedges at that point were all scaring the hole. If he gets it inside 120 yards he’s going to likely have a look at par with bogey a given.

> > >

> > > From where he was, he might have advanced the ball 10 feet into another horrendous lie. That's the way that I remember it.

> >

> > Lol. Yea. 10 ft. Go back and watch it. There aren’t any huge bushes etc on that hill. More walking paths than plants. He chose to drop it because it was a near guaranteed bogey. Then he mishit the 3rd shot and had to make bogey the hard way.

> >

> > Reverse engineer it. He hit 3 iron for the 3rd shot off the range. He flubbed it and came up 15 yards short of the pin. We know he hits 3 iron around 220. So he hit the 3rd shot around 205 ish. He had dropped back around 30 yards from where the unplayable was. After al the ruling. So we can conclude that he was roughly 190 out for his second shot. Give or take. I’m saying he could have moved it 50-75 yards without much doubt. 100 mile an hour 6 iron in the deepest junk will move a ball 50 yards with any sort of strike. Let’s be real people. He took the calculated play. And it was smart. He could have very well hit That 3 iron on and made par. It wouldnt have been the greatest par ever made if he had.

> >

> > I know all the Spieth haters cheered when he hit it there and knew he was done. Then they cried cheater when the ruling took forever. Which wasn’t any doing of his. A whole lot of sour grapes is what that all is.

>

> Again, if he was positive he could move it 50 yards, which would reach the fairway by the way, why oh why would he take an unplayable and bring double in to play?

>

> PS no sour grapes on my part. But your logic is not logical on the reason for the drop. But he did go on the hit streak after this and won.

 

See above post ^. Go back and watch it. He had room to drop and play anyway well before the range fence. Ob wouldn’t have mattered.

 

As for the sour grapes. I didn’t necessarily mean you or anyone I’m talking to now. But. At the time this place exploded in a similar fashion to tiger and the boulder moving incident. You’d have thought kuchar got mugged or something. Rulings take time. Everybody at one point is on either side of that wait.

[Shilgy]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Shilgy said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> > > > > > The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> > > > > > We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

> > > > >

> > > > > I don’t think a double is a given. He could advance the ball. He just chose the easier smart sure play. His wedges at that point were all scaring the hole. If he gets it inside 120 yards he’s going to likely have a look at par with bogey a given.

> > > >

> > > > From where he was, he might have advanced the ball 10 feet into another horrendous lie. That's the way that I remember it.

> > >

> > > Lol. Yea. 10 ft. Go back and watch it. There aren’t any huge bushes etc on that hill. More walking paths than plants. He chose to drop it because it was a near guaranteed bogey. Then he mishit the 3rd shot and had to make bogey the hard way.

> > >

> > > Reverse engineer it. He hit 3 iron for the 3rd shot off the range. He flubbed it and came up 15 yards short of the pin. We know he hits 3 iron around 220. So he hit the 3rd shot around 205 ish. He had dropped back around 30 yards from where the unplayable was. After al the ruling. So we can conclude that he was roughly 190 out for his second shot. Give or take. I’m saying he could have moved it 50-75 yards without much doubt. 100 mile an hour 6 iron in the deepest junk will move a ball 50 yards with any sort of strike. Let’s be real people. He took the calculated play. And it was smart. He could have very well hit That 3 iron on and made par. It wouldnt have been the greatest par ever made if he had.

> > >

> > > I know all the Spieth haters cheered when he hit it there and knew he was done. Then they cried cheater when the ruling took forever. Which wasn’t any doing of his. A whole lot of sour grapes is what that all is.

> >

> > Again, if he was positive he could move it 50 yards, which would reach the fairway by the way, why oh why would he take an unplayable and bring double in to play?

> >

> > PS no sour grapes on my part. But your logic is not logical on the reason for the drop. But he did go on the hit streak after this and won.

>

> See above post ^. Go back and watch it. He had room to drop and play anyway well before the range fence. Ob wouldn’t have mattered.

>

> As for the sour grapes. I didn’t necessarily mean you or anyone I’m talking to now. But. At the time this place exploded in a similar fashion to tiger and the boulder moving incident. You’d have thought kuchar got mugged or something. Rulings take time. Everybody at one point is on either side of that wait.

 

I wasn't talking about ob or the drop. Your assertion was two fold:

1) That he could for sure advance it 50 yards from his lie on the hill

(which would get him to the fairway)

2)That he was smart to take a drop.

Those two ideas clash.

[tiderider]

> @"North Texas" said:

> Good gosh, all this rehashing what happened in the Open and asking what if this and what if that. You know what they say. If my aunt had balls, she would be my uncle.

 

um, it's an internet forum ... there are millions of them, and they exist so that these types of conversations can take place ...

[bladehunter]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > > @Shilgy said:

> > > > > > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > @Dave230 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > > Sometimes I think the 2017 Open was a sign of things to come for Spieth, but not in the way we thought. His brilliant bogey on that famous hole may have clinched another major for him but the fact he could hit a 40 yard slice under pressure was more to the point. Every time he tees it up these days he's in danger of one of those horribly wayward ones and you just can't score when you're putting double bogeys on the card regularly even if you putt lights up. Might even survive one round or two rounds without one but never 72 holes and he won't win another tournament until he sorts his driving out.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > This is telling. If the practice area were out of bounds, as it should have been, Matt Kuchar wins that Open Championship.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Jordan found out for the first two rounds at the Wyndham that he can still putt. The big question mark is whether he can keep his driver on the planet. At the moment, the answer is: no.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Edit: Jordan has a very awkward driver swing. Most of us can see it for what it is; the guys who wanted Jordan to be the next Tiger cannot see it for what it is. His awkward swing start with an awkward grip (not my words, Tom Watson's words), and ends in an awkward chicken swing follow through. I think that his swing is his signature, and will never change much.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > If you want to worship Jordan, you do so at your own peril.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Has to be said. That first part is not true.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > He didn’t hit it on the range. He took an unplayable because the range was not ob. He could have hit the shot on the hill. No way for you to say that he doesn’t still win if he can’t go back and drop. We could see the ball it wasn’t a hopeless position , just a smart strategic move to take the unplayable and drop.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sure he could have hit the shot on the hill, but clearly the one stroke penalty for unplayable was BETTER than the shots he would likely have thrown away playing from the hill.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Most likely. But no way to know that. He could have hit the shot on the hill to 75 yards in fairway then holed the wedge for all we know. The what if game swings both ways.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Point is , having the range be OB isn’t even close to enough to declare kuchar the winner at that point.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > But likely would have had at least a double.... And as mentioned above probably is not pumped from his "recovery" to blitz the next few holes.

> > > > > > > The break hitting from the range is not what win for him. The next stretch of holes win the event. But does he do that if coming off a double? Triple?

> > > > > > > We'll never know if course but we all tend to know how players react to a double versus a "stroke saved bogey".

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I don’t think a double is a given. He could advance the ball. He just chose the easier smart sure play. His wedges at that point were all scaring the hole. If he gets it inside 120 yards he’s going to likely have a look at par with bogey a given.

> > > > >

> > > > > From where he was, he might have advanced the ball 10 feet into another horrendous lie. That's the way that I remember it.

> > > >

> > > > Lol. Yea. 10 ft. Go back and watch it. There aren’t any huge bushes etc on that hill. More walking paths than plants. He chose to drop it because it was a near guaranteed bogey. Then he mishit the 3rd shot and had to make bogey the hard way.

> > > >

> > > > Reverse engineer it. He hit 3 iron for the 3rd shot off the range. He flubbed it and came up 15 yards short of the pin. We know he hits 3 iron around 220. So he hit the 3rd shot around 205 ish. He had dropped back around 30 yards from where the unplayable was. After al the ruling. So we can conclude that he was roughly 190 out for his second shot. Give or take. I’m saying he could have moved it 50-75 yards without much doubt. 100 mile an hour 6 iron in the deepest junk will move a ball 50 yards with any sort of strike. Let’s be real people. He took the calculated play. And it was smart. He could have very well hit That 3 iron on and made par. It wouldnt have been the greatest par ever made if he had.

> > > >

> > > > I know all the Spieth haters cheered when he hit it there and knew he was done. Then they cried cheater when the ruling took forever. Which wasn’t any doing of his. A whole lot of sour grapes is what that all is.

> > >

> > > Again, if he was positive he could move it 50 yards, which would reach the fairway by the way, why oh why would he take an unplayable and bring double in to play?

> > >

> > > PS no sour grapes on my part. But your logic is not logical on the reason for the drop. But he did go on the hit streak after this and won.

> >

> > See above post ^. Go back and watch it. He had room to drop and play anyway well before the range fence. Ob wouldn’t have mattered.

> >

> > As for the sour grapes. I didn’t necessarily mean you or anyone I’m talking to now. But. At the time this place exploded in a similar fashion to tiger and the boulder moving incident. You’d have thought kuchar got mugged or something. Rulings take time. Everybody at one point is on either side of that wait.

>

> I wasn't talking about ob or the drop. Your assertion was two fold:

> 1) That he could for sure advance it 50 yards from his lie on the hill

> (which would get him to the fairway)

> 2)That he was smart to take a drop.

> Those two ideas clash.

 

I just disagree. A clean flat lie on the range with a stock 3 iron sounds good compared to other options. Hit the green and 2 putt for bogey. Double only comes in when you miss the 3rd shot badly. He didn’t. Not directionally.

 

If you read my post I have since said that the lie was worse than I remembered. But saying it was a 10 ft at best shot is also false to the other extreme. I’d say he could get to the fairway 3 out of 10 times. And I say he could hit That green from the range 3 out of 10 times. Heads would have exploded if he made par. Lol.

[bscinstnct]

 

> I wish the guy much success. But I also think it would be hilarious if his next and only future win is the PGA Championship. Bum/worst golfer ever to complete the Career Grand Slam.

 

 

Yes, that would be the thread...

 

“Worst golfer to win the career grand slam”

 

He’s gotta do it! You listenin, JS?

 

 

It’s too bad and let’s hope he gets it together. I wouldn’t be that surprised. Just needs that confidence back.

 

He should hire Dr. Gus from Billions ; )

 

 

 

 

[tsecor]

Tiger moving that boulder was a joke. Biggest cheat ive ever seen. Loose impediment my butt...lol....

[third-times-a-charm]

Still brings home over $1m a year in earnings after tax even with his current game and has a career $39m in earnings just from the PGA tour...if he never hits another ball again he's fine.

[North Texas]

> @tsecor said:

> Tiger moving that boulder was a joke. Biggest cheat ive ever seen. Loose impediment my butt...lol....

 

Uh oh. This has a chance to divert this thread big time. But only because you are right. One of the biggest rules travesties ever.

[straightshot7]

> @"North Texas" said:

> > @tsecor said:

> > Tiger moving that boulder was a joke. Biggest cheat ive ever seen. Loose impediment my butt...lol....

>

> Uh oh. This has a chance to divert this thread big time. But only because you are right. One of the biggest rules travesties ever.

 

I know you guys are probably joking but:

 

-it was legal to move, rules official confirmed and USGA still maintains it was legal

 

-it was the Phoenix Open and he did not win the tournament

[bladehunter]

Lol. Or. If you read the rules it was perfectly legal to move a loose impediment. No mention of it being illegal to obtain help moving it.

[Krt22]

"On the front nine I had decent looks at birdie on a lot of holes, and then on 10, when I hit that one out-of-bounds, it was like, man, I don’t know what’s going on," the ever-polite Spieth said in a short interview with reporters.

[farmer]

> @"North Texas" said:

> Good gosh, all this rehashing what happened in the Open and asking what if this and what if that. You know what they say. If my aunt had balls, she would be my uncle.

 

If only Jackie Smith had caught that pass ....

[KRAMER1997]

He's spending too much time with Smylie Kaufman.