Anyone playing a very high swingweight driver ? D-6+

[MagicMan79]

Had a bit of an ah-ha moment in the simulator yesterday while tinkering with driver swingweight.

So I play MOI matched irons that are all +1.00” - 1.5” in length. 1/4” increments from Gw all the way up to 4i. Short iron heads are lightened and long iron have added weight. Wedges are E-1 and scales down to D-7 in the longer irons. They are all long and heavy but the MoI matching and building at 1/4” increments has been one of the best things I’ve ever done , équipement wise. Never hit my irons this straight and hit as many greens. I hit 17/18 greens once this year and that was my best by far

 

My driver SS is 120-122 , and been doing some shaft tinkering since the weather has gotten cold. I like the feel of my driver at D-3, but have been struggling with a high toe miss that I just can’t shake on occassion.

I’ve added weight to drivers while in my garage and measuring swingweight. And anything at D-4 and heavier feels like a battle axe

 

So in the sim yesterday, same thing with driver - good ball, high toe, high toe, good ball..

This is a Sim2 8* with Diamana TB 60 tx, at just under 46” long. Driver in upright/square setting on adapter

 

I started moving and swapping weights, and was not influenced by my swingweight scale. Started pounding it after I added almost 7g to the head, which is quite a bit. Carrying 315-320 pretty consistently 

 

Get home and of course had to put it on the scale. It’s like D-6.2 , an absolute 🔨 

 

Never thought I’d hit it so well with such a head heavy setup, but it is what it is! Maybe it helps load the shaft that tiny bit more where my timing just matched up? Or the SW just matches my irons now so I can just swing it with the same tempo 

 

Was just curious if anyone else was swinging or had success with driver @ D-6+ ?

[Valtiel]

My driver has been D6-D8 for years now, but I also play it short (44.25"). In my experience, additional weight can help calm down certain swing mechanics that might otherwise be a little overactive. It can slow tempo, make you complete your backswing, and keep you from pulling down too hard from the top, all things that are helpful for high speed players if any of those can be issues. My initial tendency when attempting to swing a driver at speed as long as what you're using is to whack it off the toe as well. Too much length gets me feelling cramped up ironically and I lose a ton of spine angle and really flip the club from the inside. That is mostly mechanical issues, but I know to not mess with drivers that long on the course (yet). 

D6 at that length is not really heavy at all to be honest. SIM2's are coming stock at D5 these days, so I wouldn't think at all about the number. Let the on course results by the judge while keeping on eye on weight related flight problems (blocks, timing issues, fatigue etc). 

[Golf Pig]

Look at it in terms of total weight progression. For your irons plot club length vs. total weight. See if this slope lines up with the new total weight of your driver at D6.

[hagimihale]

TS3 10.5*, Diamana 'ahina 6x.  Swingweight is D7.  Its a sledgehammer, but when I'm fully warmed up, I know I can rip through the ball with this thing and it will retain the stable feel I want.

 

I don't use it all the time - on many holes on the courses around here, I would roll through the fairway and into trouble.  But its a lot of fun when I get to tee one up with this.  

 

I have an "alternate" driver (I consider it a 2W): a 12* 917D2 that plays at D6 and won't roll out past 270.  That gets much more play in most rounds...

[hwwong]

Was swinging 46" driver at E0 for a while.  Super heavy.  It's at like D6-D7 now.  Really helps with tempo for me, I usually get really quick in transition.

[cardoustie]

46.25” … 4 drivers with me here in Myrtle at E0.   
 

other guys hit my drivers, note the heavy feel but inevitably hit them well

 

irons running d9-e3 

[GolfTurkey]

I'm too frail and feeble and can't do heavy clubs anymore, either static weight or swing weight. I prefer average weight and getting stability via stiffness.

[MagicMan79]

Thanks for the input guys. Y’all crazy swinging D-9 and E-0 drivers 😂

 

I might keep going and get it up to D-7 or 8, now I’m curious!

 

The thing for me is that the overall static weight can’t get too high. I have a Fuji Pro 2.0 7x , I believe it’s 79g un-cut, and that thing feels like a tree branch getting it around….but it goes pretty straight 

 

Im wondering how a 50 tx and 200g head would be @ 46” 

 

 

[Valtiel]

1 minute ago, MagicMan79 said:

Thanks for the input guys. Y’all crazy swinging D-9 and E-0 drivers 😂

 

I might keep going and get it up to D-7 or 8, now I’m curious!

 

The thing for me is that the overall static weight can’t get too high. I have a Fuji Pro 2.0 7x , I believe it’s 79g un-cut, and that thing feels like a tree branch getting it around….but it goes pretty straight 

 

Im wondering how a 50 tx and 200g head would be @ 46” 

 

 

Balancing your static weight with headweight/swingweight/length is definitely a process. And you're right, most of the time folks are going to gravitate towards lighter shafts at longer lengths for the purposes you mentioned. Today's shaft construction is churning out far more stable products in the 50g/60g weight class than in years past and people have been taking advantage of that for these long bomber setups. 

[Righty to Lefty]

15 hours ago, MagicMan79 said:

Had a bit of an ah-ha moment in the simulator yesterday while tinkering with driver swingweight.

So I play MOI matched irons that are all +1.00” - 1.5” in length. 1/4” increments from Gw all the way up to 4i. Short iron heads are lightened and long iron have added weight. Wedges are E-1 and scales down to D-7 in the longer irons. They are all long and heavy but the MoI matching and building at 1/4” increments has been one of the best things I’ve ever done , équipement wise. Never hit my irons this straight and hit as many greens. I hit 17/18 greens once this year and that was my best by far

 

My driver SS is 120-122 , and been doing some shaft tinkering since the weather has gotten cold. I like the feel of my driver at D-3, but have been struggling with a high toe miss that I just can’t shake on occassion.

I’ve added weight to drivers while in my garage and measuring swingweight. And anything at D-4 and heavier feels like a battle axe

 

So in the sim yesterday, same thing with driver - good ball, high toe, high toe, good ball..

This is a Sim2 8* with Diamana TB 60 tx, at just under 46” long. Driver in upright/square setting on adapter

 

I started moving and swapping weights, and was not influenced by my swingweight scale. Started pounding it after I added almost 7g to the head, which is quite a bit. Carrying 315-320 pretty consistently 

 

Get home and of course had to put it on the scale. It’s like D-6.2 , an absolute 🔨 

 

Never thought I’d hit it so well with such a head heavy setup, but it is what it is! Maybe it helps load the shaft that tiny bit more where my timing just matched up? Or the SW just matches my irons now so I can just swing it with the same tempo 

 

Was just curious if anyone else was swinging or had success with driver @ D-6+ ?

Total weight and swing weight are the two most important factors of a golf club in my opinion as they speak to the mind's eye and help you feel the club moving in space around you. I gradually added weight to my driver in 10 gram increments until I found my perfect fit...which occurred after I had added some 50 grams.  At first it didn't even register on the swingweight scale but now that I play Jumbomaxx grips it swingweights at F9 along with all of my other clubs but I absolutely love the sledge hammer feel as it is exactly the reason why I loved wooden bats over aluminum ones when I played baseball. 

 

Your club's distribution of weight should "trick" you into hitting the ball inline with the CoG. This will create trust and efficiency in a given club and it is paramount to playing your best.  I don't even question it anymore as I now just accept that I have to manipulate the specs of a club to fit what I want to feel and now I can set up a club very quickly as I know exactly what I want to feel in a club and my feel is personal to me and is likely not for anyone else and that is fine.  Going from D3 to D6.2 isn't really a dramatic change but give it time and see if the feel of the club head stays with you as I found that initially when I added weight it felt dramatic...but then a few months later I was losing the sense of the club head and had to add more and retest.  Eventually you hit the sweet spot though and then I made note of that spec and can recreate it on future clubs.  

[evoviiiyou]

Ive been D5-D7 for the last 6-7 drivers at 44.5" on all my custom builds and I tend to error on the D4-5 when its a lower launch lower spin fade biased head coupled with the more tip/mid active shaft...like SIM OG with a Ventus Red. For say a SIM MAX 2 (higher seeming launching a little higher spin head) paired with an Ventus Black, Atmos TS Black, or Speeder TR always go on the D6-7 side which seems to allow the shaft to have a little more feel seemingly.  Of course this is subjective and anecdotal in nature but certainly notable in my results, FWIW.

 

I play weights and combos that allow me to feel like I can go hard and my miss isn't OB...while my great swings and tempos are rewarded with max numbers for me.  When I get into the looser shaft profiles with too much kick, it gets ugly cause then I am trying to slow it down and stuff doesn't feel proper.

[Billfitz]

I've never measured swing weight, not even once. I suspect that mine has usually been high, as I've always used ultra light shafts and grips since they first became available. That being the case, while my swing weight may be high, the static weight is low, and that's what works best for me. 

[TJ83]

I did some tinkering and fine tuning this year. Settled on a driver setup which is the tm sim @9* fujikura ventus black 6x, playing at 45. Swapped sliding weight to and 18 gram one, and as a joke left the lead tape I had on it just to see what would happen. Couldn't miss the middle of the face LOL. After about 20 balls it felt like a bit more work than I'd like so I removed one of the 4inch strips and it's perfect. I can really feel the shaft load up, and my driving has never been better. Did the "math" apparently it comes out to D8.8. Might have to experiment with the irons too now. 

[NRJyzr]

I'm a big fan of heavier swingweight with my driver and woods.  I scale the swingweight a bit based on the shaft weight.  With the 7m3 or HZRDUS 75 in driver, I'm at D6-D7.  When I used a Motore Speeder 6.3 or HZRDUS 62, I went to D8-D9.  It's the only way I get any feel for the club if I go that light with shaft weight.

 

[cardoustie]

On 11/26/2021 at 2:38 AM, MagicMan79 said:

Thanks for the input guys. Y’all crazy swinging D-9 and E-0 drivers 😂

 

I might keep going and get it up to D-7 or 8, now I’m curious!

 

The thing for me is that the overall static weight can’t get too high. I have a Fuji Pro 2.0 7x , I believe it’s 79g un-cut, and that thing feels like a tree branch getting it around….but it goes pretty straight 

 

Im wondering how a 50 tx and 200g head would be @ 46” 

 

 

Rip phenom 50tx …. Awesome at 46.25

[Tax77]

About D8, short shaft though at 43.75, 75 g. Feels good, 45+ might feel a bit weighty and mess with my swing.

[Phabs]

Yikes that heavy terrifies me.  I went 20 grams over where I usually am between a shaft and weights in the head and I felt like I couldn’t get out of my own way.  Felt like I was swinging a piece of road construction rebar.  

Edited November 29, 2021 by Phabs

[hammersia]

On 11/25/2021 at 4:49 PM, Valtiel said:

D6 at that length is not really heavy at all to be honest. SIM2's are coming stock at D5 these days, so I wouldn't think at all about the number. Let the on course results by the judge while keeping on eye on weight related flight problems (blocks, timing issues, fatigue etc). 

 

Yeah I think you might need to beef up a little bit if you find that feels heavy.

 

I did play a stupidly heavy driver in a hire set in China a few years ago, and hit it great, no idea what make it was but I suspect it was 300cc, very stiff and maybe 3 wood length.

 

I have played around with a lot of added driver head weight, shorter lengths etc. since then and never got close to that feeling again.

 

Be interesting to see if you can take your new driver to the course. 

[Rapidcat]

On 11/26/2021 at 1:14 PM, cardoustie said:

46.25” … 4 drivers with me here in Myrtle at E0.   
 

other guys hit my drivers, note the heavy feel but inevitably hit them well

 

irons running d9-e3 

I've seen you post a few times about your heavier SW's and always interested - how did you end up determining this works for you? Really heavy head weight or do you also play heavier shafts? I guess longer shafts enable a heavier SW more easily.

 

Yeah, I know, trial and error etc but what led you down this path - did you start out with heavier SW's?

 

I note that clubs of some year's past were heavier SWs, and I found this about a driver Ben Hogan gamed:

One club where the swingweight definitely was not similar is the driver, which checked in at a swingweight of G-2 -- reported to be the heaviest ever measured at the USGA test center.

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/ben-hogan-secret-clubfitting

 

Channelling Ben?

 

[cardoustie]

4 hours ago, Rapidcat said:

I've seen you post a few times about your heavier SW's and always interested - how did you end up determining this works for you? Really heavy head weight or do you also play heavier shafts? I guess longer shafts enable a heavier SW more easily.

 

Yeah, I know, trial and error etc but what led you down this path - did you start out with heavier SW's?

 

I note that clubs of some year's past were heavier SWs, and I found this about a driver Ben Hogan gamed:

One club where the swingweight definitely was not similar is the driver, which checked in at a swingweight of G-2 -- reported to be the heaviest ever measured at the USGA test center.

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/ben-hogan-secret-clubfitting

 

Channelling Ben?

 

 

I used to love D6 back in the day when my clubs were all plus 1/4 or plus 1/2

 

Then a few things happened.  Back surgery x 3 in 2007 … and I experimented with lead tape

 

So I needed longer irons overall to make it easier on my back and I found out a few things the pro’s did .. heavier and flatter in shorter irons

 

Had Quite a few “Cardy MOI” sets built where the 6i was D6 and blended a point per iron to the wedge being E0 … that’s a good system if you keep all your longer clubs at D5

 

Then a handful of years ago I started a short irons / taller golfers thread and Tom Wishon told me to lengthen my wedges …. And there you go.  Once you have your wedges running E3 you want a heavier feel in the rest of the set

 

[Rapidcat]

3 minutes ago, cardoustie said:

 

I used to love D6 back in the day when my clubs were all plus 1/4 or plus 1/2

 

Then a few things happened.  Back surgery x 3 in 2007 … and I experimented with lead tape

 

So I needed longer irons overall to make it easier on my back and I found out a few things the pro’s did .. heavier and flatter in shorter irons

 

Had Quite a few “Cardy MOI” sets built where the 6i was D6 and blended a point per iron to the wedge being E0 … that’s a good system if you keep all your longer clubs at D5

 

Then a handful of years ago I started a short irons / taller golfers thread and Tom Wishon told me to lengthen my wedges …. And there you go.  Once you have your wedges running E3 you want a heavier feel in the rest of the set

 

Thanks and can see this makes so much sense.

 

So I'm guessing you are 6ft+? plus your back issues.

 

I'm 5.10 and am experimenting with shorter shaft/heavy head drivers (although I've also played 46" drivers with some success) @ 44" and D5+ SW, I have a JDM Srixon Z725 head with 2 x weight ports (+ lead tape) that is proving fun to test. 

 

I noticed your Tassie reference...broadening that to Oz mainland, Brad Hughes is a big proponent of heavier headed clubs.

[kmay__]

I think mine is, its a stock length shaft and I've got 3 decent length strips of tape on the head. So whatever that works out to be haha. 

[cardoustie]

2 minutes ago, Rapidcat said:

Thanks and can see this makes so much sense.

 

So I'm guessing you are 6ft+? plus your back issues.

 

I'm 5.10 and am experimenting with shorter shaft/heavy head drivers (although I've also played 46" drivers with some success) @ 44" and D5+ SW, I have a JDM Srixon Z725 head with 2 x weight ports (+ lead tape) that is proving fun to test. 

 

I noticed your Tassie reference...broadening that to Oz mainland, Brad Hughes is a big proponent of heavier headed clubs.

 

Yes I am 6’2” with a shorter torso relative to my arms.  My wingspan is a touch longer than my height .. which should allow me to play shorter … but it doesn’t 

 

Funny you mention BH, he has given me a tip direct on twitter, seems like a great guy, and quite a player back in the day

 

Another side heavy story … back in 2008 I had a TM Burner TP driver.  it was “short” and very HEAVY.  John Daly like strips of lead tape on the toe.  Candy red 95 gram speeder tour spec in X.  44.75”.  I could swing 108.4 with it and carry it 278 at Ping headquarters on trackman, they couldn’t beat it with any combo.  Learned that swing the heaviest club you can if you keep the speed up

 

That year I played in our national Am and provincial Am, both national and provincial mid am’s and a nationwide event.

 

FUNNY ENOUGH I bought this driver last week down here in Myrtle Beach for $39, with a proto shaft in it.  I will be trying a bunch of my high end modern pulls in it.  Starting AD DI 6x in orange

[Rapidcat]

4 minutes ago, cardoustie said:

 

Yes I am 6’2” with a shorter torso relative to my arms.  My wingspan is a touch longer than my height .. which should allow me to play shorter … but it doesn’t 

 

Funny you mention BH, he has given me a tip direct on twitter, seems like a great guy, and quite a player back in the day

 

Another side heavy story … back in 2008 I had a TM Burner TP driver.  it was “short” and very HEAVY.  John Daly like strips of lead tape on the toe.  Candy red 95 gram speeder tour spec in X.  44.75”.  I could swing 108.4 with it and carry it 278 at Ping headquarters on trackman, they couldn’t beat it with any combo.  Learned that swing the heaviest club you can if you keep the speed up

 

That year I played in our national Am and provincial Am, both national and provincial mid am’s and a nationwide event.

 

FUNNY ENOUGH I bought this driver last week down here in Myrtle Beach for $39, with a proto shaft in it.  I will be trying a bunch of my high end modern pulls in it.  Starting AD DI 6x in orange

Great stuff👍

 

BH was a member of one of my clubs in Melbourne, he played #1 D1 (no surprise) for I think 2 seasons before turning pro. I finished playing pennant the season before he joined ( I am I think 7 or so years older than him).

 

Love his approach to the golf swing and equipment, he appears a big fan of heavier SW clubs.

[denkea]

I'm playing a Ping G410 10.5º driver with a Mitsubishi Tensie CK Orange 60grams "R" Flex.

 

Length is 46".  Swingweight was in the mid D range originally.  For Giggles I added another weight to the rear. (Now have two in the back channel).

 

Brought the SW into the Lower E range.  Absolutely love it.  

 

I've found that with a higher swing weight, irons also, that I can feel the club at the top of my backswing and am able to set my wrists prior to the down swing.  

 

I had very light SW irons at one time with no feel in the backswing that promoted an outside in path on the downswing.  Heavier Swing weight seems to have corrected that.  

[Scrubby]

I have a heavier head weight for my TS2 that takes it from D3.5 to D7.5. Definitely feel the driver head better throughout the swing and my tempo seems better at D7.5, but do you all experience a loss of swing speed and carry distance with the heavier swing weight?

[golfiteach]

Been playing Jumbomax Tour Medium grips on all my clubs for 1/2 a year.  Love the feel in the hands, but the counterbalanced weight causes loss of clubhead feel.  I decided to mess around and bought a couple 18 gram weights for my G410 plus 9*.  First took out the stock 12gram and placed both 18 in the "fade" and "draw" position.  Instantly loved the feel and added about 8 yards carry.  Threw the 12 gram back into the center with the 18s and this thing absolutely mashes.  Went from 224 carry to 240s.  Estimated swing weight using online calculator came to f9.  I can't believe this setup is going to stay in one piece, but it sure feels good for now.  

 

Had to buy lead tape for all my other clubs which feel WAY too light as a result.  

[Billfitz]

You might want to try JumboMax Ultralite. They didn't affect my club head feel at all.

[Doaner84]

it's not only the driver.  when I shaft up some clubs i take them with me and a roll of lead tape and add and subtract to each iron until it feels right.  the first time i did it the irons ended up being d4-d5 and d8 for wedges.  I had previously been playing clubs around d1-d2.  eye opener for me. 

[bladehunter]

On 11/25/2021 at 11:24 AM, MagicMan79 said:

Had a bit of an ah-ha moment in the simulator yesterday while tinkering with driver swingweight.

So I play MOI matched irons that are all +1.00” - 1.5” in length. 1/4” increments from Gw all the way up to 4i. Short iron heads are lightened and long iron have added weight. Wedges are E-1 and scales down to D-7 in the longer irons. They are all long and heavy but the MoI matching and building at 1/4” increments has been one of the best things I’ve ever done , équipement wise. Never hit my irons this straight and hit as many greens. I hit 17/18 greens once this year and that was my best by far

 

My driver SS is 120-122 , and been doing some shaft tinkering since the weather has gotten cold. I like the feel of my driver at D-3, but have been struggling with a high toe miss that I just can’t shake on occassion.

I’ve added weight to drivers while in my garage and measuring swingweight. And anything at D-4 and heavier feels like a battle axe

 

So in the sim yesterday, same thing with driver - good ball, high toe, high toe, good ball..

This is a Sim2 8* with Diamana TB 60 tx, at just under 46” long. Driver in upright/square setting on adapter

 

I started moving and swapping weights, and was not influenced by my swingweight scale. Started pounding it after I added almost 7g to the head, which is quite a bit. Carrying 315-320 pretty consistently 

 

Get home and of course had to put it on the scale. It’s like D-6.2 , an absolute 🔨 

 

Never thought I’d hit it so well with such a head heavy setup, but it is what it is! Maybe it helps load the shaft that tiny bit more where my timing just matched up? Or the SW just matches my irons now so I can just swing it with the same tempo 

 

Was just curious if anyone else was swinging or had success with driver @ D-6+ ?

Ok.  Wth. I’m working on the same combo ( mine is 9 degree and 70 TB TX ) but very close.    Same speed.  And my irons are just as you describe.  I started with PW at plus 3/4 inch an move up 1/4 each so the long irons aren’t too long. My gap-lob wedge are same length and lie as my pw.  Pw is my favorite club.  Maybe LW too !  Lol.  

 

anyway.  I’m waiting for some glue to dry and had the idea of doing the exact same. Adding 7-8 g to the head and retesting.  I previously had a heavy titleist setup like this that worked great.   And I too have the high toe miss. Exclusively.     I’m also working on a 44 inch setup that I like but still. High toe miss.  I can’t seem to get smash or contact centered up.