Why are S400 iron sets so dang hard to find?

[RoyalMustang]

I have had a few chances to hit S400 irons (8 and 9 iron) on a set of Cally MB21 blades.  The feel and weighting is sublime. When I am swinging smooth, the ball just seems to explode off the club. I hit 3 9-irons on the course last night and they were 3 of the nicest swings I have had in weeks, blades be damned.  Consistent 150 carry, tons of spin, lots of height. I play a 75X white driver and I know that the S400 is a touch soft, but that might be OK in my irons as it prompts me to be smooth. 

 

I was hoping to score a set of used clubs with S400 shafts to try for an extended period, but I can't seem to find any. Neither here or on eBay. Everything seems to be DG120 S400, which isn't really what I am looking for. 

 

Am I just looking in the wrong place? There are a zillion X100 shaft sets out there. 

[mgoblue83]

Most of the time that profile is setup with S300. S400 is the same exact shaft just weight sorted to be 1-2g heavier which is most likely not noticeable. 

 

You will probably find many sets available with S300. 

[golfinbrad]

The S400 shaft is heavy which is why you see more gaming in wedges than irons.  The trend is going lighter.  I think you are looking in the right places and will get a set in time.  Did you place an ad on the Want To Buy section?  Worth a shot.

[RoyalMustang]

5 minutes ago, mgoblue83 said:

Most of the time that profile is setup with S300. S400 is the same exact shaft just weight sorted to be 1-2g heavier which is most likely not noticeable. 

 

You will probably find many sets available with S300. 

 

good point, although the S400 is already on the light side of FCM at 6.1. I am hesitant to play the S300 at 5.8; that's a pretty soft shaft for a  7-iron carrying 173 with traditional lofts, and softer than my normal shafts. I suppose the S300 hard stepped once would get me there, but I am unlikely to find a set that way. 

 

It just seems that S400 is the goldilocks load and feel while being reasonably stable for an above-average swing speed.

[Flip4000]

I see an auction for a used set on ebay right now 3-PW shafts only though

As others have said, I don't think too many people are going with the s400s in iron sets over the s300 when the weight difference is minimal

 

I'd suggest buying a set of shafts and putting them into some heads as it might be easier 

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by Flip4000

[RogerinNewZealand]

Buy your own set of S400 shafts to install.

[mgoblue83]

1 minute ago, RoyalMustang said:

 

good point, although the S400 is already on the light side of FCM at 6.1. I am hesitant to play the S300 at 5.8; that's a pretty soft shaft for a  7-iron carrying 173 with traditional lofts, and softer than my normal shafts. I suppose the S300 hard stepped once would get me there, but I am unlikely to find a set that way. 

 

It just seems that S400 is the goldilocks load and feel while being reasonably stable for an above-average swing speed.

 

I don't think you would even notice a single difference. 

 

It's the same shaft. When making 130g S300 manufacturing tolerances are roughly +/- 2 grams. They weight sort them and label the 128g shafts as S200 or Wedge shafts, the 130g shafts as S300, and the 132g shafts as S400. It's still the exact same shaft just 1-2g heavier. 

 

[AdamMH]

As others have pointed out, the difference between the two is potentially hard to notice for most players. Have you considered that you might just like the Callaway blades?

[RoyalMustang]

12 minutes ago, AdamMH said:

As others have pointed out, the difference between the two is potentially hard to notice for most players. Have you considered that you might just like the Callaway blades?

 

Could be! I always figured mortals weren't "good enough" to play blades. But the shaft does feel great. 

[wam78]

If it’s s400 you are set on playing, then I say wait until you find what you want.  Although it might be minute differences, it will always be a thought when playing.

 

As mentioned above, put an ad up in WTB.  Also, send an email to CPO folks.  They are always good at responding.  They typically have more inventory that’s not posted yet.

 

GL!

[Cwebb]

1 hour ago, RoyalMustang said:

 

good point, although the S400 is already on the light side of FCM at 6.1. I am hesitant to play the S300 at 5.8; that's a pretty soft shaft for a  7-iron carrying 173 with traditional lofts, and softer than my normal shafts. I suppose the S300 hard stepped once would get me there, but I am unlikely to find a set that way. 

 

It just seems that S400 is the goldilocks load and feel while being reasonably stable for an above-average swing speed.

 

You might be assuming a more noticeable difference between S300 vs S400 than is really there.  It's so small that most would never notice it in a blind test or see any performance variance

[AllDunn]

I think I saw a set of Like New APEX TCBS with S400 on Callaway Pre Owned... Worth a shot.

[Whatnogarnish]

Couple used sets of shafts here. they are on eBay, but I don’t like giving eBay money anymore so I buy direct. 
 

https://www.mikesgolfoutlet.com/shafts-components/shaft-sets/#?Category0=Shafts+%26+Components&Category1=Shaft+Sets&search_return=all&Brand=True+Temper

[RoyalMustang]

1 hour ago, AllDunn said:

I think I saw a set of Like New APEX TCBS with S400 on Callaway Pre Owned... Worth a shot.

 

I looked: the only set I saw now is "average". Darn!

[PEI_Golfer]

If it has the Ti S400 shaft banding, just know that is a plus 2 skill up upon use, so it's worth it for that alone...  I'm a fan of S400s, always will be and feel that they are just that much more than S300s, which used to be dime a dozen out there.

[RolandofGilead]

5 hours ago, RoyalMustang said:

I suppose the S300 hard stepped once would get me there, but I am unlikely to find a set that way.

I have played S400s and think a hard stepped S300 or twice-soft stepped X100 is pretty much the same. You need to take up club building! Makes it very easy to test these things on your own.

[NNJ]

1 hour ago, RolandofGilead said:

I have played S400s and think a hard stepped S300 or twice-soft stepped X100 is pretty much the same. You need to take up club building! Makes it very easy to test these things on your own.

I play something that somehow worked out to what what I was told was a 1.5 soft-stepped x100 and a s400 in my wedges. The s400 still feels a bit less stiff. I have to say for me, having the heavier iron shafts has lowered my swing speed a little, but the feeling of the extra weight must make me think more about the location of the club face because it tends to result in more pure strikes than a lighter shaft did for me

Edited January 26, 2023 by NNJ

[Jc0]

7 hours ago, RoyalMustang said:

I have had a few chances to hit S400 irons (8 and 9 iron) on a set of Cally MB21 blades.  The feel and weighting is sublime. When I am swinging smooth, the ball just seems to explode off the club. I hit 3 9-irons on the course last night and they were 3 of the nicest swings I have had in weeks, blades be damned.  Consistent 150 carry, tons of spin, lots of height. I play a 75X white driver and I know that the S400 is a touch soft, but that might be OK in my irons as it prompts me to be smooth. 

 

I was hoping to score a set of used clubs with S400 shafts to try for an extended period, but I can't seem to find any. Neither here or on eBay. Everything seems to be DG120 S400, which isn't really what I am looking for. 

 

Am I just looking in the wrong place? There are a zillion X100 shaft sets out there. 

 

What did you search on ebay? I'm seeing plenty of S400 iron sets for sale. 

[BagofToast]

Just thought about this, my teammate just got a set of P7MCs with S400s and he was coming from KBS 130s. Thought I didn’t see S400 in irons much. More of a wedge shaft in my experience, felt nice in the irons though. 

[Nessism]

The difference between S300 and S400 is minor to the point that almost nobody would notice in a blind test.  Don't get wrapped around the axle.  Buy a set with DG stiff, and play golf!

Edited January 27, 2023 by Nessism

[WristySwing]

If you haven't already, try adding "Tour Issue" to your search.  Once TrueSports went all-in on the TI labelling the standard S400 with the little gold wrap around sticker became harder and harder to find.  You could also piece it together.  Here is a set of brand new S400 (non-TI) 3-PW: https://www.ebay.ca/itm/204064973909?hash=item2f83386455:g:dlsAAOSwW4hi8rPf&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAoE591vEvmK2fp88ijDcDFT6ciVURe2LktnfqvZ7BPR5vmS4CO9lclnEnH0mOtfoYCvOgMVgQ2OZsRbyxFRciG0RD7%2FIjoR3AwSJ8orOB8N00xCH%2FjoVTxrHZzSwiyKC2KDnU7UWP83LOCZCUtoyPeelGt7c3V7CVw1cfQkUf7LQaIgE0ehqVK7v7pLv6sdCJZFWpyt%2BcXgkyCiDNZHY53Ow%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR76r-rG-YQ

 

Then pick your poison on which shafted set already looks good to you and sell the shafts.  You should be able to recoup most, if not all of the shaft purchase if you find a set with something halfway sexy like C-Taper, Project X, Nippon and so forth. https://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=apex+mb21&_sacat=0&LH_PrefLoc=2&rt=nc&Flex=Stiff&_dcat=115280

 

The other option is just buying direct from Callaway.  Since it is part of their Apex line, almost all shafts are included with no upcharge.  Sure it is going to cost you more, but you get a mint set with your shaft + grip of choice + a warranty on them as well, which used doesn't afford you.

 

 

[handyquacks17]

I play tmade p7mc / 770 set with ti s400.Love the feel and weighting. for me, nothing else compares. good luck in your search. worst case scenario custom order from an OEM like tmade. Easy to get the shaft you are looking for

[Denny100]

On 1/26/2023 at 4:59 PM, RoyalMustang said:

 

good point, although the S400 is already on the light side of FCM at 6.1. I am hesitant to play the S300 at 5.8; that's a pretty soft shaft for a  7-iron carrying 173 with traditional lofts, and softer than my normal shafts. I suppose the S300 hard stepped once would get me there, but I am unlikely to find a set that way. 

 

It just seems that S400 is the goldilocks load and feel while being reasonably stable for an above-average swing speed.

 

Thats two paragraphs of forum twaddle.

 

The FCM is measuring the frequency at the butt of the shaft not the tip, so FCM is pretty pointless, and the two shafts are basically identical, except S400s weigh a couple of grams more.

 

You dont see many sets with S400 iron shafts because they dont fit many people. Hardly anyone wants a 132g iron shaft.

 

But if you want to believe 0.3 FCM makes a world of difference to your 173 yard traditional lofted 7 iron go right ahead, and avoid those S300 noodles.

[Pepperturbo]

On 1/26/2023 at 8:28 AM, RoyalMustang said:

I have had a few chances to hit S400 irons (8 and 9 iron) on a set of Cally MB21 blades.  The feel and weighting is sublime. When I am swinging smooth, the ball just seems to explode off the club. I hit 3 9-irons on the course last night and they were 3 of the nicest swings I have had in weeks, blades be damned.  Consistent 150 carry, tons of spin, lots of height. I play a 75X white driver and I know that the S400 is a touch soft, but that might be OK in my irons as it prompts me to be smooth. 

 

I was hoping to score a set of used clubs with S400 shafts to try for an extended period, but I can't seem to find any. Neither here or on eBay. Everything seems to be DG120 S400, which isn't really what I am looking for. 

 

Am I just looking in the wrong place? There are a zillion X100 shaft sets out there. 

Simple answer, S400 is like S200, neither has ever been popular like S300 (stiff).  There isn't much difference between S400 and S300.  Long time back before I went to X100, I played S400; it fit my fast tempo nicely.  DG X-100 is 130g vs S400 is 132 or 134g.  

 

IMO you can't find them today, is people are going to lighter weight shafts since technology has improved.

[dokex]

To sum up what many posters have already said, you can't tell the difference between S300 and S400.