51 in a four man scramble - Do the math

[smashdn]

Course had four par threes, four fives, and the balance (10) as fours, par 72 total.

 

Let's say they birdied all the par threes - 8 shots

Let's say they eagled all the fives - 12 shots

Leaves us 31 shots left to get to 51. (51-(8+12)=36)

 

Does that sound doable on 68.4/121?

[IcemanYVR]

Your math doesn't make sense. 4 birdies and 4 eagles is -12, which on a Par 72 course is 60. That leaves 9 shots over the remaining 10 holes.

 

Technically it's possible. It's just your math that isn't.

[bazinky]

In a word, yes.

 

With that rating, I would also anticipate several of the par 4s to be driveable, especially with how I've known scrambles to be set up.

 

Not saying it doesn't take some great play and a LOT of good luck, but I have seen it done.

[3sip]

How many mulligans did they buy? What other scramble gimmicks were there? It's possible, hell anything's possible. Is it a true honest score, with out knowing the players I doubt it.

[Air Jordan]

I came to the realization that anything is possible after I was on a team that shot a 43 in a scramble where we each had 15 feet of string and 5 mulligans. Nothing surprises me anymore.

[eddiebigeddie]

If there are driveable par 4's, 4-mulligans each, 4-skirts...yes its possible. but like everyone has said, it takes some good solid play all day long. I've been fortunate to take a team of 4 guys (2 low single caps & 2 low double caps) and shoot anywhere from -17 to -21...but having said that, its very tough & everyone has to be on point. It also helps if 2 of them can drive it over 300 routinely.

[crich88848]

Your math doesn't make sense. 4 birdies and 4 eagles is -12, which on a Par 72 course is 60. That leaves 9 shots over the remaining 10 holes.

 

Technically it's possible. It's just your math that isn't.

 

His math is good. He is just counting total strokes and not score relative to par. He is saying if they did get 4 birdies on the par 3s and 4 eagles on the par 5s that is 20 strokes total ([2*4] + [3*4] = 20). That leaves another 31 strokes to get to 51 on the par 4s. His math is correct. You are both saying the same thing, just going about it differently.

[crich88848]

If they birdied all the par 3's, birdied all the par 4's and eagled all the par 5s they would have a score of 50. It is doable but not very probable.

[golfandfishing]

-21. Hard but definitely doable. We shot 52 once and easily left a few out there. I was a +1 at the time and our D player. Former tour player now on Champs tour was our B. Nationwide player our A and a club pro was our C. We should have shot about 48 but got a wee drunk after turning in 24. Par 71 just for the record.

 

On the course you describe, if all 4 players can bring it, yeah 51 is doable.

[596]

I'd bet they were the last group to turn in a card?

[Exactice808]

44 with a 4 man scramble ( I should say 3 man and 1 women)

 

She was a legit, 36 handicapper, Course had a huge women's tee advantage.

 

2 putt max, We did everything in our power to coach her to get the ball on the green as fast as possible.

 

She basically had 2 strokes per hole..... she skulled, shanked, duffed, thinned, dumped every shot you could imagine on the green. Basically making par or better with 2 putt max, She sank 2 putts for net double eagle and net hole in one on a par 3 and par 5...... Yeah was pretty ridiculous. We didnt cheat in the slightest, just took advantage of the course and the handicap.

[smashdn]

I wasn't in the scramble, just got the report on it today. Clarified with the guy telling me about it and there were no skirts or mulligans to be bought, no strings whatever that is.

 

I am not sure what kind of talent was out there for it. I seriously doubt it was former tour players given the locale.

[knockdstiff]

It's doable.

 

-18 gets you to 54. That's birdie on every hole - with 3-4 good players not unreasonable. Especially if there aren't any long tricky par 3s. Then you just need 2 eagles - and I'm betting a course with that 68 rating has both short par 5s and some driveable par 4s.

 

It's definitely doable.

[Bonneville85308]

Played in a scramble recently behind a group of low single digit cappers who had a -17 off of 68.9/125 tees, they had also bought a 4-pack of mulligans. I can see -21 as doable if some mulligans are involved, tees are up, and all players are solid. All of the tees on the par 5's were up, they were on all of them in 2 and eagled 3 out of 4.

[LeoLeo99]

Doable. My team shot two 54s on different par 72 courses last month. Tied for first in one scramble and came in 3rd in the other. We left a few shots out there so no complaints from us if someone shot 51. And we're not + players.

[driveandputtmachine]

I am always a bit skeptical when playing a scramble and there are a bunch of people I don't know, especially when it is the last card turned in or something similar.

 

I am a +.8 and drive the ball a long way and pretty straight, I have a buddy who hits it somewhat short but normally straight and putts like a machine that is a 6. Add in another great putter that is scratch and a 4 who is a great iron player. We have a round of 49 and a couple of 51's this year, most scramble events are set to where we hit a good drive and normally eagle 3 or 4 of the par 5's and then a couple of par 4's. We also have tap in's for birdies a bunch of times on par 4's we drove close to.

 

We have also played a scramble at 7000 yards and CR of 73.2 and only shot 13 under, long par 3's are a killer in a scramble. The par 3's that day were 187, 205, 220, and 165.

 

==

 

The worst I ever saw was a shamble......Everyone hits a tee ball and then everyone plays from the best tee ball into the hole. Two Net and two gross scores are kept for each hole. The course was playing 6800 and they shot 136(8 under for their best ball gross). Their net score was 100 even. How can four players shoot 8 under best ball and get 36 strokes off of that for a net score of 100. OK, you have one really good player and he can drive near every hole, then sure, guys who get that many strokes off could chip up and make some birdies/eagles. The pro at the private course where the event was held even laughed at the score, because no one is getting bad players close enough to make pars or birdies on that many holes on a course that is 6800 yards.

[munihack]

44 with a 4 man scramble ( I should say 3 man and 1 women)

 

She was a legit, 36 handicapper, Course had a huge women's tee advantage.

 

2 putt max, We did everything in our power to coach her to get the ball on the green as fast as possible.

 

She basically had 2 strokes per hole..... she skulled, shanked, duffed, thinned, dumped every shot you could imagine on the green. Basically making par or better with 2 putt max, She sank 2 putts for net double eagle and net hole in one on a par 3 and par 5...... Yeah was pretty ridiculous. We didnt cheat in the slightest, just took advantage of the course and the handicap.

 

this doesn't seem to be a scramble

[Man_O_War]

Tiger 2000, Rory, Hogan and Jack, no problem

[Exactice808]

44 with a 4 man scramble ( I should say 3 man and 1 women)

 

She was a legit, 36 handicapper, Course had a huge women's tee advantage.

 

2 putt max, We did everything in our power to coach her to get the ball on the green as fast as possible.

 

She basically had 2 strokes per hole..... she skulled, shanked, duffed, thinned, dumped every shot you could imagine on the green. Basically making par or better with 2 putt max, She sank 2 putts for net double eagle and net hole in one on a par 3 and par 5...... Yeah was pretty ridiculous. We didnt cheat in the slightest, just took advantage of the course and the handicap.

 

this doesn't seem to be a scramble

 

???? In what way? We all hit a tee shot, pick the best ball. Everyone drops to the best position and hits in till on the green, She has 2 strokes per hole in comparison to everyone else, If we dont take here drive even with the distance advantage, she is still about 100-150 yards out on most par 4s, If she skulls it on the green chunks it on the green duffs it on the green, she is still in better position than any of the 3 guys, If any 3 guys get it on the green, At worst we will make Par with 0 stokes, If she somehow gets it on the green, at worst she makes par, and then take 2 strokes and thats eagle. So most times she gets on the green in 3, and takes net birdie.

 

The 2 short par5 (passive brag, I got us there 135 yards from the green off the drive, super short dog leg, all luck short cut.....) 15ft from the flag and the guys had eagle with 2 putts, But since she had 2 strokes, this is were she had the double eagle for her putt As she was putting from the same place we were......

 

 

Not sure how you guys play Scramble, but its best ball all the way to the green and 2 putt max?

 

 

 

 

 

Anyways, the 2 equitable strategies that I have seen for winners with a scramble tournament has always been Handicap handicap handicap.

 

Example

 

Team A - 3 low handicap players ( 0-10) and 1 Max Handicap player( 36+) - 3 guys gets the Max Handicap player to the green as fast as possible.... generally speaking 2 on is automatic par with 2 putt max, 3 on is automatic bogey with 2 put max, you are still 2 strokes net...with max handicap.... Eagle, Birdie and PAR at worse....but on of the other 3 should have par covered....

 

Team B - 2 Low handicaps players and 2 Women, 1 Max handicap and 1 low handicap (anything below 15) The low women, usually can take HUGE advantage of the red tees for tee off, leaving super short approach shots......and again as above, gross par or bogey, net eagle or birdie.......

[TMBob]

Here is the math...both apply

 

Multiply everyones entry fee, divide by 4 ='s their winnings? Or Multiply everyone's entry fee, divide by 4 = Everyone got Pencil Whipped!

 

What was their prize?

 

 

[larrybud]

???? In what way? We all hit a tee shot, pick the best ball. Everyone drops to the best position and hits in till on the green, She has 2 strokes per hole in comparison to everyone else,

 

I don't get it. What does it mean that she has "2 strokes per hole in comparison to everyone else"?

 

A scramble doesn't change just because you're on the green. You take the best shot of the 4, repeat, all the way until you're in the hole. Nobody gets individual strokes for a net score. That's not a scramble.

[Exactice808]

???? In what way? We all hit a tee shot, pick the best ball. Everyone drops to the best position and hits in till on the green, She has 2 strokes per hole in comparison to everyone else,

 

I don't get it. What does it mean that she has "2 strokes per hole in comparison to everyone else"?

 

A scramble doesn't change just because you're on the green. You take the best shot of the 4, repeat, all the way until you're in the hole. Nobody gets individual strokes for a net score. That's not a scramble.

 

AWWWW CRAP!!!!!! My bads....... sorry....... I really need to get some sleep,

 

My apologies, I just realized I was confusing another format,

 

 

Sorry that format that we played was "Shamble" Not scamble....Crap!

 

 

Anyways...... Yeah that was a bit much..... In comparison to a "scramble" that takes the teams best score, Whoops!!! LOL!

[smashdn]

Outside of deciding A,B,C, D players I have never seen handicaps used in a scramble.

 

If you can bring your own team you can stack the deck.

 

In the case I am talking about I am pretty sure it was just a vendor hosting a scramble for their customers. Drag up a team and go play. I am not even real sure what the prizes were.

 

I was a bit miffed due to the score. Even in the bring your own team scrambles on an easier course according to slope and rating the lowest I can recall was a 55.

[EKELLY]

Why not, I can usually drive at least 2 par 4's, and hit 7 or 8 into most par 5's. And that's just me on my regular team.......All it takes is 2 guys hitting good iron shots, and 2 or more guys rolling it well......I've seen 4 12 handicappers shoot a legit -20......

[Jwin323]

Absolute pencil job.

[apprenti23]

I've been apart of multiple 51 scramble teams and even shot -19 in superintendent's revenge style setups where you lap the field. When you have four scratch or better players who all hit it three bills anything can happen.

[Southfield]

With a course rating of 68.4 I'd say highly doable. It's practically a par 68 course then and 51 is just -17.

 

Given that there are some long hitters in the group that can get the ball close or on the green on some short par 4s.

[garf0404]

I mean that's a good score on any course.. but very skeptical! I don't think that round was 100% accurate..

[EKELLY]

I am always a bit skeptical when playing a scramble and there are a bunch of people I don't know, especially when it is the last card turned in or something similar.

 

I am a +.8 and drive the ball a long way and pretty straight, I have a buddy who hits it somewhat short but normally straight and putts like a machine that is a 6. Add in another great putter that is scratch and a 4 who is a great iron player. We have a round of 49 and a couple of 51's this year, most scramble events are set to where we hit a good drive and normally eagle 3 or 4 of the par 5's and then a couple of par 4's. We also have tap in's for birdies a bunch of times on par 4's we drove close to.

 

We have also played a scramble at 7000 yards and CR of 73.2 and only shot 13 under, long par 3's are a killer in a scramble. The par 3's that day were 187, 205, 220, and 165.

 

==

 

The worst I ever saw was a shamble......Everyone hits a tee ball and then everyone plays from the best tee ball into the hole. Two Net and two gross scores are kept for each hole. The course was playing 6800 and they shot 136(8 under for their best ball gross). Their net score was 100 even. How can four players shoot 8 under best ball and get 36 strokes off of that for a net score of 100. OK, you have one really good player and he can drive near every hole, then sure, guys who get that many strokes off could chip up and make some birdies/eagles. The pro at the private course where the event was held even laughed at the score, because no one is getting bad players close enough to make pars or birdies on that many holes on a course that is 6800 yards.

It does take some luck. On a bet one day years ago, 8 of us broke up into 2 groups. I may have been the weakest link at a +4 at the time, and this is on 7000 yard courses, based TRULY on tournament scores. we both shot -21, from over 7000....Now this was 3 guys that eventually played on tour, and we all had mini-tour wins recently..............I don't care what anyone says, (4) 12-15's aren't shooting 18-20 under without an eraser........they don't have the game.....At least not with anyone watching!!....LOL

[baby-g]

I was on a scramble team a couple years ago one + me at a 10 and 2 guys that couldn't break 100 on a good day. We birdied every hole and just missed 3 eagles on par 5's. Short course so lots of 40 yard approaches into par 4's and one of the bad players ran in a long put on a par 3. 54 and lost in a score card playoff. #1 is a par 5 and we birdied it and the other 54 eagled it.