Crossfield on staff with Titleist (MERGED)

[Gary Gutful]

The only sheep I see are the ones blindly following their messiah Crossfield. Because to him everything is either black or white. Your either with him or a victim of the TM marketing machine.

 

Well, Golf consumers are smarter than that. Especially the people on this site

 

Until TM offers up any side of their story, people are blindly following them, or standing behind them because MC has butthurt them somehow. Like it or not, at least MC has given a side of the story and does bring up some very valid points about the way they want people to perceive things.

 

You don't have to view MC as a "messiah" to use your own brain to start asking some tough questions about a big company that has made some ridiculous claims about their products over the years. A guy like MC brings that to the forefront and he's called a whiner, a b****, a little girl.... The guy is literally putting info out there that if people pay attention to, can save them/us lots of money. TM is feeding you bowl after bowl of BS and somehow THEY are the victims... can't make this crap up.

 

But alas, you did make such crap up.

 

I can't see anywhere where Anth suggested that TM are 'victims'. His comment was about how MC is painting himself as a victim.

 

It is possible to disagree with MC's suggestion that he is a victim without thinking that TaylorMade themselves are victims.

 

I never said HE suggested they were. Sounds like you're making crap up. I know what his comment was about....LOL Thanks for the clarification though, bud thanks for stopping by.

OK then, who were you talking about?

 

I haven't really seen anyone suggest that TM are 'victims', mainly just that they have a right not to give MC their clubs.

 

Enlighten me.

[Maximilian]

TaylorMade didn't send me a new driver either. Look for my 45 minute rant on YouTube soon and be sure to give it a lot of likes. :rolleyes:

[argee1977]

I don't think TM come out well either to be fair, after seeing the teeuplo channel getting all the new stuff it sends a message that they're happy for some to get hold of it early, whilst others have always had difficulty, or been sent stuff late. I do see MC's point, but TM are a company, companies advertise as close to the line as they possibly can, it's life and he needs to move on with this one.

 

I tend to avoid talking TM though as i have stopped buying their stuff, not due to any of this malarky, but a warranty issue on faulty goods that just left me a bit annoyed. I also didn't do a youtube video on this experience though and will probably give up on this promise the minute a good deal is in sight!

[Your-away!]

The only sheep I see are the ones blindly following their messiah Crossfield. Because to him everything is either black or white. Your either with him or a victim of the TM marketing machine.

 

Well, Golf consumers are smarter than that. Especially the people on this site

Are they really? some are yes, a lot are really not!

[QEight]

By reading this thread you might think that MC is 24/7 live Youtubing TM rant.

[Gary Gutful]

By reading this thread you might think that MC is 24/7 live Youtubing TM rant.

Lots of people contributing who live in different parts of the world.

[gaffs]

I wonder if Titleist is disappointed with how Crossfield is handling himself. Seems he is alienating a number of viewers who Titieist paid him to be able to reach.

 

Agree. It doesn't reflect well on Titleist that they have signed up such a volatile baby. If Titleist drop him, will he go on a rant about them?

 

He doesn't let anyone get a word in edgeways and his jokes and style are really cringe worthy, so it is going to be awkward viewing when he is doing work with with the tour pro's.

[Holy Moses]

All Crosswood had to do is announce in a video that TM has decided to not send him clubs for review. It would have clarified TM's position and allowed him to move forward as a Titleist rep. It was his choice to make a 20+ minute whiny video about TM and take cheap shots at their marketing, management and equipment. If I was Titleist I'd be sending over a revised contract to protect them from his immaturity and lack of professionalism when their deal ends.

 

I’m too wondering if Titleist thinks Crossfield is getting too whiny. Could make them look bad. Apart from the KSig ball, Titleist doesn’t usually publicly go after OEMs in a marketing war.

 

The way Crossfield has handled himself is the very thing that TaylorMade was afraid of. Crossfield has already hurt his following the last few days. Just get over it already. Whether or not TaylorMade was unfair to him or not didn’t force Mark to act this way.

 

I’m just curious Moses, do you have someone inside TM that told you exactly what it was that TM was afraid of with MC? And is his following hurt?

 

There’s so much misinformation floating around it doesn’t do justice to either side, people seem to just be saying things as if they’re true. Seems Crossfields subs are actually up from a few days ago last time I checked, so I’m just wondering if this is speculation or you know something other than what the numbers are showing.

 

Informed speculation. What message boards are for.

[Nixhex524]

All Crosswood had to do is announce in a video that TM has decided to not send him clubs for review. It would have clarified TM's position and allowed him to move forward as a Titleist rep. It was his choice to make a 20+ minute whiny video about TM and take cheap shots at their marketing, management and equipment. If I was Titleist I'd be sending over a revised contract to protect them from his immaturity and lack of professionalism when their deal ends.

 

Im too wondering if Titleist thinks Crossfield is getting too whiny. Could make them look bad. Apart from the KSig ball, Titleist doesnt usually publicly go after OEMs in a marketing war.

 

The way Crossfield has handled himself is the very thing that TaylorMade was afraid of. Crossfield has already hurt his following the last few days. Just get over it already. Whether or not TaylorMade was unfair to him or not didnt force Mark to act this way.

 

Im just curious Moses, do you have someone inside TM that told you exactly what it was that TM was afraid of with MC? And is his following hurt?

 

Theres so much misinformation floating around it doesnt do justice to either side, people seem to just be saying things as if theyre true. Seems Crossfields subs are actually up from a few days ago last time I checked, so Im just wondering if this is speculation or you know something other than what the numbers are showing.

 

Informed speculation. What message boards are for.

 

Message boards are for a lot of things... rarely about truth it seems, but who cares about details....

[ProphetLogic]

 

Agree. It doesn't reflect well on Titleist that they have signed up such a volatile baby. If Titleist drop him, will he go on a rant about them?

 

He doesn't let anyone get a word in edgeways and his jokes and style are really cringe worthy, so it is going to be awkward viewing when he is doing work with with the tour pro's.

 

He has done videos with tour pros before that weren't awkward. They were all pretty good. Andy Sullivan, Lee Westwood, Shane Lowry, Nicolas Colsaerts, I'm sure there are a few more I can't remember. He has done videos with Sullivan and Westwood more than once, so they couldn't have been too put off by him. More entertaining than any show on the golf channel.

[Your-away!]

Agree. It doesn't reflect well on Titleist that they have signed up such a volatile baby. If Titleist drop him, will he go on a rant about them?

 

He doesn't let anyone get a word in edgeways and his jokes and style are really cringe worthy, so it is going to be awkward viewing when he is doing work with with the tour pro's.

 

He has done videos with tour pros before that weren't awkward. They were all pretty good. Andy Sullivan, Lee Westwood, Shane Lowry, Nicolas Colsaerts, I'm sure there are a few more I can't remember. He has done videos with Sullivan and Westwood more than once, so they couldn't have been too put off by him. More entertaining than any show on the golf channel.

 

He did one with Luke Donald, but it was very forgettable, Luke Donald is one of the most boring people in the world!

[JonnyKrasnodar]

The video where he carries on about Taylormade is a bit long. At first I thought he is really whining - and he is. But then I think, why doesn't TM just send him some stuff? If they've every watched his videos he doesn't seem biased in one direction or the other during his reviews.

 

Then I remember, TM stopped sending him stuff before he was signed with Titleist. So what the heck man?

 

Then I think, well if you're going to base your career off of unbiased reviews of golf equipment - why would you sign with anyone? That doesn't make sense!

 

Then I think what I actually think. I like to watch equipment reviews and I think Mark does a good job. Taylormade is unscrupulous with their "new technology" ploys, relentless with their release cycle, annoying with their marketing and they still make really good clubs. Really good clubs.

 

For me, I'm going to stick with PING and Mizzy primarily because of many reasons.

 

I think TM is playing a dangerous game that they can't possibly win against the educated golf community. They are counting on us all being sheep.

 

Very good post. Unfortunately, as this thread shows, there are many more sheep than is healthy.

 

Can you clarify? Are you calling all TM players sheep?

 

Not for the first time you've completely missed the point. Or trolling it's hard to tell.

 

You must be very easily sold to.

Yes, i complteley miss the point, if you have one.

Which is why I asked you. I will try again.

 

Are you calling all TM players sheep?

 

Not all, but the vast majority of pro TM posts in this thread have perpetuated the flawed reasoning for not giving him their clubs etc blaming mark.

 

As the poster I quoted said, or implied, it's only a matter of time before their shocking treatment of pros (club pros, YouTube pros etc) catches up to them.

 

An educated person, as Mark said in his video, would not go to them for a fitting and accept what they said about low spinning balls. The thought their chief guy was doing the fitting and couldn't grasp such a basic concept is worrying. On that basis, if people are just accepting what their told, not asking questions, then they're feeding the machine. So those people are sheep. At no point did I say or imply all but nice try.

[new2g0lf]

All Crosswood had to do is announce in a video that TM has decided to not send him clubs for review. It would have clarified TM's position and allowed him to move forward as a Titleist rep. It was his choice to make a 20+ minute whiny video about TM and take cheap shots at their marketing, management and equipment. If I was Titleist I'd be sending over a revised contract to protect them from his immaturity and lack of professionalism when their deal ends.

 

I’m too wondering if Titleist thinks Crossfield is getting too whiny. Could make them look bad. Apart from the KSig ball, Titleist doesn’t usually publicly go after OEMs in a marketing war.

 

The way Crossfield has handled himself is the very thing that TaylorMade was afraid of. Crossfield has already hurt his following the last few days. Just get over it already. Whether or not TaylorMade was unfair to him or not didn’t force Mark to act this way.

 

I’m just curious Moses, do you have someone inside TM that told you exactly what it was that TM was afraid of with MC? And is his following hurt?

 

There’s so much misinformation floating around it doesn’t do justice to either side, people seem to just be saying things as if they’re true. Seems Crossfields subs are actually up from a few days ago last time I checked, so I’m just wondering if this is speculation or you know something other than what the numbers are showing.

 

I've avoided the misinformation and strictly focused on MC's actions via his VLOGS. TM, like any manufacturer, has the right to choose who they send free equipment to for evaluation and review. MC knows this is how the business works and I'm sure he knows some people in the industry that have requested equipment to review and not received it.

 

Crossfield pretends to not understand that free evaluation equipment is limited and manufacturers will send that equipment to whoever they believe will provide them the best reviews. I remember Golf Digest claiming they were refused demo equipment from a manufacturer for their equipment review edition. TM obviously felt MC signing with Titliest dropped him in terms of priority and notified him they would no longer send him equipment. His 20 minute rant against TM was to use them as an example to any other manufacturer of what they could expect if they dropped him from their reviewer list as well.

 

I don't care how honest a guy is, if he's getting a hefty paycheck from Titleist, he's biased. Maybe he will still say positive things about other equipment but there's no way the Titleist relationship doesn't influence his reviews going forward.

[JasonPetermann]

I've avoided the misinformation and strictly focused on MC's actions via his VLOGS. TM, like any manufacturer, has the right to choose

I don't care how honest a guy is, if he's getting a hefty paycheck from Titleist, he's biased. Maybe he will still say positive things about other equipment but there's no way the Titleist relationship doesn't influence his reviews going forward.

 

Isn’t this also misinformation? How do you know he is biased? How do you know his reviews will be influenced? Have you seen reviews that prove this? Have you spoken to Mark and seen evidence of the bias? No proof of that as of yet. In fact, the 1st review (Callaway UT) actually showed us the opposite. Maybe he will be biased, but we do not know.

[jimb6golf]

It's amazing how much has been made of Crossfield signing with Titliest. Not only did TM blackball him but a lot of the other youtubers are now talking about this issue specifically or have changed their review styles as a result. Pretty amazing. Crossfield review clubs, and gives on line lessons, with a different slant (purposely) than all others in order to generate viewers. His off beat personality is fun to watch but his reviews are pretty generic and usually end up with something along the lines of 'all clubs are the same, it's up to each person to get fit, etc'. And although he said his channel wouldn't change he went out of his way to casually put his clubs in his new Titleist bag while talking to the camera in his latest video.

[QEight]

By reading this thread you might think that MC is 24/7 live Youtubing TM rant.

Lots of people contributing who live in different parts of the world.

 

True, but the globe has already revolved and this "discussion" is still stuck at ground zero.

[Gary Gutful]

By reading this thread you might think that MC is 24/7 live Youtubing TM rant.

Lots of people contributing who live in different parts of the world.

 

True, but the globe has already revolved and this "discussion" is still stuck at ground zero.

 

Hmmm, poignant....

[bcflyguy1]

he went out of his way to casually put his clubs in his new Titleist bag while talking to the camera in his latest video.

 

That's some USDA Choice trolling right there...

[Double Gee]

The more I think about this thread the more it makes me laugh.

 

Mark Crossfield is just a pro on YouTube having a bit of fun, making some people laugh doing some reviews. Some of his golf vlogs can be fantastic so what does it matter about TaylorMade and Titleist. These guys are not gods, are not politicians that run our lives.Yes, it's all fun I really think we all need a reality check.

[Shawn Paul]

The video where he carries on about Taylormade is a bit long. At first I thought he is really whining - and he is. But then I think, why doesn't TM just send him some stuff? If they've every watched his videos he doesn't seem biased in one direction or the other during his reviews.

 

Then I remember, TM stopped sending him stuff before he was signed with Titleist. So what the heck man?

 

Then I think, well if you're going to base your career off of unbiased reviews of golf equipment - why would you sign with anyone? That doesn't make sense!

 

Then I think what I actually think. I like to watch equipment reviews and I think Mark does a good job. Taylormade is unscrupulous with their "new technology" ploys, relentless with their release cycle, annoying with their marketing and they still make really good clubs. Really good clubs.

 

For me, I'm going to stick with PING and Mizzy primarily because of many reasons.

 

I think TM is playing a dangerous game that they can't possibly win against the educated golf community. They are counting on us all being sheep.

 

Very good post. Unfortunately, as this thread shows, there are many more sheep than is healthy.

 

Can you clarify? Are you calling all TM players sheep?

 

Ha, certainly not calling any TM players sheep. I think, TM is counting on the less informed consumer with their products. "It's better because its new!" We get the same things with car mfgrs, tv's, phones, what have you. After a while you realize things don't change year to year, only every 5-10 years. I really like TM clubs and I think they perform great. Personally I'm a big fan of PING & Mizzuno because they have a 2 year release cycle (well maybe 18 months) and they approach their customers with a little more respect - in my eyes.

 

I think by TM saying they want less people to review their gear, they reinforce the idea that less information about their product is better. But, I also think that it was a poor choice for Mark to sign a deal with any Mfgr when his bread and butter is reviewing gear. Hope that helps.

[Hawkeye77]

I wonder if Titleist is disappointed with how Crossfield is handling himself. Seems he is alienating a number of viewers who Titieist paid him to be able to reach.

 

Agree. It doesn't reflect well on Titleist that they have signed up such a volatile baby. If Titleist drop him, will he go on a rant about them?

 

He doesn't let anyone get a word in edgeways and his jokes and style are really cringe worthy, so it is going to be awkward viewing when he is doing work with with the tour pro's.

 

Me and My Golf took their model to more website based and away from as much YouTube, so apart from Shiels, Crossfield is the biggest thing out there for YouTube reviews and presence. Titleist knows what it is doing, remains to be seen if it will work, but Titleist isn't coming out the poorer on this one at this point and Crossfield was understandable - plus, nobody knows or is going to find out just how favorable the terms were or were not for Crossfield. Titleist may be getting quite the return (on balance) vs. its investment - they certainly didn't need Mark as much as he, in theory, would have needed them.

[carn9698]

I think I threw up a little bit on the latest me and my golf vid with Rory when Rory claimed the twist face making his misses straighter. Mark and others railing against marketing I love. Bill Hicks style,

[Londoner]

The video where he carries on about Taylormade is a bit long. At first I thought he is really whining - and he is. But then I think, why doesn't TM just send him some stuff? If they've every watched his videos he doesn't seem biased in one direction or the other during his reviews.

 

Then I remember, TM stopped sending him stuff before he was signed with Titleist. So what the heck man?

 

Then I think, well if you're going to base your career off of unbiased reviews of golf equipment - why would you sign with anyone? That doesn't make sense!

 

Then I think what I actually think. I like to watch equipment reviews and I think Mark does a good job. Taylormade is unscrupulous with their "new technology" ploys, relentless with their release cycle, annoying with their marketing and they still make really good clubs. Really good clubs.

 

For me, I'm going to stick with PING and Mizzy primarily because of many reasons.

 

I think TM is playing a dangerous game that they can't possibly win against the educated golf community. They are counting on us all being sheep.

 

Very good post. Unfortunately, as this thread shows, there are many more sheep than is healthy.

 

Can you clarify? Are you calling all TM players sheep?

 

Ha, certainly not calling any TM players sheep. I think, TM is counting on the less informed consumer with their products. "It's better because its new!" We get the same things with car mfgrs, tv's, phones, what have you. After a while you realize things don't change year to year, only every 5-10 years. I really like TM clubs and I think they perform great. Personally I'm a big fan of PING & Mizzuno because they have a 2 year release cycle (well maybe 18 months) and they approach their customers with a little more respect - in my eyes.

 

I think by TM saying they want less people to review their gear, they reinforce the idea that less information about their product is better. But, I also think that it was a poor choice for Mark to sign a deal with any Mfgr when his bread and butter is reviewing gear. Hope that helps.

I agree with all off this re TM and other OEM like Callaway with their product cycle. I bought an m2 but my previous driver was an R7 quad.

I dont see the MC saga as proof of TM not wanting people to test. The TM vs MC thing has been running 18 months at least. Long ago he hacked TM off by making very juvenile disparaging remarks about TM. So much so they omitted him from a product launch which 13 months ago triggered his first TM video meltdown. You can review products and marketing and give it a negative review. Doing it the way he did with TM is just so unprofessional and childish it was insulting. If he continues Titleist will distance themselves from him and other OEMs will think long and hard.

[kevingopher]

I don't think TM come out well either to be fair, after seeing the teeuplo channel getting all the new stuff it sends a message that they're happy for some to get hold of it early, whilst others have always had difficulty, or been sent stuff late. I do see MC's point, but TM are a company, companies advertise as close to the line as they possibly can, it's life and he needs to move on with this one.

 

I tend to avoid talking TM though as i have stopped buying their stuff, not due to any of this malarky, but a warranty issue on faulty goods that just left me a bit annoyed. I also didn't do a youtube video on this experience though and will probably give up on this promise the minute a good deal is in sight!

 

Teeuplo is on the books for Taylormade. Gets free balls etc.

[Nixhex524]

 

I agree with all off this re TM and other OEM like Callaway with their product cycle. I bought an m2 but my previous driver was an R7 quad.

I dont see the MC saga as proof of TM not wanting people to test. The TM vs MC thing has been running 18 months at least. Long ago he hacked TM off by making very juvenile disparaging remarks about TM. So much so they omitted him from a product launch which 13 months ago triggered his first TM video meltdown. You can review products and marketing and give it a negative review. Doing it the way he did with TM is just so unprofessional and childish it was insulting. If he continues Titleist will distance themselves from him and other OEMs will think long and hard.

 

This is where the importance in all this lies.... Whether he went about it the right way or not, when someone tries to silence you because you say something they don't like, it's a slippery slope and where does it end? A company like TM has to be the bigger person in all this and they're just not. This is not taking away from anyone's opinion of how Mark handles things since people seem to be awfully sensitive about that point as well, I haven't always agreed with the way he goes about things either but he's ONE dude... on YouTube!!! TM can't handle that any other way other than black balling him from their gear? Yet, I don't see anyone saying this is childish, whether it's their right or whatever, doesn't make it the right way to go about things.... Just as TM is gaining supporters here, they are losing them as well, same with Mark.

 

And these "facts" being thrown around that Titleist is upset and they'll pull away, it's laughable and based on NO facts. I would even go as far as to say that other OEM are just fine... NONE of them are being made out to look bad, in fact they were presented as companies who are willing to have discussion and work with someone like Mark, so he's not going to have anything negative to say about their business model because in his mind, they get it. Why would any of them pull away from someone who gives them good, free press WHILE UNDER CONTRACT with another OEM? MC is opportunity for them, why throw it away when he has the following he has.... would be foolish.

[North Butte]

My goodness but this is amazing. You guys are talking about "MC" and "TM" as though they are real people having a tiff over who's taking whom to the prom. "TM" is in this case the marketing department of a huge multinational conglomerate. And "MC" is a construct, the YouTube persona devised and portrayed by some teaching pro in the hinterlands of England in order to supplement his income and provide free trips to sunny places to play golf.

 

We've blown right past the Age Of Reality TV and straight into the great beyond. It's Ludicrous Speed, everything has gone Plaid.

[Golfrnut]

I agree with all off this re TM and other OEM like Callaway with their product cycle. I bought an m2 but my previous driver was an R7 quad.

I dont see the MC saga as proof of TM not wanting people to test. The TM vs MC thing has been running 18 months at least. Long ago he hacked TM off by making very juvenile disparaging remarks about TM. So much so they omitted him from a product launch which 13 months ago triggered his first TM video meltdown. You can review products and marketing and give it a negative review. Doing it the way he did with TM is just so unprofessional and childish it was insulting. If he continues Titleist will distance themselves from him and other OEMs will think long and hard.

 

This is where the importance in all this lies.... Whether he went about it the right way or not, when someone tries to silence you because you say something they don't like, it's a slippery slope and where does it end? A company like TM has to be the bigger person in all this and they're just not. This is not taking away from anyone's opinion of how Mark handles things since people seem to be awfully sensitive about that point as well, I haven't always agreed with the way he goes about things either but he's ONE dude... on YouTube!!! TM can't handle that any other way other than black balling him from their gear? Yet, I don't see anyone saying this is childish, whether it's their right or whatever, doesn't make it the right way to go about things.... Just as TM is gaining supporters here, they are losing them as well, same with Mark.

 

And these "facts" being thrown around that Titleist is upset and they'll pull away, it's laughable and based on NO facts. I would even go as far as to say that other OEM are just fine... NONE of them are being made out to look bad, in fact they were presented as companies who are willing to have discussion and work with someone like Mark, so he's not going to have anything negative to say about their business model because in his mind, they get it. Why would any of them pull away from someone who gives them good, free press WHILE UNDER CONTRACT with another OEM? MC is opportunity for them, why throw it away when he has the following he has.... would be foolish.

 

 

You must be either joking or not understanding what's going here at all. Silencing him? Where is that happening? You see a C & D order? Have they threatened him in anyway? As for the blackballing comment...how is that so? They aren't sending him stuff for free, nowhere in that letter did they say he could not purchase, borrow, steal or otherwise acquire gear to test their stuff. That's it. You are trying to make this into something way more than it is...just like he is.

[Londoner]

I agree with all off this re TM and other OEM like Callaway with their product cycle. I bought an m2 but my previous driver was an R7 quad.

I dont see the MC saga as proof of TM not wanting people to test. The TM vs MC thing has been running 18 months at least. Long ago he hacked TM off by making very juvenile disparaging remarks about TM. So much so they omitted him from a product launch which 13 months ago triggered his first TM video meltdown. You can review products and marketing and give it a negative review. Doing it the way he did with TM is just so unprofessional and childish it was insulting. If he continues Titleist will distance themselves from him and other OEMs will think long and hard.

 

This is where the importance in all this lies.... Whether he went about it the right way or not, when someone tries to silence you because you say something they don't like, it's a slippery slope and where does it end? A company like TM has to be the bigger person in all this and they're just not. This is not taking away from anyone's opinion of how Mark handles things since people seem to be awfully sensitive about that point as well, I haven't always agreed with the way he goes about things either but he's ONE dude... on YouTube!!! TM can't handle that any other way other than black balling him from their gear? Yet, I don't see anyone saying this is childish, whether it's their right or whatever, doesn't make it the right way to go about things.... Just as TM is gaining supporters here, they are losing them as well, same with Mark.

 

And these "facts" being thrown around that Titleist is upset and they'll pull away, it's laughable and based on NO facts. I would even go as far as to say that other OEM are just fine... NONE of them are being made out to look bad, in fact they were presented as companies who are willing to have discussion and work with someone like Mark, so he's not going to have anything negative to say about their business model because in his mind, they get it. Why would any of them pull away from someone who gives them good, free press WHILE UNDER CONTRACT with another OEM? MC is opportunity for them, why throw it away when he has the following he has.... would be foolish.

If anybody has said Titelist are reviewing the situation then i must have missed it. I wouldnt be surprised if they were though.

Just one more thing to consider. What effect does the Titelist deal with MC have on people? I for one would be less likely to purchase Titelist BECAUSE of their support for such a devisive, unprofessional partner.

[sheldonjhacker]

[North Butte]

 

People just love to pick sides and root for "somebody" against "somebody else". I read a thing one time that said they could dress up two goats in Gator and Seminole jerseys and sell 80,000 tickets to watch them butt heads.