Course Setup To Combat Today's Bomb-And-Gouge Game

[EmperorPenguin]

When I started playing the game, the name of the game is fairways and greens.  This is no longer the case, as guys are just bombing it off the tee and gouging balls out of the rough with wedges.  How can we stop the insanity?  I have some ideas that can help.

 

1. For the first 270 yards the fairway will be generous: 35-40 yards wide with standard 1.75" collars and rough at 2.5" tall.

1. From 270-300 yards the fairway narrows to about 30-35 yards, with two-yard collars at 1.75" tall; graduated rough with first cut ten-yards wide and rough 3.5" tall; primary rough at 5" to 6" tall.

2. From 300-330 yards narrow the fairways to about 26 yards wide with two-yard collars at 1.75" tall; no first cut but primary rough at 5" to 6" tall.

3. From 330-400 yards the fairways are still 26 yards wide with two-yard collars at 1.75" tall; go straight to uniform, primary rough after that at 7" to 10" tall.

 

The long-hitters will always have the option to use the driver, but there will be huge risks as the ball travels farther from the tee.

 

How would you set up the course?

[tannyhoban]

The sky is falling! Take 5,973

[Hawkeye77]

Where's Charles Barkley when you need him?  Turrible ideas, worse than turrible.

[cardoustie]

So make it wider for shorter hitters ?

[chipa]

I read this started a long time ago in the 60's with Jack actually. I believe he was considerably longer than most in the field comparatively speaking, plus he had a steep swing with the short irons that helped in the rough. Maybe only Weiskopf hit it farther consistently. What a great swing he had too. I think I remember him hitting a 5 iron 195 when everyone was hitting their 3 the same distance.

Edited September 20, 2020 by chipa

[Hawkeye77]

10 minutes ago, cardoustie said:

So make it wider for shorter hitters ?

 

Yep, they are known for being wild! ?

[FakeClubPro]

Oddly - Two of the longest hitters are in first and second.   Matt Wolff is pretty mature for such a young guy.  I am surprised how well mad bomber Bryson is doing.  Some people hav e said his short game is weak but he seems to be playing well. 

[cardoustie]

MW swing with irons great for out of rough

[FakeClubPro]

24 minutes ago, cardoustie said:

MW swing with irons great for out of rough

 

It is insane.   The rough for him is not a big deal.  He just muscles it out like it is nothing.  Wow.  Where does he get his power and strength?  

 

[jdl]

I'd probably set it up like Winged Foot and hope for some wind. I mean, there's 3 guys under par after 54 holes.

[Kilo1545]

750yd Par 4's with 12 inch rough in the fairways, and a piss test on every hole.  Test for steroids and protein shakes.

 

 

Or...

 

List the hole as a 446yd Par 4, but secretly move the green to only 254yds, causing the bombers to hit their tee shots OVER the green.  If there's anything we've learned from Winged Foot, it's that you have to be under the hole.

Edited September 20, 2020 by Kilo1545

[Titleist99]

4 hours ago, EmperorPenguin said:

When I started playing the game, the name of the game is fairways and greens.  This is no longer the case, as guys are just bombing it off the tee and gouging balls out of the rough with wedges.  How can we stop the insanity?  I have some ideas that can help.

 

1. For the first 270 yards the fairway will be generous: 35-40 yards wide with standard 1.75" collars and rough at 2.5" tall.

1. From 270-300 yards the fairway narrows to about 30-35 yards, with two-yard collars at 1.75" tall; graduated rough with first cut ten-yards wide and rough 3.5" tall; primary rough at 5" to 6" tall.

2. From 300-330 yards narrow the fairways to about 26 yards wide with two-yard collars at 1.75" tall; no first cut but primary rough at 5" to 6" tall.

3. From 330-400 yards the fairways are still 26 yards wide with two-yard collars at 1.75" tall; go straight to uniform, primary rough after that at 7" to 10" tall.

 

The long-hitters will always have the option to use the driver, but there will be huge risks as the ball travels farther from the tee.

 

How would you set up the course?

Hmmmm!....Let me see, we have a major tournament going on right now and after three rounds there is only three of the worlds best Touring Pros under par.....I think that I'd set up all courses like Wing Foot Golf Course. We still have another round to go,I may change my mind, i don't know.

Edited September 20, 2020 by Titleist99

[OrangeGravy]

3 hours ago, FakeClubPro said:

 

It is insane.   The rough for him is not a big deal.  He just muscles it out like it is nothing.  Wow.  Where does he get his power and strength?  

 

It's all a**/thighs. He's got a thick trunk

[RSinSG]

I don’t understand the dislike of bomb and gouge. I like watching those guys and I wish I could do it.

[Joe Smoeter]

I've been saying for years the rough should be graduated from green to tee not from side to side. 10 inches at 320, 8 inches at 300, 5 inches at 280 etc... whatever the formula. This is no different than having fairway bunkers at certain distances, it makes the players decide on the risk/reward. As it is now a 3 wood off the tee that gets a bad bounce is in the same thick rough as BD bomb 350 off the tee 40 yards left! Makes no sense.

[James the Hogan Fan]

I redesigned the 11th at Winged Foot. I hope you find the changes more appropriately punishing...

[Fischputza]

Just look at European courses or the Ryder Cup setup in Europe....Wolff or BDC would watch the weekend on TV

[pinhigh27]

9 hours ago, FakeClubPro said:

 

It is insane.   The rough for him is not a big deal.  He just muscles it out like it is nothing.  Wow.  Where does he get his power and strength?  

 

It’s not about muscle it’s about AoA 

[caniac6]

I’d ban working out, and bring back Sans A Belt slacks.

[Christen_The_Sloop]

I have a better idea. No spotters, just officials operating stop watches. You hit the ball. You find it. If you can find it in the allotted time. Tough luck. Put a drop area in the rough 220 yards away on par 4s, 270 on par 5s and add two strokes to the card. If you are going to launch the ball into orbit, you should be the one that finds it.

[bigred90gt]

Here’s a novel idea:

 

there’s only a handful of guys that have the strength and speed to get out of the rough, combined with the skill to do it with any kind of consistency. How about we leave we’ll enough alone and let those that possess those 3 attributes take advantage of them. 
 

reed put on a clinic Friday, but look what happened when he missed the fairways yesterday. He’s not exactly a short hitter by your standards, but still doesn’t have the speed to get out of that rough. Contrast it to Matthew Wolf who is a fairway missing machine, but he does have the speed and his results show it. That is his advantage. Why would anyone want to take that advantage away? 

[bladehunter]

Op I’m with you. But I’m afraid it’s gone.  That game is gone. It’s gone at the am level too.  
 

the only way it could be squashed is a complete equipment rewind to around 1950.    From putter to driver.  And it’s not going to happen.  We just have to live with it or quit playing. 
 

Symptom I’ve noticed.   Iron sets slowly dying.  Even at the pro level.  Guys are realizing  that most approaches are two types.  Under 125  yards or over 180 so they carry 4 speciality wedges and now are figuring out that carrying an iron over a 5 ( a real iron not a hollow etc iron ) isn’t needed.   You’re seeing a lot of iron sets now 5-9 only.  This is a symptom of bomb and hack.  
 

anyway.  It’s gone. There won’t be another tiger winning without a driver , and hitting 6 irons in on every par 4. 

[bladehunter]

2 hours ago, pinhigh27 said:

It’s not about muscle it’s about AoA 

Thank you.  It’s the gouge part.  Shallow normal golf swings don’t get to the back of the  ball. It’s not pure strength.  Wolff isn’t a body builder. He’s fast. But guy isn’t beating Paul Casey in an arm wrestling match.  

[Hawkeye77]

3 hours ago, Fischputza said:

Just look at European courses or the Ryder Cup setup in Europe....Wolff or BDC would watch the weekend on TV

 

LOL, I can't believe this was posted twice!

 

Never knew I could take that European vacation in Mexico.

[tannyhoban]

2 hours ago, caniac6 said:

I’d ban working out, and bring back Sans A Belt slacks.

Amana hats too

[tannyhoban]

13 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

Op I’m with you. But I’m afraid it’s gone.  That game is gone. It’s gone at the am level too.  
 

the only way it could be squashed is a complete equipment rewind to around 1950.    From putter to driver.  And it’s not going to happen.  We just have to live with it or quit playing. 
 

Symptom I’ve noticed.   Iron sets slowly dying.  Even at the pro level.  Guys are realizing  that most approaches are two types.  Under 125  yards or over 180 so they carry 4 speciality wedges and now are figuring out that carrying an iron over a 5 ( a real iron not a hollow etc iron ) isn’t needed.   You’re seeing a lot of iron sets now 5-9 only.  This is a symptom of bomb and hack.  
 

anyway.  It’s gone. There won’t be another tiger winning without a driver , and hitting 6 irons in on every par 4. 

Oh c'mon now. There are lots of ways to score, that hasn't changed a bit. Long hitters who can make some putts have been around since golf started.

[munichop]

valderama type courses minimize bomb and gouge, narrow like Hilton head, low hanging branches and 20 mph cross winds.

But bomb and gougers will still try to smash the ball and wedge it, they just miss the cut.

wolfe admitted he got good lies all day. Reed did too until he didn’t  so I can see BD and MW both in the mid 70’s today. If not one gets the trophy and the usga continues to study distance without doing anything.

[Hawkeye77]

10 minutes ago, tannyhoban said:

Amana hats too

 

Greatest tourney ever!

[bladehunter]

1 minute ago, tannyhoban said:

Oh c'mon now. There are lots of ways to score, that hasn't changed a bit. Long hitters who can make some putts have been around since golf started.

Sure.  One , two a generation.  Now the quotient for bombers who can putt is raised x390 and .... they use equipment that is so far superior than yesteryear that the courses cannot defend.  I don’t think that’s really debatable is it ?    All hitters.  Long and short used to play inside the old growth trees of courses.  They now play over the trees , even when playing down  the fairway in between them.    
 

clubs make a difference.   I’m sorry. But it’s all about scale.  Today’s driver and 3 woods move that scale , you can swing harder.  I know. I’m one of those hard swingers.  I know what it’s giving me.  But I also know what it’s taking from me.    I know a pga master pro who has taught all the way to the big time. His words are “small ball and big ball “.  Everybody plays big ball now.  There is no value in trying to hit every fairway and every green.  The value is practicing driver and 100 and in.  Period. 

[Kilo1545]

2 hours ago, Christen_The_Sloop said:

I have a better idea. No spotters, just officials operating stop watches. You hit the ball. You find it. If you can find it in the allotted time. Tough luck. Put a drop area in the rough 220 yards away on par 4s, 270 on par 5s and add two strokes to the card. If you are going to launch the ball into orbit, you should be the one that finds it.

I actually kind of like this idea.