Irons question: How far is too far?

[Alpha3]

160 is good for me. As I got older I have moved to progressively stronger lofts to maintain this.  Lofts and design have changed over the years. When my hcp was lowest I hit a 7 160 and liked building my set around that. Never needed more than that. Simple question simple answer.  It would be very hard to  gap a set around a 200yd 7 iron but I for sure wouldn’t care  what loft length or number was on somebody else’s iron!

[PhillipG78]

According to the interwebz PGA pros average 177 for their 7 iron so clearly that’s far enough to be a scratch or better golfer. If you can hit a driver consistently 265 you can birdie a par 5. 

[NZ315]

9 hours ago, eric61 said:

Right, this is exactly the point, and why I wouldn’t want this and wasn’t looking for personal advice. What’s the point at which you say, no, that’s too far? 185? 170?

My too far point with a stock shot would be 180carry. My ideal 7 iron is 175. Also why we wouldn’t need distance irons. At least not yet in life, maybe down the road.

Sorry wasn’t try to give you personal advice. I was just backing up my theory of how that would affect my gappings.

[phizzy30]

I don't believe in hitting irons too far as long as you're getting enough spin to hold greens. 

17 hours ago, Sean124 said:

185-190 yards is perfect for me with a 34* 7 iron. 

You and I are capable of carrying 200 with 7 iron, but at that point, I find dispersion can potentially become a problem.  I'm actually good with 185 to 190 carry as well with 7 iron. 

[nitram]

Why do we never have this question about a driver or fairway woods?

[wfrogge1]

I am a high ball hitter and carry my 7 iron 165. There is no way I would want my 7 iron to carry 180 because it would lead to a BIG problem from 8 iron down to gap wedge with height, wind, and ultimatly distance/accuracy. 

I chase distance so don't get me wrong. Just not going to buy distance by getting lofts that end up making my 6 iron down to PW have 15 yard gaps between the clubs.  

Edited March 19, 2023 by wfrogge1

[dgarland]

I get what you’re saying.  If you’re hitting a 7 iron 200 yards you’re going to run out of full swings fast. 

[PedronNiall]

In theory, too far is when as other mentioned I no longer get the descent angle + spin to stop the ball as I'd expect it to. That's going to vary by swing. Rory or Woodland can muscle a 7 200 and still get the ball to hold pretty well despite all the delofting they cause to occur because AoA and all those other fun things work together in the right ways for them.

 

I've never chased distance with my irons, but instead worked to improve my setup so that my club can be as efficient through the ball as possible without damaging my body over time. If a new set of irons let me continue to do that but somehow added distance while maintaining the flight characteristics needed to not end up ballooning I'd certainly be interested enough to take a look.

 

I don't think gapping on the low end would stress me too much. I'm fine making my PW work from 90% down to 50% without too much thought. Fine with 15 yard gaps throughout the bag and having a lot of options when it comes to which club to take at different yardages.

 

Longer irons would also mean the ability to maybe drop off my 3 iron and slot in a longer than the 4 fairway finder hybrid or some such or an additional wedge for shots that might be needed at a specific course. I think the biggest benefit would be that, more room in the bag for comfort or finesse clubs.

[Red4282]

Stop worrying about the number associated with the club. Wether it spins at 4000 or 8000 for a “7 iron” it doesnt matter. The “7” is just purlely an association, just as was cleek, spoon etc. What matters if it spins at 4000 or 8000 for that given LOFT. 
 

Sure it be nice if everyone would just get on the same page and associate their clubs the same, but thats not happening. 

[PedronNiall]

Relevant to the topic: Fleetwood just went 6-iron at a 226 pin with a helping wind. Came up a little short right because he came out of it, but call it a 215 club, which puts his 7 iron right around 200 as well. He's playing the P7TW, which are certainly performance focused--not distance focused--clubs capable of the distance being discussed while maintaining flight & spin characteristics that will hold greens on tour.

[njmack]

5 hours ago, nitram said:

Why do we never have this question about a driver or fairway woods?

 

Because that would require some imagination and ego death lol

 

I think yours is a more interesting question! If I could hit a GI 7 iron 200, a 4 iron 250, and be comfortable with my wedges from 150 and in.... what's the point of bagging a driver other than tradition? For me, with a 10* driver at 250-260 average, it's just risk at that point.

 

If someone wants to donate a set of Dynapowers, I'd love to be a guinea pig for this experiment lol

 

[realmfg]

I think on PMT podcast they asked Kopeka how far he hit his 7i.  He said how long.... or playing distance.  It was somewhere around 220 or 230 all out, but 190 tournament play.  Don't recall the exact quote.

Edited March 19, 2023 by realmfg

[mantan]

6 hours ago, nitram said:

Why do we never have this question about a driver or fairway woods?

 

I think it shows up in two ways, though somewhat different.

 

As 5-wood lofts have crept up a lot of players suddenly had less use for a 3-wood. They were essentially hitting their 5 wood close to the same distance...and a whole lot better off the deck.  25 years ago a 3-wood was 16*.  Now we have adjustable 5-woods at 17.5*.  (This also rendered the 4-wood irrelevant.

 

And you hear people posting that their 3-wood driver and driver distances are close off the tee.  A 15*  with a 43 inch shaft is going to hit as long for some people as their old driver...or too long to be an effective gapping option.  (I also think the 460* driver has become forgiving enough to make a 'fairway finder' more about a layup distance than hitting something more forgiving.

 

 

[mantan]

2 hours ago, Red4282 said:

Stop worrying about the number associated with the club. Wether it spins at 4000 or 8000 for a “7 iron” it doesnt matter. The “7” is just purlely an association, just as was cleek, spoon etc. What matters if it spins at 4000 or 8000 for that given LOFT. 
 

Sure it be nice if everyone would just get on the same page and associate their clubs the same, but thats not happening. 

 

It makes me think about what Ian on TXG said about 27* being the line of demarcation that most amateurs are comfortable hitting an iron.  And everything with a lower loft becomes increasingly difficult.

 

It seems like a lot of newer sets try to get the 7-iron within a degree or two of that mark.  You're spot on that it's really just making sure the spin is right for that loft.  My 923 HM fitting was giving me 6 iron numbers because that's what the loft was like...even though it said it was a '7-iron'.

 

 

 

 

[Red4282]

21 minutes ago, mantan said:

 

It makes me think about what Ian on TXG said about 27* being the line of demarcation that most amateurs are comfortable hitting an iron.  And everything with a lower loft becomes increasingly difficult.

 

It seems like a lot of newer sets try to get the 7-iron within a degree or two of that mark.  You're spot on that it's really just making sure the spin is right for that loft.  My 923 HM fitting was giving me 6 iron numbers because that's what the loft was like...even though it said it was a '7-iron'.

 

 

 

 

Its not just spin either, its launch angle, descent angle as well that should correlate to lofts. 
 

The one that gets me the most is some people including oems use launch angle as a metric for determining what to associate a club with. This is justifying in their minds a stronger loft because it launches higher based on a low cog design. I guess thats fine of we are honest about, but that usually isnt the case. Cog changes CAN Increase launch angle but its very minimal, certainly not enough to justify a 27 degree 7 iron and a 35 degree 7 iron. No way the 27 degree club launches just as high as the 35 degree club. Second, data has shown the these low cog irons arent in fact all that low in and some cases actually higher.

[NavyMU]

Love this question. Here's how I think. Start with a driver that I hit with best dispersion, goes about 285 consistently. I'm taking 20 yards off ideally for next 2 woods, so 265 3w, 245 5w. Now I have 10 clubs to gap backwards from 245...

 

230 4h/ 215 5i/ 200 6i/ 185 7i / 170 8i/ 160 9i/ 150 PW/ wedges 48, 54, 60

 

To your point, that's a 185 7i, so going up 15-20 yards really crowds my distance clubs. That being said, I can get to 185/7i with a player distance iron but not a MB/CB that I normally play. More like 170-175.

 

200 is too much on a 7 for my game.

 

[Cwebb]

23 hours ago, eric61 said:

Right, this is exactly the point, and why I wouldn’t want this and wasn’t looking for personal advice. What’s the point at which you say, no, that’s too far? 185? 170?

 

When you're not interested in carrying multiple gap wedges.  Take Davis Love and Tiger Woods for examples.  They played most of their careers with a 49* Pw along with a sand and lob wedge.  Their 5 irons were 29* and 7i at 37*.  Both were high speed, high launch players, so their iron lofts were based purely on the distance they wanted to hit those clubs. 

 

They were good long iron players and didn't want to remove any of those from their set...and had no interest in relearning iron distances based on different lofts.  When trying to be as precise as possible, it's an advantage to have full familiarity and trust in your distance control

Edited March 20, 2023 by Cwebb

[Roejye]

I would say over 180 would probably be too much, as others have said you're running out of full swings pretty quick. That being said I'm also very much a member of the number on the bottom of the club is just a reference for what club you're hitting for that distance.

[Jamande]

Anything over 195 to me is too much. Just no reason to swing that hard

[amace04]

Nothing is "too long" as long as you can keep decent gapping.

 

My irons are i210, 33° 7i, no not jacked by any means.  7i is my 190 club.  I manage to keep pretty good gapping but have been toying with a 5 wedge setup lately by removing a 3w.  

[lefty1978]

Slower swinger with traditional lofts. I hit my 35° 7 iron 152 carry, my 24° 4 iron 188, and my 47° pw 115. This set up works for me. Irons cover mostly under 200, woods/utility Irons for over 200 and specialty wedges sub 100. 

 

I never or will never be hitting a 7 iron 200, so that is a completely different world for me. 

[MattM97]

Depends on who is swinging and what they're swinging. You're not going to see a pure ball striker swinging a 7i in the 90s a T400 for example and someone with a hip replacement swinging in the 60s with a 620MB. 

 

There's clubs for everyone and if there's a club with 7i loft of 26° it doesn't mean it's for everyone same with the 7i at 35°. 

 

I don't think people can wrap their head around golf having options now for everyone. 

[Billy-Bo-Jim-Bob]

Theoretically, I think I'm confused about all these theoretical theories.

[realmfg]

Berkshire hit his 8i 302 yards for a video and he still is able to play some pretty good golf with 14 clubs.

[dandoholy]

Not a great player by any means but my 7i (T100) is roughly my 185 carry club.

 

What it mostly means for me is that I have to be really good with partial wedges.

[starrman77]

20 hours ago, PedronNiall said:

Relevant to the topic: Fleetwood just went 6-iron at a 226 pin with a helping wind. Came up a little short right because he came out of it, but call it a 215 club, which puts his 7 iron right around 200 as well. He's playing the P7TW, which are certainly performance focused--not distance focused--clubs capable of the distance being discussed while maintaining flight & spin characteristics that will hold greens on tour.

We are not Fleetwwod, nor do we have his abilities. If we did we would all be on tour.

[ChipStrokes]

i get around ok with a 200y 7i. 

 

estimated spin sucks, so don’t mind the rollout. i really need to buy a sleeve of rct balls. i usually see my 7i around 6700. titleist t100 at 34*. 

 

[tipperi]

The piece to this discussion that never gets discussed enough is how long of a golf course are you typically playing?

I play T100 bent a degree weak currently because playing from 62-6600 yards that set and gapping helps me cover every number i need to hit throughout 18 holes on a course that long given that I hit driver 260-275.

I've played GI irons because as someone who fluctuates from an 8.5-11, sometimes I feel like I need the help. Typically though what I gain in distance I don't like giving back in bigger gaps between clubs that HAVE to happen somewhere in the 14 carried.

If I were consistently playing the tips closer to 6800-7K my bag would look entirely different, if nothing else because a longer course requires bigger gaps throughout the bag.

[Billy-Bo-Jim-Bob]

20 minutes ago, ChipStrokes said:

i get around ok with a 200y 7i. 

 

estimated spin sucks, so don’t mind the rollout. i really need to buy a sleeve of rct balls. i usually see my 7i around 6700. titleist t100 at 34*. 

 

Beast like 7 iron! 152 feet,,,,yikes!

[JermWRX]

On 3/19/2023 at 1:07 AM, mantan said:

 

You're right about the HM/HMPs.  They essentially have less clubs at the lower end of the bag. If you went with the full set you have 4 clubs between 42.5* and 60*.  Compare that to a set that has 5 clubs in that space.  (42* 9, 46* PW, 50* gap, 54* sand, 58* lob)

 

You're asking somebody to be versatile in the short end of the bag to cover 15* gaps.  That's giving up a lot to be able to say you nuke your 7-iron.  

 

I had the hot metals for a short bit and hated the gapping on the short end.  My 923 PW (42.5*) was a 140-145 club.  My gap (48*) wedge was 120-125.  Anything inside of 150 is my 'go zone'.  I'd rather have 10-12 yard gaps there. Outside of par 3's, I'm not looking at 170-190 yard approach shots nearly as much as things at the lower end of the bag.

 

I have 923 HMPs that I'm gonna have to get rid of for this exact issue. The gapping in those clubs are awful. I could probably spend a ton of time getting everything bent, testing, re-bend, test, etc.... I don't want to do that. You shouldn't need to manipulate every club in a set and mess with the bounce and offset just to find playable gaps. Major flaw in these irons. It's a shame because I like the look and feel, but the clubs don't make any sense together.