Saw some new Callaway Woods last night (The Epic Thread)

Sean2 · November 2, 2016

I have an all Callaway bag, that said there is a plus to the premature release of that photo...it has generated a lot of buzz. In addition, perhaps a number of people planned on purchasing a driver/FW in the near future, but will now hold off until they can hit the new Callaway equipment.

QuickFeet · November 2, 2016

I have an all Callaway bag, that said there is a plus to the premature release of that photo...it has generated a lot of buzz. In addition, perhaps a number of people planned on purchasing a driver/FW in the near future, but will now hold off until they can hit the new Callaway equipment.

True but hopefully Callaway has all of their IP protection in place...........patents, copyright and trademark registrations completed. Otherwise Callaway could loose all rights since the product is now out in the public domain.

Also, with the pictures shown and the comments provided from this thread, a knock-off clone could be on eBay with 30 to 45 days. International law won't be much help to Callaway dealing with an Asian based manufacturer who's specialty is counterfeit products.

mgholda · November 2, 2016

Don't let Harry fool you. This hype is all by design. Callaway is a golf media company now which Harry has explained before.

If Callaway really wanted GBB Epic kept secret then why start showing it the first place and create the opportunity for leaked photos? Then to deny everything under the guise of protecting the brand when TM photos are leaked and a significant number of tour players are going with the M2? Not sure I buy all that even though I liked the style of Harry's post. I get wanting to manage the message, but this was a major battle being lost by Callaway in the five years war and they had to do something to capture the news/buzz back.

Ultimately, the fact that Callaway and TM are pushing each other will benefit the consumer and that is a good thing.

misplacedtexan83 · November 2, 2016

Callaway Reps (all oem reps) have to show products off to clients to get them interested in stocking for next year.

I was excited to see the leak photos like all of us. However, I immediately knew someone was getting fired.

Imp · November 2, 2016

I bet Harry has better pictures for us.

I bet he doesn't!

--kC

(Let's see if reverse psychology works on him.)

Imp · November 2, 2016

@callaway golf official

yes - the baseball is hard to see clearly. it is off white. red stitching. an autograph that is either blue or black ink....now let's look at the flip side of photography and pictures. when the average consumer drives by a McDonald's billboard and sees an Big Mac. wow does it look great. the meat, tomatoes, lettuce juicy as can be....and the cheese literally melting onto the bun - spilling over. it's a $3 hamburger on 13 pieces of bread with a cardboard patty that may or may not be beef.

the dude that lost his job did you a favor with his photography skills. it was real. it is the picture that you took of your coffee or of an idiot who parked his car in the grocery cart return bin that you bombed your squad with.

just think it wasn't as blurry as the picture he sent his girlfriend from the back room at unsaid golf retail store earlier in the day - that was taken at a certain angle for certain reasons that just so happened to be blurry kind of on purpose - and it sure as hell beats the picture on the USGA / R & A conforming list.

losing valuable secrets and confidential information sucks. it's dog eat dog. your organization was in financial chaos at one point of time - you understand - everything counts. truly sorry that it went down the way it did...but its not your first rodeo. this has happened before and will happen again until secrets are really guarded. if apple can keep it as tight as they do - I'm sure you'll find appropriate measures moving forward.

respectfully,

ryan

Why did you have to go and mention a big mac...... I'M hungry now.....

Best "disease" I've had - diverticulitis. I can no longer eat sesame seeds (among other things). Kept me away from McDonalds and BK and other fast food places. :lol:

--kC

mgholda · November 2, 2016

Callaway Reps (all oem reps) have to show products off to clients to get them interested in stocking for next year.

I was excited to see the leak photos like all of us. However, I immediately knew someone was getting fired.

Callaway probably gave the person a secret bonus and said good job. To keep everything secret you do not manage a product roll out in this manner. Instead you would 1) announce and show the new product at your sales meeting and train the sales reps, 2) very shortly thereafter you would have a media release where you supply all the approved product images, marketing materials, etc., and then 3) allow your sales reps to show the product to customers to book orders (this an oversimplification of the steps for illustrative purposes). This launch and other launches by OEMs are basically being handled where step 3 comes before step 2 to create maximum buzz and excitement all by design. There is nothing wrong with this approach and very appropriate for the social media world of marketing. However, to object to leaked photos when that was the objective from the start is laughable.

Ed Settle · November 2, 2016

Pure wrote this in the Rory M2 thread.....read the last line as it seems that he has already tested them.

"I 100% believe these guys are picking up ball speed with the M2 - both in the driver and the fairway. I also 100% believe they can see 5-6 mph ball speed increases on off center hits. I don't think that Nike drivers and fairways are as "hot as anything" on the market, especially at the consumer level. A good friend of mine is a Nike athlete and has been going through this equipment switch circus - at TPI the 917D2 and D3 beat his Flex 440 in ball speed by about 2 in average, the new Callaway Epic and M1/M2 beat that 917 driver by another 2-3 mph in ball speed."
JJ Spaun has tested them, not Tai.

Yeah. He had great things to say about everything at Callaway, the irons and this driver were his favorites. The last Callaway setup I had in the bag was the RFE and the XHP 3 wood, neither lasted very long and then got a bit turned off to the brand after that. After hearing about the new stuff from a credible source, I'm definitely interested in trying it out. Sounds promising, but also was mentioned to be in the arena of the M1/M2, which I already have, so I'm not sure what gains I can realistically expect to see.

Is the definition of "not long" one round? ?

Might have been a half bucket...?

misplacedtexan83 · November 2, 2016

Callaway Reps (all oem reps) have to show products off to clients to get them interested in stocking for next year.

I was excited to see the leak photos like all of us. However, I immediately knew someone was getting fired.
Callaway probably gave the person a secret bonus and said good job. To keep everything secret you do not manage a product roll out in this manner. Instead you would 1) announce and show the new product at your sales meeting and train the sales reps, 2) very shortly thereafter you would have a media release where you supply all the approved product images, marketing materials, etc., and then 3) allow your sales reps to show the product to customers to book orders (this an oversimplification of the steps for illustrative purposes). This launch and other launches by OEMs are basically being handled where step 3 comes before step 2 to create maximum buzz and excitement all by design. There is nothing wrong with this approach and very appropriate for the social media world of marketing. However, to object to leaked photos when that was the objective from the start is laughable.

A lot clients want to see the product and "test" some. Obviously, it is not just this one event since multiple reports of seeing this or that.

I agree with Harry, I doubt they want a blurry iPhone picture as their "buzz" starter.

BCULAW · November 2, 2016

Not going to take up space by quoting the entire post, but we got an iconic and contextually accurate Pulp Fiction quote, a Greg Maddox/ SAN Diego Padres reference to remind us all that the HOF pitcher did, in fact, pitch for the Pads late in his career, a subtle plug to remind us that EVEN BETTER photos of a club that has this site buzzing are on the way, and an Allen Iverson-esque cross-over on the Epic Callaway Giveaway that has us crying and cheering all in the matter of a few short paragraphs! Bravo, Harry! You are either incredibly creative or clinically insane!! Ha Ha!

Can't wait to hit the driver.

Ed Settle · November 2, 2016

Not going to take up space by quoting the entire post, but we got an iconic and contextually accurate Pulp Fiction quote, a Greg Maddox/ SAN Diego Padres reference to remind us all that the HOF pitcher did, in fact, pitch for the Pads late in his career, a subtle plug to remind us that EVEN BETTER photos of a club that has this site buzzing are on the way, and an Allen Iverson-esque cross-over on the Epic Callaway Giveaway that has us crying and cheering all in the matter of a few short paragraphs! Bravo, Harry! You are either incredibly creative or clinically insane!! Ha Ha!

Can't wait to hit the driver.

I think we can all agree… Harry knows how to create buzz. Fuzzy pictures or not. Well done.

gioguy21 · November 2, 2016

Harry was quite poetic in the way he spoke however -- I cannot imagine with the connections that WRX has at their disposal, that they would let a non-approved, bystander photo be posted on their homepage without a) callaway knowing, or b) getting a yes or no to be allowed to post considering it is pre-launch.

that being said, I can't wait to try the Epic SZ fairway and driver...since it was mentioned by St. Louis I've been thinking about it a lot since my 3w is on the block.

Oaks · November 2, 2016

Callaway Employee: :telephone: Hi Harry, the new GBB Epic pictures were posted to facebook yesterday and have broken the internet like Kim Kardashian - what do we do?

Harry A: We can deal with the perpetrators who leaked the images later :busted_cop: but now - I must quote Jules and Pulp Fiction over at GolfWrx.com

Harry's post last night is why they run probably the best marketing ship in the industry...

J13 · November 2, 2016

Don't let Harry fool you. This hype is all by design. Callaway is a golf media company now which Harry has explained before.

If Callaway really wanted GBB Epic kept secret then why start showing it the first place and create the opportunity for leaked photos? Then to deny everything under the guise of protecting the brand when TM photos are leaked and a significant number of tour players are going with the M2? Not sure I buy all that even though I liked the style of Harry's post. I get wanting to manage the message, but this was a major battle being lost by Callaway in the five years war and they had to do something to capture the news/buzz back.

Ultimately, the fact that Callaway and TM are pushing each other will benefit the consumer and that is a good thing.

I get the conspiracy theory because of the bubble we all live in on Golfwrx but this place is getting to be like X-Files. Everyone is assuming a Callaway person leaked it which isn't the case.

Farrow · November 2, 2016

Don't let Harry fool you. This hype is all by design. Callaway is a golf media company now which Harry has explained before.

If Callaway really wanted GBB Epic kept secret then why start showing it the first place and create the opportunity for leaked photos? Then to deny everything under the guise of protecting the brand when TM photos are leaked and a significant number of tour players are going with the M2? Not sure I buy all that even though I liked the style of Harry's post. I get wanting to manage the message, but this was a major battle being lost by Callaway in the five years war and they had to do something to capture the news/buzz back.

Ultimately, the fact that Callaway and TM are pushing each other will benefit the consumer and that is a good thing.

I get the conspiracy theory because of the bubble we all live in on Golfwrx but this place is getting to be like X-Files. Everyone is assuming a Callaway person leaked it which isn't the case.

I agree. And for us to think that some leaked photos on here are really moving the needle in the real world is a little arrogant in my opinion. While a lot of us are on this site morning, noon, and night, we really represent a pretty small population of the world golf community. If it was some orchestrated conspiracy why not air 10 seconds of the new commercial on Golf Channel and let it cut away like it wasn't supposed to have played. But an a low res iPhone pic on a golf blog? What's the upside, to create buzz in the bubble of 1% of golfers on the planet?

ocburg17 · November 2, 2016

I want to start by saying that I don't agree with the conspiracy theory of Callaway leaking the photos.

I now want to comment that I do believe the 1% (Golfwrx members) have the ability to move the needle when it comes to golf equipment. If the 1% is more educated, outspoken and passionate then the 99% will be persuaded to follow. I believe this to be true in any industry.

Although I don't consider myself highly golf educated on Golfwrx, I am to my buddies. Most golf purchases, they ask for my opinion. If a buddy of mine were to ask about new drivers today, I would certainly comment about the EPIC driver and waiting. He doesn't need to be on Golfwrx to be effected by these releases.

grm24 · November 2, 2016

I heard they are using the old Zevo (Sean Toulon company) face technology.... Or at least portions of it.

http://ktowngolf.own...st=4806,|DRIVER
makes you wonder why they bought Toulon now. Kind of like when Callaway bought Ghinty in the 90's over possible infringements with the Heavenwood, or TM and Adams regarding fairway wood slots. Hopefully Sean still can still make putters moving forward.

That's what I said right when I saw the tech. Interesting that they buy Toulons company, put him on payroll, then use his old Zevo tech from 20 years ago. Could be coincidence but what they are doing sure looks like Zevo to me.

20+ year old tech passed off as new. Next breakthrough by Callaway will be using the double faced tech that KZG (Gemini) and Nicklaus (Dualpoint/Airmax) used some years back in their drivers. Nicklaus Golf called it a multi-layer face. I mean the ball that changed the ball has already been changed 2-3-4 times so I'm sure this "new" tech "breakthough" will be changed as frequently as well.

bama11 · November 2, 2016

I cannot wait to see the actual official Callaway release approved pictures. I like the looks of the “conspiracy” photo that is posted, even though there isn’t much to see really. I trust Callaway with whatever they release, I never thought I would like the Fusion” because of the look, wrong, a wolf in sheep's clothing!! I’m purchasing the Epic and the Sub Zero just because I can as well as the Sub Zero 3 wood; I just wish they were being released sooner, and I cannot wait for the Pro Series irons”, it’s going to be a Epic year for Callaway Golf and me :taunt:

Warrick · November 2, 2016

Harry was quite poetic in the way he spoke however -- I cannot imagine with the connections that WRX has at their disposal, that they would let a non-approved, bystander photo be posted on their homepage without a) callaway knowing, or b) getting a yes or no to be allowed to post considering it is pre-launch.

that being said, I can't wait to try the Epic SZ fairway and driver...since it was mentioned by St. Louis I've been thinking about it a lot since my 3w is on the block.

Have you seriously not bagged an 816 Alpha 3 wood?

gioguy21 · November 2, 2016

Harry was quite poetic in the way he spoke however -- I cannot imagine with the connections that WRX has at their disposal, that they would let a non-approved, bystander photo be posted on their homepage without a) callaway knowing, or b) getting a yes or no to be allowed to post considering it is pre-launch.

that being said, I can't wait to try the Epic SZ fairway and driver...since it was mentioned by St. Louis I've been thinking about it a lot since my 3w is on the block.

Have you seriously not bagged an 816 Alpha 3 wood?

Lol i have not kind sir

Golfer from MO · November 2, 2016

@callaway golf official

yes - the baseball is hard to see clearly. it is off white. red stitching. an autograph that is either blue or black ink....now let's look at the flip side of photography and pictures. when the average consumer drives by a McDonald's billboard and sees an Big Mac. wow does it look great. the meat, tomatoes, lettuce juicy as can be....and the cheese literally melting onto the bun - spilling over. it's a $3 hamburger on 13 pieces of bread with a cardboard patty that may or may not be beef.

the dude that lost his job did you a favor with his photography skills. it was real. it is the picture that you took of your coffee or of an idiot who parked his car in the grocery cart return bin that you bombed your squad with.

just think it wasn't as blurry as the picture he sent his girlfriend from the back room at unsaid golf retail store earlier in the day - that was taken at a certain angle for certain reasons that just so happened to be blurry kind of on purpose - and it sure as hell beats the picture on the USGA / R & A conforming list.

losing valuable secrets and confidential information sucks. it's dog eat dog. your organization was in financial chaos at one point of time - you understand - everything counts. truly sorry that it went down the way it did...but its not your first rodeo. this has happened before and will happen again until secrets are really guarded. if apple can keep it as tight as they do - I'm sure you'll find appropriate measures moving forward.

respectfully,

ryan

Why did you have to go and mention a big mac...... I'M hungry now.....
Best "disease" I've had - diverticulitis. I can no longer eat sesame seeds (among other things). Kept me away from McDonalds and BK and other fast food places. :lol:

--kC

How many diseases have you had?!

Buying an Epic too period

Sef · November 2, 2016

This season I switched from Callaway 816DBD to an M2 halfway through, it was the first time in years my driver wasn't Callaway. I loved the 815 DBD, loved the Razr Fit Xtreme, and hope the Epic SZ can displace the M2. I also played an X2 Hot pro 3 wood for the last few seasons, finally replacing it with an M2 after denting the face on my 2nd X2 Hot.

I Hope the Epic SZ FW is great also as I would love to bag both next season. I enjoy my M2, but the sound, feel, and shape of Callaway woods are the very best in my opinion. If they are on par with everything else performance wise I will choose them every time based on those factors, this year they just did not do as well when I was fit. Looking forward to 2017 and I love the green.

jongalt55 · November 2, 2016

I want to start by saying that I don't agree with the conspiracy theory of Callaway leaking the photos.

I now want to comment that I do believe the 1% (Golfwrx members) have the ability to move the needle when it comes to golf equipment. If the 1% is more educated, outspoken and passionate then the 99% will be persuaded to follow. I believe this to be true in any industry.

Although I don't consider myself highly golf educated on Golfwrx, I am to my buddies. Most golf purchases, they ask for my opinion. If a buddy of mine were to ask about new drivers today, I would certainly comment about the EPIC driver and waiting. He doesn't need to be on Golfwrx to be effected by these releases.

^^This is spot on^^

I think the way the major manufacturers use golfwrx (and other forums) to interact with hard core equipment junkies is just good business. They know how golfers work ("Hey, sweet--you got the new [insert name of new club here]--mind if I hit it?"). They know if we're on here multiple times per day, we're also probably at our respective clubs talking about what latest and greatest product we're going to spend our sweeps on. They know that inside information is like crack to gear junkies and travels like wildfire. And they know that engaging communities like this one has a significant trickle-down effect on the avid golfing population (I feel like it is safe to assume that most members on here--whether they are primarily reading or posting a ton--have groups of golfers they regularly play with).

You want to see how committed Callaway in particular is to multi-channel marketing, just go look at the "News + Buzz" or "Videos" tabs on their website--then compare what you see there to what you see from other major manufacturers and tell me who you think is further ahead in that category at the moment. Callaway has managed to build a marketing platform that is both informative and entertaining. Their official post earlier in this thread is a perfect example of that. Other manufacturers might be well-advised to look closely at what Callaway is doing and follow suit...

Imp · November 2, 2016

@callaway golf official

yes - the baseball is hard to see clearly. it is off white. red stitching. an autograph that is either blue or black ink....now let's look at the flip side of photography and pictures. when the average consumer drives by a McDonald's billboard and sees an Big Mac. wow does it look great. the meat, tomatoes, lettuce juicy as can be....and the cheese literally melting onto the bun - spilling over. it's a $3 hamburger on 13 pieces of bread with a cardboard patty that may or may not be beef.

the dude that lost his job did you a favor with his photography skills. it was real. it is the picture that you took of your coffee or of an idiot who parked his car in the grocery cart return bin that you bombed your squad with.

just think it wasn't as blurry as the picture he sent his girlfriend from the back room at unsaid golf retail store earlier in the day - that was taken at a certain angle for certain reasons that just so happened to be blurry kind of on purpose - and it sure as hell beats the picture on the USGA / R & A conforming list.

losing valuable secrets and confidential information sucks. it's dog eat dog. your organization was in financial chaos at one point of time - you understand - everything counts. truly sorry that it went down the way it did...but its not your first rodeo. this has happened before and will happen again until secrets are really guarded. if apple can keep it as tight as they do - I'm sure you'll find appropriate measures moving forward.

respectfully,

ryan

Why did you have to go and mention a big mac...... I'M hungry now.....
Best "disease" I've had - diverticulitis. I can no longer eat sesame seeds (among other things). Kept me away from McDonalds and BK and other fast food places. :lol:

--kC

How many diseases have you had?!

Buying an Epic too period

I have a couple.

--kC

bama11 · November 2, 2016

I just contacted Julian Assange to see if he could break who really released the “Conspiracy pic.’, he is coming up with the “WikiLeaks GOLFWRX version as I type this, I just hope no Weiner’s are involved in this release! :busted_cop: :busted_cop: :busted_cop: :stop:

percymon · November 2, 2016

A few pages of sketchy, but improving, details plus a fuzzy photo and half a dozen small scale test hits = half of you want to splash 500 bucks on a new driver. Callaway doesn't need to advertise.

I can understand Callaway wanting to get feedback from retailers and golfers, but there are such things as clinics and closed door viewings if you really don't want leaked details. Reps pulling heads from their car trunk during driver fittings is hardly a secure way to gauge product acceptance.

Zach Heusser · November 2, 2016

Your post is so long! It's literally 500 words more than Taylormade, Titleist and Ping corporate have posted combined in 5 years on WRX. The cool thing is you got a Twitter "Follower" to give you a +1! I actually like the driver and have said one negative thing about it or Callaway, I hope it performs well and sells good for you guys. Regarding the tinfoil and attempted dig.... what's the saying, "when they go low, you go high"? I am going to take that route on this one. I will however be interested to revisit your post in a few months and discuss the Jailbreak technology.

You going "high" by theorizing Callaway "acquired Toulon Design for it’s ground breaking 20 year old Zevo patent" is one of many comments that prompted Harry to post.

Give it up buddy. You might be able to bully regular WRX members, but I have a funny feeling that won't fly with Harry and Callaway.

That didn't make any sense to me at all. Sean sold Zevo 20 years ago. I highly doubt he was able to keep any IP. And even if he did why would Callaway want it?

misplacedtexan83 · November 2, 2016

A few pages of sketchy, but improving, details plus a fuzzy photo and half a dozen small scale test hits = half of you want to splash 500 bucks on a new driver. Callaway doesn't need to advertise.

I can understand Callaway wanting to get feedback from retailers and golfers, but there are such things as clinics and closed door viewings if you really don't want leaked details. Reps pulling heads from their car trunk during driver fittings is hardly a secure way to gauge product acceptance.

True but even in closed door views, employees will still have access to see it. Probably one person got over antsy it seems.

Let's not forget the OP started the buzz was being spread of people seeing it and we were all looking for this or that about it.

scratchswinger · November 2, 2016

That didn't make any sense to me at all. Sean sold Zevo 20 years ago. I highly doubt he was able to keep any IP. And even if he did why would Callaway want it?

I doubt the only reason they hired Sean was for the Zevo..... But regardless of that it will be interesting to see how much of the 20 year old technology highlighted below relates to the new driver.

The Zevo Compressor Driver has a unique combination of design, technology and materials to compress its outer structure. PreLoaded Technology places the Driver club head in permanent tension, which increases its strength by more than 50%, eliminating expansion of the head so that all energy is directed to the clubface on impact with the ball. Each Driver head is subjected to a 660lb 22 cycle testing prcedure which is far in excess of the pressure necessary to place the driver head in 12,000 pounds per square inch of pressure.